Sell Arma Rasa/HK-55 recovery mission for 2- 5$ on web as digital extension of Kotfe.

[Monumenta]

And yet, none of the subscriber rewards have ever been redistributed or made available in any other way.

 

Sometimes change happens.

[GelstonJ]

No. HK-56, maybe.

[Keraejis]

I am on the side of what was promised to the subscribers. But I agree 'DLC' style mission content should not be a reward for anything. But there is a lot more here to all that. Both sides argue the same thing for the opposite side.

 

Being mature, being entitled, being a hat.

 

That's it for those TLDR.

 

The 'mature' thing to do is to go by the rules that were set and move on. Some players will not get the content and others will. It's just one companion (two if you count Nico) and just one little mission. And this will be argued that if that is all it is, then why not give it to everyone and if that is all it is, then why be upset some players didn't do what was needed to be awarded with it?... Because of the rules that were already put down in order to get it.

 

If you didn't win the gold in the Olympics in 2016 but win the gold in 2020, you don't get the gold for 2016. Maybe you competed but just weren't good enough to make it all the way (as in subbed too late) you still get some of the rewards like Wheaties endorsements or a bobble head in your likeness but you don't get the gold. This being akin to the HK-55 themed monthly rewards, of course. Hopefully that's a good enough analogy but really analogies shouldn't be needed. Rules are rules.

 

The argument that someone didn't know and started playing after the fact is not even an argument here. The game has been out for over 4 years. The advertisements have been all over the place for all of those 4 years. A strangely large number of games older than 4 years have had timed rewards that included extra content that was exclusive to that time even if they didn't specifically say the word 'exclusive'. This is not an unknown ploy companies do to get business.

 

Entitlement is not bad when you are entitled. The players who played by the rules are entitled to the rewards. The players who did not play by the rules are not. People who came to the game late did not play by the rules. Was it their fault, well, technically yes. Unless they've been in some monastery in Tibet for the last 4 years they would know there was a SWTOR from all the hype and reviews and other players who play it. It's not my fault if they ignored the advertisements and notices. It is their fault. They should have clicked, went to the website to find out more information and even try it for free... a long time ago.

 

I understand the new movie has created a new surge of players and those players want to eat up all they can. The episodes each month for KotFE were really too short and with the instant 60's everyone got, they don't have to really experience the early game, but that's what they should focus on instead of HK-55 and one little episode specific to it. If you just subbed you get it all: Vanilla, Rise of the Hutt Cartel, Shadow of Revan and Knights of the Fallen Empire. Those who subbed through all this had to pay full price for all that. Non-subs get it all for $15 and call subscribers entitled elitists for getting awarded with something as small as a companion and that companion's mission story? Perspective, please. Granted this timeline goes back much further than the beginning of the HK-55 promotion but it still has relevance as far as subscribers getting 'awarded'. And I will say that most of the subscriber 'rewards' were advertised well before hand so non-subscribers could subscribe for the limited time and get the reward for only a month's subscription once a year or two.

 

And really subscribers do not get perks or rewards, subscribers get the base game. Non-subscribers get the trial with incentive to become a subscriber and that is why non-subscribers get less than the base game. Like most freeware, you can buy the full version or you can settle for the free version that does not include the bells and whistles. I'm just mentioning this because of all those who throw out that subscribers already get awards. We don't. We pay for what we get just like non-subscribers.

[Ratajack]

You have an interesting understanding of human psychology. Go shower one of your kids with gifts because they were born five-minutes earlier and see if the other one agrees with your stance.

 

How about if I CLEARLY AND EXPLICITLY tell all of my children that if their rooms are clean on Saturday, they will receive a special gift. One of my children cleans his room and his room is clean on Saturday. The other two don't and their rooms are NOT clean on Saturday. Should I reward only the child who actually cleaned his room and MET the requirements for the special gift? Should I let the other two children learn from this experience in the hopes that the next time a special gift is offered for doing a specific thing, they find themselves motivated to do that specific thing?

 

Should I let the other children clean their room another time or do some other chore to get that special gift? Should I reinforce their false sense of entitlement and reinforce their belief that they do not have to meet the requirements set forth because if they whine and cry loud enough or long enough and throw a temper tantrum they will be rewarded with the special gift, even though they KNOW they did not meet the requirements to receive it?

 

 

 

That's like demanding someone pay $120 for a breakfast because you got a continental breakfast with the room you rented at a motel.

 

No, it's more like expecting a customer who missed the sale on those tv's to pay the regular price, not the sale price.

 

 

All Bioware has managed to do with this is further divide the community. Those players who actually MET the requirements to receive the subscriber rewards and those entitled players with a false sense of entitlement that get frustrated because no matter how much they work for or pay, they are forever outside of that club.

 

Fixed that for you.

[Ratajack]

Simple solution. For anyone that subscribes for 8 consecutive months without a break in subscription would be able to get the HK-55 bonus chapter and upon completion of HK-55 bonus chapter you get the HK-55 Alliance mission.

 

The terms and conditions were VERY clear and did not say any 8 consecutive months. The specific dates were from January 11-August 1, 2016. If you were not subscribed continuously from January 11- August 1, 2016, you do NOT qualify to receive the BONUS chapter.

[wilseifert]

Let me start off by saying... I have the bonus chapter (still have yet to do it). I was mostly pointing out that to meet the requirement, we (us subscribers), essentially had to subscribe for 8 consecutive months which is also equivalent to $120. The OP clearly was a ********, played the first 9 chapters, unsubscribed, and then resubscribed to pay $15 dollars for the remaining chapters, then got butt hurt when they saw a bonus chapter that they would never get. I was just pointing out that I would possibly concede the content to anyone that maintained the subscription for those 8 months. Realistically, I am also calling them out because they won't maintain their subscription for 8 months.

[dxlolman]

If they did there probably be a legal dispute about refunding long time subcribers as they waited and paid for this.

Stop asking for this.

There are tones of limited edition items in this game, limited editions stay limited editions.

[masterceil]

Entitlement is not bad when you are entitled. The players who played by the rules are entitled to the rewards. The players who did not play by the rules are not.

 

Excellent post overall. My favourite part is that left in the quote above - particularly the [emphasis added] : )

[CrazyCT]

This topic is reminding me of

- It was ok the first time you listened to it, but it's been overplayed so freaking much it's annoying, but it's just keeps on coming on the radio. Maybe time to let it, if not die completely, at least give it a year or so before dragging the same old arguments and feelings back up.

[jauvtus]

source please?

 

This word is not used by bioware to describe sub rewards.

 

SWTOR Knights of the Fallen Empire Terms and Conditions:

** To qualify for the HK-55 Bonus Chapter, the account must continuously be in active Subscription status between January 11 - August 1, 2016. Once you qualify and the Bonus Chapter is released, you may enter and play the Bonus Chapter after you complete Chapters 1-16.

 

Let's play grammar!

When can you play the Bonus Chapter? Once you qualify and the Bonus Chapter is released.

The Bonus Chapter is released, so how do I qualify? Your account must have continuously been in active Subscription status between January 11 - August 1, 2016.

So are there other ways to qualify (buying it separately for 5$, buying it with CC, whining enough on the forum)? No, the Terms and Conditions clearly list only one method to qualify, therefore the reward is EXCLUSIVE to those who qualified that single way possible.

You are welcome.

Edited September 17, 2016 by jauvtus

[Riftgrinder]

I agree, to a certain extent. I personally think it should stay exclusive for about 6-9 months. Then put it on CM for around $5-10.

 

The reason I think so, is because this is actual content, not just (IMHO) crappy cosmetic stuff. Cosmetic stuff should be locked away forever if you weren't there when it happened.

Edited September 17, 2016 by Riftgrinder

[jauvtus]

I agree, to a certain extent. I personally think it should stay exclusive for about 6-9 months. Then put it on CM for around $5-10.

 

The reason I think so, is because this is actual content, not just (IMHO) crappy cosmetic stuff. Cosmetic stuff should be locked away forever if you weren't there when it happened.

 

You may request this for future sub rewards. But you can't retroactively change KotFE Terms and Conditions.

[Kingsbount]

Oh yeah...

Another day - another thread...

 

I wan't PVP rewards for all seasons.

I don't like PVP. I don't want PVP.

This is not fair that only PVP'ers get access to it! Im a customer!!! Im PAYING MAH MONEY!!!

Put them in CM so i could buy them without doing PVP.

DO IT!!

NAO!!!!!

[Riftgrinder]

SWTOR Knights of the Fallen Empire Terms and Conditions:

** To qualify for the HK-55 Bonus Chapter, the account must continuously be in active Subscription status between January 11 - August 1, 2016. Once you qualify and the Bonus Chapter is released, you may enter and play the Bonus Chapter after you complete Chapters 1-16.

First of all, I'm pretty sure you only have to play up to Chapter IX in order for it to unlock. So, BW, did indeed retroactively change the TaC, assuming what you posted here is true.

You may request this for future sub rewards. But you can't retroactively change KotFE Terms and Conditions.

And secondly, I have already played through it. I enjoyed it far more than I thought I would and I want more people to experience it. And I don't want this chapter to fall into obscurity behind an exclusivity wall.

 

This is why I want it be exclusive for a time (to make some of us feel we've gotten our money's worth), and then be available to the public. Not for free, of course.

Edited September 17, 2016 by Riftgrinder
Wording

[Ratajack]

First of all, I'm pretty sure you only have to play up to Chapter IX in order for it to unlock. So, BW, did indeed retroactively change the TaC, assuming what you posted here is true.

 

 

 

To access the alert for the HK-55 companion, I believe that you need to complete chapter 9 of KotFE, as per the terms and conditions.

 

To access the BONUS chapter, you need to complete chapter 16 of KotFE, as per the terms and conditions.

 

The companion is not the same as the BONUS chapter.

 

And secondly, I have already played through it. I enjoyed it far more than I thought I would and I want more people to experience it. And I don't want this chapter to fall into obscurity behind an exclusivity wall.

 

This is why I want it be exclusive for a time (to make some of us feel we've gotten our money's worth), and then be available to the public. Not for free, of course.

 

If the BONUS chapter was so enjoyable, then that should be extra incentive for people to remain subscribed in the future, so as not to miss any future subscriber rewards.

Edited September 17, 2016 by Ratajack

[TheRandomno]

To access the alert for the HK-55 companion, I believe that you need to complete chapter 9 of KotFE, as per the terms and conditions.

 

To access the BONUS chapter, you need to complete chapter 16 of KotFE, as per the terms and conditions.

 

The companion is not the same as the BONUS chapter.

 

I'm pretty sure you just need 1-9+alert to access the bonus chapter.

Edited September 17, 2016 by TheRandomno
Quoting is hard

[Riftgrinder]

To access the alert for the HK-55 companion, I believe that you need to complete chapter 9 of KotFE, as per the terms and conditions.

 

To access the BONUS chapter, you need to complete chapter 16 of KotFE, as per the terms and conditions.

 

The companion is not the same as the BONUS chapter.

 

 

 

If the BONUS chapter was so enjoyable, then that should be extra incentive for people to remain subscribed in the future, so as not to miss any future subscriber rewards.

What?

 

The HK-55 Alliance Alert, if I'm not mistaken, was a January Sub reward.

To access the bonus chapter you need to have completed KotFE up to chapter IX plus said Alliance Alert.

 

Do correct me if I'm wrong.

[Ratajack]

 

I'm pretty sure you just need 1-9+alert to access the bonus chapter.

 

All of my characters have either completed chapter 16 or not started KotFE at all. I have no characters that have completed only through chapter 9, so I can not confirm this. The only thing I can confirm is what the terms and conditions state.

 

The terms and conditions do state that the companion is only available after completion of chapter 9 and the BONUS chapter is only available after completion of chapter 16.

 

If the BONUS chapter is available after chapter 9, that does NOT, in any way, change the requirements set forth in those terms and conditions to be eligible to have access to the BONUS chapter, though.

[Riftgrinder]

If the BONUS chapter is available after chapter 9, that does NOT, in any way, change the requirements set forth in those terms and conditions to be eligible to have access to the BONUS chapter, though.

Well, 'cept for the fact you don't have to play through to Chapter XVI, otherwise you're right. I just started up an old toon that hasn't started Ep10 yet and she was eligible to play it.

 

Oh, and I forgot to respond to this:

If the BONUS chapter was so enjoyable, then that should be extra incentive for people to remain subscribed in the future, so as not to miss any future subscriber rewards.

Like I previously stated, this is actual story content. I think it would be harmful to keep it locked away forever from both new and returning players. I mean, this is not some... Party Jawa. It's a side-story, sure, but it's story content nonetheless. And I'm pretty certain that given time, BW will make it available for just about everyone for a price. And so they should.

 

In 6 to 9 months no one should really care anymore. But there will most likely be a small, vocal minority that still do care, and their tantrums would then just come across as childish, petty, and pathetic. But if that's the hill they want to die on, well...

Edited September 17, 2016 by Riftgrinder

[CrazyCT]

The whole point of them having this chapter, was to keep people subscribed. Too many people saying "Screw this, I'm gonna not sub until the last chapter is out, and then pick up the whole story for the price of 1 month's sub." The bonus chapter was a reward to the people who stuck by the game and subbed every month.

 

To give the bonus chapter away to anyone who basically tried to "cheat" their way to getting all of KotFE isn't just a slap in the face to the people who paid and stayed subbed all those months, it's business suicide. Release the bonus chapter to everyone, and we won't even get to see how KotET finishes - EA won't keep this going more than a couple of months when they see every single player unsub, waiting till every chapter is released, and then QQ on the forums to get any bonus gear they don't deserve.

[Halinalle]

Like I previously stated, this is actual story content. I think it would be harmful to keep it locked away forever from both new and returning players. I mean, this is not some... Party Jawa. It's a side-story, sure, but it's story content nonetheless. And I'm pretty certain that given time, BW will make it available for just about everyone for a price. And so they should.

 

What storyline?

 

It's not part of KotFE story.

It's not part of Dread Master story.

It's not part of Shroud story (2.x). I'm sure that 99% of players never even finished that.

It doesn't have Kephess.

Edited September 17, 2016 by Halinalle

[Riftgrinder]

The whole point of them having this chapter, was to keep people subscribed. Too many people saying "Screw this, I'm gonna not sub until the last chapter is out, and then pick up the whole story for the price of 1 month's sub." The bonus chapter was a reward to the people who stuck by the game and subbed every month.

 

To give the bonus chapter away to anyone who basically tried to "cheat" their way to getting all of KotFE isn't just a slap in the face to the people who paid and stayed subbed all those months, it's business suicide. Release the bonus chapter to everyone, and we won't even get to see how KotET finishes - EA won't keep this going more than a couple of months when they see every single player unsub, waiting till every chapter is released, and then QQ on the forums to get any bonus gear they don't deserve.

I don't think anyone expects BW to just give it away. There will be a pricetag, I'm sure of it. And there should be.

EDIT:

What storyline?

 

It's not part of KotFE story.

It's not part of Dread Master story.

It's not part of Shroud story (2.x).

It doesn't have Kephess.

So? Because it's a standalone story, it doesn't count? What kind of logic is that?

Edited September 17, 2016 by Riftgrinder

[CrazyCT]

I don't think anyone expects BW to just give it away. There will be a pricetag, I'm sure of it. And there should be.

 

Congratulations - You've won a medal for completely missing the point of my rant.

[lightSaberAddiCt]

I would hope that most players in the game are mature enough to accept that there will be some things in game that they will never have. I would hope that most players in the game are mature enough to accept that BW is not at fault if THEY do not meet the requirements to have a certain item, and that BW is under NO responsibility to make that item available to them.

 

Best joke on the thread Rat, you know as well as I do that will never happen lol.

 

But in all seriousness, now it begins. The flood of threads in regards to this, now that people see others running around with ZO-OM. At least BW is staying on top of it and pushing them into the suggestion box. $2-5 I mean seriously?

LOL

[Halinalle]

I don't think anyone expects BW to just give it away. There will be a pricetag, I'm sure of it. And there should be.

 

I'll try to explain:

If they give bonus content to everyone for free or for 4 USD/EUR. Then a lot more players would just wait until they sell the content on website or CM instead of remaining subbed. Of course there would still be small amount of players who sub to get full access to game but let me say this: number of subs would be a lot lower.

 

And that means less money = less money for new content.

We already see it on forums. Players crying about lack of end game content.