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Companion Change Feedback


EricMusco

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I already do the weekly heroics on my stealth classes versus my non-stealthers because it is such a slog. I'm fine with stuff being challenging, or stuff needing to be done many times, but the cross-product of those two states is something best left to younger people with much more free time to play than this middle-aged geek with job, wife, and kids.

 

My recommendation would either be to nerf the difficulty (OP companions achieved that) or reduce the number needed (increase the influence gained from crates to compensate).

 

Planetary heroics - tried these on my assassin tank and on a sith marauder I made up. Assassin did Hoth and had no issues at all with companion healing. Health dipped a bit more than I was used to but otherwise it was fine. This was with Xalek healing at influence 24ish.

 

My mara did only the Korriban heroics (at level 11/12) with Vette healing. Vette's healing was noticeably weaker than Nico's and I was still having to heal up after normal trash mobs in class quest content. Against the heroics I had much the same experience - no deaths but health dipped a lot.

 

This is as a "Legendary" player with some (not all) datacrons (maybe half?) and all class story presence buffs and human legacy racial presence buff. So a "true newbie" would do much, much worse.

 

I had completed all of the heroic Star Fortresses on my Sith Juggernaut pre-nerf but never to get the "All for One" achievement. I'll try that tonight or tomorrow and see how it goes.

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Another question is: why do you need us to tell you things like that? You have a great number of metrics at your fingertips. You can tell how many of each mobs were engaged. You can tell the outcomes of all fights. You can see the deaths from what encounters. You can track trends of these deaths.

 

Because it's all blowing smoke. They're gonna do what they're gonna do. Just like they did when they pushed massive changes to the game untested. This is just to make those who are pissed off but haven't quit feel involved. It's damage control and spin. Nothing else.

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It's almost like they should have tested companions before the original change, even.

 

They need some sort of vision for them. They could not of thought grinding to level 50 influence to get half the power a well geared companion had at level 60 was an acceptable outcome. (I'm using numbers from memory of another person's post). What would be reasonable expectations? Certainly at influence 50, they should be more powerful than a well geared companion pre 4.0. I would argue between 80-100% of an average player. And at half that influence they should be at least as good as well geared companion pre 4.0. Otherwise this was a complete waste and they may have well just kept them as they were before. And in that case I would end up grinding better gear for 2-3 companions on each character which helps solve their lack of solo content problem.

 

It really isn't that hard.

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Posted earlier and have read most of the posts.

 

Best thing to do is log out and not play. They will see the drop off post patch population and realize that the majority of people playing aren't Leet Tanks with augments and set bonus towing a rep 30+ companion.

 

 

If a pre patch companion can get a group of three through a HM FP so be it. If a pre patch companion can get a solo player to complete H2 SF, so be it.

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Hey folks, etc.

 

  • Your level = 65
  • Roughly Average Item Rating = 208
  • Discipline = Lethality
  • Companion = Pierce
  • Companion role = Heals
  • Companion Influence level = 50
  • Which Mission or Star Fortress are you playing (Solo Mode? Heroic Mode?) = Heroic SF
     
  • Your personal experience while playing this content = The One and Only achieve still quite attainable. Just tried today, and though I skipped the paladins and went straight for the Exarch, I had no issues completing Heroic SF Belsavis. Edit: The third reactor room was quite challenging, and I had to use line of sight, Unity, and Heroic Moment to beat it. The Exarch posed the most difficulty only when he dropped aggro and starting attacking my companion. Otherwise, it was fairly simple. I bet I could do it with a companion rank 1-5.
     
    The companion nerf was justifiable, and I have no problem with the values the companions now output. That being said, I'm sure there are others who wish the companions stats were slightly higher.

Edited by Shirvington
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solo mode 2h and solo Sf.

65 socr Madness

in combo of 208 and 216

Companion = Lana Beniko

Companion role = healer

Companion Influence level = 26

Comando 26 88

Companion Dorne

Companion role healer

Companion Influence level =12

from what I can say that there is a handy cap that my main can clear most of the 2h solo but when I try it on a blow 50 alt they get wiped out and my main can live throw the fights. I tried to even pop my heroic movement on my 26 and seconds after using the first attack was dead cause donre+ ticking heals could not keep me up on a small pack of gold and 3 slivers cause cc and dead

Edited by higginsjf
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Hear hear. I'm sure they could have implemented a nerf that wouldn't have brought the sky down for most casuals, but for some reason, they are insistent upon making all changes without any player input, and then notifying us a day beforehand. Has it ever worked well for them?

 

I agree completely. This is not an effective way to make corrections in a game, or in any kind of organizational endeavor for that matter.

 

Admittedly, the companions needed down-tuning. But not dramtic over-correction. The change should have been incremental. I've seen this kind of thing before. The development team might think that bracketting their corrections dramtically like this allow them to hit a 'goldilocks' tune point psychologically with the player base at some point. Thats failed thinking. All they will do instead is disenfranchise the player base. Ultimately, tha includes players on both sides of the issue.

 

These changes should have been implemented in PTS first. And they should not have been so dramatic. Since they have already made the mistake of a dramtic, un-tested correction with the live audience, the only choice they have now is to immediately publish a partial correction the other way.

 

This is not smart project management. Next time, make your changes incrememntal

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Though this will get lost, missed, or just plain not paid attention too, because so many upset customers and of course our friendly trolls lighting up the thread, I'll try anyway. I have nothing else to do right now since, like yesterday, I simply don't have any desire to play this game right now.

 

I have 3 accounts, all on 6 month auto renew, have paid and played since launch. I have multiple characters of every class and play them all. I play 99% solo because that's my game style. My pace, my enjoyment, not rushed through content or pretty scenery by other players telling me to spacebar through things, skip this, skip that, let's go,,,

 

One of the games within the game I play on my own is, bringing up each class from 1 to 60 (most were up to 55 which was max level at the time), without one single defeat. Just a goal I set for myself and accomplished on all classes. That's one way I enjoy playing, setting little games within the game for myself to accomplish.

 

I don't PvP and I don't run OP's, so when the game is developed with PvP or OP's as part of the requirements, I click the "Untrack" button, and never give it another thought. I'm not going to get M1-4X on any character other then my Troopers and I'm not going to get Pierce on any of my characters other then my Warriors. Because I'm not going to sign up for 20 matches of PvP which I have no clue nor desire to do, and ruin a PvP players game experience.

 

That said, my game experience for some reason is being toyed with by the trolling on these forums. I will not partake in their parts of the game, such as, PvP and OP's, why they feel the need to tell me how to play solo is beyond me. They come into the threads and tell people to L2P, make friends and group, and so on. In chat, on Fleet, you'll see many times "Need 2 dps, 1 Heal, 2 Tanks for (enter OP here), know fights, be geared, and don't suck", yes, that's the kind of group I want to spend money and an afternoon playing with,,, play how you want, I'm trying to play how I want, and as it is now, since patch 4.0.2, I can no longer play how I want, nor do I have the desire to.

 

All that said, I spent most of last night watching and participating on the Forum Threads, something I've never done in the 4 years I've been here. Why? Because I, like so many others, have lost the desire to log in and play the game.

I read in some of the posts last night, that the forums were lighting up a couple of weeks ago, by the pro-nerf crowd, demanding that Companions be nerfed. I didn't know there was a problem and people were complaining. Why? Because I was finally enjoying this game in the way I've wanted to since day one. I've paid my subscriptions to date with the hopes that this game would get better and better. It finally reached a point that I was fully enjoying building up Alliances and running the weeklies to get what was needed for my Alliance. I felt I was getting my monies worth for the first time in 4 years.

 

Then Black Tuesday hit. I finally logged into the game around 1am last night, played a level 38 Merc I'm leveling up and went to Hoth. Several times, I had to use my own off-heals to help Mako heal me. When fighting the one-eyed guy, elite, I actually had to pop Heroic moment, use my 15 seconds shield, apply my own off-heals, all because Mako (Influence 22) couldn't keep up with a simple fight. This is not entertainment. Sorry for those of you who want to play a game like that. Well, I'm not sorry, it is what you want, but it's not what I want.

 

I've already posted in other threads that I took two of my best geared (220's, 216's and some 208's) through the Star Fortress H2, they couldn't get past the Champion Zakuul Paladins, after 3 defeats on each, the longest I could last was about a minute, using all CD's, off-heals (which were better then Lana's heals), Heroic Moment, and so on, I'm guessing I hit just about everything I had at my disposal, to no avail. This is what I pay money for? So now I can't see what's beyond the door he's blocking unless I group with someone? Someone who is then going to tell me how fast we're going to go, which way we're going to do it, and then they "Need" on every single drop, green or otherwise? No thank you, if I can't do it on my own, at my own pace, then it's not worth it. I understand, and expect, to have to do a bit more then I did on Tython, or Coruscant, or heck, even Yavin 4. But remember, I am a Jedi, or a Sorcerer, or a Warrior, etc. I am being told by Lana when she breaks me out of Carbonite, I'm worth saving. Right now, my characters may as well look like Elmer Fudd hunting Wabbit's because that's how my characters feel to me.

 

Good luck with the fix, but most of all fix it,,,

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Also people posting something like "companions suck now! sub cancelled!" and nothing else need to grow up. Give actual feedback or don't bother wasting space with a worthless post.

 

to be totally fair, that is viable feedback from a paying customer. if a barman served me half a pint of ale and then tried to charge me for the full pint, words would be short and payment refused.. this is no different.

 

besides, they don't need detailed feedback, they already know what the issue is, this is just a feeble attempt to indirectly validate their actions, and try to minimise acceptance of a big mistake on their part..

Edited by cambul
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Your level : 65

 

Roughly Average Item Rating : 216 with a 220 main hand

 

Discipline : Deception Assassin

 

Companion : Lana

 

Companion role : Healer

 

Companion Influence level : 48

 

Which Mission : Star Fortress Heroic 2+

 

Your personal experience while playing this content :

 

I did the Aldreraan SF on Heroic twice. First time was with no buffs. I found that moving through was no problem. The knights were about the same as before the patch. I did the Praetorian Skyguard with no problem. However the Paladins were impossible. I tried everything I could think of but could not defeat them. Passed by these guys on to the end. Got through the reactors ok. The Exarch fight was a little longer than before the patch but I defeated him no problems. Health never went below 80% except for the paladins which I died on.

 

Second time through was with the buffs. Pretty much the same experience with the same results. Could defeat everything albeit a little easier this time except for the paladins. Even with the sliced medpack and heroic moment I got my *** handed to me. These guys are way overtuned IMO. I finished this run as well by defeating end boss.

 

I am sure someone will call BS or flame it but that was my experience on my two solo runs.

Edited by dlcman
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Eric, I'm a lvl 65 shadow tank with a gear lvl of 216 and above that is mostly optimized for dtps. I know my class very well and just finished the tatooine heroic star fortress. Now it didn't give me the achievement "one for all", but i did do it with out the buffs and equipment. I don't really care about the achievement, I just wanted to see if it was possible now after the patch. I use Nico for my companion and have his influence at 45 in heal stance. With that said the companions are not bad for my tank. However, On any of my other toons like my TK sage that i know very well, I would never be able to make it through that. Also on my Healer sage that is in 208 and above, with lana at 10., there are a few heroics that i can't do like vipers nest on makeb i believe.
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Right now the current setup of the Companions are next to worthless. as a healer they tend to under heal and generally for all 3 roles they tend to die faster since the patch came out.

 

Yes, i agree the Companions were overpowered when KotFE came out, but if BioWare wants to nerf the Companions they should have revert the General Stats as they were before KofFE so players could determine if they want their Companions suck or not with what type of gear/weapons players gives them which effects their Stats... not just plain universally suck as the Dev's gave with the basic non change stats (except level scale) that they got... my Companions performed far alot better before KotFE than they are right now after this patch.

 

The only change i did like for the Companions on KotFE is the ability to change their roles to fit the style that players want them in.

Edited by Dalapoism
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Hey folks,

 

Following the Companion changes we made Tuesday in 4.0.2, we want to gather your feedback on your gameplay experiences. We hope by this point you have had some time to jump in and get your hands on the changes yourselves. First, before we get into the feedback we are looking for, let’s talk a bit about our specific design goals related to Companions:

 

  • Leveling Content – Challenge Level: Low. To complete this content, a player should have a basic understanding of game mechanics and have level-appropriate gear. Their companion’s role shouldn’t matter.
  • KotFE Chapters – Challenge Level: Low. Like leveling content, a player should have a basic understanding of game mechanics and have level-appropriate gear. Their companion’s role shouldn’t matter.
  • [Heroic 2] Missions – Challenge Level: Medium. To complete this content, a player should have a good understanding of their class and game mechanics, as well as level appropriate gear. Their companion’s role should begin to matter at this point, supplementing the player’s own Discipline. We expect some players to find these challenging initially—maybe even needing a friend’s help--but once the player earns better gear, a few levels of Influence with their companion, and has a greater understanding of the game, they should be able to solo the hardest of these missions.
  • Star Fortress – Challenge Level: Medium. These are similar to [Heroic 2] Missions. Star Fortresses should be similar to [Heroic 2] Missions. To complete this content, we expect you to have level-appropriate gear, a good understanding of your class, a companion with a few levels of Influence, as well as being in a role that supplements the player’s. We expect most players to be able to solo these with a little practice and effort on their part to gain some increased power.
  • Heroic Star Fortress – Challenge Level: High. At this point we expect players to really understand their class, their companion, and their gear. Players should have sought out gear upgrades, as well as increased their companions’ Influence level. These are meant to be challenging and difficult to do solo.
  • “The One and Only” Achievement should still be possible. As an Achievement, this is definitely intended to be extremely hard and rewarding to players. This means the Achievement can be exceptionally challenging, and similar to HM Star Fortress, you will need to be a skilled player, with moderate to high Influence level with your companion, and very good gear on your character.

Based on these statements above, do you think that these are true after Tuesday’s changes? What content is more or less difficult than you expected? Is there something that is just flat out impossible?

 

Please give us your feedback, and we simply ask you to be as constructive as possible. Include information such as:

  • Your level
  • Roughly Average Item Rating
  • Discipline
  • Companion
  • Companion role
  • Companion Influence level
  • Which Mission or Star Fortress are you playing (Solo Mode? Heroic Mode?)
  • Your personal experience while playing this content

If you have a video or other related content to go with your feedback, feel free to link that as well as it will allow us the best insight into your experiences.

 

The team will be reviewing all feedback, along with supporting data, to see what / if any future adjustments need to be made. Thank you all in advance for your feedback!

 

-eric

 

Ok where do we send videos?

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I'll post a more detailed post later, but I just wanted to get in here and voice my opinion on the companion nerf. I've run several characters through the heroics since the nerf, and while it's not *impossible* it just isn't *fun* anymore. It was fun being able to dash through content I've been doing for almost four years and be able to grind up my alliance as quickly as I could manage it. Now it's slow, tedious and mind-numbingly dull. During 4.0 I logged into each of my 61's+ and ran through as many heroics as I could to try and level my alliances and was having FUN doing it. Now? I can barely get through 4 planets before I want to scratch my eyes out. It takes *too long* to accomplish and not everyone has 10-20+ hours a week to dedicate to the game. I play mostly healers and our defenses and dps are next to nothing. I get that not everything should be easy-mode, and I don't want it to be, but content that I've been running for almost four years isn't something I want to get stuck on or die repeatedly or slog through, either.

 

Plus....KOTFE and the companion nerf is NOT alt friendly, and considering they just bumped up the character slots to 40? There is no chance, at all, that anyone will be willing to run all those heroics hundreds if not thousands of times to level all the alliances up without the 4.0 companions or something close to it. It's too time consuming and makes me want to huddle in a corner and cry uncontrollably. I've only gotten one character through KOTFE and was trying to max their alliance influence before I moved onto the next one (I have 10+ level 60-65s) and there is very little chance I'll be running the heroics enough to get most of them to 10, let alone 20, with the way things are now. I just can't force myself to do it. And that makes me really sad. Maybe when the dust settles on this catastrophe and I have nothing else to do when I log on, I'll run a few. But it won't be something I grind and grind and grind to try and max out.

 

I've been here since Early Access 2011, I've never unsubbed during that time and I've loved SWTOR since the first day I played. But since the nerf, I find myself not really wanting to do much and it saddens me. I won't unsub, but I probably won't be logging on as often as I did during 4.0, either.

 

Most of my friends haven't logged on, except for our usual raid times, since the nerf. The GTN on The Harbinger has taken a hit. The volume has definitely gone down. People are not logging in, people are not playing as much. This needs to change. And it needs to change fast, or it's going to damage the population, possibly even beyond repair.

 

I agree that companion heals were way OP in 4.0. But to swing that nerfbat and hit them for 75% is insane. The change was too dramatic, too great, and it's affecting the gameplay for a lot of people. Maybe there should be a buff that we can toggle on or off, kinda like the 12xp thing that you could buy from that vendor. The buff could make companions OP again and then there could be something that turns it off. That way we can still blow through the content if we are pressed for time or want to grind alt alliances, or we can do it the hard, time consuming way if we want a challenge. That way everyone is happy.

 

Please buff them back up or give us a way to make them stronger again.

Edited by blindxsecrets
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Level: 65

Item Rating: 216/220 augmented

Discipline: mains are Sage, Sorc, Shadow

Companion: Nadia, Senya, Lana

Companion role: Tank

Companion Influence level: 35-50

 

The issue seems to have been very specific: players on a character in either tank or dps spec, with their companion set to a healing role, in H2+ Star Fortress, felt overpowered. Not many people were complaining about playing a healing class with a companion in tank role, or other combinations. But you nerfed companions across the board, so that even running vanilla planet heroics became a chore. With a DPS class and a tank companion, we need to stop and rest after every single fight. Nobody was asking for that. It's not challenging, it's just tedious. These are missions we run dozens of times a day, and they do not really factor into the overall challenge level of the game.

 

Try addressing the issue people brought up: that healing was a little too strong in certain situations that should have been more challenging with that player-companion spec setup. Nerfing across the board just lets us know you don't understand your own content, how people play it, and what we hope to get from the game in general.

 

Tanks suck now. I don't know what you're on about saying they hold aggro better now - they do not. I constantly pull aggro from them with even a little AoE on any mob they are not directly wailing on. Their health pool and defense are too low to do their job effectively. Nadia, for example, does not heal herself, and I certainly don't heal her as an Infil Shadow. She never felt overpowered to me, and now she feels underpowered, because you nerfed her, because Senya was healing a little.

 

Maybe stop and think a bit about what the actual problems are, and then put up some changes on Test, and see how folks like them, instead of blasting out a knee-jerk overreaction and then having to come ask again if it's okay.

 

Here's an idea: strongly couple the influence mechanic to companion performance. If folks feel like they need more from their companion, raise their influence. If they feel like they're fine, don't raise their influence. I know that this is what you said you designed, but you've put yourself in the bind of wanting us to blow tons of time and money raising influence. Give up on that grind. Make influence actually matter, and give us direct control of companion performance via that rating. Or just give us a slider, for crying out loud.

Edited by Furiant
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  • Your level
  • Roughly Average Item Rating
  • Discipline
  • Companion
  • Companion role
  • Companion Influence level
  • Which Mission or Star Fortress are you playing (Solo Mode? Heroic Mode?)
  • Your personal experience while playing this content

 

 

  • 65
  • 218
  • Sorc heals
  • Scorpio
  • tank (have also tried dps)
  • 50 influence
  • solo and heroic
  • I have loved everything about the game, including the ability to solo the content you said we'd have fun doing solo. Which I in fact did, and wanted to continue doing.
    After the patch, nothing. Nothing at all is enjoyable. One would think a companion with max lvl influence would make things just a little more smooth. Nope. Thank you for ruining it for me, and all my other friends, who mirror my statement.

 

OR

You could also, if you felt like it, refer to the 47+ pages of people who already answered this question for you, in the general discussion forums, which your company has decided to move to "Off-Topic"

 

....But thats none of my business

**sips tea**

 

 

(link for the forum topic mentioned above for the people who don't want to go looking for it: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=854139)

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Level: 65

Item Rating: 216/220 vendor, all augmented

Discipline: Sorc

Companion: Talos

Companion role: Heals

Companion Influence level: 50 (Presence 3392)

 

Not going to go into too much detail but overall, in my opinion, the adjustments to companions went a bit too far. They needed to be tuned not destroyed. I feel bad for people with worse gear, influence and presence since while I could complete my objectives it was a pain and annoying and oh so long. I don't want a total cakewalk but for grinding rep this seems a bit much.

 

My experience: Talos sees me dying. Talos stares at me. Talos thinks about healing me. Talos starts to heal me. Too late Talos, I'm dead. I hate you Talos.

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Your level: 65

Roughly Average Item Rating: 216, 200 augs

Discipline: Gunslinger sharpshooter

Companion Senya

Companion role DPS/TANK/HEAL

Companion Influence level 50

Which Mission or Star Fortress are you playing (Solo Mode? Heroic Mode?) Star heroic one for all,Star heroic solo (buffs etc)

Your personal experience while playing this content

 

One for all SF heroic was a challenge. There is very little room for error in this mode as any mistake would cost you . Most difficult was the final boss due to senya getting herself killed or by her randomly standing idle not doing anything(not healing me). Most of the instance was done with senya in DPS mode and I switched her to healer on boss/mini boss fights (except droid she was dps there). Now that I have done one for all (didnt do it pre patch) I have no reason or incentive to to do it again. IMO I wouldve enjoyed it more if senya's healing wasnt so lack luster and buggy, that made it frustrating. Oh and as a lvl 50 healer her biggest crit on me was 6.5k lol.

 

SF heroic with buffs etc: No problems here solo breezed through.

 

Heroic 2 missions: Now I enjoy doing these and still kinda do but since the patch I have had to adjust the way I do some of the heroics. When on a mission where i use a healer, if there is more than one mob on me I feel my comp cant keep up with the damage. She is just slow and sluggish to heal.

 

Reading KOTF changes is what got me to resub to swtor and when it dropped it was absolutely brilliant. Post patch I still enjoy it but the comp Nerf has most definitely taken the shine off .

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i found a great use for the companion.. sent him to craft while i just got on and played solo with no extra dps, tankage or healing at my side. I got superb results from my companion, and was able make a few nice things.

 

Where i would LIKE my companion though is at my side doing 75% at least as well as they did before 4.0.2, not 75% less.

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[*]Heroic Star Fortress – Challenge Level: High. At this point we expect players to really understand their class, their companion, and their gear. Players should have sought out gear upgrades, as well as increased their companions’ Influence level. These are meant to be challenging and difficult to do solo.

[*]“The One and Only” Achievement should still be possible. As an Achievement, this is definitely intended to be extremely hard and rewarding to players. This means the Achievement can be exceptionally challenging, and similar to HM Star Fortress, you will need to be a skilled player, with moderate to high Influence level with your companion, and very good gear on your character.

 

-eric

 

This is where you people in Bioware dropped the ball.

 

You fail to understand that a big portion of the current player base is absolutely NOT inclined to go through the process you describe here. They want everything, they want it now and they want it without having to invest anything in terms of effort or time. Just read the majority of the posts on these boards.

 

You brought this on yourselves. In true Bioware fashion you shipped 4.0 with utterly broken companions without any real testing prior to release. You tried to fix the issue with a method resembling a raging bull in a porcelain store (regarding the healing aspect) and all hell broke loose.

 

And now, you ask us to do YOUR job and test the system.

Edited by Galentor
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Just did H2 Nar Shadaa SF with my wife (2 dps chars)... 2 gold mobs kill inf 15 tank companion in about 5 seconds no matter healing one output, over DPS a DPS spec Sorc healing + "heal companion" - grapple bug + AOE clearing of normal mobs with CC gold = wipe even grouped if not have legacy perks (HM & Unity).

 

Before that tried leveling lvl 30 TK Sage... with inf 1 companion - borrrring ... companion may be passive fluff for all that matters.

Tank - stays and watch till I kill half of the mobs then jump on 1 of them and I kill rest till "tank" kill 1 normal mob.

Dumbest AI possible...

Aggro ... laugh.

DPS - output is laughable.

Heal - take damage from mobs I don't hit yet and start self healing with about 1% HPS = better aggro management from tank role if I am not using AOE (maybe 10-20% of leveling fights).

Leveling is as I said tedious and boring due to recuperating after fights... and annoyance from companions bugs and cut output.

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