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"Mistress" title for female Jedi


AlienEyeTX

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Master is a masculine title and not fitting for a true lady. We should have the optional title of "Mistress" for female Jedi.

 

I am only recommending this as an option for PCs who want a proper title. No need to select it if "Master" is your preferred designation.

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Master is a masculine title and not fitting for a true lady. We should have the optional title of "Mistress" for female Jedi.

 

I am only recommending this as an option for PCs who want a proper title. No need to select it if "Master" is your preferred designation.

 

Correct me if I am wrong, but female Jedi ARE called Master, not Mistress. Master Satele, Master Kiwiiks, Master Yuon ect. I do not know a single Jedi of Master rank called "mistress". As far as I know, Master does not denote gender in the Jedi Order. It is pretty neutral in that regard.

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1. Jedi are always "Master".

 

2. Master comes from Latin Magister and Greek Magistros (which I'm pretty sure only appears in Romeika Greek and therefore stems from the Latin word rending it pointless to mention the Greek word) which are masculine but because Women were not allowed in military functions in European cultures (barring the Scythian and Sarmatian supercultures) and typically weren't allowed in administrative or civil functions (they weren't in the classical civilizations) there is no feminine equivalent.

 

Your closest equivalent to a feminine of "master" would be Dominus (Master/Lord) and Domina (Lady) which is covered by the Sith.

 

3. Mistress has other connotations/denotations....

 

~ Eudoxia

Edited by FlavivsAetivs
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Master is a masculine title and not fitting for a true lady. We should have the optional title of "Mistress" for female Jedi.

 

I am only recommending this as an option for PCs who want a proper title. No need to select it if "Master" is your preferred designation.

 

As of this moment, your suggestion thread comes right after "Lady" title for female Sith thread... Is that just a coincidence? You don't really have to answer since the mirrored effect is quite obvious, imo. The subtle irony is refreshing! :)

 

That being said, if I were to bite, I'd go with this:

It's Master because you are a Master of your profession, not nobility.

 

Also, while there are NPC characters to support the Lady option, there are none for Mistress (to my knowledge).

 

However, the gender issue - when it comes to titles, is a nightmare in most languages.

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This was the issue I immediately thought of.

 

 

 

Congratulations women, you get to use the same titles as men now. Isn't equality grand?

What? still not happy?

 

I am. It's fine by me. The "sir" bit took some getting used to but it's not an issue either.

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As of this moment, your suggestion thread comes right after "Lady" title for female Sith thread... Is that just a coincidence? You don't really have to answer since the mirrored effect is quite obvious, imo. The subtle irony is refreshing! :)

 

That being said, if I were to bite, I'd go with this:

 

 

Also, while there are NPC characters to support the Lady option, there are none for Mistress (to my knowledge).

 

However, the gender issue - when it comes to titles, is a nightmare in most languages.

 

Here is the definition. Only the last one is "sordid." It's a shame that people's minds go there automatically.

 

It's an elegant title, from a more civilized age. :cool:

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I have always considered Master a gender-neutral title. Anyone can do things masterfully or be a master of their chosen discipline. You might call someone a master woodworker or say they're masterful at the guitar, no gender implied.
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I have always considered Master a gender-neutral title. Anyone can do things masterfully or be a master of their chosen discipline. You might call someone a master woodworker or say they're masterful at the guitar, no gender implied.

 

Exactly this.

 

Jedi work to master the force; they don't work to mistress it.

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To expand on my point for a moment, the titles are all about context and connotation.

 

For the Sith, the title of lord signifies power. They use the force to gain power and rule through it. It allows them to become lords in a hierarchical sense. Their power with the force gives them power over people. This is why the argument for a lady of the Sith title is valid. Lord and lady both carry the same connotation in this context.

 

For the Jedi, the title of master signifies mastery. It's about their connection to and understanding of the force, not their ability to use the force to become masters of other people. While master and mistress could be used in a similar way to lord and lady, in that both sets of titles can signify a position of power and control, this connotation is not in line with Jedi ideals. And while mistress could certainly be a title that female Jedi are addressed by when those speaking to them want to convey respect, it does not carry the full connotation of force mastery found in the title of master.

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Congratulations women, you get to use the same titles as men now. Isn't equality grand?

What? still not happy?

 

I have a sneaking suspicion it's more men than women pushing for this title, so they can make their skimpily-clad toons all dominatrixy.

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I have a sneaking suspicion it's more men than women pushing for this title, so they can make their skimpily-clad toons all dominatrixy.

 

What in the world do dominatrices have to do with this?

 

It is about offering an OPTION for a gender-correct title of respect and authority.

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What in the world do dominatrices have to do with this?

 

It is about offering an OPTION for a gender-correct title of respect and authority.

 

Except for the fact there is no feminine form of the word "Master." If you had read my post earlier in this thread, I wouldn't have to re-state this:

 

Master comes from Latin Magister and Romeika Greek Magistros which are both masculine, but because Women were not allowed in military functions in European cultures (barring the Scythian and Sarmatian supercultures) and typically weren't allowed in administrative or civil functions (they weren't in the classical civilizations) there is no feminine equivalent.

 

Your closest equivalent to a feminine of "master" would be Lady (the word "Lady" doesn't stem from Latin and neither does "Lord") which is covered by the Sith.

 

In modern English most of our word don't take genders, as far as I know. And Master is gender-neutral in all contexts.

 

EDIT: Wiktionary says a feminine form exists (Magistra) but it's not sourced and I have never actually seen it used in any Latin text I have read or heard of. It is probably an invention of neo-latin (modern latin).

 

~ Eudoxia

Edited by FlavivsAetivs
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Except for the fact there is no feminine form of the word "Master." If you had read my post earlier in this thread, I wouldn't have to re-state this:

 

Master comes from Latin Magister and Romeika Greek Magistros which are both masculine, but because Women were not allowed in military functions in European cultures (barring the Scythian and Sarmatian supercultures) and typically weren't allowed in administrative or civil functions (they weren't in the classical civilizations) there is no feminine equivalent.

 

Your closest equivalent to a feminine of "master" would be Lady (the word "Lady" doesn't stem from Latin and neither does "Lord") which is covered by the Sith.

 

In modern English most of our word don't take genders, as far as I know. And Master is gender-neutral in all contexts.

 

EDIT: Wiktionary says a feminine form exists (Magistra) but it's not sourced and I have never actually seen it used in any Latin text I have read or heard of. It is probably an invention of neo-latin (modern latin).

 

~ Eudoxia

 

And if you read my link, you wouldn't have had to type all that.

 

Mistress IS the feminine form of Master. You may not like it, but there it is. :eek:

 

Besides, if something is optional and you don't like it, you don't have to use it.

 

***EDIT***

 

BTW: The masculine form or "Lady" is Lord, not Master. It's sad that I would have to tell you that.

Edited by AlienEyeTX
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I implied that Lady is not related to "Master". I stated it was the closest true equivalent in terms of carrying the connotation of authority. Lady and Lord may come from Germanic dialects but their meanings transfer from Roman culture. Dominus is latin for "Lord" and also for "Master" depending on the period and context. Domina operates in the same way.

 

Mistress may be a modern "equivalent" to master but it does not carry the same connotation as "Master". Mistress implies a Woman of authority in some contexts although rather rarely. Master carries the same meaning in one of its usages, but it carries several meanings Mistress doesn't. Nobody earns a "Mistress' Degree" nor is someone a "Mistress Blacksmith", for example.

 

A Jedi is not a "Mistress" of the force, a usage which would imply the force is in... the best analogy might be a student-teacher paradigm. They are a "Master" of the force, where the force is an art or a craft to be shaped or used, like a sword or a painting.

 

~ Eudoxia

Edited by FlavivsAetivs
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And if you read my link, you wouldn't have had to type all that.

 

Mistress IS the feminine form of Master. You may not like it, but there it is. :eek:

 

Besides, if something is optional and you don't like it, you don't have to use it.

 

***EDIT***

 

BTW: The masculine form or "Lady" is Lord, not Master. It's sad that I would have to tell you that.

 

You should read your own link, or type master and see there is no similarity, on the subject that matters here.

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I wouldn't have any objection to the title being made one in the game, but not as the 'female' equivalent of the Master title. To me, a Master is a Master, it's what a Jedi Master is called, with no gender specificity to it.

 

Now, there is use of mistress as an honorific, I do believe that C-3PO called Leia, "Mistress Leia" and I see nothing wrong with it in that way. I know there will be some that use it in the domina.trix sense, and honestly, I don't care about that either. It would work for Sith, or BH, agents, smugs...anyone really who wanted to use it.

 

I wouldn't mind if Lady was a title option too, but just as with the Jedi, I don't see it as the female Sith equivalent to 'Lord'.

I do like the idea of Lady being available, so that you don't necessarily have to be a Lord, but you could be married to one, like Lady Grathan.

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I do like the idea of Lady being available, so that you don't necessarily have to be a Lord, but you could be married to one, like Lady Grathan.

 

Lady title is already seen for female sith lords in EU (Legends), like in books Fate of the Jedi. So I agree, it should be added.

Edited by Shivax
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Lady title is already seen for female sith lords in EU (Legends), like in books Fate of the Jedi. So I agree, it should be added.

 

I haven't read a lot of the EU, just Annihilation, Revan, Deceived and I just acquired The Bane Trilogy, but I have no issue with the title being added. I would use it as an honorific of a married woman to a certain sith lord, that would be my reasoning for it, and it would be great. :) If I was a sith lord in my own right, I'd still use Lord and Darth, but to each their own. ^^

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I haven't read a lot of the EU, just Annihilation, Revan, Deceived and I just acquired The Bane Trilogy, but I have no issue with the title being added. I would use it as an honorific of a married woman to a certain sith lord, that would be my reasoning for it, and it would be great. :) If I was a sith lord in my own right, I'd still use Lord and Darth, but to each their own. ^^

 

To each their own is a great way of looking at it.

 

It's a shame so many people are arguing against something that was proposed as an option. Not mandatory. Not replacing anything. Just something for people who prefer things be done properly.

 

But, to each their own.

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I can't think of any dark connotations to "Master" other than slavery which has in large part been out of the American consciousness for 100 years, and the European consciousness for about 150. Contrary to "Mistress" of which more and more people seem to have one these days...

 

The current connotations we associate with the word all stem from its role as an administrative and military position in the Roman Empire from the 4th-10th centuries [Magister Officorum, Magister Militum in particular, and the title Magistros continued into the "Byzantine" era of Roman History]. Or of course, as master of a profession/art/craft.

 

There are other usages too of course, for example before we began using the term "Captain" (Romeika Greek Katepan, coincidentally also with no feminine equivalent) the owner/commander of a non-military ship was a Master as well.

 

~ Eudoxia

Edited by FlavivsAetivs
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