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Questions about PvP for a Noob


DomiSotto

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Let me start this by saying that I am very, very, very fond of the PvP'ers, and my biggest aspiration is to be an inconspicuous unranked player (who immediately leaves any and all 4x4's) that doesn't aggravate others. I am trying my best, and I try to live by the golden rules (such as thou shalt not break a CC and thou shalt do thine uttermost to target the marked un') but here is what keeps me awake at night:

 

1.Identifying the core pre-made. If I pugged, and there is four of them sporting the same Guild Name, I assume a premade in communication. If this doesn't happen, any other indicators I don't know of? Do they load zone at once as a block of 4, or is it as random as a pug?

 

2.Guard or Not to Guard. On one hand, in one of the earliest warzones I was in, a general command was issued to the Undergeared to go west (assuming the guard duty here). Which made sense to me at the time. It freed up the senior players to be at the mid. Now, after trying to guard a few times, I came to second guess this choice. A simple lack of skill makes it necessary (even if I do not facepalm, which, let's be honest, I do, no matter how hotly I desire not to) to always rely on a fast arrival of a back-up from a senior player. I am simply not even remotely close to being good enough to win a 1x1 against a player(s) who normally would go for capping the opposing team's node. Not to guard?

 

3. In-decisions at the gate: How to know where the most people would file/intend to file? Is following the game designated Ops leader the general rule? Is it always go right in the Voidstar? Because...

 

4. Non-standard tactics. Normally, I see an attack for the left and mid. Then suddenly, once in every dozen or more warzones, the group would split down the middle and go for the left and right, ignoring the mid. In one(!) case only I have seen this stratagem to win the zone (still not sure how). So, providing that the Golden Rule is not to go against more than <1 opponent the answer is to... go and sit tight for the lack of choices?

 

5. Objectives? The Guides say trying to achieve objectives, but it seems to aggravate people. Is leaving the objectives (save for defender points) to the senior players a better course of actions as that has less of a chance of messing up their plan? Is that an expected behavior?

 

6. Playing as a low level noob vs. high level noob (when a non-noob is not an option). A high level noob incites unfavorable comment, and the advice is to start a lowbie to learn the PvP. I tried that, and the thing is, at a very low level, the character is, well, as inadequate as the high-level one was before (and during) gearing process (yes, yes, the player is a common denominator). What are the advantages? I have only the time for one character to do the daily/weekly in the PvP, so I want to pick the right one. Stick to the L55 noob and continue gearing, or take a L17 further down that road to L55 and start gearing then (again)? Ranked obviously doesn't enter consideration, neither does conquest.

 

7. Coming upon a marked player all by his or her own self? Attack or proceed at the highest speed to the rest of the team? Attacking presumably would tie down the targeted player for the time it takes him or her to kill the noob, is it valuable enough window or detrimental as far as the kill count goes?

 

8. A Marked Player drops aggro - is there point to continue attacking at disadvantage, or risk switching the target to an unmarked player?

 

9. Which option in the Targeting selection gives a player the exact most way to start authomatically targeting a Focused player (not a modifier)? And, what is the best targeting function to target the closest friendly player 360 degrees? (Because Target Nearest seem to have a very different opinion on what the nearest is than I seem to have)?

 

Thank you!

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too many questions!

you seem a person with a brain..just practice. don't guard if you don't feel comfortable doing it..just don't go capping if you don't intend to guard, better going mid. if the most of your team goes to a weird position..like an offnode..go with the majority of them. you should be able with a bit of time, to recognize random pugs and bad premades from their guild name..sometimes if a lot of players in a big guild, queue together it may happen that they are actually solo queuing..about marked players..use your stun, slow, cc, mezz..they are usually healers and if they cross heal with another it will be hard to bring them down alone..try to help an eventual teammate focusing with you

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I'll answer what I can.

 

2.Guard or Not to Guard. On one hand, in one of the earliest warzones I was in, a general command was issued to the Undergeared to go west (assuming the guard duty here). Which made sense to me at the time. It freed up the senior players to be at the mid. Now, after trying to guard a few times, I came to second guess this choice. A simple lack of skill makes it necessary (even if I do not facepalm, which, let's be honest, I do, no matter how hotly I desire not to) to always rely on a fast arrival of a back-up from a senior player. I am simply not even remotely close to being good enough to win a 1x1 against a player(s) who normally would go for capping the opposing team's node. Not to guard?

 

Guarding a node does indeed require some 1v1 skill. However, it can also be done with a stealth class. Not because the element of surprise will win you the 1v1, but because stealthers have their sap (Mind Trap for Assassins, Sleep Dart for Operatives) - a long stun that can only be used in stealth on targets outside of combat - perfect for delaying the enemy until a teammate shows up to help you. One very important thing to note is that you should never guard next to the node. Be at least 10-15 meters away from it. This is because even in stealth, an enemy stealther will look for you there, and if they find you first, they can sap you and have just enough time to capture the node. However, if you're a bit farther from the node, the sap will break before they're done capping, allowing you to interrupt them.

 

TL;DR: If you're not good 1v1, only guard a node if you're a stealther.

 

3. In-decisions at the gate: How to know where the most people would file/intend to file? Is following the game designated Ops leader the general rule? Is it always go right in the Voidstar? Because...

 

People randomly get the Ops Leader title. It doesn't mean anything. For Voidstar, when attacking, it's best to go where you see an opportunity (enemy teammates outnumbered by yours). When defending, you can often just stand there and wait to see how many of your team go one side compared to the enemy team, and decide accordingly.

 

4. Non-standard tactics. Normally, I see an attack for the left and mid. Then suddenly, once in every dozen or more warzones, the group would split down the middle and go for the left and right, ignoring the mid. In one(!) case only I have seen this stratagem to win the zone (still not sure how). So, providing that the Golden Rule is not to go against more than <1 opponent the answer is to... go and sit tight for the lack of choices?

 

If your team decides to try and get both side nodes, it's actually a very good idea to attack mid. By keeping pressure on mid, you're forcing the opponents to waste time and effort they're not spending on getting their side node back, making your team's job easier.

 

5. Objectives? The Guides say trying to achieve objectives, but it seems to aggravate people. Is leaving the objectives (save for defender points) to the senior players a better course of actions as that has less of a chance of messing up their plan? Is that an expected behavior?

 

This one really depends on what maps. If you're not good at Huttball, you're probably better off passing the ball if you accidentally get it. But other than that, nodes are less of an issue. If you've won the fight mid, does it matter if you or someone else rightclicks the node? Same with Voidstar doors. Hypergate is no different: if you're in mid, and the enemy isn't there or isn't paying attention, feel free to grab an orb and carry it to your pylon. In fact, not enough people focus on doing that.

 

6. Playing as a low level noob vs. high level noob (when a non-noob is not an option). A high level noob incites unfavorable comment, and the advice is to start a lowbie to learn the PvP. I tried that, and the thing is, at a very low level, the character is, well, as inadequate as the high-level one was before (and during) gearing process (yes, yes, the player is a common denominator). What are the advantages? I have only the time for one character to do the daily/weekly in the PvP, so I want to pick the right one. Stick to the L55 noob and continue gearing, or take a L17 further down that road to L55 and start gearing then (again)? Ranked obviously doesn't enter consideration, neither does conquest.

 

My vote goes to low level. At level 55, you have all your abilities, and it can get really messy trying to make sense of it all, and keybinds, etc. If you're not experienced at a level 55 toon, you'll just get repeatedly slaughtered without really improving, because the learning curve will simply be too steep.

 

At level 17, it's a lot more simple. Yes, theree will be level 29s who will have more abilities than you, but this begs the question: who cares? What matters is your own improvement, and that's what you gain by playing a low level toon. It's far less mechanically-demanding, so you can learn to improve your decision-making and the way you play the maps themselves, as opposed to just combat. Furthermore, it's a slow and steady learning curve. With every few levels, you gain a new ability to add to your repertoire. It usually synchronizes with other abilities, slowly painting a picture of how to chain the abilities into a successful rotation.

 

7. Coming upon a marked player all by his or her own self? Attack or proceed at the highest speed to the rest of the team? Attacking presumably would tie down the targeted player for the time it takes him or her to kill the noob, is it valuable enough window or detrimental as far as the kill count goes?

 

Only attack if you can beat your target 1v1. Delaying them only means something if your team is capping something and the target is the only one close enough to interrupt them. If you're a Mercenary and the target is a Shadow, back off and pray he didn't see you. If you're an Operative and the target is a Sage, start stabbing. However, if the target happens to be a healer, it's always good to focus them. You're not gonna kill a healer without help, but making them use all their heals on themselves instead of their teammates is definitely worth it.

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Thank you, that helps. :)

 

Gods, no, I do not play the stealth classes, as I am barely handling a Beetle, don't hand me a Ferrari.

 

Hypergate is no different: if you're in mid, and the enemy isn't there or isn't paying attention, feel free to grab an orb and carry it to your pylon. In fact, not enough people focus on doing that.

 

See, I got a mock prompt (very funny one, actually) about my DPS role when I did it in Hypergate, and that's what made me ask. So, chances are, I have missed that the group was hard pressed holding the line.

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Well, I am by no means an expert, but since I've also struggled with all these questions (and still do)...

 

Let me start this by saying that I am very, very, very fond of the PvP'ers, and my biggest aspiration is to be an inconspicuous unranked player (who immediately leaves any and all 4x4's)

 

If you are leaving 4x4's because you don't like them, then be all means keep doing that. If you are leaving 4x4s because you are worried you are "not good enough" - well you don't get better at something by not doing it. :D And no one has any right (IMO) to expect that anyone who stays in an unranked 4x4 is in any way an expert.

 

I didn't think I'd like 4x4, and usually I don't. But I stay for them, just because I stay for almost everything, and I have to admit that I've learned a lot about the actual "fighting" of a WZ by doing 4x4. No objectives to worry about means you don't have anyone who's job it is to guard. :)

 

1.Identifying the core pre-made. If I pugged, and there is four of them sporting the same Guild Name, I assume a premade in communication. If this doesn't happen, any other indicators I don't know of? Do they load zone at once as a block of 4, or is it as random as a pug?

 

I don't have any help to offer hear, but I'm curious why you care? The only guild I've been in we said almost NOTHING in chat. Basically made jokes about the game. But we were a pretty casual guild, so maybe that's unusual. In any event, I think people expect more of the "dreaded premade" than is realistic.

 

2.Guard or Not to Guard. On one hand, in one of the earliest warzones I was in, a general command was issued to the Undergeared to go west (assuming the guard duty here). Which made sense to me at the time...

 

Never, EVER apologize for guarding. I guard A LOT. First because my main is a Shadow, so I'm just expected to guard. But even on all my alts I end up guarding all the time anyway, because no one else wants to. Maybe your server is different, but on POT5 (lowbie right now, with my alts) it's almost guaranteed to get at least 75% of the matches where 1/2 the team goes to cap the "off node" (or the pylon), and I go mid. Then I look up and that entire 1/2 team that went to cap the off node/pylon has left it defenseless. And I go guard. After this had happened so many times, I will NEVER feel bad if I lose a node while guarding, either by mistake or because my team just didn't respond to incs. (Ok, I'll feel a little bad if I lose it by my mistake.)

 

And those "senior players", never forget that if they are really all that great, they will have the awareness to be on their way to help you, almost before you know you need help (no, this doesn't mean you don't need to call incs). I posted a thread about this a while ago, and got some support and some ribbing - but it's totally true. I see it most in a good Voidstar defense team - you'll see them switching sides before the frantic call is made from the lone guard on the other side - because they've already noticed that there's a whole lot of green players and not many red at the spot where they are.

 

What you can do is type it into chat - "I'm a newb. If I call inc, come FAST because I won't last long." Then if some one is worried about it they will come replace you. Otherwise, well you gave them fair warning. (One other thing to check is the status of your Cc breaker when you are left to lone guard - if it's on cooldown, let people know - if anyone cares about guarding they WILL come to help/replace you - especially in AHG, where people love to try to sap-cap).

 

3. In-decisions at the gate: How to know where the most people would file/intend to file? Is following the game designated Ops leader the general rule? Is it always go right in the Voidstar? Because...

 

I always follow the ops leader if they are trying to lead. Even if I don't think it's the best strategy, I figure better that at least a few people try to coordinate, than everyone doing their own thing. That said, ops leader is basically random (no, it's not really random - but it's not anything like "the person with the most PvP experience" or anything remotely like that) - so many ops leaders have no interest in "leading". With this in mind, if someone else wants to lead, I follow what they ask for.

 

If no leader emerges (which is common), then I think for the "cap 2 of 3" WZ, the standard is to go for mid/south and the "natural" node. (One of the off nodes is always closer to your spawn spot). In AHG the "clockwise" node seems to be the one people go for. In VS the usual start is "everyone go [X], stealth go [not X]" - pick your favorite side. Hutball everyone runs up the middle.

 

But teams mess with this all the time. Feel free to suggest a strategy, or ask in chat if anyone else wants to. In VS especially, it's really easy to just type "right?" or "left?" into chat if no one else is. Don't be surprised when only 1/2 the team follows the "agreed upon" strategy. My advice here is just be willing to be flexible. It's not a bad idea to just hang back a bit and watch where people go. I'm of the opinion you can be more useful this way anyway. Instead of "blindly" rushing in, wait and see where you'll do the most good.

 

4. Non-standard tactics...

 

See above... :D If someone wants to try something non standard - and the rest of the group doesn't start arguing about it - then I'll go for it. You never know, as you've found out, what might work. I've had a game where someone suggested "lets go after their pylon" in AHG - the other side was a superior team in terms of raw "fighting ability", but it set them off-canter so much that they never recovered, and we won it easily. I've been in another game where we tried the same thing, and the other team adapted quickly and slaughtered us. I think the "golden rule" is, feel free to try something - if it works, great. If it doesn't work, don't keep trying it over and over. And just because it worked for you once, don't expect it to again.

 

5. Objectives? The Guides say trying to achieve objectives, but it seems to aggravate people. Is leaving the objectives (save for defender points) to the senior players a better course of actions as that has less of a chance of messing up their plan? Is that an expected behavior?

 

I've never been chastised for going for objectives. But I'd say don't do it blindly. Are you in a big melee and no one is seemingly paying attention to the nodes? Try to cap. See if anyone notices. Again, sometimes it will work. And, also again, if it turns out that the other team is paying attention, and they stop you (maybe you tried it twice) - then STOP trying that.

 

On the other hand, if your ENTIRE team has abandoned all hope of objectives, I think it's sometimes less aggravating to just join them in the "mindless bashing fun". I found that I get a lot less angry at the screen, for example, if when I find I'm they only one on my team trying to play huttball to just give it up and start deathmatching and ignore the score. :)

 

6. Playing as a low level noob vs. high level noob (when a non-noob is not an option). A high level noob incites unfavorable comment, and the advice is to start a lowbie to learn the PvP. I tried that, and the thing is, at a very low level, the character is, well, as inadequate as the high-level one was before (and during) gearing process (yes, yes, the player is a common denominator). What are the advantages?

 

I think the advantages are that when you start in lowbies you get to learn two things gradually. 1. Your character. 2. the warzones. If I remember right, for example, you did not keybind when you started. I think it's easier to lean keybinds as you go. And to figure out how each new power fits in with the old ones if you only have one (or two) new powers at a time. On the other hand, it might encourage the "newb" to stick to what they know as they level, so they end up sticking with the original powers from low level, because those are the keybinds they now know - sort of like when learning an instrument... it's a lot easier to "practice" the stuff you already know and are good at, than it is to practice the new stuff that's hard and you suck at. :D

 

I'm not sure learning the WZs is really any easier, but in theory people are more forgiving in lowbie, because that's where you are supposed to be when you are learning. There's something of a consensus that if you dare to step foot into a 55 WZ you should already know what you are doing (I don't agree with this, BTW - but that's neither here nor there). However, I've seen no shortage of chat messages on POT5 (again, your server may differ), even in lowbies, about "you are all so bad, go back to PvE" and "you should unsub, stop PvPing". I always respond with something like, "good thing we are sucking in lowbie, WHERE WE ARE SUPPOSED TO BE WHILE WE SUCK". Because I can't put into polite words here how much that attitude pisses me off.

 

7. Coming upon a marked player all by his or her own self? Attack or proceed at the highest speed to the rest of the team? Attacking presumably would tie down the targeted player for the time it takes him or her to kill the noob, is it valuable enough window or detrimental as far as the kill count goes?

 

If my team is trying to cap, an that player is rushing to help defend, I attack. If I think I can actually take them, I'll try. Otherwise I'll try to slow them down as much as possible. I'll do this with me vs. 2 or 3 or 4 even also. You never get anyone who notices, but if your team finishes a cap while those 4 "defenders" are all chasing you around because you've get them all tunneled on you, it's a great feeling. You are surely going to die, but you can be smug in the knowledge that you were pretty much single handedly responsible for giving your team time to get that node. :D

 

On the other hand, if you have 2 nodes and are defending, never go for a 1v1, if you can get a 2v1, 3v1, etc. I always head back to the group. Let the group help me kill them.

 

On the third hand, if your team is in a big melee and that's where everyone is headed (so it's not the situation where, for example, they are heading to the off node, and you could just follow them and then help the node guard where there'd be 2 of you against that 1 person) - well. I don't know if there is a hard and fast rule. One of those situational things again I think?

 

8. A Marked Player drops aggro - is there point to continue attacking at disadvantage, or risk switching the target to an unmarked player?

 

I'm not sure what you mean by this. You mean, do you bother going after a marked player if no one else is attacking them? Mostly, it depends on me and my class, and why is no one else attacking them. Can you get to them without the rest of the enemy team peeling you? Because it doesn't do much good to wade through 2 maras, a sniper and an assassin trying to get to the op healer so that you can fire off one auto-attack at her before you die from all the other people beating on you. But if it's a free-casting healer, and you can get to them, then yes, I think it's worth it. (It's why I love my current alt, my operative - I get to stealth to the back and go after all those pesky classes that try to hide back there and stay unnoticed - like the marked healers. :D )

 

9. Which option in the Targeting selection...

 

Sorry, I suck at targeting. I know some people use target of target, and target of focus and so on. Mostly I just tab target enemies and use the ops frame to target friendlies. Not the best, but oh well, I suck in so many other ways already it's not at the top of my list of priorities to be working on. :D

 

Thank you!

 

You are welcome. Whew! That was a long list of questions.

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Let me start this by saying that I am very, very, very fond of the PvP'ers, and my biggest aspiration is to be an inconspicuous unranked player (who immediately leaves any and all 4x4's) that doesn't aggravate others. I am trying my best, and I try to live by the golden rules (such as thou shalt not break a CC and thou shalt do thine uttermost to target the marked un') but here is what keeps me awake at night:

 

1.Identifying the core pre-made. If I pugged, and there is four of them sporting the same Guild Name, I assume a premade in communication. If this doesn't happen, any other indicators I don't know of? Do they load zone at once as a block of 4, or is it as random as a pug?

It is possible to queue as a group of four in un-ranked, or solo. So, it is possible that four guild mates all queued solo and happened to be in the same match on the same team. It is also possible that they queued as a group.

 

2.Guard or Not to Guard. On one hand, in one of the earliest warzones I was in, a general command was issued to the Undergeared to go west (assuming the guard duty here). Which made sense to me at the time. It freed up the senior players to be at the mid. Now, after trying to guard a few times, I came to second guess this choice. A simple lack of skill makes it necessary (even if I do not facepalm, which, let's be honest, I do, no matter how hotly I desire not to) to always rely on a fast arrival of a back-up from a senior player. I am simply not even remotely close to being good enough to win a 1x1 against a player(s) who normally would go for capping the opposing team's node. Not to guard?

It depends on your class, really. There are some classes that are just awful at guarding, and should never do it. Healers, marauders / sentinels, possibly sorcs / sages should not be guarding solo. Stealth, PT/VG, Sniper / GS have more tools that are beneficial for guarding. I've had numerous experiences in which nobody is willing to guard a node (even when it's obvious that enemies are inbound), so I inevitably attempt to solo guard only to lose a 3v1 and then get chewed out in chat by the idiots who refused to guard themselves. :mad: Bottom line is, node guarding is the worst thing in this game. If you don't want to do it, don't do it.

 

3. In-decisions at the gate: How to know where the most people would file/intend to file? Is following the game designated Ops leader the general rule? Is it always go right in the Voidstar? Because...

Over time, you will figure out strategies. If somebody suggests a terrible strategy, ignore them. Good strategy? Do it. The ops leader thing is useless. I don't follow somebody just because they are ops leader. In voidstar, sometimes it is beneficial to overload one side while the other side has one guy attempting to draw 2-3 enemies. This gives a numbers advantage. Sometimes all 8 on one side works. Sometimes stealth caps are highly effective. When you are attacking, it's generally a good idea to try to get the enemies to engage you away from the door, 30m or more. When defending, you want to park right on the door so that you are in range of interrupting a cap.

 

4. Non-standard tactics. Normally, I see an attack for the left and mid. Then suddenly, once in every dozen or more warzones, the group would split down the middle and go for the left and right, ignoring the mid. In one(!) case only I have seen this stratagem to win the zone (still not sure how). So, providing that the Golden Rule is not to go against more than <1 opponent the answer is to... go and sit tight for the lack of choices?

I try to go with what the team is doing. If you are the only one attacking e.g. snow in civil war and your teammates are going after mid and grass, you should probably go mid or grass. However, if you think you can 1v1 or 1v2 the enemies guarding snow, then go for it. Also, if you hold 2 of 3 turrets in civil war and your team is going to win if you can hold the 2, don't be an idiot and go for a 3rd when it is unnecessary - go help guard one of the two.

 

5. Objectives? The Guides say trying to achieve objectives, but it seems to aggravate people. Is leaving the objectives (save for defender points) to the senior players a better course of actions as that has less of a chance of messing up their plan? Is that an expected behavior?

In my experience, people only get mad when other people ignore the objectives. In huttball, move to either support the ball carrier or receive a pass. In hypergate, guard pylons, go for orbs, or kill the enemy. In voidstar, go for plant / prevent planting. In Novare Coast and Alderaan Civil War, cap nodes and guard nodes. If you go for objectives, there is no way that you can mess up a teammate's plan. As you begin to understand the objectives better, you'll begin to understand how to work with your teammates better.

 

6. Playing as a low level noob vs. high level noob (when a non-noob is not an option). A high level noob incites unfavorable comment, and the advice is to start a lowbie to learn the PvP. I tried that, and the thing is, at a very low level, the character is, well, as inadequate as the high-level one was before (and during) gearing process (yes, yes, the player is a common denominator). What are the advantages? I have only the time for one character to do the daily/weekly in the PvP, so I want to pick the right one. Stick to the L55 noob and continue gearing, or take a L17 further down that road to L55 and start gearing then (again)? Ranked obviously doesn't enter consideration, neither does conquest.

Ignore the haters. Just go with whatever character you like the most. If your gear sucks, it will gradually get better as you get more warzone comms. Don't worry about it. The only things that you should worry about in 55 pvp are: use stims and augments, make sure that you have close to 2018 expertise inside a warzone (after bolster takes effect).

 

7. Coming upon a marked player all by his or her own self? Attack or proceed at the highest speed to the rest of the team? Attacking presumably would tie down the targeted player for the time it takes him or her to kill the noob, is it valuable enough window or detrimental as far as the kill count goes?

Focus fire. Figure out who your team is focusing and do the same. Often times, healers are marked. You're probably not going to solo a healer. Then again, there are myriad reasons why a player could be marked. Still, focus fire.

 

8. A Marked Player drops aggro - is there point to continue attacking at disadvantage, or risk switching the target to an unmarked player?

I think you mean that the player that your team is focusing has ran off, out of range? If so, it depends. If you think you can chase after him and finish him off, do it. If not, move on to the next target.

 

9. Which option in the Targeting selection gives a player the exact most way to start authomatically targeting a Focused player (not a modifier)? And, what is the best targeting function to target the closest friendly player 360 degrees? (Because Target Nearest seem to have a very different opinion on what the nearest is than I seem to have)?

Yeah, it's hard. I just look at the health bars of neighboring enemies, see visual effects activating on him, and go for it. Tab-targeting is not super effective.

 

Thank you!

Hope that helps.

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See, I got a mock prompt (very funny one, actually) about my DPS role when I did it in Hypergate, and that's what made me ask. So, chances are, I have missed that the group was hard pressed holding the line.

 

One thing you an do here to have your cake and eat it to is to grab the orb, but don't deliver it (stay in mid and just keep fighting). That way you sort of played objectives by denying the orb to the enemy, but you also stuck with your DPS role.

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Let me start this by saying that I am very, very, very fond of the PvP'ers, and my biggest aspiration is to be an inconspicuous unranked player (who immediately leaves any and all 4x4's) that doesn't aggravate others. I am trying my best, and I try to live by the golden rules (such as thou shalt not break a CC and thou shalt do thine uttermost to target the marked un') but here is what keeps me awake at night:

 

1.Identifying the core pre-made. If I pugged, and there is four of them sporting the same Guild Name, I assume a premade in communication. If this doesn't happen, any other indicators I don't know of? Do they load zone at once as a block of 4, or is it as random as a pug?

Can be a little tricky to tell, since some pugs (although rare) can coordinate similarly to a premade - just a bit slower due to lack of voice chat. Good indicators are usually; 4 of the same Guild name, dps peeling for heals and Tanks actually doing their job properly. But you can get similar things in pugs with good players. Keep in mind that a Great Pug against a Bad Pug is going to seem feel a premade. Also helps to know the guilds on your server and how they run - I can think of a couple guilds that run 4man premades on Harbinger.

 

2.Guard or Not to Guard. On one hand, in one of the earliest warzones I was in, a general command was issued to the Undergeared to go west (assuming the guard duty here). Which made sense to me at the time. It freed up the senior players to be at the mid. Now, after trying to guard a few times, I came to second guess this choice. A simple lack of skill makes it necessary (even if I do not facepalm, which, let's be honest, I do, no matter how hotly I desire not to) to always rely on a fast arrival of a back-up from a senior player. I am simply not even remotely close to being good enough to win a 1x1 against a player(s) who normally would go for capping the opposing team's node. Not to guard?

Some classes are better at guarding than others; Vanguards, Gunslingers, Scoundrels and Shadows come to mind (not in that order.) Outside of that; it just comes down to knowing your class and playing it as defensively as possible - having the New Guy guard is probably the stupidest thing a team can do. If you still get stuck guarding - Call Incs with a number (hell, even call suspected incs - atleast you're covering yourself), Bide Time and if you die, you die. You did your part - if your team failed to help, that's their problem.

 

3. In-decisions at the gate: How to know where the most people would file/intend to file? Is following the game designated Ops leader the general rule? Is it always go right in the Voidstar? Because...

Depends. If you're unsure, ask before the round starts - someone more experience will say. If not, hang back and follow the crowd.

 

4. Non-standard tactics. Normally, I see an attack for the left and mid. Then suddenly, once in every dozen or more warzones, the group would split down the middle and go for the left and right, ignoring the mid. In one(!) case only I have seen this stratagem to win the zone (still not sure how). So, providing that the Golden Rule is not to go against more than <1 opponent the answer is to... go and sit tight for the lack of choices?

Again, depends. Just follow the crowd until you're comfortable with tactics and your class.

 

5. Objectives? The Guides say trying to achieve objectives, but it seems to aggravate people. Is leaving the objectives (save for defender points) to the senior players a better course of actions as that has less of a chance of messing up their plan? Is that an expected behavior?

The only people who get annoyed by the objectives are those who chase big numbers on the board. Who cares if you only hit 150k damage in that Huttball? You scored 4 of your teams goals.

 

6. Playing as a low level noob vs. high level noob (when a non-noob is not an option). A high level noob incites unfavorable comment, and the advice is to start a lowbie to learn the PvP. I tried that, and the thing is, at a very low level, the character is, well, as inadequate as the high-level one was before (and during) gearing process (yes, yes, the player is a common denominator). What are the advantages? I have only the time for one character to do the daily/weekly in the PvP, so I want to pick the right one. Stick to the L55 noob and continue gearing, or take a L17 further down that road to L55 and start gearing then (again)? Ranked obviously doesn't enter consideration, neither does conquest.

Two Options: 1) Stick to 55s and find someone on your server to group with and help you. 2) Start at lowbie - this way you learn your character through PvP gradually, rather than having everything dumped on you at once. But that depends on how much time you have.

 

7. Coming upon a marked player all by his or her own self? Attack or proceed at the highest speed to the rest of the team? Attacking presumably would tie down the targeted player for the time it takes him or her to kill the noob, is it valuable enough window or detrimental as far as the kill count goes?

Depends. Where are they heading? And why are they marked? If it's a healer; up to you, but 1v1'ing a healer can take a while if their defensives are up. If it's a dps that is wiping the floor with everyone, chances are that he's going to explode you and move on. If they're heading to attack your node; call inc, and either stall them or kite them back to your node hopefully where you have a buddy guarding who can help take them down.

 

8. A Marked Player drops aggro - is there point to continue attacking at disadvantage, or risk switching the target to an unmarked player?

If it means leaving an objective unguarded - I wouldn't. If you're in mid, and it's a healer running away, I'd chase the kill if I had an escape (Force Camo, Guardian Leap, Stealth, etc) incase things get hairy for me.

 

9. Which option in the Targeting selection gives a player the exact most way to start authomatically targeting a Focused player (not a modifier)? And, what is the best targeting function to target the closest friendly player 360 degrees? (Because Target Nearest seem to have a very different opinion on what the nearest is than I seem to have)?

Can't say. If I'm healing, I usually click targets in the ops frame.

 

Thank you!

 

Answers in Green.

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Responses in red

 

People randomly get the Ops Leader title. It doesn't mean anything. For Voidstar, when attacking, it's best to go where you see an opportunity (enemy teammates outnumbered by yours). When defending, you can often just stand there and wait to see how many of your team go one side compared to the enemy team, and decide accordingly.

 

People don't randomly get the OPs leader title. It's actually decided by who is closest to achieving the next valor level. If I join a WZ and I'm made OPs leader because I'm 3000 valor from reaching 89, I can be replaced as OPs leader by someone joining who only needs 1000 to reach 65. Also, if you're defending and you stand outside the gate too long, you've just let enemy stealthers, if there are any, get that much closer to the door. I've seen it happen numerous times where people stand there too long trying to decide and actually let someone plant on the door.

 

 

If your team decides to try and get both side nodes, it's actually a very good idea to attack mid. By keeping pressure on mid, you're forcing the opponents to waste time and effort they're not spending on getting their side node back, making your team's job easier.

 

This works only if you know, for certain, that those attacking the off node are actually capable of taking it,holding it and that the person that decides to attack mid is actually capable enough to make themselves a threat.

 

If neither of these things is possible then you have robbed those members of your team defending the off node of valuable reinforcements.

 

This one really depends on what maps. If you're not good at Huttball, you're probably better off passing the ball if you accidentally get it. But other than that, nodes are less of an issue. If you've won the fight mid, does it matter if you or someone else rightclicks the node? Same with Voidstar doors. Hypergate is no different: if you're in mid, and the enemy isn't there or isn't paying attention, feel free to grab an orb and carry it to your pylon. In fact, not enough people focus on doing that.

 

Grabbing an orb in HG is situational. I've seen too many people run past team mates that are in a fight where the odds are 2v1 or 3v2 where the person that decided to grab an orb instead of helping caused the death of team mates. Since kills actually matter in HG, it is far better to help your team mates kill the enemy and control mid than it is to just rush pass them and grab an orb. Once that control is established, then grab the orbs and run them.

 

Only attack if you can beat your target 1v1. Delaying them only means something if your team is capping something and the target is the only one close enough to interrupt them. If you're a Mercenary and the target is a Shadow, back off and pray he didn't see you. If you're an Operative and the target is a Sage, start stabbing. However, if the target happens to be a healer, it's always good to focus them. You're not gonna kill a healer without help, but making them use all their heals on themselves instead of their teammates is definitely worth it.

 

Who marks a Shadow? Even then, why should a merc run and pray? Shadow vs Merc is not a guaranteed win for the Shadow. I've seen 2 Shadows get the jump on 2 mercs and get melted. 99% of the time a marked player is a healer and if they are out on their own they are, more than likely, trying to get to a node to start healing. So yes, delay them and it is quite possible for a lone DPS to kill a healer as long as they know what they're doing and use their tools correctly. (i.e. stuns, interrupts, KDs, chokes, etc)

 

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I'm a noob and this thread is called "questions for a noob" so this is right up my alley. :D

 

Seriously though, don't be so self-deprecating and stop constantly referring to yourself as a "noob". The simple fact that you're here asking questions instead of running your mouth, calling for nerfs or whining puts you in a whole different league. There's going to be better players than you and there's going to be worse players. That happens to everyone - it doesn't really matter what side of the curve you're on provided that you keep trying to get better and are willing to listen to actual advice when offered.

 

Others have already covered your questions better than I could so I'm simply going to offer my take on 1v1s: I don't bother unless I have a specific reason to engage solo. The usual reason would be, obviously, stopping a cap. Calling for help first and then trying your darndest to delay your death until help arrives should be your priority and you should always do it in this situation. Otherwise, I generally avoid 1v1s because the outcome is always uncertain -even when the odds are stacked in my favor because I know the classes and have the advantage- you never know if there's a stealther tagging along or if his buddies are right around the corner. In addition you are robbing your team of your own help when it may be needed elsewhere for no reason other than a single kill. Play it safe, play objectives and try to keep your attention to what's happening in the WZ rather than just the guy in front of you.

 

Happy hunting!

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This is an excellent thread, and I'm glad you got some great responses here, Domi. I've been following your advancement in PvP and I'm glad to see you coming along :)

 

A couple of niggling clarifications came to mind as I was reading the (extremely helpful!) responses:

 

The ops leader in a warzone is not determined randomly: it's the person with the highest valor. If you have ops leader (A) and (B) joins the match with higher valor, THEY will become the new ops leader. So, actually, the ops leader IS the most experienced PvPer in the op.

 

In Pylons, as the match progresses, kills become worth more points than orbs. If there is nobody to kill in mid (your team has cleared them all out), then feel free to grab an orb and run it back. If there are folks to kill in mid, though, get to killin'. On the other hand, if there's nobody to kill in mid because your entire team is trying to cap the enemy pylon, then you should probably find a way to get to the big fight and start killin'!

 

In closing, I would recommend that you stop dropping 4v4 matches, especially on your lowbie. You need to learn how to duel 1v1, and this is the best arena in which to learn (see what I did there?).

 

Good luck, Domi!

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Responses in red

 

I agreed with most of your points, but then this happened:

 

Who marks a Shadow? Even then, why should a merc run and pray? Shadow vs Merc is not a guaranteed win for the Shadow. I've seen 2 Shadows get the jump on 2 mercs and get melted.

 

And I've seen an Operative kill a Vanguard. So? The only thing this one specific case proves is that these Shadows were bad (if they got the jump, why not sap one first?), or had no cooldowns available. As someone who plays a Concealment Operative, which these days is considered little more than an inferior Shadow, I have never lost a duel to a Merc, or even came close to losing, and I'm hardly a pro. Shadows/Assassins are amazing duelists, arguably stronger than Vengeance Juggernauts. Nothing is ever a guaranteed win, but assuming no major disparity in player skill or abilities on cooldown, Shadow vs Merc goes very heavily in favor of the Shadow.

 

and it is quite possible for a lone DPS to kill a healer as long as they know what they're doing and use their tools correctly. (i.e. stuns, interrupts, KDs, chokes, etc)

 

Were it so easy. It's possible if you've got mad burst, like Deception or Carnage, have all your cooldowns, and they have literally none of theirs. Other than that, it's not gonna happen. Healers have tools as well, you know. Stuns, knockbacks, defensive cooldowns, speedups, rolls, slows, cc break, and let's not forget - heals. They're in no shortage of abilities to defend themselves with, and once you run out of cc, it's over, as they heal for a lot more than any single class can damage them.

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With the understanding you have of the WZ you've lost the Noob title - title that's good to lose! I followed your "PVP a day" thread with interest, now this one with more good information being validate. Interesting to see the 2 faces of the PVP community: one griping and whining about everything, the other very helpful.

 

Only constructive comment I have is, all the guides and advice on winning WZs found in this forum and elsewhere are a great starting point - but that's all they are. The WZs are always dynamic, and fluid throughout. The best course of action at any moment depends on what the situation is. I love Civil War in this respect because flying back to the field after each death gives you a great bird's eye view of what's going on!

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Let me start this by saying that I am very, very, very fond of the PvP'ers, and my biggest aspiration is to be an inconspicuous unranked player (who immediately leaves any and all 4x4's) that doesn't aggravate others. I am trying my best, and I try to live by the golden rules (such as thou shalt not break a CC and thou shalt do thine uttermost to target the marked un') but here is what keeps me awake at night:

 

1.Identifying the core pre-made. If I pugged, and there is four of them sporting the same Guild Name, I assume a premade in communication. If this doesn't happen, any other indicators I don't know of? Do they load zone at once as a block of 4, or is it as random as a pug?

 

2.Guard or Not to Guard. On one hand, in one of the earliest warzones I was in, a general command was issued to the Undergeared to go west (assuming the guard duty here). Which made sense to me at the time. It freed up the senior players to be at the mid. Now, after trying to guard a few times, I came to second guess this choice. A simple lack of skill makes it necessary (even if I do not facepalm, which, let's be honest, I do, no matter how hotly I desire not to) to always rely on a fast arrival of a back-up from a senior player. I am simply not even remotely close to being good enough to win a 1x1 against a player(s) who normally would go for capping the opposing team's node. Not to guard?

 

3. In-decisions at the gate: How to know where the most people would file/intend to file? Is following the game designated Ops leader the general rule? Is it always go right in the Voidstar? Because...

 

4. Non-standard tactics. Normally, I see an attack for the left and mid. Then suddenly, once in every dozen or more warzones, the group would split down the middle and go for the left and right, ignoring the mid. In one(!) case only I have seen this stratagem to win the zone (still not sure how). So, providing that the Golden Rule is not to go against more than <1 opponent the answer is to... go and sit tight for the lack of choices?

 

5. Objectives? The Guides say trying to achieve objectives, but it seems to aggravate people. Is leaving the objectives (save for defender points) to the senior players a better course of actions as that has less of a chance of messing up their plan? Is that an expected behavior?

 

6. Playing as a low level noob vs. high level noob (when a non-noob is not an option). A high level noob incites unfavorable comment, and the advice is to start a lowbie to learn the PvP. I tried that, and the thing is, at a very low level, the character is, well, as inadequate as the high-level one was before (and during) gearing process (yes, yes, the player is a common denominator). What are the advantages? I have only the time for one character to do the daily/weekly in the PvP, so I want to pick the right one. Stick to the L55 noob and continue gearing, or take a L17 further down that road to L55 and start gearing then (again)? Ranked obviously doesn't enter consideration, neither does conquest.

 

7. Coming upon a marked player all by his or her own self? Attack or proceed at the highest speed to the rest of the team? Attacking presumably would tie down the targeted player for the time it takes him or her to kill the noob, is it valuable enough window or detrimental as far as the kill count goes?

 

8. A Marked Player drops aggro - is there point to continue attacking at disadvantage, or risk switching the target to an unmarked player?

 

9. Which option in the Targeting selection gives a player the exact most way to start authomatically targeting a Focused player (not a modifier)? And, what is the best targeting function to target the closest friendly player 360 degrees? (Because Target Nearest seem to have a very different opinion on what the nearest is than I seem to have)?

 

Thank you!

 

1. It doesn't really matter... there are often premades that are worse than 4 random good players... so don't worry too much about it.

 

2. Guarding. You have a bit of misunderstanding and have been given here in this thread some really bad advices. Your first aim as a guard node is to call early and stall by staying alive as much as possible giving as much as possible time to your teamate(s) to arrive and assist you. So basically there is no need to try and kill your attacker just avoid and interrupt even if you are a sentinel or a vanguard. So 1v1 skill has nothing to do with guarding, although it might help as if you are confident enough that you can beat the other then there is no need for help. Of course this overconfidence or miscalculation has resulted in epic fails often for many reasons. And of course some classes are better than others when it comes to guarding... particularly stealth ones. But always don't stay too close to what you are guarding to avoid being mezzed and capped. And when you call call with numbers, some players do take them into consideration and might even check their map or have a look to see what is happening... You don't need to write an essay just s1="snow 1 visible incoming" is more than sufficient, or r1="right door as you come out from spawn there is 1 visible enemy"...

 

3. That's way too complex... depends on class, zone, team composition and organisation... Try to get better yourself and don't worry too much about following "orders"... eg. someone mezzed opponent and is capping... try to hold your horses and get ready to assist with a chain cc, pull, push, etc... Think CC before pewpew, but don't hold your pewpew back either when needed. Practice following target (look at your keybindings) even as a pug, think what utility your class brings and use in the most effective way when appropriate, etc.

 

4. PVP is fairly dynamic that attacking mid node while having the sides might be the thing to do... e.g. it seems you will be losing side node fairly soon so while enemy is occupied at sides get mid... but in general it is a bad practice... and should be employed by someone that has the ability to (win 1v1 and) cap... So bottom line is that unconventional tacticts are better left to experienced players, especially those that had done ranked warzones when existed have a better awareness of the situation... then again experienced players often don't play for objectives even if they perfectly know how to do so :).

 

5. Senior players often don't play objectives... :)

6. I think you are getting stressed to much about it, it is just a game in the end of the day... but undergeared players entering ranked will create alienation... undergeared meaning not in full obroan gear and unaugmented. So if you have fully augmented obroan gear which takes little time to obtain you are perfectly geared for ranked.

 

7-9: Not sure I understand all your questions here, but there are various options with targetting, play with them and see what works for you... also look at set target focus and bind target focus' target... if you are dps... if you are healer or tank it helps to have on your focus win an enemy rather than a teamate that you would as dps... although you could have an enemy as a dps too and modify that your focus becmes your target to quickly target him.... There are a few targeting options out there, play with them and see what works for you.

Edited by MusicRider
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Folks, thank you, I am starting to figure out what I would do, with all the replies. I understand every situation is different, but i think I will benefit from having rules that would save me those fractions of seconds hesitation that kills ya!

 

Obviously, thank you for the votes of confidence and pats on the back, but trust me, I have the front seat here, so I can judge my performance well enough :)

 

I think I am going to take your point to heart about the 4x4s. Not on my Gunslinger whose average lifespan of 20 seconds doesn't really net me much but watching a tragic movie my team's death. But on my baby Vanguard, I will need to try it out. That's what he is made for after all.

 

With the keybinds, I have read and reread the section on the targeting with using focus in the Guides (How to Become...) a few times, and I still don't understand which one when keybound would target the focused/marked player for me automatically. I use 'middle f the screen' for the enemies, but still resort to point-and-click for friends when I am trying to be precise, and not rely on the keybound 'target nearest' which failed me plenty in the past. Sort of like the "target companion' always targets the companion?

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