TUXs Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 (edited) Really? You think players get kicked for asking questions? They get kicked in sm ops because of gear? Yes. I think players get kicked for every imaginable reason. Not having any knowledge of the fight is most certainly one I've seen. I don't agree with it, but I've seen it. edit: I should add...I believe they get kicked for someone "better" usually, but the excuses have certainly been gear and not knowing the fights. Edited September 4, 2014 by TUXs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImmortalLowlife Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Well let me just say I'm calling BS ! 1) I have never been in an ops that kicked a player because they asked a question. Now if you go afk in protest because you don't want to run the ops then yes you will get kicked. But for asking a question that 100% BS 2) nobody get kicked from sm ops anymore and have not in awhile you know why? Cause they are bolstered. Again I'm calling BS. If you got kicked... 1) it wasn't because you asked a question 2) it wasn't because of your gear....well unless you had strength mods on a sorc.... YOU can call whatever you want, but regardless....IT'S A FACT. IT HAPPENED....And fyi I know how to gear myself. Just because something's never happened to you, doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Gtfohwts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdmaha Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Yes. I think players get kicked for every imaginable reason. Not having any knowledge of the fight is most certainly one I've seen. I don't agree with it, but I've seen it. edit: I should add...I believe they get kicked for someone "better" usually, but the excuses have certainly been gear and not knowing the fights. Well my experience has been different as I said before in the post you replied with your arrogant lol comment. I have never seen a player kicked for asking a question in a SM OPS. If that player then proceeds to make mistakes go afk or doesn't listen then yes they will get kicked. As for gear I have never been in a SM ops have the leader do a gear check and kick somebody because of their gear never not once and I've been here for a long time buddy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manabuka Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 First I didn't call you ignorant. I said IF you came to an mmo expecting to experience everything as a solo played then you were. Second this game is already the most solo friendly mmo out, they will continue to and will continue to add content for the solo player, but it's also and mmo and they will add mmo aspects. For some to complain about adding mmo/group content that solo player can't play is ridiculous. I didn't come to this game expecting anything. I had never played an mmo before. I had no preconceived notions of what I would and wouldn't be able to do. I was pleasantly surprised by how much fun it was and how much of it I could do on my own. And as I've said repeatedly, I do the group content and even enjoy the experience most of the time! But it is forced on me. Ultimately my argument boils down to more choices are better for any game. I haven't once complained that the group content exists. Just that it is the ONLY way to experience some of the story, when more choices would be better, especially for Bioware and Star Wars fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Well my experience has been different as I said before in the post you replied with your arrogant lol comment. I have never seen a player kicked for asking a question in a SM OPS. If that player then proceeds to make mistakes go afk or doesn't listen then yes they will get kicked. As for gear I have never been in a SM ops have the leader do a gear check and kick somebody because of their gear never not once and I've been here for a long time buddy. You're lucky then. I've seen players get kicked from S&V for gear as well as DP/DF SM Ops recently. When a player can't even change a level 15 implant, they probably aren't geared for healing/tanking a DF, even if it's only SM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdmaha Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 You're lucky then. I've seen players get kicked from S&V for gear as well as DP/DF SM Ops recently. When a player can't even change a level 15 implant, they probably aren't geared for healing/tanking a DF, even if it's only SM. You are aware that it doesn't matter if they wear a level 15 implant no implant or a level 50 implant right? In SM OPS they get bolstered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivanhedgehog Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Some people do like to arrange the design and look of their strongholds as well as their character. And again, going by the succes of the cartel market, this probably isn't an insignificant amount of the playing population. Just becaurse it isn't group content (in the traditional sense) doesn't mean that it isn't content. What people do in the game, as meaningful things to do for -them-, IS content, whether you like the specific content or not. And who gets to decide what good or bad content is then? If people wants to turn themselves into little ponies and would happily pay Bioware to do that, how would that ever be "not good content" then? Housing is a popular feature in several MMOs on the market currently, so Biowares decision to add it here aswell is simply a logical one. Firstly: What exactly are you basing the premise of Bioware losing subscribers on? Losing subscribers would be a sad thing indeed, no arguements there, but where's the evidence that they are losing them? Secondly: You claim Bioware has not put allot of money back into development. What do you base that arguement on? Simply that you don't like the content they have released with Strongholds or what? Creating entirely new features in the game, that relies on alternative mechanics, such as space-pvp and stronghold-editor, isn't something you just do in an afternoons worth of programming. It's something that requires allot of man-hours and a significant investment into the product, even on relatively similar additions to the standard game mechanics, even more so on mechanics that require, more or less, complete reworkings of the game mechanics available. A small budget? And ofc, you have something to back up this claim, such as a comparative analysis of the content-releases and budgets commonly used in the MMO-industry or anything to that effect? Or are you simply grasping at straws based on a assumption that Bioware isn't using the money they make to further develop the game while still maintaining costs and wages, just like any business would do to survive a competitive market? The MMO-industry is a highly competitive market with allot of "fickle" customers (if you base it on forum opinions atleast) so withholding investments would be a poor idea for any developer, if they wish to retain their customers. But where is the evidence that Bioware, more than any other company, is not investing their profits into further developing the game. They are continuing to implement new features and content in the game at a very competitive rate with the other MMOs, so what exactly do you base this opinion, that Bioware isn't investing in the game, on? I didnt say housing wasnt good, desired or worthwhile. It just isnt playable content. its not bad, I have had fun setting it up myself. some people like to play with the character appearance kiosk for long periods of time. nice feature, but not playable content. the players will decide what is good content and what isnt...kinda like the hordes of people doing seeker droids stuff. some people do it, just not many. again, read what I said. I didnt say swtor was losing subs..I said if it did it would there would be a large effect...that is part of the problem with a hybrid model...no model is perfect. I also said the the "fleet is empty we are doooomed" threads are pretty much worthless. visual population ques dont show the real picture any more. More people are off elsewhere doing things, not hanging around on fleet. Not a bad thing. the indications are the bioware devs are working hard with a small budget. I may disagree with some of the things they do, but that doesnt mean they are sitting around drinking lattes and playing mahjong. We havent seen a huge hiring spree of artists and programmers that would give them the man hours to do some of the projects that I am sure they would like to do. Only so many hours in the day for them. I am NOT beating on the devs, just saying keep a open mind to reality. everything isnt coming up roses but it also is not DOOOOOMMMMED. I dont think the expansion will be out before Jan/Feb. just my feeling and if thats they way it works, so be it. If it is out in Dec I will be surprised, but it will be ready when it is ready. the world wont end one way or another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 You are aware that it doesn't matter if they wear a level 15 implant no implant or a level 50 implant right? In SM OPS they get bolstered. That's a recent change. That didn't exist for the first 2-1/2 years of this games release. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deewe Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 I didnt say housing wasnt good, desired or worthwhile. It just isnt playable content. its not bad, I have had fun setting it up myself. some people like to play with the character appearance kiosk for long periods of time. nice feature, but not playable content. Actually this isn't true, playable content is just being able to interact with the game, versus say watching cut scene. For some housing or tweaking their character look or even dressing them up is actually playable content. Even for MMO combat isn't the only type of playable content. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdmaha Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 That's a recent change. That didn't exist for the first 2-1/2 years of this games release. I am aware of that it was mentioned in my post you replied to. You must have missed it while you came up with that arrogant reply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivanhedgehog Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 You are aware that it doesn't matter if they wear a level 15 implant no implant or a level 50 implant right? In SM OPS they get bolstered. that is only a recent addition. and some raid leaders cant seem to remember it was added. I raid in full 180/186 so it doesnt affect me, but I have seen it happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Icebergy Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 You are aware that it doesn't matter if they wear a level 15 implant no implant or a level 50 implant right? In SM OPS they get bolstered. Bolster or not, if someone is still wearing a level 15 implant at level 55, they are not the kind of player I want to group with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdmaha Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Bolster or not, if someone is still wearing a level 15 implant at level 55, they are not the kind of player I want to group with. And I would question how many players are running around at level 55 with a level 15 implant trying to get into DF or DP. I'm sure the answer is extremely low...pretty sure Mr. TUX example is called an exaggeration or an attempt to mislead in order to sway others to his side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ikinai Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Bolster or not, if someone is still wearing a level 15 implant at level 55, they are not the kind of player I want to group with. I'm sorry but thanks to the new law passed by the senate, the Fair Access to All Law, heretofore referred to as FATAL, you must accept these people into your OPs. These OPs will now be referred to as FATAL Ops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khevar Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 I'm sorry but thanks to the new law passed by the senate, the Fair Access to All Law, heretofore referred to as FATAL, you must accept these people into your OPs. These OPs will now be referred to as FATAL Ops. ikinai's posts are better than coffee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heat-Wave Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 And I would question how many players are running around at level 55 with a level 15 implant trying to get into DF or DP. I'm sure the answer is extremely low...pretty sure Mr. TUX example is called an exaggeration or an attempt to mislead in order to sway others to his side. I've seen it with lvl 37 and 44 implants, with 112 blue mods... The performance of those players matches their gear in my experience... If you haven't played the game enough to be able to at least be in all lvl 50 gear, you probably aren't ready for raids... In our own guild, before we take people on raids, we make sure they have done all the daily areas at least once, some of them a few times, that should get them into a mix of 50 and 53 gear (Oricon story is great for the 53 stuff). Then we take them on some 50 and 55 HM FP to get more comms and gear. THEN they are ready for raids... I see people trying to skip steps, generally their performance suffers for it. (yes, there are exceptions, but I'm speaking generally) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 And I would question how many players are running around at level 55 with a level 15 implant trying to get into DF or DP. I'm sure the answer is extremely low...pretty sure Mr. TUX example is called an exaggeration or an attempt to mislead in order to sway others to his side. I never claimed it was common, but it happened just a few weeks ago in an Ops I was in. I'm not trying to mislead anyone...I'm trying to convey to you that although you have never allegedly seen anyone kicked for any petty reason, I have seen players that have been kicked for those reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdmaha Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 I've seen it with lvl 37 and 44 implants, with 112 blue mods... The performance of those players matches their gear in my experience... If you haven't played the game enough to be able to at least be in all lvl 50 gear, you probably aren't ready for raids... In our own guild, before we take people on raids, we make sure they have done all the daily areas at least once, some of them a few times, that should get them into a mix of 50 and 53 gear (Oricon story is great for the 53 stuff). Then we take them on some 50 and 55 HM FP to get more comms and gear. THEN they are ready for raids... I see people trying to skip steps, generally their performance suffers for it. (yes, there are exceptions, but I'm speaking generally) And that is something different. And I have seen players get kicked for not knowing how to play their class. What I have said is I have not seen a ops leader do a gear check and kick a player or kick a player because he asked a question in SM OPs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manabuka Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 EXCELLENT post!!!! We're glad you're here with us, even if you don't like playing with us I hope this MMO opens you up to a whole new genre of gaming. My personal draw to MMO's, over other game types, is that my story doesn't have an ending...after I'm done with what Bioware wrote, I can continue my journey and continue to improve my character through experience. I find that appealing. I hope you find more, beyond the story, to enjoy. Thanks for the support! I do actually enjoy playing with others. I would just like to be able to do so when I want to, as opposed to being forced to. Honestly, given the choice between running an op with a group and solo, I would probably choose the group, but I would appreciate the option. 99% of my grouping experiences have been positive and fun and I enjoy learning and even teaching others. I am by no means an expert, but I'm patient and have been playing since December 21, 2011, so I've picked up a few things! As I said before, I think this game could use more choices for more people. I think opening up a single player path through the game would be an immense boost to player numbers and bring more players into the fold. They could even gate the single player path behind the subscription to prevent f2p from accessing the entire game and story for free. And when those single player RPG fans are exposed to the fun that group play can be, they would have players for life, like me. I don't want the game to become Mass Effect. I want to bring Mass Effect fans in! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infernixx Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Just me speaking, but I don't give a damn what other people are wearing in GF Ops....If we wipe in there, it's not because of gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heat-Wave Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Just me speaking, but I don't give a damn what other people are wearing in GF Ops....If we wipe in there, it's not because of gear. Gear often informs what to expect from players. It isn't perfect, I've seen some people in 156/162 who were clueless, but the reverse tends to not be true. Someone in 168/180 gear always seems to know what they are doing. The other thing I look for is augments. Expensive to do a full set, but makes a world of difference. Last night, did a GF. PUG run of S&V. Sometimes that can be rough, depending on the people, but this was nice. The main tank was in mostly 162 gear, but had a full set of 156 augments, that makes a difference and anyone who has ponied up the credits probably knows what they are doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotharofxev Posted September 5, 2014 Share Posted September 5, 2014 Just me speaking, but I don't give a damn what other people are wearing in GF Ops....If we wipe in there, it's not because of gear. BAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHAHA Generalize much? Tell ya what, you take a group of folks in 112 blues into DP NIM, let me know how that works out for ya. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Wicked Posted September 5, 2014 Share Posted September 5, 2014 BAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHAHA Generalize much? Tell ya what, you take a group of folks in 112 blues into DP NIM, let me know how that works out for ya. You can't do NiM runs with Group Finder I believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khevar Posted September 5, 2014 Share Posted September 5, 2014 You can't do NiM runs with Group Finder I believe. Sure you can! You just have to press Up-Up-Down-Down-Left-Right-Left-Right, B, A, SELECT, Start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CyberneticDucks Posted September 5, 2014 Share Posted September 5, 2014 When a player that doesn't like doing group content (which is fine, I have no problem with that) looks at story in operations and complains, "why are you preventing me from experiencing that story?" I feel like what that person is actually asking for, is "please make sure that operations have no story." The Dread Masters arc was told primarily through operations. It's true that the purely solo player can't experience it. But that's simply because Bioware decided to give operations players some story, too. What's so bad about that? no, i definitely want raids and group content to have story, i just want to be able to experience that story content by my own. if they could just make single-player versions of ops and FP that one person, provided they are geared well enough, could complete. also, if ops and FP had their story by their own i would love that. up until endgame all FPs had a story that branches off from the main story. in other words, if you never ever did hammer station it wouldn't have any effect on my understanding of what is going on in the game. unfortunately with planets like ilum and oricon, the FP/op is actually the ending to the previously all single-player storyline with a profound impact on what is going on in the galaxy. now players who do not want to play with others have no idea what happens, they just get a big middle finger in their face at the climax of the story. i would like ops and FP to have a high quality story so long as it is independent and unessential for the greater picture like the early FPs were. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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