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Lvl cap increase and PvP players


Morthwyll

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The point in it's purest form is that Bioware REMOVED content for paying subscribers by moving ranked PvP to lvl60, and removing lvl55 PvP gear.

 

How is that fair?

Common sense among a sea of trolls, thank you.

Regardless of what the avid consumers of **** on this board say, PVP'ers shouldnt be penalised with the introduction of a new xpac.

You are not selling your product well. When you get something new on the market you don't **** all over your old customers who enjoy your older products.

 

They can sell warzone passes on the CM but they can't sell access to level 60 for PVP'ers only? Doh.

Edited by dragospastiu
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The game is growing..grow with it or stay left behind...

I understand the cry to allow subs access to level 60...I view levels as sub filler, not "content", so I truly can sympathize with those of you not wanting to shell out $20 just for 5 more levels that you really don't give a flip about...but...DOHboy is right...the game grew and you either make the choice to grow with it, or wait to grow...eventually SoR will be part of the sub and included for 'free' for everyone...but for now, it's limited to those who bought the Expansion.

 

From a business stand point, I don't know if it's smart or silly of Bioware to hold off on allowing subs access to the expansion levels...what do they lose in subs vs what do they lose in sales? I tend to think that if you aren't willing to shell out $20 for the expansion, you probably don't buy anything off the CM either, so all they lose is your $15...but how many of those $15 are they willing to lose?

 

I can see both sides in this one and I think both sides have compelling arguments.

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Glad you're making sense now TUXs.

I don't even want the level 60 increase for free, I'm willing to buy it from the CM at a reasonable price.

I just don't see myself handing out 20$ just to get to 60 so I can warzone PVP in the big league.

Thank you.

I try to be reasonable. ;) And I can see how this is an issue...I think a $10 CM boost would be a fine compromise.

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I don't know of any game that allows players to gain benefits from an expansion without ponying up the cost of the expansion.

 

Whether or not you use a little of it or all of it, if you want something from the expansion you'll have to either shell out the cash or wait until it's free.

 

When the game grows, it doesn't care if some players of one small portion of the entire game feel slighted. Levels 56-60 are a feature of the expansion and you can either stay 55 or buy the expac.

 

PvP players won't get any special treatment. PvE players that don't pay for the expac are in the same exact boat. Their gear is stuck at 55 and they can't level up. Basically, if you want to continue your PvP climb, you'll have to pay.

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The point in it's purest form is that Bioware REMOVED content for paying subscribers by moving ranked PvP to lvl60, and removing lvl55 PvP gear.

 

How is that fair?

 

in a way they removed ranked PvP but in truth this always happens ..

 

If a PvP player bought the xpac and subbed and is at 60th level is it fair that he has to do level 55 PvP..

 

though I am sure some would enjoy this since I bet they would be killing those at 55th level whole sale I think this would become a trifle annoying to be 55th levels being killed repeatedly by someone that they could barely touch..

 

You can used the Pvp content IF you buy the expansion.. I mean after all it isn't that much and think of it as paying to improve the game which is what will happen with more influx of cash.

 

:D

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PvP players won't get any special treatment. PvE players that don't pay for the expac are in the same exact boat. Their gear is stuck at 55 and they can't level up. Basically, if you want to continue your PvP climb, you'll have to pay.

 

PvE enthusiasts have better situation, afaik they still can do the same operations/flashpoints/quests they did before patch on lvl 55 chars. Additionally if they buy that expansion they'll get content they will probably enjoy - new stories, flashpoints and operations.

PvP players only get their lvl cap increase and the game modes they already had on lvl 55 shifted to lvl 60 (while messing up with 2nd bracket in the process - there is an issue with balance), no actual new content.

Additionally some classes loose some of their previous potential without the expansion, because some important passives where moved to lvls 56-59, not to mention that if you have the expansion you get access to more powerfull versions of already used skills, which isn't actually good for balancing the game and have a stench of pay-to-win, even if the difference is seen only for 5 lvls (which takes some time to get if you only play PvP though).

 

If any of new planets would offer open PvP area with reasonable rewards and interesting gameplay I would probably pay those 20$ with a smile on my face. Tbh I would probably pay double that, if it would be really good.

But they don't offer any new PvP content (other than being ganked on starting area from what I heard so far...).

And yes, I know that there are a lot of players that do and enjoy both PvE and PvP, but there are also many ppl focused on PvP only.

 

I'm up for paying for content packs, but why should I if I won't use most of this content?

 

Personally I'm a big fun of how Funcom handles that kind of stuff - on example of "The Secret World"™ MMO - subs gets 10$ worth of points every month they sub and when expansion comes out it costs about 10-15$ equivalent in those points (btw sub also means 10% discount on all in-game store items, including content packs, lifetime sub is 20% afaik).

However if you don't buy the expansion, you still get all of the QOL and balance improvements, including new ways for character progression instantly with new patch (even if you don't pay the sub).

 

I also understand that economically it's good for EA/Bioware to have paid expansions, I just have a feeling they would get more if they actually made an seperate lvl cap/gear unlock buyable with $ or CC and still have new content only for ppl with full expansion.

Also if you could buy actual content or expansions with some CCs, paying sub would get more appealing (more subs = $$$) or ppl would just buy the CCs directly - still profitable for developer.

Now the main reason to pay sub is to avoid limitations, not to gain anything extra.

Edited by Morthwyll
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PvE enthusiasts have better situation, afaik they still can do the same operations/flashpoints/quests they did before patch on lvl 55 chars. Additionally if they buy that expansion they'll get content they will probably enjoy - new stories, flashpoints and operations.

 

Okay. But everyone that buys the expac gets that. If you choose not to use it, that's on you.

 

PvP players only get their lvl cap increase and the game modes they already had on lvl 55 shifted to lvl 60 (while messing up with 2nd bracket in the process - there is an issue with balance), no actual new content.

If any of new planets would offer open PvP area with reasonable rewards and interesting gameplay I would probably pay those 20$ with a smile on my face.

 

First, if you only do PvP in a game, that's your fault. That may be harsh, but if you chose to ignore the majority of the game to concentrate on a small part, that's all on you. Second, you can still do 55 PvP but like the PvE game if you want to access the new top tier, you'll have to buy the expac. PvE players don't get access to level 60 and the new HM's and OP's without buying the expac either.

 

But they don't offer any new PvP content (other then being ganked on starting area from what I heard so far...).
And what, pray tell, is new content for PvP? Some more WZ's and Arenas? Just like RotHC, you'll see those eventually. And ganking in starter areas isn't PvP.

 

I'm up for paying for content packs, but why should I if I won't use most of this content?

 

You bought the game and only use a small part of it. If you want to do level 60 PvP, buy the expac.

 

Personally I'm a big fun of how Funcom handles that kind of stuff - on example of "The Secret World"™ MMO - subs gets 10$ worth of points every month they sub and when expansion comes out it costs about 10-15$ equivalent in those points (btw sub also means 10% discount on all in-game store items, including content packs, lifetime sub is 20% afaik).

However if you don't buy the expansion, you still get all of the QOL and balance improvements, including new ways for character progression instantly with new patch (even if you don't pay the sub).

 

And how well is that game doing?

 

I also understand that economically it's good for EA/Bioware to have paid expansions, I just have a feeling they would get more if they actually made an seperate lvl cap/gear unlock buyable with $ or CC and still have new content only for ppl with full expansion.

Also if you could buy actual content or expansions with some CCs, paying sub would get more appealing (more subs = $$$) or ppl would just buy the CCs directly - still profitable for developer.

Now the main reason to pay sub is to avoid limitations, not to gain anything extra.

 

Simply put, there isn't enough "just PvP" players to justify it. They aren't going to cater to a very small portion of the player base with more work and effort (and therefor, more cost to them). You can either buy the expac or deal with level 55 PvP. You aren't special because you PvP only. You don't deserve special treatment because you don't play the entire game. Sorry, but if you chose to artificially limit yourself in game, it isn't EA/BW responsibility to cater to you.

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First, if you only do PvP in a game, that's your fault. That may be harsh, but if you chose to ignore the majority of the game to concentrate on a small part, that's all on you.

 

Second, you can still do 55 PvP but like the PvE game if you want to access the new top tier, you'll have to buy the expac. PvE players don't get access to level 60 and the new HM's and OP's without buying the expac either.

 

And what, pray tell, is new content for PvP? Some more WZ's and Arenas? Just like RotHC, you'll see those eventually. And ganking in starter areas isn't PvP.

(...)

And how well is that game doing?

 

1st - I know that, I choose how I use my time in game and I'm OK with my choices, I just don't like having something I already have limited, because I choose not to pay extra for not having it limited.

 

2nd - you can't do 55 PvP - no more rankeds avaible for lvl 55 and you get to que in lvl 30-59 bracket, which is not "55 PvP" by my understanding.

 

New content for PvP could be new warzone modes, organised open PvP areas or, by definition, anything that rewards you and let you develop your character through competition with other players (not fighting against NPC like in PvE).

And I was obviously being sarcastic about being ganked in starter areas (that supposed to be sanctuary) as content - it's obviously a failure, not content...

 

TSW is a niche game, but it's because of the specific gameplay and not how they treat their consumers, and for a niche game it's doing pretty well, have at least couple of bigger content packs / expansions and few smaller ones a year and faster balancing changes / fixes than SWToR, but that's not the point.

Edited by Morthwyll
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To be clear - I'm OK with waiting because I choose not to pay extra, I just wish to know if and when I'll have access to it.

(Please read OP, possibly with understanding, when joining the discussion).

 

And I think that it would be better if they put minimal amount of "work and effort" (which is putting already exisiting unlock, which I believe is not directly linked to new content via program code, as seperate buyable expansion) and make it avaible to buy <-(important word) the lvl cap increase and access to gear without paying for the content I choose not to use (because I won't enjoy it enough to make it worth that extra money).

 

I don't see how exactly they would loose this way - players enjoying all of the game modes would buy the full expansion like they did now, and ppl who doesn't enjoy PvE would pay for the partial unlock.

Unless the PvP-only player base is big enough to earn a lot on making them buy a content they won't use just so they can enjoy competetive modes developers took away from them... but treating them this way is not really good for business if this is really that big group.

 

Also if they wouldn't like to differ between PvP-only and PvE-only player base, they would make the PvE and PvP gear interchangeable, so players could gather PvP usefull gear in PvE and the other way, but they obviously don't want it, so there always be many players who doesn't have time or will to farm both modes.

Edited by Morthwyll
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