Healing reduced by 30% in pvp. WHY!?

[GumBoil]

It most certainly is not fine... the only way i should be able to be killed by ANY amount of dps as a healer is if I get interrupted. If they don't interrupt me they should be punished by not being able to kill me ever. Even if it's the entire opposing team.

 

I think you would probably be better off with a single player game that has a god mode console cheat.

 

As a DPS I should be able to one shot anything.

 

As a control/support class I should be able to chain stun anything.

 

As a tank I should be able to jump into anything (even the entire opposing team) and walk out the other side unscathed.

 

Aint going to happen. This is a troll post right? No one in their right mind could really thing this could they?

[GumBoil]

Senefera is well known across a number of EU MMO servers as being a quality competitive PVP healer.

 

Senefera heals as well as you forum rage, so as you can see Senefera heals pretty well.

 

I'm sure he is a legend in his own underpants, we'll just have to take your word.

[Knifewrench]

It literally only absorbs 2k damage aka 1 hit.

 

One HUGE hit.

[CHRISGG]

One HUGE hit.

 

2k damage is a huge hit? Rofl every single class has a basic attack ability that crits for 2k.

[Painaid]

30% debuff is very, very dumb. Healing should punish players who ignore healers and simply tab target to the nearest enemy player. Right now, I can't heal through any sort of damage. Needless to say, I switched specs and stopped trying to heal. It's way too frustrating and underpowered in PvP.

 

Right now, healers can be completely ignored by DPS. The only real threat is the Guard mechanic of tanks when they apply this ON TOP OF healing.

Edited December 26, 2011 by Painaid

[Jooji]

30% debuff is very, very dumb. Healing should punish players who ignore healers and simply tab target to the nearest enemy player. Right now, I can't heal through any sort of damage. Needless to say, I switched specs and stopped trying to heal. It's way too frustrating and underpowered in PvP.

 

Right now, healers can be completely ignored by DPS. The only real threat is the Guard mechanic of tanks when they apply this ON TOP OF healing.

 

Or you're just bad and/or under-leveled. You can't expect to dominate as a healer before getting your main abilities. As an operative level 50 healer I do fine in warzones, typically having more healing than the highest dps has damage. Don't come on the forums screaming about a mechanic that you don't understand.

[CHRISGG]

typically having more healing than the highest dps has damage.

 

Guys, the scoreboard. My friends might die through my freecasted healing, BUT LOOK AT THAT SCOREBOARD.

[Bejita]

Its lowered by 30% because resilience in this game increases healing done on you, and at 50 you can still tank 3-5 bad players at once, atleast operatives can ive seen a ball carrying operative tank 6 people untill the time limit ran out and then the game killed him because the enemies couldnt

 

I dont even want to know how OP healers are with full expertise armor

[Jooji]

Guys, the scoreboard. My friends might die through my freecasted healing, BUT LOOK AT THAT SCOREBOARD.

 

If 3-4 dps are on your "friend" then you SHOULDNT be able to heal through the damage, unless he's a tank ofc. Now if you can't heal through 2 DPS on someone then chances are you just suck. I have no problem keeping my guildies up when 2 DPS are on then. 3 DPS is doable if we're CCing/stunning one of them as we can and kiting/LOSing.

[raelimar]

Its lowered by 30% because resilience in this game increases healing done on you, and at 50 you can still tank 3-5 bad players at once, atleast operatives can ive seen a ball carrying operative tank 6 people untill the time limit ran out and then the game killed him because the enemies couldnt

 

I dont even want to know how OP healers are with full expertise armor

 

You know that Expertise also increases damage dealt, yes? I'm not having a ton of issues on my Operative, aside from raid frames not updating properly, but this isn't a great argument.

 

On the subject of healing effectiveness in general...I'm finding it to be a very different experience from WoW. Not necessarily worse...just different. In WoW, my Disc Priest could tank multiple players and heal like crazy until I ran out of mana, but my Op still has several advantages over that model.

 

-More effective defensive cooldowns. Between Evasion, Cloaking Screen (this is the big one), and Shield Probe, I have more escapes. In WoW I basically had Barrier and Pain Suppression.

 

-Interrupts are far less punishing in this game. There are no "spell schools" - interrupts only lock out the one ability being cast.

 

-Limitless energy pool. If you know what you're doing as an Operative, you will not run out of energy...at least not in the traditional "out of mana" sense.

 

-Much, much better CC. Debilitate/Slip Away, Sever Tendon, Flashbang all make me very tough to pin down.

 

-Much better damage. I'm not one of those players that likes to DPS on their healer, but if I'm forced to actually fight someone, I can actually dish out some decent damage. My Explosive Probe + Snipe combo can push 3K+, Hidden Strike is in a similar range.

 

-PVP tanks! Grouping with a Powertech has been a huge boost to survivability.

 

Basically, the lower healing values are the one downside that I'm finding. Otherwise, it's a pretty fun experience.

Edited December 26, 2011 by raelimar

[Repefe]

30% debuff is very, very dumb. Healing should punish players who ignore healers and simply tab target to the nearest enemy player. Right now, I can't heal through any sort of damage. Needless to say, I switched specs and stopped trying to heal. It's way too frustrating and underpowered in PvP.

 

Right now, healers can be completely ignored by DPS. The only real threat is the Guard mechanic of tanks when they apply this ON TOP OF healing.

 

It's always ... healers mindlessly spam heal and dps players have to pay attention and be clever. When heales have to be clever ... it's dumb system And right now healers can't be ignored ... some healers can't be ignored.

[Lina_Inverse]

Whoever has mentioned the extreme effect that guard has on healers or the fact that expertise (the pvp stat) reduces this penalty substantially are the heroes of this thread. Without the penalty, and with the addition of guard, taunt, and expertise into the equation, I think you'll find most healers would be perilously strong.

 

Forget the notions garnered from past experiences in other games of healing being the only way to offset damage, for this is a different game and there are multiple stacking ways to mitigate and prevent it here.

Edited December 26, 2011 by Lina_Inverse

[Nalissi]

healing is fine. if it was anymore powerful it would be OP. I usually hit 200k heals and 150k damage in huttball or voidstar that are full length matches.

 

Healed for 300k and did 100k damage in that Cap and Hold "Titan" mode, the heals were mostly on just three people.

 

Sorry, but the 30% reduction makes no sense since realisticly that's 30% of your effectiveness down the drain.

 

Now I know why people QQ, if 2+ healers work together it can get quite annoying. Fact is tho, if you have 1 person on each healer using CC properly while DPS cycles they drop instantly.

 

I play a healer myself, I watch my target and the enemy healer/DPS at all times.

 

"Oh look he's going for a heal" and bam, he's interupted for 4 seconds, maybe a stun from my derp-stone, if I'm close I'll even knock them down. If he tries it again I stun him. At that time the target is most likely dead.

 

It doesn't take much to kill a healer, at all, you have to focus ALL the healers or at least make sure to save CC for both of them. Otherwise you're done.

 

Hell, I paired with another Sage and we completely locked down the enemy's heals. 2 stuns for 4 seconds, double stones (Forgot what the skill is called, throws a large object from out of the ground) while one of them always stuns in most cases, and 2 possible 4 second interuption/power block.

 

Or you do what people do to me if I'm the only healer, jump on my *** and don't get distracted and use CC when I'm going for heals rather then opening up with them.

[Tembian]

It most certainly is not fine... the only way i should be able to be killed by ANY amount of dps as a healer is if I get interrupted. If they don't interrupt me they should be punished by not being able to kill me ever. Even if it's the entire opposing team.

 

But but ...that is just an opinion...

[Nalissi]

Whoever has mentioned the extreme effect that guard has on healers or the fact that expertise (the pvp stat) reduces this penalty substantially are the heroes of this thread. Without the penalty, and with the addition of guard, taunt, and expertise into the equation, I think you'll find most healers would be perilously strong.

 

Forget the notions garnered from past experiences in other games of healing being the only way to offset damage, for this is a different game and there are multiple stacking ways to mitigate and prevent it here.

 

A better option is to provide healing debuffs that would have to be used properly, and expertise increases damage as well so that kinda nulls that subject completely.

 

It's not hard to fix, give classes possible debuffs to reduce healing done to a target with a decent CD. Hell, the debuff could be 50% but it wouldn't be a "Well I would have kept you alive, but, my healing is reduced by 30% at all times." and more-so of skill based play.

 

Problem solved, less QQ, and possible heavy countering to healing without being derp-tastic.

[Desgarden]

I want and am entitled to a THOROUGH explanation as to why this is necessary.

 

NOW.

 

Not later.

 

NOW.

 

Because it is a team based game and unlike as in WoW a healer is not supposed to be a raidboss who can tank several people and stay alive while keeping others alive as well.

 

I have a healer, too and it works just fine. However, you need more than usual to be successful: positioning, clever use of your cc and of course sometimes the help of your comrades (but they need you, too).

 

Oh, and if you have played WAR...well, just wait and see what healers with a guard can do.

Edited December 26, 2011 by Desgarden

[Hypernetic]

So they can balance healing in PVP without nerfing it in raiding? 30% is a large enough margin that small buffs here and there to help in PVE won't be so drastic in PVP.

 

Also expertise.

[Thaderin]

Because it is a team based game and unlike as in WoW a healer is not supposed to be a raidboss who can tank several people and stay alive while keeping others alive as well.

 

I have a healer, too and it works just fine. However, you need more than usual to be successful: positioning, clever use of your cc and of course sometimes the help of your comrades (but they need you, too).

 

Yeah, that's fine and all, but you need those abilities in every game. That's down to the player.

 

It's forced penalties for being a healer that is the problem here. It's basically punishing people for wanting to play a certain role.

 

Why not just have everyone allowed to be dps in pvp and be done with it. Seems to be the way mmo communities and devs want it to go. Then everyone can be Rambo!

[Nalissi]

Because it is a team based game and unlike as in WoW a healer is not supposed to be a raidboss who can tank several people and stay alive while keeping others alive as well.

 

I have a healer, too and it works just fine. However, you need more than usual to be successful: positioning, clever use of your cc and of course sometimes the help of your comrades (but they need you, too).

 

Oh, and if you have played WAR...well, just wait and see what healers with a guard can do.

 

Still doesn't explain why a 30% perma-debuff is required compared to possible debuffs that a player applies onto you.

 

As someone already stated, nerf damage by 30% and you'll hear about it just as much. People complain about healers because it's "Anti-fun" mostly since they have no idea how to counter it.

 

If 1 person is tanking 5+ people, they deserve to lose because they are clearly on the wrong target or that target is getting massively focus healed. (Again, meaning they are on the wrong target)

[Thaderin]

Whoever has mentioned the extreme effect that guard has on healers or the fact that expertise (the pvp stat) reduces this penalty substantially are the heroes of this thread. Without the penalty, and with the addition of guard, taunt, and expertise into the equation, I think you'll find most healers would be perilously strong.

 

Forget the notions garnered from past experiences in other games of healing being the only way to offset damage, for this is a different game and there are multiple stacking ways to mitigate and prevent it here.

 

Umm, every other mmo I've played has exactly the same alternative ways to offset damage. This is the first one I've played where they basically just go "screw you" to healers and reduce healing effectiveness across the board.

 

Oh, and no AAA western mmo with pvp is ever really different. They just gloss things over using lore/setting appropriate terminology.

[Thaderin]

One HUGE hit.

 

Compared to the amount of damage that is CONSTANTLY being dish out...no, that's not a huge hit.

[Thaderin]

Considering that I on my assassin more or less have the "Not enough force" message burned into my monitor, that's not a healing only issue.

 

True enough, but you're not the one everyone *****es at when they're dead.

[Podrik]

It most certainly is not fine... the only way i should be able to be killed by ANY amount of dps as a healer is if I get interrupted. If they don't interrupt me they should be punished by not being able to kill me ever. Even if it's the entire opposing team.

 

Holy paladin much?

[Thaderin]

That's what I would say fair... So that means if you put 2 DPS on 1 healer ... He's going down...

 

= Balanced to me...

 

No, if one dps player is enough to shut down a healer completely then frankly healing is underpowered.

 

Why?

 

Because there are always more dps players than healers so, if one dps is enough to stop a healer then two are just going to faceroll their skills until the healer is dead and move on with a hop, skip.

Edited January 7, 2012 by Qishari
inappropriate content, no further action due to age of the post

[Desgarden]

Still doesn't explain why a 30% perma-debuff is required compared to possible debuffs that a player applies onto you.

 

As someone already stated, nerf damage by 30% and you'll hear about it just as much. People complain about healers because it's "Anti-fun" mostly since they have no idea how to counter it.

 

If 1 person is tanking 5+ people, they deserve to lose because they are clearly on the wrong target or that target is getting massively focus healed. (Again, meaning they are on the wrong target)

 

I grant you that, that additional heal debuffs are over the top. However, I see no problem with the perma healdebuff. Sorry to point out Wow again: but just look there what happens if pve healing = pvp healing. It is totally imbalanced.

 

Let's assume for a second that you would have the same healing capacity as a WoW healer. Now add the tanks' guard ability to the scenario and you would have immortal healers for sure.

 

Summa summarum: the perma heal debuff is fine and the differentiation between pvp and pve healing is really well-done.

 

That's my opinion, though. I don't want to tell you how or what to think

 

 

No, if one dps player is enough to shut down a healer completely then frankly healing is underpowered.

 

Why?

 

Because there are always more dps players than healers so, if one dps is enough to stop a healer then two are just going to faceroll their skills until the healer is dead and move on with a hop, skip.

No, it is not underpowered.

 

Why?

 

1. Healing is still more powerful and efficient than dpsing. This means that the pressure of the dpser will decline at one point (BH's heat, agent's energy etc)

 

2. If a dpser can fully unload and pressure the healer than use your ccs your team mate has also cc

 

Seriously, a healer is not supposed to handle 2 guys alone. THAT would be overpowered.

 

 

What annoyed me, though, was when my healer was low level, that I had just that crappy long-time cast heal and it felt ages until I got my hot. Things got much better from that point onwards

Edited January 7, 2012 by Qishari
quoted inappropriate content