DarthDucky Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 So, I recently came to realize, at the painful cost of 140 (or so) basic commendations, that the off-hand armoring slot, does not actually changes anything on your armor rating. For some reason, unless I am mistaken, it seems to increase Force power instead. I contacted support, and this is working as intended, although, the agent seemed as confused as me on the reason or logic of this (extract of the agent's reply below): "(...)Thank you for contacting Star Wars™: The Old Republic™ Customer Service. I have responded to your query in-game and, for your convenience I have included a summary of the response below in case you are unable to access the in-game mail at the moment. Please note – at times, cases and responses from Customer Support may appear blank in the in-game help portal. If you have accessed your case and are unable to see a response from us, please respond to this mail and myself or a colleague will respond as soon as possible. I apologize for any confusion caused by offhand armorings. This is working as intended though I am uncertain as to the exact mechanics behind it. When an armoring is fitted to an offhand, it will increase your health but not the overall armor rating. I hope this sheds some ligh on your question though I myself now am curious about the thinking behind this!(...)". So, while the answer is pretty much what I'd have expected, that is working as intended, it makes no sense at all that the armoring slot would increase force power (for my inq's companion xalek).. for just about any class other than DPS or healer, it is virtually a lost slot imo, and being extremely confusing since it seems to be the only "armoring" slot that acts this way. Could anyone explain the logic, or lack of, behind this design? And more importantly, does anyone knows the value applied per "armor" points, and where they actually go? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bdatt Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 (edited) I'm sure the alternative of putting a hilt or barrel in a shield seemed weird. Regardless I agree it's not intuitive. You could search the class forums for discussion of the armor equation. It's out there but I don't know it, and it'll change with 3.0. Also, I don't understand the last part of your last question. Edited October 31, 2014 by bdatt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tito_O Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 The reason for a 'armoring' mod in an offhand item is just practicality: Some classes have offhand weapons that are actual weapons with either a hilt or a barrel mod. Other classes without a offhand weapon have to use a different mod for that slot, and the only other thing already designed are armorings, even when said item does not count as an armor and does not give armor rating. Otherwise the devs would've had to design a extra mod item called 'whatever' and you would have another mod type to care for. That would've cost them developement time and therefore money, so they just stuck with the easy solution. Armor rating improves your damage reduction, as per the formula in this thread: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=615111 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DawnAskham Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 (edited) The reason for a 'armoring' mod in an offhand item is just practicality: Some classes have offhand weapons that are actual weapons with either a hilt or a barrel mod. Other classes without a offhand weapon have to use a different mod for that slot, and the only other thing already designed are armorings, even when said item does not count as an armor and does not give armor rating. Otherwise the devs would've had to design a extra mod item called 'whatever' and you would have another mod type to care for. That would've cost them developement time and therefore money, so they just stuck with the easy solution. Armor rating improves your damage reduction, as per the formula in this thread: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=615111 Or they could have simply set all offhands to use hilts / barrels. The current system is not only unintuitive, but makes it more difficult to gear certain companions when the player character of the primary stat uses an OH weapon (barrel / hilt) and the companion uses a non weapon (armoring) or the companion use a weapon (hilt / barrel) and the player uses a non weapon (armoring). It also makes it more difficult to learn certain schematics, which in turn increases the cost (rarity) for certain crafted items, as certain stat items do not exist in commendation off-hands which can be RE'd to a schematic (e.g. strength has offhand weapons for hilts, willpower does not). Edited October 31, 2014 by DawnAskham Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Botho Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 So, So, while the answer is pretty much what I'd have expected, that is working as intended, it makes no sense at all that the armoring slot would increase force power (for my inq's companion xalek).. for just about any class other than DPS or healer, it is virtually a lost slot imo, and being extremely confusing since it seems to be the only "armoring" slot that acts this way. I wouldn't call it a lost slot at all, even tanks need power, fair enough threat management is somewhat trivial, but in group content Tanks are part of the overall Dps quota. If a tank is standing waiting for something to do in a fight (i'e only 1 boss no adds ect) then they are not carrying there own weight. So to me it stands to reason that you would want to squeeze what you can out of your potential Dps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthDucky Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 (edited) The reason for a 'armoring' mod in an offhand item is just practicality: Some classes have offhand weapons that are actual weapons with either a hilt or a barrel mod. Other classes without a offhand weapon have to use a different mod for that slot, and the only other thing already designed are armorings, even when said item does not count as an armor and does not give armor rating. Otherwise the devs would've had to design a extra mod item called 'whatever' and you would have another mod type to care for. That would've cost them developement time and therefore money, so they just stuck with the easy solution. Armor rating improves your damage reduction, as per the formula in this thread: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=615111 Agreed, however as stated, the armor value is not added to armor rating of your character, and as such, I can find nowhere to see where the armor points for the off hands go, and what impact it actually has. I did notice a force power increase for xalek, but I couldn't figure how it was calculated for that item. Edited October 31, 2014 by DarthDucky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoom_VI Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Or they could have simply set all offhands to use hilts / barrels. The current system is not only unintuitive, but makes it more difficult to gear certain companions when the player character of the primary stat uses an OH weapon (barrel / hilt) and the companion uses a non weapon (armoring) or the companion use a weapon (hilt / barrel) and the player uses a non weapon (armoring). It also makes it more difficult to learn certain schematics, which in turn increases the cost (rarity) for certain crafted items, as certain stat items do not exist in commendation off-hands which can be RE'd to a schematic (e.g. strength has offhand weapons for hilts, willpower does not). Because putting a gun barrel in a power generator makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azudelphi Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Agreed, however as stated, the armor value is not added to armor rating of your character, and as such, I can find nowhere to see where the armor points for the off hands go, and what impact it actually has. I did notice a force power increase for xalek, but I couldn't figure how it was calculated for that item. Force and tech power for main-hand and off-hand weapons, shields, focuses, and generators are based on the item level of the hilt, barrel, or armoring in it. Armor rating of chest, legs, etc. are based on the item level of the armoring in it. Basically, yes... it's an armoring mod by name, but really it comes down to the type of shell + item level of top slot item mod. So off-hands of all types don't do anything to armor rating and are dps boosters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cernow Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 (edited) Agreed, however as stated, the armor value is not added to armor rating of your character, and as such, I can find nowhere to see where the armor points for the off hands go, and what impact it actually has. I did notice a force power increase for xalek, but I couldn't figure how it was calculated for that item. There is zero armor boost from the armoring fitted in offhands. The armoing either boosts Force Power or Tech Power depending on the weapon and type of armoring fitted. The higher level the armoring, the more the boost to Force / Tech Power. It's not a lost slot, because Force Power / Tech Power are useful and important stats. Dps and healers get the most benefit from them, but they still have some relevance to tanks (damage isn't a tanking priority but it's still useful). The system with offhands and what fits in what does't entirely make sense. But it's what we have and working as intended, so we have to work with that. Edited October 31, 2014 by Cernow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calsetes Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 I could swear some offhands used hilts and barrels before - the more offensive-based ones - but maybe I'm just mistaken, or something. I think Vibroknives use barrels. Shotguns use barrels. I could swear generators and focii used barrels / hilts before, too, and armorings were left to shields. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthDucky Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 Next question then, is there a point in slotting a purple on there, or a a typical basic L55 armor is more than enough and does not actually change enough to justify the time/cost of the purple in it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spudik Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 (edited) At the very beginning, offhands were not modable at all. Some patch around 1,4 changed that and since that day Generators, Shields and Focuses use armoring, Knives, Blasters and Sabers uses Hilt/Barrel. Offhand never, even at launch gave u armor boost, only Force/Tech power. When we needed to mod our offhands by ourselves rather than take whats given, they changed it, simple as that. EDIT: And as some1 already set, higher is the rating of the armoring, more Force/Tech power it will give. Since "Force/Tech Power" is completely separate from the secondary stat "Power", is only found on Main hand and Offhand. And it gives bigger boost to Bonus damage than Power and Main stat. You really want the best armoring/hilt/barrel you can get in there. Blue lvl 53 armoring has rating 148 Purple has rating 156. Higher is better Edited October 31, 2014 by spudik Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthDucky Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 At the very beginning, offhands were not modable at all. Some patch around 1,4 changed that and since that day Generators, Shields and Focuses use armoring, Knives, Blasters and Sabers uses Hilt/Barrel. Offhand never, even at launch gave u armor boost, only Force/Tech power. When we needed to mod our offhands by ourselves rather than take whats given, they changed it, simple as that. Thank you, that actually does make sense the remaining 2 questions (repeated in case they were missed): -Is the a point in slotting a purple in armor? (rather than green or blue) -linked to the above question, how is force power calculated from the armoring slot (basically, to know if it is worth slotting purples in there ). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spudik Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Edited my previous post You are quicker then me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cernow Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Next question then, is there a point in slotting a purple on there, or a a typical basic L55 armor is more than enough and does not actually change enough to justify the time/cost of the purple in it? Depends on class and role. Yes for dps or healing roles. Perhaps less important for a tank. I tend to play mostly dps, so upgrading my offhand is usually the first thing I spend my comms on because the boost to Force Power or Tech Power really helps with dps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthDucky Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 Thank you all for your replies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agamemnon- Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Because putting a gun barrel in a power generator makes sense. No more or less silly than putting a gun barrel in a viroblade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsillah Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Well I think it's easy to see that when they decided to make off hands moddable that they either needed to invent a complete new set of items or just use the existing ones albeit a bit odd in some cases. The second option clearly was the cheapest but also the easiest without adding to the list of craftable items which is insanely long in my view already. So I'd go for a practical reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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