jkutswings Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 An enormous amount of people are very enthusiastic about the direction that the new expansion is going. They played the daylights out of series like KOTOR, Mass Effect, and Dragon Age, and are geeked that SWTOR is including major elements of that nature, to continue the Bioware tradition. Another significant amount of people are more along the lines of traditional MMO fans, and feel that KotFE has focused on elements that they're less pleased with, at the expense of the features that they enjoy the most. Frankly, I wish EA / BW would've just made both games, doing justice to each niche, instead of what we have now. Don't get me wrong; many QoL aspects of 4.0 (and other recent patches) are fantastic, and I really like the story in SWTOR, particularly the 1-50 and the Dread Masters saga. I even like many parts of the tale they're telling in the expansion (just starting Chapter 7 at the moment, so I haven't seen it all, to be able to comment on the later parts). I'm just NOT AT ALL a fan of the vehicle they're using for telling that story. I'd honestly rather just pick up text quests from a daily hub than watch 2 minutes of a movie, then kill 3 easy mobs, then repeat over and over. But my point isn't to bash on KotFE, because the people that like the changes are equally entitled to their opinion. It's that while things like ops / PvP / conquest / stronghold decoration are all side aspects to the game, that people can either do or not do, the approach to the storyline is what really defines the game, and it's very unfortunate that they took a game that launched as a mess of an MMO, then tried to "kinda" turn it into an RPG, while still "kinda" keeping the MMO parts. It just feels like they're doing both halfway, instead of making the KOTOR 3 that the RPG fans really want, and going full-bore on the MMO that traditionalists want. Is it so wrong to want these two different games, each in all its glory, instead of the patchwork compromise we have? I mean, just as it wasn't fair to the "RPG crowd" to have to run DF/DP to see the full Dread Masters storyline in the 2.0 cycle, now it's not fair to the "MMO crowd" to sit through 10 hours of interactive YouTube, instead of actually questing in an open environment. Oh well. It's obviously not going to change, at least for the time being, but I do wish that the fundamental nature of the game could've been separated into two titles, so each legitimate camp could've gotten the game they really wanted. As it stands, I've gone from, "Maybe I'll sub again next spring" to, "Not happening until the next level cap increase." Life goes on, I guess... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuiwe Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 **** the "MMO" parts! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Djiini Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 KOTFE is the KOTOR 3 we all wanted to begin with, to be honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkutswings Posted October 29, 2015 Author Share Posted October 29, 2015 Very mature. I could just as easily bash on the RPG parts, but the whole point is that while you're free to like one or the other (or both, for that matter), it's a major disappointment to have a mediocre version of both, instead of a great version of each. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zakua Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 While I may not totally agree with you OP, well said. I feel as though BW can carry both aspects you describe with their current direction. Maybe ( as is the case with these first 9 chapters) they are unable to hammer out and release both styles of content simultaneously and plan to introduce new MMO content further down the road. This new path they have taken surely lends possibility to expand on and foster both styles. I hope to see more stuff period over time and I do not believe BW is done with any aspect of the game regarding MMO RPG. I don't like cut scene games much...not into ME or any of those other games you mentioned at all....ironic I guess because I claim to be a SW whore and do any and all things SW....besides the KOTOR games 0_o Yet here I am playing praise to the new cut scene expansion haha. I will admit it was a bit much at times but IMO had to happen to set the story in motion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IamLordeRandy Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 An enormous amount of people are very enthusiastic about the direction that the new expansion is going. They played the daylights out of series like KOTOR, Mass Effect, and Dragon Age, and are geeked that SWTOR is including major elements of that nature, to continue the Bioware tradition. Another significant amount of people are more along the lines of traditional MMO fans, and feel that KotFE has focused on elements that they're less pleased with, at the expense of the features that they enjoy the most. Frankly, I wish EA / BW would've just made both games, doing justice to each niche, instead of what we have now. Don't get me wrong; many QoL aspects of 4.0 (and other recent patches) are fantastic, and I really like the story in SWTOR, particularly the 1-50 and the Dread Masters saga. I even like many parts of the tale they're telling in the expansion (just starting Chapter 7 at the moment, so I haven't seen it all, to be able to comment on the later parts). I'm just NOT AT ALL a fan of the vehicle they're using for telling that story. I'd honestly rather just pick up text quests from a daily hub than watch 2 minutes of a movie, then kill 3 easy mobs, then repeat over and over. But my point isn't to bash on KotFE, because the people that like the changes are equally entitled to their opinion. It's that while things like ops / PvP / conquest / stronghold decoration are all side aspects to the game, that people can either do or not do, the approach to the storyline is what really defines the game, and it's very unfortunate that they took a game that launched as a mess of an MMO, then tried to "kinda" turn it into an RPG, while still "kinda" keeping the MMO parts. It just feels like they're doing both halfway, instead of making the KOTOR 3 that the RPG fans really want, and going full-bore on the MMO that traditionalists want. Is it so wrong to want these two different games, each in all its glory, instead of the patchwork compromise we have? I mean, just as it wasn't fair to the "RPG crowd" to have to run DF/DP to see the full Dread Masters storyline in the 2.0 cycle, now it's not fair to the "MMO crowd" to sit through 10 hours of interactive YouTube, instead of actually questing in an open environment. Oh well. It's obviously not going to change, at least for the time being, but I do wish that the fundamental nature of the game could've been separated into two titles, so each legitimate camp could've gotten the game they really wanted. As it stands, I've gone from, "Maybe I'll sub again next spring" to, "Not happening until the next level cap increase." Life goes on, I guess... Life sure does go on! Great insight :-) Hope you find something fun to do. I for one have brought a few friends back and we are having a blast with the alliance system, I am seeing no problem staying subed. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bdatt Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Is it so wrong to want these two different games, each in all its glory, instead of the patchwork compromise we have? I mean, just as it wasn't fair to the "RPG crowd" to have to run DF/DP to see the full Dread Masters storyline in the 2.0 cycle, now it's not fair to the "MMO crowd" to sit through 10 hours of interactive YouTube, instead of actually questing in an open environment. In essence you're asking EA to spend more money, and charge separately for two different games. Since I would ultimately play both I would prefer they just do one game justice on both ends: story and MMO elements (especially Ops). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sith_Ravager Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 **** the "MMO" parts! **** on the KOTOR wannabe... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sith_Ravager Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 KOTFE is the KOTOR 3 we all wanted to begin with, to be honest. Again with WE ALL...I was here when this first started, I was here before Beta...I Did NOT want a KOTOR 3,...I wanted a good Star Wars MMO... So no dont use things like WE ALL, say some, or a portion of the playerbase...but you damn well dont speak for all... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asroha Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 (edited) KOTFE is the KOTOR 3 we all wanted to begin with, to be honest. Yes, you finally got the game you wanted, congratulations. I only hope that as time moves forward you have enough people to play the game with, this game you always wanted... Edited October 29, 2015 by Asroha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuiwe Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 **** on the KOTOR wannabe... Indeed! **** the KoTOR wannabe too! Let me play multistory 1-50 goodness in peace and record my stories <3 ! I don't care for Arctur...woops!...Valkorion Meng...DAMN!...Emperor Valkorion either. But 1-50 is just so god dam precious. Losing it would be a real shame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Djiini Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Again with WE ALL...I was here when this first started, I was here before Beta...I Did NOT want a KOTOR 3,...I wanted a good Star Wars MMO... So no dont use things like WE ALL, say some, or a portion of the playerbase...but you damn well dont speak for all... Yes, 'we all', as in the majority. Because that is exactly what the vast majority wanted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sith_Ravager Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Yes, 'we all', as in the majority. Because that is exactly what the vast majority wanted. I dont know I see alot of people saying its not what they wanted... Again WE ALL denotes Everyone...which is obvious your wrong...I dont mind if you say the majority...but dont say we like everone thinks this is the "AWEZOMEZT STUFFZ EVERZ"..cause seriously we dont... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eillack Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 KOTFE is the KOTOR 3 we all wanted to begin with, to be honest. Who is this 'we all' you speak of? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldarion_Velator Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 I actually understand the OP's perspective, as it is one that I held before KotFE. But the more I think about it, the more I realize that the time and resources to make two separate games that SWTOR has somewhat merged simply don't exist. If, by some chance or fit of madness the head honchos at EA/BioWare had decided to make two separate games based on the "legacy of Revan" era, I suspect that neither game would have seen the light of day, or both would have died very quickly with no support. Only by making a single game could EA/BioWare actually make any money (i.e. continue to support a game with updates and expansions), and better that than gambling on two games and getting nothing at all. Many of the game's limitations (and I suspect that the developers/EA/BioWare feel the same way though they may not be able to comment on this directly) stem from the game's engine. Many threads have already discussed this at length, so I won't expand here, but I think the developers' seemingly limited ability to cater to *all* fractions of the player base stems from limitations imposed not by any person or group of people but rather by what they can and can't do in the game's own programming. Personally I think they're doing a fantastic job - I was disappointed at the MMO format of SWTOR (I am a KOTOR I and II player/modder) and for this reason I didn't start playing until late 2012/early 2013, and when the rumors started swirling around 4.0 I was used to the MMO format (and had spent the vast majority of my playtime in endgame) and was again apprehensive. But having played through the expansion, my confidence in the developers' programming abilities, responsiveness, and storytelling ability is higher than it has ever been. I am still a little apprehensive about the substantially greater time/effort I will have to spend on each of my characters getting them up to speed (pre-4.0 I had 13 level 60 characters, and was spending a little time leveling my 4 sub-50 characters; since early access I have gotten only 7 characters to 65, cleared chapters 1-9 on only 2, and have mostly cleared the new content to include the Star Fortress story arc in heroic mode on only my main character). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Djiini Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 (edited) Who is this 'we all' you speak of? I dont know I see alot of people saying its not what they wanted... Again WE ALL denotes Everyone...which is obvious your wrong...I dont mind if you say the majority...but dont say we like everone thinks this is the "AWEZOMEZT STUFFZ EVERZ"..cause seriously we dont... Well, let's see, the forum is the only place where I see people whining, the subreddit and in-game chat are nothing but praise... Almost as though it's full of self-entitled people, given it's the only place you have to be subscribed to post. Could that be it? Edited October 29, 2015 by Djiini Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlrikFassbauer Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Frankly, I wish EA / BW would've just made both games, doing justice to each niche, instead of what we have now. My personal interpretation is this : 1. Bioware wants to do an offline KOTOR 3 2. EA says : "no, no, we don't do *any* offline games anymore ! Everything must be online, because Online = DRM !" 3. Bioware changes SWTOR into SWKOTOR 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihilkult Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Sure two games would have been great but with our "friends" at EA thinking we're all multiplayer addicts, we got that. Could be much worse. I just hope they will cater some more content for mmo focused players because, well, I'm not into mmo myself anymore , I'm here because of Kotor but I don't see why mmo players should not have their share. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odyssys Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 One VERY Simply thing that would have made KotFE (and Shadows of Reven) awesome would be to allow you to quest with a group of friends through the content. Story Content is awesome and I think everyone agrees its the best part of SWTOR. We want to live and breath in the world and not experience the game through boring texted and fetch and gather quests like other MMOs. However what is not fun is being forced to do entire mini expansions solo. It would not have taken much more time to allow you to do this content in a group and not have to shift to a personal phase every 5 minutes or in KotFE case for the entire 9 chapters. My wife is very demotivated to play through KotFE more than once cause we can't experience it together. We loved playing through every story line together. We always played different classes so that we could join the other in their story mission and still experience it even if they were making all the choices and the cut scenes revolved around them. We had planned to come back to SWTOR for the next 4-6 months while waiting for the next wow expansion but I don't see us staying that long if all their is to do is solo 10 characters through a few hours of story content. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_Iurus Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 This is pretty much what they advertised the expansion would be. The point is that if you prefer the game content and the story, you can do that and it is enough. If you prefer the group content, you can do that instead. Either way, it's not difficult to gain the extra 5 levels so the expansion is not necessary for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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