Please introduce dual spec ASAP

[Khamil]

 

Originally Posted by Khamil

Dualspec is to prevent swapping from spec to spec all the time

 

 

 

... Now I do wonder who is misunderstanding... I'm pretty sure this is exactly what Dual Spec facilitates...

 

 

Argh. I accidentally worded it wrong. I hate when the sentence make sense in my own head but ships with bugs

To clarify the sentence:

I meant to avoid running to and from skill mentor to swap spec all the time, as well as racking up quite an insane bill for doing so. There.

 

As I recall from wow, the cost to purchase dualspec was significant (at least for me playing up solo at the time with little support).

I wouldnt mind there to be a significant cost on it here as well.

My main reason to support a dualspec a la wow is that it save time (everyone's) and it will save credits on skill mentor (over time, if the dualspec is a onetime purchase option).

And the end result is it will remove players hesitance for speccing for heal so that groups can start up quicker as well. Im fairly enthusiastic about avoiding wasting time you know

 

 

Originally Posted by Khamil

Without a dualspec syste, - would you love to pay the cost at skill mentor on your 150ieth swap for 1.5mill credits? Yes? (number pulled out of my *** but likely closer to the mark than we'd like to think)

 

I wasn't trying to talk of respec costs... Didn't touch that... Don't want to touch that. Not a part of my consideration because it's a separate suggestion.

 

Well, its one of the top issues for people who want dualspec it seems?

Time, cash cost, timesink.. its fairly relevant to this. Imo.

 

That's a design philosophy difference. If I understand you correctly, your philosophy says that you would rather find a group, and then fill whatever role is missing. Cool. What is currently supported is being a role, and then finding a group that needs that role. Just as cool. Only difference is the method. End result should be the same: You, in a group as a role you enjoy.

 

Indeed. The thing is getting a dualspec system will permit flexibility and save time as we dont have people running around looking for skill mentors between different activities.

[Khamil]

Noo to dual spec...no its not needed.. Jedi/sith...lol right...jedi/smuggler...what a joke.. Leave it the way it is

 

Have some more coffee before you try to comprehend what this thread is about

[Khamil]

Dual Spec within your Advanced Class - sure, no problem - that's a feature which is currently available in the game right now. If I don't want to be an operative spec'd healer, then I can respec as to an up close stealth assassin or a ranged DOT dealer. 1st time is free while additional respecs become more costly.

 

Dual Spec of your Advanced Class [ie: being able to change from Sniper to Operative] - HELL NO. You made a permanent choice of an Advanced Class - it's your own fault if you failed to pay attention to the descriptions/skill trees before choosing.

 

I can see dual spec [within you AC] beneficial as a time saver for filling groups or that spot in raid in case the healer/tank drops and that's about it.

 

Unlike other MMO's - you're not gimped if you have a healing or tank spec - you have a companion that compliments your Advanced Class. My operative healer has no problems tearing through the game content and can solo quite a lot of the heroic 2 and any heroic 4 that doesn't require me to kill anything.

 

 

Amen.

Yes to dualspec is what ive seen, and your adv class sticks. Want to try the other option, reroll. Thats that (shame about completely same story but oh well).

Ill point out one thing: you dont bring companions along in groups when there is many members as they are considered a playerslot.

[Nanomancer]

I think its insane that this game was not released with dual spec hell i would even love 4 specs so i can have one for pvp tank, pvp dps, pve tank, pve dps. There is absolutely no good argument why this game shouldn't allow you to save more then one spec.

[Airinya]

I think its insane that this game was not released with dual spec hell i would even love 4 specs so i can have one for pvp tank, pvp dps, pve tank, pve dps. There is absolutely no good argument why this game shouldn't allow you to save more then one spec.

 

Except the five or six or seven that numerous people have pointed out and you have selectively chosen to ignore. Nice try though!

[Naej]

I might be wrong, but I think that those against the dual-spec think this way.

 

What is the point to do a hybrid spec, if you can have a spec for one thing and another for another one.

 

I kinda agree on that, allowing dual-specing, people will get 2 cookie-cutter specs and be optimal in any circumstance.

 

By not allowing it, you will have for example, people specing strait-out healing, thus forfeiting the ability to DPS decently, and people that will find a hybrid build, putting whatever they feel they need in healing to be efficient as a healer, while putting the remainder in DPS to allow them more versatility.

 

There is simply no point to a hybrid spec if everytime you walk in a PvP zone, everyone is in the perfect PvP spec, and when you party, everyone is in perfect PvE/Operation spec. You'd be looser on both aspects.

 

If they don't go foward with dual spec, they should put a CD on the respec (as well as a high cost) so that it is possible, but not easy to respec often.

 

Before I get flailed, I will like and play the game whatever they choose to do. It was fun to have it in WoW, I don't see how it would ruin it so much for the people that are against it. I wouldn't mind if they decided against it either, I'm playing right now without it, and I have a good hybrid build I wanna check...

[drkside]

I seriously need this! as a Vanguard tank level 28 its painfully slow to kill things, my crits are a meagre 500/600, I crit more as a sniper level 20!

[LightningGus]

Please try and read this as being a neutral viewpoint. Dual spec will not make or break my sub to SWTOR. I will say that I enjoy the game a lot.

 

An argument I would like to make is based around one fact. I know many people claim many things to be facts on these forums, but this one is true (I’m fairly certain). SWTOR is not wow. There are many reasons why dual spec might have been good for wow, and why it might or might not be good for TOR.

 

One example is tanks in pvp. For much of wow’s history tanks absolutely sucked in pvp outside a few niche roles like flag carrying. For this reason dual spec was a good thing for tanks in wow, as they could now enjoy pvp without respeccing. In TOR, tanks are very useful in pvp. They can dish out a lot of damage while defending squishy members of their team, contributing greatly.

 

Even though TOR and wow are very similar in many ways, such as the three pronged talent trees, tank/heal/dps trinity, and combat style, they are different in just as many ways if not more. I do not think that comparing TOR to wow is a compelling argument for or against dual spec. If you are going to argue for dual spec/against dual spec it would be much more moving to make your arguments based on whether it’s good for TOR, not whether or not it was good for wow or any other game.

 

Lastly I’d like to make one observation. Consumers are very much like children (including myself), especially concerning video games (because much of our community actually is children). They will beg and scream and kick for the new toy they saw on TV claiming they must have it to be happy. BioWare must be careful to play the role of the strict but loving parent. Maybe we do need that toy to be happy and maybe we should get it, but maybe it will just make us spoiled and unsatisfiable.

 

BioWare: please don’t make choices just because people want something. Make them because you believe they are the best choice for the health of the game.

[Othehto]

The OP has not "made his case" sufficiently IMO to warrant a dual spec option.

 

 

1. Specing heals isn't enough of a boost to healing to justify it as your only spec.

 

2. You tend to spend 90% of the game soloing missions, and having only a heal spec slows the game down quite a bit.

 

3. Constantly respecing isn't really a viable option long term for many reasons.

 

 

1. My healer levels as fast if not moreso than those of my peers without it. I have little to no down time while questing. I tend to be able to take on bigger challenges than my non healing friends; including elite or champion bosses that they do not consider.

 

So how is the game slowed down?

 

2. I do not kill slower and I can actually kill take on and kill larger groups than my non healing capable friends so how does this slow the game down?

 

3. I have no need to "constantly respec" due to 1 and 2 above so the viability it a moot point.

 

While dual speccing is a nice option it also promotes skilled play through specialization. IE, you know who the true healers are at the higher levels.

 

Second, having a need to gain certain specialties seems to promote more socialization. I have found and been found my many players due to my "single" spec which has led to an increased friends list which would have been avoided if my small clique would have simply respecced out of the need to include others.

 

So until the community can voice a need more than "I want." You are not standing on very firm ground.

Edited December 30, 2011 by Othehto

[Flyjedi]

I don't see why people would be against a dual spec. If you don't want to use it then it has completely no effect on your character in any way but for those that do want it it's a huge convenience and time/money saver.

 

A lot of people are just idiots. They really are. It's the same thing with the LFG tool debate. They just want to stop you from using tools that make the game more fun and convenient, even when they themselves don't have to use the tools at all if they don't want to.

 

Really.. HTF does it effect your game play AT ALL if someone else has the ability to change specs from healer to DPS, or tank to DPS? It doesn't. Zip. Zero. Zilch. Yet people don't want it, and like the other useful tools people want and expect, there are those who seemingly just want you not to have something, just for the sake of not having it.

 

Most of the negative comments I see about dual spec and the LFG tool boggle my mind.

[Airinya]

A lot of people are just idiots. They really are. It's the same thing with the LFG tool debate. They just want to stop you from using tools that make the game more fun and convenient, even when they themselves don't have to use the tools at all if they don't want to.

 

Really.. HTF does it effect your game play AT ALL if someone else has the ability to change specs from healer to DPS, or tank to DPS? It doesn't. Zip. Zero. Zilch. Yet people don't want it, and like the other useful tools people want and expect, there are those who seemingly just want you not to have something, just for the sake of not having it.

 

Most of the negative comments I see about dual spec and the LFG tool boggle my mind.

 

How does it affect your gameplay at all if I want to play a purple glowing ball named Mr. Gobbly Goo and bounce from planet to planet shooting rainbow beams? What? It doesn't! So I can do it?!

[Inthecrevice]

This is an important struggle for a new game.

 

You can't bag on wow and turn around and say you want TOR to play like wow.

 

New game-let the community build. So many people picked specs that were just like wow. Fast leveling damage dealers. End game, end game, end game, where is the new content this game blows mindsets will only damage all new mmos. This game is designed to have the potential to be different. Let go of the dark side of wow and embrace the light side of TOR. Make your alt a healer, have a tank play the other classes.

 

If we were given dual spec tomorrow the game would be done by the end of the year. This game needs community to make it appealing. If you see someone struggling group with them. If you are moving through an area and see on chat someone is looking for help help them. Go beyond the guild. For every can't find a healer there is a healer who probably has little self esteem because he cant play the game as well as wow yet. Guide them dont "wow" them.

[Flyjedi]

How does it affect your gameplay at all if I want to play a purple glowing ball named Mr. Gobbly Goo and bounce from planet to planet shooting rainbow beams? What? It doesn't! So I can do it?!

 

If they added an option that allowed you to play a purple glowing ball named Mr. Gobbly Goo and bounce from planet to planet shooting rainbow beams and you wanted to be one... I'd say go for it, and have fun.

[zandadoum]

How does it affect your gameplay at all if I want to play a purple glowing ball named Mr. Gobbly Goo and bounce from planet to planet shooting rainbow beams? What? It doesn't! So I can do it?!

 

if enough people wanted it and they implemented it? hell i'd want to do that too!

[Sendrel]

A lot of people are just idiots. They really are. It's the same thing with the LFG tool debate. They just want to stop you from using tools that make the game more fun and convenient, even when they themselves don't have to use the tools at all if they don't want to.

 

Really.. HTF does it effect your game play AT ALL if someone else has the ability to change specs from healer to DPS, or tank to DPS? It doesn't. Zip. Zero. Zilch. Yet people don't want it, and like the other useful tools people want and expect, there are those who seemingly just want you not to have something, just for the sake of not having it.

 

Most of the negative comments I see about dual spec and the LFG tool boggle my mind.

 

I think there's definitely a 'people just want to control how others play the game' aspect to this (and other) debate. That said, I think more than anything, its just a function of game forums not being capable of rational discourse.

[AlpsStranger]

You can't bag on wow and turn around and say you want TOR to play like wow.

 

Show me where I bagged on WoW. I don't recall doing so.

[Chomag]

This game doesn't have a /roll function and you want dual-spec ?!?

[zandadoum]

This game doesn't have a /roll function and you want dual-spec ?!?

you have a point. however /roll is very little used nowadays, with all the automatic rolling going on (in convos and on loot)

while, with a 4man party system and on fresh servers where there are not yet many players, a dual specc system would be more useful than a /roll

 

tho /roll should be much more easy to implement. i give you that xD

[LightningGus]

A lot of people are just idiots. They really are. It's the same thing with the LFG tool debate. They just want to stop you from using tools that make the game more fun and convenient, even when they themselves don't have to use the tools at all if they don't want to.

 

Really.. HTF does it effect your game play AT ALL if someone else has the ability to change specs from healer to DPS, or tank to DPS? It doesn't. Zip. Zero. Zilch. Yet people don't want it, and like the other useful tools people want and expect, there are those who seemingly just want you not to have something, just for the sake of not having it.

 

Most of the negative comments I see about dual spec and the LFG tool boggle my mind.

 

Imagine you are a class that cannot spec into anything but DPS. If dual spec is implemented you now have a distinct disadvantage when it comes to trying to find a group compared to a class who can dual spec between healing and dps. That is only one way it could affect someone's gameplay.

[Sendrel]

Imagine you are a class that cannot spec into anything but DPS. If dual spec is implemented you now have a distinct disadvantage when it comes to trying to find a group compared to a class who can dual spec between healing and dps. That is only one way it could affect someone's gameplay.

 

How are you any more or less 'disadvantaged' with or without dual spec? If all your options boil down to dps, you're always going to be dps no matter what. I'm not getting the comparison to a class that can heal or dps - how does that factor in at all? If anything, a class respecing to heals removes competition for your spot in a group.

 

Not getting your point.

[Godsfear]

This game doesn't have a /roll function and you want dual-spec ?!?

 

Touche sir

 

Touche

 

But I still want both.

[zandadoum]

Imagine you are a class that cannot spec into anything but DPS. If dual spec is implemented you now have a distinct disadvantage when it comes to trying to find a group compared to a class who can dual spec between healing and dps. That is only one way it could affect someone's gameplay.

 

what Sendrel said, but besides, could you please point me to which swtor class can only fulfil ONE role in their specialisation?

 

you can either dps/heal

or tank/dps

 

so, your point is... which exactly?

[SlickDevlan]

Here was my post with my logical anlaysis. Feel free to try to refute it line for line. A common way to refute a logical argument is to prove a premise is flawed or not true, or that the conclusion does not follow from the premises.

 

Good luck.

 

You have yet to do any refuting either...

 

You talk a big game, but wilt when it comes time to put up...

[Flyjedi]

How are you any more or less 'disadvantaged' with or without dual spec? If all your options boil down to dps, you're always going to be dps no matter what. I'm not getting the comparison to a class that can heal or dps - how does that factor in at all? If anything, a class respecing to heals removes competition for your spot in a group.

 

Not getting your point.

 

 

Beat me to it. Well said btw.

[DamenX]

ya plz add a duel spec.. its insane trying to find a healer/tank for the heroic missions because everyone is specced dps for questing .. it already takes forever to get all the people to the quest/flash point. Having to wait for people to go respec first is just aggravating plus its just not fair to have only certain people forced to waste there money to respec. Anyone saying no duel spec plz makes absolutely no sense... pretty sure they are just trolling.