KoTFE for all classes, what if Lana and Theron ...

[MusicRider]

TL;DR:

KoTFE was a very good and fun story to play. But it makes more sense if you are a force user class and not so much otherwise. I think the only thing that would help is if in the end of the current chapters your character does not become the leader of the Alliance. Instead it is Lana Beniko who remains the commonly accepted leader with possibly Theron being the deputy leader; and your character stays the Outlander, the most valuable asset and the first and last hope of defeating the Eternal Empire. This would make every class perfectly viable for this role and the story should fit very nicely indeed.

 

What people think?

 

 

Some further thoughts.

Lana has done all the hard work to bring this alliance together, so the people trust her in one way or another. She is a Sith but often confused for a Jedi due to her character, which would make another interesting story whether as a light side character you bring her completely to the LS or as a dark side one she becomes more cruel. On top of that, your character without being the leader has complete freedom to act as he/she pleases, still having the responsibility of defeating the EE but without the stress of a leader. And due to this freedom, it can make some interesting development, operate from the shadows, take more active role in the military, espionage, politics, whatever. Your opinion still matters to Lana, and would be fun if there is a romantic relationship when you disagree. Also it would be interesting to see conversations of Lana and Theran defending you to the alliance members that might have doubts about your "prophecy".

 

Overall, I think that it would be not only more convincing for a non-force user but also open up some very interesting story lines.

[lokdron]

Its simple the reason why you are the leader is because you are the one constantly saving the galaxy and on the front lines. They will not follow anyone else.

 

Lana light side? Not gonna happen she is a sith and empire patriot and is still all about hate to quote the jedi knight to the imperial mole on zoist "Lana may seem like a nice sith lord but if she finds out she will eviscerate you." which she asks you to do on the empire side.

 

She is just a realist that everyone has to work together to defeat zakuul and my sith inqusitor agrees.

Edited November 10, 2015 by lokdron

[SerraShar]

I be happy if they ditch the 'Outlander' title..since I find it soo boring . And just call us with Titles we actually earned and killed for . Aka Nox , wrath , Hunter..and so on .

[lokdron]

I be happy if they ditch the 'Outlander' title..since I find it soo boring . And just call us with Titles we actually earned and killed for . Aka Nox , wrath , Hunter..and so on .

 

Yeah that's too expensive we are ALL the outlander now we have to live with it. Plus story wise the zakuul people who currently control the galaxy don't give a toss about our old titles.

 

Example

 

SW: I am the empire's wrath!

 

Zakuul Npc: Who? Never heard of you.

[Yermog]

Yeah that's too expensive we are ALL the outlander now we have to live with it. Plus story wise the zakuul people who currently control the galaxy don't give a toss about our old titles.

 

Example

 

SW: I am the empire's wrath!

 

Zakuul Npc: Who? Never heard of you.

 

Yeah, members of the old factions (Republic, Empire) would probably recognize the old titles, but being called the Outlander gives the character universal recognition amongst everyone.. Plus "Outlander" is a unifying name. Being called the Empire's Wrath would just remind the Pubs that they used to be on opposite teams.

[MusicRider]

Its simple the reason why you are the leader is because you are the one constantly saving the galaxy and on the front lines. They will not follow anyone else.

 

Lana light side? Not gonna happen she is a sith and empire patriot and is still all about hate to quote the jedi knight to the imperial mole on zoist "Lana may seem like a nice sith lord but if she finds out she will eviscerate you." which she asks you to do on the empire side.

 

She is just a realist that everyone has to work together to defeat zakuul and my sith inqusitor agrees.

 

IMO you don't need the title and the responsibility of leader in order to "save the galaxy". Look for example Luke, he was not the leader of the rebels. And not to mention that field commanders are never the overall commanders of an organisation due to obvious reasons.

 

Regarding Lana, she is DS 1 and many Siths and much more hard core than her have been brought to the LS. Not to mention that a romantic relation might have something to do with it.

[MusicRider]

On the topic of the title the "Outlander" although it might not sound as fancy as the previous ones it is a fitting one, the character is an Outlander to Zakuul. Can't recall though who coined it first, probably Arkann after the murder of Valkorion in the scene in the throne room. Plus Zakuul people have no clue about what a Jedi or a Sith are, there is a dialog with a bartender woman in one of the pubs in Zakuul.

[Lazproperty]

Lana has done all the hard work to bring this alliance together, so the people trust her in one way or another. She is a Sith but often confused for a Jedi due to her character, which would make another interesting story whether as a light side character you bring her completely to the LS or as a dark side one she becomes more cruel.

 

I think Lana is fine how she is presently, no need to turn her light or dark like a Jaesa 2.0, her views are already firmly set and she's not some gullible padawan.

Edited November 11, 2015 by Lazproperty

[MusicRider]

I think Lana is fine how she is presently, no need to turn her light or dark like a Jaesa 2.0, her views are already firmly set and she's not some gullible padawan.

 

I agree, and personally I wouldn't change her either as the way she currently is makes her an interesting character. However, there is no harm having the option, or having a pseudo-option in the sense of trying to change her but failing to do so, as you well pointing out she is already a firmly developed character; this could lead to some interesting conversations though IMO, such as about Jedi and Republic vs Sith and Empire structures and ideals. Plus staying on opposite sides I think makes a romantic relationship more interesting.

[Lazproperty]

I agree, and personally I wouldn't change her either as the way she currently is makes her an interesting character. However, there is no harm having the option, or having a pseudo-option in the sense of trying to change her but failing to do so, as you well pointing out she is already a firmly developed character; this could lead to some interesting conversations though IMO, such as about Jedi and Republic vs Sith and Empire structures and ideals. Plus staying on opposite sides I think makes a romantic relationship more interesting.

 

I could see the benefit of this but more so on the republic side, the JK can make attempts at the end of SoR for example, something like 'hope you'll turn light side one day heh so I could teach you wink wink". However I don't see much logic in Sith characters trying to turn Lana more dark than she is, since she's already a sith.

[DudeinFlames]

I don't know how you didn't notice, but Lana doesn't lead because Lana can't lead. She has next to no people skills. Realize that in about a week or two you became literally the best friend she's ever had, regardless of how you talk to her, in SoR. And yes, while that can be argued to be, quite frankly, terrible writing, it's still true. That's sad. That's beyond sad.

 

In contrast, you're a leader. You're the only person who got the the Republic and the Empire to work together; it wasn't the thought of being eaten alive. Also classes are also given many leadership roles, interpersonal with Republic and Imperial soldiers mind you.

 

Lana's a good support character, and she plays that role well, but she isn't a leader. It's nice that she was able to gather the Alliance, but that doesn't mean she could have done that without dropping your name several times, let alone hold it together and convince them all to follow her. Whereas the Outlander is a living legend that has already saved the galaxy on several occasions that both the Empire and the Republic can relate with. Making them the leader is a no brainer. They aren't going to follow anyone else.

[MusicRider]

I could see the benefit of this but more so on the republic side, the JK can make attempts at the end of SoR for example, something like 'hope you'll turn light side one day heh so I could teach you wink wink". However I don't see much logic in Sith characters trying to turn Lana more dark than she is, since she's already a sith.

 

Maybe. but remember there are different shades of Sith. Lana seems to be patriotic and far from being chaotic and bloodthirsty than the majority of her fellow Sith, maybe cruel at times hence her DS 1. So, if your PC is too DS then it could be a case of trying to lure her into a more chaotic state, something of course that would fail. In fact insisting too much on changing her either as a Jedi or a Sith could have a negative impact in the case of a romantic relationship. IMO Lana and Marr have not been the usual stereotype of Siths, and if they were born in the Republic side they probably would have actually been and remained Jedis.

[MusicRider]

I don't know how you didn't notice, but Lana doesn't lead because Lana can't lead. She has next to no people skills. Realize that in about a week or two you became literally the best friend she's ever had, regardless of how you talk to her, in SoR. And yes, while that can be argued to be, quite frankly, terrible writing, it's still true. That's sad. That's beyond sad.

 

In contrast, you're a leader. You're the only person who got the the Republic and the Empire to work together; it wasn't the thought of being eaten alive. Also classes are also given many leadership roles, interpersonal with Republic and Imperial soldiers mind you.

 

Lana's a good support character, and she plays that role well, but she isn't a leader. It's nice that she was able to gather the Alliance, but that doesn't mean she could have done that without dropping your name several times, let alone hold it together and convince them all to follow her. Whereas the Outlander is a living legend that has already saved the galaxy on several occasions that both the Empire and the Republic can relate with. Making them the leader is a no brainer. They aren't going to follow anyone else.

 

That's far from true. She was the one that worked towards bringing this alliance together prior to the PC arrival, yes with the promise that there is a chosen one, while the chosen one was in carbonite the whole time. Her diplomacy and espionage skills are excellent and shown in a number of occasions. She is basically a Sith agent. Also, consider that the chosen ones never needed the title of leader (repeat see Luke and Anakin for example), and the contrary they had the freedom to work independently without the responsibilities of leader.

 

Also saying that Lana had no friends is not really a valid argument as none in the Sith society actually has friends. In fact Lana is probably the only one that made friendships with Theron, the PC, then Marr and in KoTFE with Koth and Senya. In fact the contrary, look at the story of the inq for example, there are 0 friends excluding the forced companions which most of them would gladly throw them out of the airlock.

Edited November 11, 2015 by MusicRider

[DudeinFlames]

That's far from true. She was the one that worked towards bringing this alliance together prior to the PC arrival, yes with the promise that there is a chosen one, while the chosen one was in carbonite the whole time. Her diplomacy and espionage skills are excellent and shown in a number of occasions. She is basically a Sith agent. Also, consider that the chosen ones never needed the title of leader (repeat see Luke and Anakin for example), and the contrary they had the freedom to work independently without the responsibilities of leader.

Which has nothing to do with the interpersonal skills required to actually be a leader. The skills required to be diplomatic are nowhere near the same that are required to lead troops into battle and encourage bravery. The ones need to communicate a sense of camaraderie and openness are. Do you think Octavian built his empire from the ground up, or do you think he had people much more experienced people handle the details?

Also saying that Lana had no friends is not really a valid argument as none in the Sith society actually has friends. In fact Lana is probably the only one that made friendships with Theron, the PC, then Marr and in KoTFE with Koth and Senya. In fact the contrary, look at the story of the inq for example, there are 0 friends excluding the forced companions which most of them would gladly throw them out of the airlock.

Also not true. The fact that the Sith Empire fosters competition is not proof that they aren't, you know, normal and rational sentient beings who think similarly to the way we do. Lana also isn't friends with Marr, or even truly with Theron at this point. She's such great friends with Koth she supports ignoring and disagreeing with everything he says, including letting a few thousand people die, this of course having no impact on whether I agree this is logical; it's still not "friendly." Nox also has plenty of "friends." Not sure where you got that they don't from. Even in that story Zash seemed to have "friends," who surprising acted human despite the fact that they were Sith.

[Canareth]

Maybe. but remember there are different shades of Sith. Lana seems to be patriotic and far from being chaotic and bloodthirsty than the majority of her fellow Sith, maybe cruel at times hence her DS 1. So, if your PC is too DS then it could be a case of trying to lure her into a more chaotic state, something of course that would fail. In fact insisting too much on changing her either as a Jedi or a Sith could have a negative impact in the case of a romantic relationship. IMO Lana and Marr have not been the usual stereotype of Siths, and if they were born in the Republic side they probably would have actually been and remained Jedis.

 

Lana could be a Jedi if you cured her of the casual homicide.

 

Marr is a Sith war beast, through and through, including prosecuting much of the war on the Republic. The Cold War has only been in place for a decade and Marr has held his seat as head of defense for four of them.

[Anysao]

I be happy if they ditch the 'Outlander' title..since I find it soo boring . And just call us with Titles we actually earned and killed for . Aka Nox , wrath , Hunter..and so on .

Actually, there's a reason. I learned from one of the Star Fortress Old God lore objects that "Outlander" is actually a significant title to the people of the Zakuul Empire. If you're called an Outlander, it's not a good thing.

[DAWUSS]

I be happy if they ditch the 'Outlander' title..since I find it soo boring . And just call us with Titles we actually earned and killed for . Aka Nox , wrath , Hunter..and so on .

 

We've progressed from "Outlander" to "Commander"

[lokdron]

Don't get this lana light side talk and if you look closer lana actually has white veins around her cheeks along with the sith eyes in the expansion. Lana is still an evil sith lord she casually commits homocide, allows thousands of people to die for the sake of her objective and is willing to manipulate "allies" if it benefits the sith and the empire.

 

Yeah.... she is far from the light in my opinion faar from it she is just a sith with a head on her shoulders and that's how most sith rise to power actually having some form of sense. She still believes in using hatred and having no mercy for your enemies.

 

Marr? is still an evil sith he is just more of a warlord than a politician and actually has some form of sense hence why he is dark council member. He is still an evil sith lord example heeey lets crash my ship into another ship to murder as many of the enemy as possible oh the soldiers on the ship? Doesn't matter they are soldiers they will die don't care if they don't have time to evacuate.

 

Plus on Balmorra how do you guess he will turn the captured jedi to the dark side? Remember the imperial guard during SOR? They are going to have a rough time.

 

I will say it again the outlander is leading because they were always in the limelight in the past leading and solving all the galactic issues for their faction and the larger galaxy. The alliance won't follow anyone else.

[SithKoriandr]

I don't know how you didn't notice, but Lana doesn't lead because Lana can't lead. She has next to no people skills. Realize that in about a week or two you became literally the best friend she's ever had, regardless of how you talk to her, in SoR. And yes, while that can be argued to be, quite frankly, terrible writing, it's still true. That's sad. That's beyond sad.

 

In contrast, you're a leader. You're the only person who got the the Republic and the Empire to work together; it wasn't the thought of being eaten alive. Also classes are also given many leadership roles, interpersonal with Republic and Imperial soldiers mind you.

 

Lana's a good support character, and she plays that role well, but she isn't a leader. It's nice that she was able to gather the Alliance, but that doesn't mean she could have done that without dropping your name several times, let alone hold it together and convince them all to follow her. Whereas the Outlander is a living legend that has already saved the galaxy on several occasions that both the Empire and the Republic can relate with. Making them the leader is a no brainer. They aren't going to follow anyone else.

 

I got the impression that a little more than two weeks go by in that time.

[MusicRider]

Which has nothing to do with the interpersonal skills required to actually be a leader. The skills required to be diplomatic are nowhere near the same that are required to lead troops into battle and encourage bravery. The ones need to communicate a sense of camaraderie and openness are. Do you think Octavian built his empire from the ground up, or do you think he had people much more experienced people handle the details?

[\quote]

Exactly. Never argued that Lana should be the field commander but rather the leader of the overall alliance, think of her filling in the shoes of Suresh. Again a field or platoon commander is never the leader of a faction for obvious reasons.

 

Also not true. The fact that the Sith Empire fosters competition is not proof that they aren't, you know, normal and rational sentient beings who think similarly to the way we do. Lana also isn't friends with Marr, or even truly with Theron at this point. She's such great friends with Koth she supports ignoring and disagreeing with everything he says, including letting a few thousand people die, this of course having no impact on whether I agree this is logical; it's still not "friendly." Nox also has plenty of "friends." Not sure where you got that they don't from. Even in that story Zash seemed to have "friends," who surprising acted human despite the fact that they were Sith.

 

I hope we don't think the same as the Sith... otherwise I have to eliminate my work colleagues before they do.

 

In any case my proposition was not to convince anyone, but rather a suggestion of an option. For sure on my inq I would take the leaders role and have more minions do my bidding. On my consular I would not, as a Jedi does not seek authority and power over others. Maybe field commander/general something like the role the Jedis were playing during the Clone wars. Same for my non-force users which is kind of unrealistic to put them in that position when there are more suitable people around.

[MusicRider]

Don't get this lana light side talk and if you look closer lana actually has white veins around her cheeks along with the sith eyes in the expansion. Lana is still an evil sith lord she casually commits homocide, allows thousands of people to die for the sake of her objective and is willing to manipulate "allies" if it benefits the sith and the empire.

 

Yeah.... she is far from the light in my opinion faar from it she is just a sith with a head on her shoulders and that's how most sith rise to power actually having some form of sense. She still believes in using hatred and having no mercy for your enemies.

 

Marr? is still an evil sith he is just more of a warlord than a politician and actually has some form of sense hence why he is dark council member. He is still an evil sith lord example heeey lets crash my ship into another ship to murder as many of the enemy as possible oh the soldiers on the ship? Doesn't matter they are soldiers they will die don't care if they don't have time to evacuate.

 

Plus on Balmorra how do you guess he will turn the captured jedi to the dark side? Remember the imperial guard during SOR? They are going to have a rough time.

 

I will say it again the outlander is leading because they were always in the limelight in the past leading and solving all the galactic issues for their faction and the larger galaxy. The alliance won't follow anyone else.

 

Absolutely. Lana and Marr are certainly DS, never said otherwise. This is due to the faction they grew up, which promotes that the means justify the cause. At the same time though they are not psycho egocentric power maniacs like the vast majority of the Sith, but rather more patriotic. Persuading them, or having the option to persuade them that "the cause justifies the means" is not the only way could have led them in a more neutral/LS alignment. In the case of Marr that would have been most certainly a failure, and most likely for Lana too. Still, it would give rise to some interesting dialogs in the process.

[Shayddow]

<<He is still an evil sith lord example heeey lets crash my ship into another ship to murder as many of the enemy as possible oh the soldiers on the ship? Doesn't matter they are soldiers they will die don't care if they don't have time to evacuate. >>

 

I think of it more in the classic content. Willing to sacrifice anything - to take down as many of the enemy with you.as possible. Propers to prior usage in Star Trek - TNG - by captain Picard -, in Star Trek, first contact <"perhaps this IS a good day to die - Worf">, and of course, the original - in Ben Hur.

[StarMagus]

Not gonna happen she is a sith and empire patriot and is still all about hate to quote the jedi knight to the imperial mole on zoist "Lana may seem like a nice sith lord but if she finds out she will eviscerate you." which she asks you to do on the empire side.

 

To be fair, stopping at Eviscerating a betrayer is pretty nice for a Sith Lord. The not nice ones torture you for years, and even go after you family. After they are done with you, the idea of just being eviscerated seems like the most pleasant thing in the world.

[SithKoriandr]

To be fair, stopping at Eviscerating a betrayer is pretty nice for a Sith Lord. The not nice ones torture you for years, and even go after you family. After they are done with you, the idea of just being eviscerated seems like the most pleasant thing in the world.

 

So true. Lana doesn't seem to draw it out (likely willing to torture for information) but when it comes to being a betrayer of the Empire or a Spy (both things considered kill worthy on both sides of the line), she doesn't draw it out she kills you! Sure the choking isn't instant, but it's not exactly strapping someone down on a table either.

[StarMagus]

Force Choking somebody to death is pretty much Standard Sith Punishment 101. You sort of have to force choke somebody every now and then to keep the other people in line and to remind the other sith that if you have to you'll force choke somebody who steps out of line. Ironically by killing somebody every now and then you limit the number of people you have to kill because the other Sith won't view you as weak and so won't constantly try to off you just to take your power.