Izichial Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 Even assuming prenerf levels of slicing profitability had caused some levels of inflation (and there have been several excellent posts in this thread in argument against this) I'd rather have high end spending (rare-epic items and equivalents) be "overpriced" (see below) than stop spending on the GTN completely because I worry too much about money. I actually didn't roll a slicer from the start but I also would rather be "forced" to roll one (and as has already been pointed out, the additional funds in circulation made it more viable for people without it to make a decent profit from their other crew skills) than play with three other crew skills in the current climate. Additional funds in circulation also provides more granularity in prices, when people's willingness to spend covers gaps in supply vs. demand, providing even more opportunities to sell crafted and gathered items. Consumer confidence is an economic indicator which measures the degree of optimism that consumers feel about the overall state of the economy and their personal financial situation. How confident people feel about stability of their incomes determines their spending activity and therefore serves as one of the key indicators for the overall shape of the economy. In essence, if the economy expands causing consumer confidence to be higher, consumers will be making more purchases. On the other hand, if the economy contracts or is in bad shape, confidence is lower, and consumers tend to save more and spend less. This is what slicing provides to a lot of people who didn't gamble on selling crafted items and came out ahead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Behrit Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 Why don't you try throwing a hissy fit, stomping and screaming, being completely ignorant and disregarding all evidence? It's what got slicing nerfed which, incidentally, is partially why your items aren't selling all that well any more. BS. Line up two lvl 25 toons, and I can tell you every time which one was a pre-nerf slicer. They are the one with the latest and greatest gear and speeder. It was busted, and you all know it. I think they went too far on the correction, but it needed to be fixed. If what you guys are saying is true, about losing money now, I hope they fix that. But, it was busted, and if you're honest, you know I'm right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belkiratwo Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 The people who are buying my "crafted shi*t" were the leveling scene. People who haven't hit level 50, who were gearing up their character. FYI, the leveling scene is much bigger than the level 50 scene right now. You don't automatically hit level 50 when you start the game. Everyone starts at level 1 and level up. The people who buy mods are the ones with a guild or friends who try to be as geared as possible doing FPs with their friends. Get your head out of your ***. No, they were leveling slicers... you know; the people with credits to spare. Now they'll be saving money for 50 instead of wasting it on minor upgrades. I was one of those people buying **** from the GTN. Now at level 26 sitting on 276k CR i'll be waiting to 50 before I think of buying anything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoroth Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 (edited) The reason why you can't sell your mods is because they're easily available for commendation in Fleet. I don't reaslly see the relevance of Slicing. Edited December 28, 2011 by Zoroth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticoccus Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 The reason for your argument is that noone has been able to make money in any other capacity. So would you rather that if you line up two level 25 characters now they will be dressed in rags and not have enough money to get sprint, that they should have gotten at level 14? =p Once again, rather than cursing who you see as the 1%, you should look at the other 99% and try to figure out why they earn no money. Because all other crew skills are "busted" as well, if you're honest you know I'm right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pokota Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 The average selling price of materials on the GTM is going to sink like a stone. The reason for this, relative to the Slicing nerf, is two-fold: first, Slicers won't be buying as much or as liberally, that's pretty obvious, but the second factor is that now people who were running Slicing missions will instead be running gathering missions. There will be a large influx of materials which drive down profits. If the average selling price of raw materials drops below the cost of running missions, then the economy will be boned. Yes, crafted goods will be dirt cheap, but they'll also be a losing proposition for the crafters. It's going to get ugly pretty soon. As someone who made nice money off Salvaging, I am not happy with the outlook. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkrom Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 Pre nerf: Slicing profits Raid gear Biochem Post nerf: mob grind Raid gear Biochem This > because craftables always turn out to be junk compared to a drop anyways. Now we just have to farm for repair credits. Awesome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Behrit Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 The reason for your argument is that noone has been able to make money in any other capacity. So would you rather that if you line up two level 25 characters now they will be dressed in rags and not have enough money to get sprint, that they should have gotten at level 14? =p Once again, rather than cursing who you see as the 1%, you should look at the other 99% and try to figure out why they earn no money. Because all other crew skills are "busted" as well, if you're honest you know I'm right. The only problem with your theory is that I have had enough money to buy all the things I needed, not all the things I wanted though. I had no problem buying Sprint. If you knew anything about me, you would be laughing as hard as I am now about your 1% vs. 99% comment. Don't lump me in with that crap movement. Look, I don't make money now selling stims and medpacks, but that is because there is not much demand for them right now. That will change. But, c'mon man, having lvl 20s rolling around with a quarter million credits is silly. Again, I think they went too far, but it was busted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wesmagyar Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 Ok as for i dont want pre nerf amounts i just dont want to lose money doing it. if i made at least SOME profit it would be bearable but as it is now i have lost credits running slicing. i send em out on a mission that costs 1800 and i get back 1250 i mean come on... at least with the other professions i get some mats if the mission succeeds. as it stands now its pointless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acheros Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 having lvl 20s rolling around with a quarter million credits is silly. Again, I think they went too far, but it was busted. Why is it silly? What is the relative value of 250,000 credits? or are you just afraid of the big number? at 20, even i'll admit a quarter mill is kind of alot. But, think about this... at level 40, which is actually pretty easy to get...a speeder ALONE cost a quarter mill. Not to mention skill training being over 10K EACH! Plus the giant repair bills, that were 10K each at level 30~ If you're just ************ about big numbers, you need to grow up. Put a cap on what crew missions you can do at each level...heres a hint, mission skills actually do have LEVELS for their mission, it even says 1-17, 18-25, i'm not sure the exact numbers, anyway. MAKE THOSE LEVELS THE CAP! so if you're level 10, you can only do the first rank of missions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticoccus Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 (edited) The only problem with your theory is that I have had enough money to buy all the things I needed, not all the things I wanted though. I had no problem buying Sprint. If you knew anything about me, you would be laughing as hard as I am now about your 1% vs. 99% comment. Don't lump me in with that crap movement. Look, I don't make money now selling stims and medpacks, but that is because there is not much demand for them right now. That will change. But, c'mon man, having lvl 20s rolling around with a quarter million credits is silly. Again, I think they went too far, but it was busted. If you knew anything about me you'd know that I'm always laughing, I'm the laughing man. Besides, let me ask you one thing: What can you do at level 20 with a quarter million credits? And then allow me to answer you. You can buy a speeder for 8k in preparation for getting speeder piloting at level 25, hell, you could buy them ALL. You could spend money on levelling up a crew skill, that's a coupla thousand right there (Closer to 10k if you want it to the appropriate level for 20) oh, and one of those fancy minipets for 25k. That's 40k (Assuming you want to save for piloting) plus 8k for the speeder and maybe 10k for crew and class skills and your own personal interrogation droid for 25k. What will you do with the remaining money? Everyone knows that in order to get "the best" gear you need warzone commendations or planet commendations, you can't buy those. Edited December 28, 2011 by Morticoccus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GellonSW Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 (edited) I tried slicing on my T7 (near max affection) and got his skill up to around 200 and I simply don't see how it's outrageous at all. I craft my own gear by using multiple t5ons and ship them to each other. It's really not that hard to get good gear if you are A) willing to invest time into crafting and B) use your alts. The whole players able to afford latest and greatest upgrades only from slicing is ludicrous and silly. Edited December 28, 2011 by GellonSW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hulduet Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 Haha... that explains why things aren't selling as well as they were. Didn't really know about slicing until today(and the nerf). Made a lot of money from AH, kinda slowed down a lot after the patch... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeido Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 My stuff is selling just as fast today as they did pre-nerf, with the exception of UT metals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acheros Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 Haha... that explains why things aren't selling as well as they were. Didn't really know about slicing until today(and the nerf). Made a lot of money from AH, kinda slowed down a lot after the patch... You're whats known as an unintended consequence. Something everyone needs to think about before screaming for change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyfeld Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 The average selling price of materials on the GTM is going to sink like a stone. The reason for this, relative to the Slicing nerf, is two-fold: first, Slicers won't be buying as much or as liberally, that's pretty obvious, but the second factor is that now people who were running Slicing missions will instead be running gathering missions. There will be a large influx of materials which drive down profits. If the average selling price of raw materials drops below the cost of running missions, then the economy will be boned. Yes, crafted goods will be dirt cheap, but they'll also be a losing proposition for the crafters. It's going to get ugly pretty soon. As someone who made nice money off Salvaging, I am not happy with the outlook. Personally, I think BW would do the whole economy a lot of good if they would scrap commendation gear/mods altogether. There is literally zero reason to buy gear or mods off the GTN when it's so readily available just by collecting tokens from quests and turning them in afterward. If they did away with the commendation vendors, and reduced BoE drop rates, crafting would become viable. And once crafting becomes viable, sales for crafting materials shoots through the roof. One of the worst things World of Warcraft ever did was making it possible to grind reputation for high quality gear, and SWTOR has taken that idea to the Nth level with commendation vendors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Svalkur Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 (edited) I swear people will not be happy till they drive this game into the ground First nerf slicing, side effect the market isnt doing too well anymore but no, its not because of the slicing now its because of commendations lets nerf that now that way people will have to buy items off the market..oh wait..with what money? seriously? cant people leave well enough alone? Edited December 29, 2011 by Svalkur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyfeld Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 (edited) I swear people will not be happy till they drive this game into the ground First nerf slicing, side effect the market isnt doing too well anymore but no, its not because of the slicing now its because of commendations lets nerf that now that way people will have to buy items off the market..oh wait..with what money? seriously? cant people leave well enough alone? i /facepalm If you get rid of commendation gear, crafting becomes a viable way to attain gear. If crafting becomes viable, prices on crafting materials, schematics and missions increases. This is called inflation caused by increased demand. This inflation allows people to make more money by selling items to other players. Is that simple enough for you, or do you need a picture book as well? Edited December 29, 2011 by Greyfeld Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Svalkur Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 (edited) yeah thats all well and good if there was actually decent starter money to buy the things on the market to increase prices to get a system going, but yeah, your right, something ive learned from all this slicing drama is every one is right and noones wrong played countless mmos in the long run, company's that listen to the whining on the forums generally dont do well in the long run. Fact of the matter is whiners are the loudest while the majority of the players are..playing and trying to have fun never fails Edited December 29, 2011 by Svalkur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pirias Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 having no issue with artifice at all i put gems up they sell i put more up they sell dont know why people are complaining but my server has a great market with out the slicing issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyfeld Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 yeah thats all well and good if there was actually decent starter money to buy the things on the market to increase prices to get a system going, but yeah, your right, something ive learned from all this slicing drama is every one is right and noones wrong played countless mmos in the long run, company's that listen to the whining on the forums generally dont do well in the long run. Fact of the matter is whiners are the loudest while the majority of the players are..playing and trying to have fun never fails Yeah, I'm not going to waste more time trying to explain it to you. The fact is, current gear accessibility undercuts the necessity of crafting, period. having no issue with artifice at all i put gems up they sell i put more up they sell dont know why people are complaining but my server has a great market with out the slicing issue. You know what the difference is? Weapon crystals aren't sold through vendors, and BoE world drop crystals are almost nonexistent. Where demand exists, supply rakes in the credits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Svalkur Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 (edited) yeah, don't waste more time with me just keep living in your own little world where you have to be right It takes a real smart guy to understand the concept of seed money to get a economy going but yeah that's that, moving on from your genius idea now myself Edited December 29, 2011 by Svalkur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverWF Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 I tried slicing on my T7 (near max affection) and got his skill up to around 200 and I simply don't see how it's outrageous at all. I craft my own gear by using multiple t5ons and ship them to each other. It's really not that hard to get good gear if you are A) willing to invest time into crafting and B) use your alts. The whole players able to afford latest and greatest upgrades only from slicing is ludicrous and silly. What? If you dont have real life you can make a million of alts. We - not! I dont want make a tons of alts - I love my character! I dont want to grind mobs - this is not a Korean-game! Only they rly was need to do - up another professions: make craft equpment more cooler. But they nerf slicing. Great! Now we have worst crafting professions and worst slicing. 1st + 2nd = dead market. Incredible. BW - are rly "professionals"! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greyfeld Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 (edited) "Seed money," as you call it, are the credits you get from questing. Just like everybody else. Let's not forget that sending your companions out on missions gets you crafting material that you can sell without requiring a credit sink into the GTN. I fail to see what the problem is. Edited December 29, 2011 by Greyfeld Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kallio Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Missions really did get shafted, to say that you can't make enormous amounts of creds with slicing however is plain wrong. While i'd like the cash rewards of missions a bit higher, i'm really hoping alot of people will drop slicing, because the super easy way to print money is gone now. Takes a bit of thinking now, is all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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