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How to Guide to BEAT Underlurker. Cancelling cross damage


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Hello all, This is my guide on what strategy to use to beat underlurker sm even with a bugged cross.

This strat uses 1 powertech tank 5 dps and 2 heals.

 

Step 1. Bring a powertech tank.

Step 2. Spec an ability point into Sonic Rebounder, in the masterful category.

Step 3. You must kill the lurkerling adds before the cross finishes it's cast preferably before it starts its cast (any adds left alive will cause this strat to fail).

Step 4. Considering a phase to equal boss>adds>collapse>rage storm>cross, On phase 2 and 4 immediately after collapse finishes casting use Riot Gas to lower the damage of rage storm a great deal to give some relief to your healers.

Step 5. EVERY time underlurker begins his cross cast, everyone stack under the boss, with 2.5 seconds left cast Sonic Rebounder on the boss and the damage from the failed cross will be completely negated.

 

So all steps together would be as follows. Start on boss. All dps down the adds immediately when they appear. Avoid red circles from collapse cast. Phase 1 DO NOT cast riot gas for collapse because everyone should still be ok for life at this point. Everyone get behind rocks asap to avoid damage from rage storm. After knockback everyone rushes to stack under the boss, killing any adds that remain. Once cross cast reaches 2.5 seconds tank uses sonic rebounder to cancel all cross damage. Phase two do the same as phase 1 except this time tank will cast Riot gas at end of collapse cast to help cancel a great deal of damage from rage storm assisting heals. Still need to be quick getting behind rocks but with riot gas damage is severely reduced. When you stack under boss you will notice that sonic rebounder has an almost perfect cool-down timer to be cast almost perfectly to 2.5 seconds again. Phase 3 is same as phase 1 no Riot Gas as it is on cooldown. Phase 4 is same as phase 2 cast Riot Gas to mitigate damage and help healers. Once the cross is finished on phase 4 it is time to burn the boss. So kill 4 add sets, finish 4th cross, burn. If you cannot kill underlurker before 4th cross finishes or soon after then you will need to increase your gear or find another way to increase your dps. Underlurker will beserk soon after 5th phase starts so even with this strat you still need heavy dps. This strat is extremely useful to any groups struggling to beat the underlurker due to cross mechanics because it completely cancels the cross damage even with a failed cross. This strat is NOT useful if low dps or heals is your groups problem, this is because you still need to get the adds down before cross finishes casting and you still need to be able to heal the basic mechanics of the fight. By canceling the cross damage you are effectively achieving the same effect of a successful cross without having to worry about bugged mechanics. If you have any questions about this strat ask away :) This strat worked on 8 man sm. No reason why it should not work on 16 as well because the effects of sonic rebounder does not have a player number limit listed. Also not sure if this will work on hm as I have not tried hm yet. Thank You for Reading and I hope this strat really helps those still struggling with underlurker cross mechanics.

Edited by AmaranthChaos
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Keep in mind that Sonic Rebounder only applies to players other than the tank using Sonic Missile. So it does not completely negate the damage unless you have a DPS also throwing it out on the tank.

 

Also, it doesn't have to be a PT tank, can be a Jugger (sonic wall), and it can also be a DPS of either class.

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Doesn't Jugg Sonic Wall just effectively act like a static barrier? (That is, it breaks after X damage where Rebounder completely absorbs and reflects one attack). I don't think it would work the same.

 

It is an issue though where the tank won't be protected. We could have two PTs (my group runs one for DPS, and we have a couple that can tank). Still, at that point, it's getting a touch contrived.

 

You know what would really solve the problem? If the cross mechanic worked like it was supposed to. :p

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Doesn't Jugg Sonic Wall just effectively act like a static barrier? (That is, it breaks after X damage where Rebounder completely absorbs and reflects one attack). I don't think it would work the same.

 

It is an issue though where the tank won't be protected. We could have two PTs (my group runs one for DPS, and we have a couple that can tank). Still, at that point, it's getting a touch contrived.

 

You know what would really solve the problem? If the cross mechanic worked like it was supposed to. :p

 

True, yes, it's an absorb shield and not a reflect. Still, it's a good way to mitigate the damage, it just doesn't also deal damage.

 

I main-tank that fight (unable to DPS on my PT as I am) and my "off-tank" (read: dps) is a jugger so we both pop our AOE taunts and it all goes down fine.

 

The problem is less that it doesn't work (sometimes it doesn't, this is true, such as the orange cross and when he jumps the tank, which I don't think is supposed to happen), and more that different ping will show the cross in different places for different people. So while on their screen my healer might be in it, he's outside it on the off-tank's. The server sees him out of it and bam, red cross.

 

The easiest solution is for your main tank to stand in the middle of the room after the knockback, so that the ground around the boss is flat. Then, stand in the dead center of your arm of the cross and jump; when everyone does it, it's worked just fine for us when both of these things happen. The edges of the room can mess up the cross, and standing dead center (and/or on top of everyone else) almost always negates the ping problem, giving a nice green cross. We usually toss out rebounder and wall just in case, but it's not always needed and when it is, more often than not we can see who messed up and why. We almost never get red crosses that we can't immediately explain.

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When my group did the underlurker last week with this strategy. ( I am the tank powertech) I noticed that even though sonic rebounder says that the tank does not get the damage cancel, I still Never took any damage from a failed cross. The reason that i never took damage I cannot say, we did NOT have another powertech in the group nor anyone with wall ability. The only thing I can guessbased on what i have observed, is that i have seen a failed cross outright kill just 1 player and leave the rest alone with no damage. If this is the case the tank would then have a 1 in 8 or 1 in 16 chance of being the player targeted with the one shot failed cross. However without more data and without experiencing it happening this is pure speculation. All I can confirm for now is that this strat works effectively, and as of yet I have not taken any damage even with the failed cross.

Again this start is not meant to replace the mechanics of the fight in general, it is meant to help those that for whatever reason ie: bugs, lag, server ping. To actually have a chance at successfully beating this fight.

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You know what would really solve the problem? If the cross mechanic worked like it was supposed to. :p

Guess what, it IS working as intended.

It SEEMS buggy sometimes because of a bad client <->server sync. Which comes from a combination of bad latency, slow servers, the crappy engine that swtor uses and bad programming. If they would simply force the server to sent the actual postion the moment he starts casting, no one would have a problem. That's all.

 

And how to beat Underlurker:

Pull, kill adds, everyone behind the same rock and DON'T F*CKING MOVE until he jumped and started casting the cross. Everyone onto his assigned position, see cross turn green, rinse and repeat until he's dead.

Only difference for HM is that the two people in front and behind him have to swap positions(not threat, only positions) every other cross.

Works like a charm. No PT/Vanguard, Jugg or whatnot needed.

Edited by Torvai
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Guess what, it IS working as intended.

It SEEMS buggy sometimes because of a bad client <->server sync. Which comes from a combination of bad latency, slow servers, the crappy engine that swtor uses and bad programming. If they would simply force the server to sent the actual postion the moment he starts casting, no one would have a problem. That's all.

 

And how to beat Underlurker:

Pull, kill adds, everyone behind the same rock and DON'T F*CKING MOVE until he jumped and started casting the cross. Everyone onto his assigned position, see cross turn green, rinse and repeat until he's dead.

Only difference for HM is that the two people in front and behind him have to swap positions(not threat, only positions) every other cross.

Works like a charm. No PT/Vanguard, Jugg or whatnot needed.

 

Orange cross ;)

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Orange cross ;)

So what? From what i saw it works like this:

Green = Everybody stands correct

Orange = Everybody stands correct and one or more is dead

Red = One or more people standing in wrong positions.

 

If anybody has better ideas what the orange cross means, feel free to enlighten us all.

And guess more, just killed him in HM with this strat without a Vanguard and had green crosses all over the place.

Edited by Torvai
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Maybe I am not right but VG sonic rebounder deflect shield can be only applied on 5 person +caster(probably its invisible)

No, it has no player limit and excludes the caster, at least according to it's tooltip.

The Problem with using it on Underlurker is, that the range that is shown ingame isn't the real range. Your whole group has to basically stand on top of each other right under the boss for all to get the buff.

Edited by Torvai
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Guess what, it IS working as intended.

It SEEMS buggy sometimes because of a bad client <->server sync. Which comes from a combination of bad latency, slow servers, the crappy engine that swtor uses and bad programming. If they would simply force the server to sent the actual postion the moment he starts casting, no one would have a problem. That's all.

If you think that a mechanic of a fight that RELIES on the good latency and hardware specs of the clients is a reasonable gameplay feature, then please promise me you will never get into game design.

 

Until the fight can be done without it failing due to people's poor client hardware, it is, under no circumstance, "working as intended."

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If you think that a mechanic of a fight that RELIES on the good latency and hardware specs of the clients is a reasonable gameplay feature, then please promise me you will never get into game design.

I never said it's good game design, but I promise I won't get into it ;)

But the mechanic is stand in the right spot -> no damage. Stand in the wrong spot -> damage.

Works as intended.

The fact that you often can't see wether you are in the right or wrong position doesn't make it buggy, since this is no bug, but bad sync.

So is it bad game design to create an encounter that heavily relies on right positioning with an engine that can't handle it properly? Sure.

Is it working as intend? Yes.

Until the fight can be done without it failing due to people's poor client hardware, it is, under no circumstance, "working as intended."

See my first post in this thread for the right strat. This strategy works almost 100% of the time. As I said, we repeatedly cleared it on 8m HM with it, with at least one dps who had ~10fps during the fight. And still every cross turned green.

Edited by Torvai
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See my first post in this thread for the right strat. This strategy works almost 100% of the time. As I said, we repeatedly cleared it on 8m HM with it, with at least one dps who had ~10fps during the fight. And still every cross turned green.

 

You are missing a very key point here. Just because your group regularly clears it does not mean it's working as intended.

 

If you have to move the boss to a magic spot, spin around three times, throw salt over your shoulder, and face east towards Korriban just so the boss doesn't bug, the boss is still bugged. If in some areas of the room the boss misbehaves, but in other areas of the room he doesn't, he's still bugged.

 

Bugs exist as a thing. A workaround for a bug doesn't make the bug go away. It's, by very definition of the existence of the work around, bugged.

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The fact that you often can't see wether you are in the right or wrong position doesn't make it buggy, since this is no bug, but bad sync.

 

This is, by very definition, a bug. Two systems are not integrating correctly.

 

There's literally no other word that describes it better than "bug." Yes, the bug is rooted in a sync issue. But that's, still, say it with me now, A BUG.

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You have a good point, Smiley.

But following your definition, the whole game is a bug. ;)

Bad positioning sync is nothing that is restricted to this specific encounter, or swtor.

It's a general problem with online gaming and some games suffer more from it than others, presumably because of the different engines they use, idk.

The only difference is, in most other parts of the game it's not much of a big deal, but here whole raids get wiped out.

 

Relying a whole bossfight onto such mechanics(and I really like the idea of the underlurker mechanic) when the game engine can't handle it properly is bad game design, sure. But, imho, it's not buggy.

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You have a good point, Smiley.

But following your definition, the whole game is a bug. ;)

Bad positioning sync is nothing that is restricted to this specific encounter, or swtor.

It's a general problem with online gaming and some games suffer more from it than others, presumably because of the different engines they use, idk.

The only difference is, in most other parts of the game it's not much of a big deal, but here whole raids get wiped out.

 

Relying a whole bossfight onto such mechanics(and I really like the idea of the underlurker mechanic) when the game engine can't handle it properly is bad game design, sure. But, imho, it's not buggy.

 

Then your honest opinion is wrong.

 

If a particular problem avails itself more aggregiously under a particular set of circumstances, you need to find a way to change those circumstances.

 

In either event, unless you willfully believe Bioware sought to have this bug expose problems with their engine as a mechanic, it's not working as intended. Your opinion is lovely to have, but it is also wrong.

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So what? From what i saw it works like this:

Green = Everybody stands correct

Orange = Everybody stands correct and one or more is dead

Red = One or more people standing in wrong positions.

 

If anybody has better ideas what the orange cross means, feel free to enlighten us all.

And guess more, just killed him in HM with this strat without a Vanguard and had green crosses all over the place.

 

"Orange" refers to when the cross turns green and red at the same time (why people have taken to calling it orange, I'm not entirely sure). It happens apparently at random and can happen when everyone is alive. My co-tank was one-shot last night on a green cross.

 

So no, not working as intended.

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Solution to all things not working in SWTOR. Just use the same mechanic developed by players in Corruptor Zero's Anti-Gravity Field.

 

 

Jump.

 

 

It's the devs way of making PvE content more PvP friendly.

 

The issue isn't the server recognizing your position. The solution is that the "safe" position is not accurately telegraphed.

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Then your honest opinion is wrong.

 

If a particular problem avails itself more aggregiously under a particular set of circumstances, you need to find a way to change those circumstances.

 

In either event, unless you willfully believe Bioware sought to have this bug expose problems with their engine as a mechanic, it's not working as intended. Your opinion is lovely to have, but it is also wrong.

 

So you want to tell me you never died to a void you where already 10meters away from? Or got kicked by a mob/player although your client showed you where on the other side and shouldn't get hit by it? Ever played a sent/Jugg and got resettet to your starting position after a leap? Yeah. It's certainly not in the whole game, just this specific encounter:rolleyes:

 

The issue isn't the server recognizing your position. The solution is that the "safe" position is not accurately telegraphed.

And it comes from, say it with me BAD SYNC ;)

 

My point is simply that it's no error in the programming of the Underlurker fight, but a game wide problem.

If it is caused by the engine, latency, busy servers or whatnot, I have no clue about, I know way too liitle about these things to say for sure.

Edited by Torvai
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My group has never really seen the out of sync cross more than once so we just brushed it off, but I thought I'd throw something out there.

Stand at melee range on the boss in your selective with everyone stacked on their respective sides. Could potentially lower the chance of standing outside the cross.

 

Oh, and Sonic Rebounder will not cancel all the damage. It has a cap, and will break once that's reached. You can reflect a green cross and maybe orange (depending on who takes the most damage), but you cannot reflect a red cross.

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So you want to tell me you never died to a void you where already 10meters away from? Or got kicked by a mob/player although your client showed you where on the other side and shouldn't get hit by it? Ever played a sent/Jugg and got resettet to your starting position after a leap? Yeah. It's certainly not in the whole game, just this specific encounter:rolleyes:

 

 

And it comes from, say it with me BAD SYNC ;)

 

My point is simply that it's no error in the programming of the Underlurker fight, but a game wide problem.

If it is caused by the engine, latency, busy servers or whatnot, I have no clue about, I know way too liitle about these things to say for sure.

 

Again. If you don't think that server sync issues are bug, you are wrong. Period.

 

So again. You are wrong. And still wrong. And continuing to be wrong.

 

The issue here is that instead of being a killzone, the telegraph is a safe zone. Yes, it's a consistent issue in the game. It is also a bug. However, the telegraph issue is reasonably fixable if the game appoints one person to form the gold standard who uploads the coordinate of two points of the cross. The rest can be interpolated.

 

And you're wrong, still.

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Solution to all things not working in SWTOR. Just use the same mechanic developed by players in Corruptor Zero's Anti-Gravity Field.

 

 

Jump.

 

 

It's the devs way of making PvE content more PvP friendly.

 

What's really sad is how often this works (for mechanics in general).

 

Oh, and Sonic Rebounder will not cancel all the damage. It has a cap, and will break once that's reached. You can reflect a green cross and maybe orange (depending on who takes the most damage), but you cannot reflect a red cross.

 

My understanding (and everyone else I've heard talk about it) is that you aren't supposed to need to reflect green at all. But regardless of how much damage it does or does not negate, the healers tend to love it.

Edited by FrozenGoalie
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