Is concrete-cleave the new standard now?

[Lhancelot]

To all whiners:

Dps specs are not overpowered. Even commando can successfully duel jugg dps, if there are los objects. If you have troubles on other classes then it's a l2p issue.

 

If a commando beats a jugg in a duel, that jugg is bad.

[aristrokratie]

If a commando beats a jugg in a duel, that jugg is really bad.

 

Had to add something

Edited January 23, 2016 by aristrokratie

[ace_boogie]

Its been the standard this entire patch.

 

Premades run two heals and two tanks, or one tank and one dps, two heals.

The heals are always sorc/sages, very rarely we get an Operative for stealth caps and indefinite kiting.

 

been playing a few years now, I have literally never seen this. What backasswards server do you play on so I know to never play there ever?

[Ruhun]

been playing a few years now, I have literally never seen this. What backasswards server do you play on so I know to never play there ever?

 

Pretty common on BC, but to be fair I've only seen Pubs do it.

They also love to coordinate queueing and doubling up on premades, so it's easy to see 8 guys from the same guild in a team stomping regs.

They literally only win when they do stuff like this.

Edited January 24, 2016 by Ruhun

[Evanouss]

**** tanks for being tanks.

All tanks uninstall to make this guy feel better about himself.

#regsmatter

 

Here's an interesting idea how about attacking my point instead of me....If you're just going to attack me why even bother? Probably because you can't.....I wasn't just talking about regs either, this happens in ranked as well.

Edited January 24, 2016 by Evanouss

[Quarast]

Here's an interesting idea how about attacking my point instead of me....If you're just going to attack me why even bother? Probably because you can't.....I wasn't just talking about regs either, this happens in ranked as well.

 

Awww don't insult the baby he'll cry. Also lol @ tanks being OP, did you see how badly shield and absorb were nerfed in 4.0? They needed to gain something like damage or would be pretty awful

[Ruhun]

Awww don't insult the baby he'll cry. Also lol @ tanks being OP, did you see how badly shield and absorb were nerfed in 4.0? They needed to gain something like damage or would be pretty awful

 

Tanks aren't OP.

 

At least I don't think so, its the Tank specced people that wear DPS gear.

They hit fairly hard and have insane survivability. Add a sage or two into the mix and they're a brick wall that hits back.

Them being alive for more time allows them to pull higher numbers.

Edited January 24, 2016 by Ruhun

[jedcjedcjedc]

been playing a few years now, I have literally never seen this. What backasswards server do you play on so I know to never play there ever?

 

you already do play there actually

 

well, to be fair I've only seen one that continuously does it, queuing up as a premade with either a dps or tank and two sorc healers.

[Arehonn]

I actually like playing against tank DPS guardian heavy comps like this on my Pyro/Plasma. They all come straight to my wheelhouse and they burn a lot faster then a true tank. As it is, a good Pyro is excellent to have against tanks.

[Racter]

Let's make it clear, I am speaking about regs.

 

In regs (8v8s) I rarely see sin tanks, and when I do never once have I thought when fighting them that, "man that guy hits hard and he does tons of damage!"

 

In fact after the matches, I never seen a sin tank parse highest damage and "consistently do more damage" than any jugg hybrid that had a clue how to play.

 

Until then, I am going to chalk up your comments as ridiculous exaggeration. Jugg tanks in dps gears are extremely popular now, and tank sins in dps gears are not. That alone says something.

 

The only thing I ever found myself thinking during a match or afterwards about a tank sin is how annoying their pull is. That's it.

 

Now, if you are talking about 4v4 ranked, competitive PVP, I don't know how sin tanks in dps gears match up with jugg tanks in dps gears.

 

From what I have been told by competitive pvpers though, is that jugg tanks benefit the most from using dps gears

whereas the other tanks not so much. (I don't know why they didn't explain it to me.)

 

That being said, I am going to have to believe that those players I respect in pvp, and my own eyes with what I see in the warzones and after the matches when I compare numbers. Jugg tanks with dps gears seem to be overperforming.

 

Just because you haven't seen it doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Darkness damage is far higher than Immo atm. It is marginally harder to play and far, far squishier, but it does substantially more damage as a trade off.

 

Shock proc w/ Reck is 15k, DV is 7100 a tick x4, Maul w/ set bonus proc is ~11k. You can get lucky and Shock > Maul > Shock for 40k+ instantly on 2018 players. Jugg damage isn't bad but it's not that high comparatively.

 

Again, as mentioned before, a tank in full DPS gear does between 50-70% of what a DPS spec will do played at the same skill level.

Edited January 24, 2016 by Racter

[yellow_]

In regs (8v8s) I rarely see sin tanks, and when I do never once have I thought when fighting them that, "man that guy hits hard and he does tons of damage!"

 

Until then, I am going to chalk up your comments as ridiculous exaggeration. Jugg tanks in dps gears are extremely popular now, and tank sins in dps gears are not. That alone says something.

 

Since we're apparently just going to swap anecdotes: the sin tanks you're playing with are bad.

 

The exceptionally high damage output from darkness and kinetic combat is well established in 4s play and is one of the pros of the spec, relative to the other tanks. You have to be dismal at darkness to get outdpsed by an immortal jugg with the same gear setup.

 

You can break 3K in darkness and kinetic combat while spending GCDs swapping guard and, even more importantly, you don't need one of those rare epic cleave games where all the sorcs are doing 4K+ to make it happen either.

[Lhancelot]

Since we're apparently just going to swap anecdotes: the sin tanks you're playing with are bad.

 

The exceptionally high damage output from darkness and kinetic combat is well established in 4s play and is one of the pros of the spec, relative to the other tanks. You have to be dismal at darkness to get outdpsed by an immortal jugg with the same gear setup.

 

You can break 3K in darkness and kinetic combat while spending GCDs swapping guard and, even more importantly, you don't need one of those rare epic cleave games where all the sorcs are doing 4K+ to make it happen either.

 

If you want to debate which is better between sins and jugg tanks in dps gears, I concede to you, you win. Regardless, obviously neither should be doing what they do damagewise imo, by wearing dps gears and tank stance at the same time.

 

If this is intended, then pure dps classes need a damage boost. real tanks need a survival boost. And, ops/merc healers would need a vast boost to their healing output for PVP if that all occured.

 

I actually like having options, it's fun when a spec can change gears and has options to manipulate the cookie cutter system that is boring and bland.

 

The problem is when such manipulation creates stronger builds that shouldn't be possible, such as skank tanks that outdamage pure dps, or even come close... This is not working as intended.

 

There's just too much utility with a tank spec using dps gears who can guard equally effective as a pure tank in PVP, thanks to a broken system where defensive stats are useless, all except for endurance which can be stacked by skank tanks as pure tanks do for equal affect.

 

This skank tanking is just a way players have found to exploit the broken PVP system which doesn't reward a pure tank spec for using defensive stats, shield stats, or absorb stats in PVP.

 

That's my thought on it anyway.

 

I just wish that tanking stats were effective in PVP, and that would reward true tanks for not choosing dps gears and mods.

 

I don't blame tanks that do so, as it stands why gimp your damage for some really minor improvements defensively in PVP when you can grab dps gear for PVP and do great damage along with having very nice utility with the ability to guard?

[Evanouss]

Awww don't insult the baby he'll cry. Also lol @ tanks being OP, did you see how badly shield and absorb were nerfed in 4.0? They needed to gain something like damage or would be pretty awful

 

 

 

Again, make some points and have an arguement...Whats the matter pumpkin, the doctor didn't slap your a$s hard enough to get your brain started when you were a baby?

Edited January 24, 2016 by Evanouss

[Cretinus]

Again, make some points and have an arguement...Whats the matter, the doctor didn't slap your a$s hard enough to get your brain started when you were a baby?

 

The slap is for starting the respiratory system, not the brain.

[Evanouss]

The slap is for starting the respiratory system, not the brain.

 

....you missed the point , his brain is in his ***...

[Greezt]

Keep this thread alive, I feel it's going places.

[patricklee]

#regsmatter

 

Actually, regs do matter- at least in comparison to ranked.

Particularly when you consider what a small fraction of pvpers participate in ranked- regs are by far MORE important as they affect a much larger portion of the playerbase.

 

Then note that SWTOR is not an esport, no huge cash prizes, no livestreams garnering huge audiences.

 

I'm not trying to bash ranked or the participants, simply pointing out that the elitist views of some that ranked performance should somehow have greater influence on specs & such isn't warranted by either numbers or any other reason.

[Evanouss]

#regstar is one of my favorite epeen elitist sayings ever. Every good player should be a regstar. If you're good in ranked and not good in regs...*** does that even mean?

 

I agree with the above post. 90% of your time is in regs, but yeah, it doesn't matter, they should cater to the other 10% of pvp. Or maybe the other -1% that is team ranked.