Operatives and Snipers need to be nerfed, here's why.

[captpickles]

Flashbang lasts 6, and the ancient hypergates pylons take only 5 seconds to capture IIRC. However, he and his fellow node guarder simply screwed up.

 

*EDIT

 

Mez/sap lasts 8, and can be used as many times as they want, but it can only be used on one player at a time.

 

logged in via logemin remotely and took a look.. it is 8 seconds.

[MasonMc]

it's 8 according to tor... have to log and look ta my toon to be 100%

 

Normally I would of done that, but he was capping the pylon and I was farther away from it. And the sage, that was next to you was stunned and just.. wasn't doing anything so I leaped in and got stunned.

 

Quoted the wrong thing lol, but when you were talking about to not use the stun breaker on the first stun.

Edited November 1, 2013 by MasonMc

[Vandicus]

logged in via logemin remotely and took a look.. it is 8 seconds.

 

Just checked my sniper and so it does, seems like I mistakenly assumed it had the same duration as the juggernaut one. However, that's largely irrelevant to the node cap in every map besides Hypergates, where it is in fact long enough to allow a cap. 8 seconds on any other map allows the player about 1 sec of time to hit any instant to stop a cap(because of time delay to move over to start capping).

[captpickles]

just checked my sniper and so it does, seems like i mistakenly assumed it had the same duration as the juggernaut one. However, that's largely irrelevant to the node cap in every map besides hypergates, where it is in fact long enough to allow a cap. 8 seconds on any other map allows the player about 1 sec of time to hit any instant to stop a cap(because of time delay to move over to start capping).

 

^+1 ..

[Vandicus]

Normally I would of done that, but he was capping the pylon and I was farther away from it. And the sage, that was next to you was stunned and just.. wasn't doing anything so I leaped in and got stunned.

 

Quoted the wrong thing lol, but when you were talking about to not use the stun breaker on the first stun.

 

BTW sorcs get an immune to everything button somewhere in between 50-55, which allows them to sit there and hit an aoe right as they pop out to stop caps. The game isn't balanced around lowbie pvp. Sentinels don't make very good node guards though. They have stronger anti-damage defensive cooldowns but not as many anti-cc defensive cooldowns.

[Ottoattack]

First thing you said. Okay, what happened was I was running from the pylon. This Operative, while he's still invisible, stuns me once, I pop my stun breaker, and he stuns me again while he's still invisible. That just seems OP and should be balanced.

 

And it's not that I can't kill one, because I usually can. Most people just think I'm calling out nerfs because it's the "one class I can't beat" No, that isn't it. I'm just saying, against all the other classes. The Sniper is special, certain ways to engage them, certain ways to fight them. With just about every class there is no strategy to beat them, just use your interrupt and just kill them. But if you're melee and up against a Sniper they are just slowing your movement speed for far away, stunning you and knocking you back while you get close, then slowing your movement speed again. It just seems unfair.

 

For operative, I think you are mixing between stun and mez. Stun means you are can't move or attack and anyone can attack you. These can't be used and the target stay in stealth. Mezes are out of combat CCs where theeffect is the same, but breaks on damage. Both assassins and operatives have the out of combat 8 sec mez. The mezes are meant to slow down people from attacking nodes solo, not for offensive purposes. Unfortunately in Hyper Gate WZ, some genius in BW devs decided to make pylons cap 6 secs not 8 like everything else. Why? No one knows, and it serves no strategy in competitive play as well.

 

Regarding having "strategy" while attacking snipers, you need strategy while attacking every single class. If you don't, they will continuously out gun you. You go and "smash" you aint going to win, especially solo. You need to understand what other classes are capable of and how they can retaliate, otherwise you are shooting blind. This comes with experience. Again, snipers are anti-melee class. They are supposed to win against melee classes. They are the paper for your rock. Stealth and some ranged classes have edge on sniper, so they are the scissor for that paper.

 

Just to give you an idea, operative dps is considered one of the worst in end game competitive PvP and snipers are deemed balanced for the most part, so no they do not need a nerf. Are snipers annoying for melee classes? Ya, but you have to learn to adjust. Some classes have edge on yours and you will have edge on others.

[CommanderKeeva]

Having played a Sentinel, a Scoundrel and a Gunslinger at 55, I can tell you the following things. Being alone in any warzone is probably the worst thing one can do. Even on stealthers I try to stay close to my teammates, so I can back them and vice versa should the need arise. We can debate here endlessly about which class beats which class but there is a very simple truth many people seem to forget, warzones are 8v8 and not 1v1. Try to attack targets at least 2v1, wherever you go and whatever you do. Most smart players realize that fighting 2v1 is risky and will simply avoid confrontation. The not so smart ones...well...they die. But nevertheless in my experience: all three classes can be killed by all three classes depending on gear, circumstance and player skill.

 

Operatives: If you get jumped by an operative, there's not much you can do about it. Your main priority is to survive the opening burst, the Operatives are a class that deal a ton of damage up-front than nothing. If the Operative is very good, you'll be dead within 5-10 seconds regardless of your strategy. If you're not dead by the end of the second stun, you can easily turn the fight around. DoT them, push them, root them, after burning their initial cooldowns, they're really vulnerable. It's very important to always DoT the Operatives because they will try to stealth away when they see their HP reach around 30%. Smart ones always cleanse before trying to disappear, so that's your cue to DoT/root again. Always try to counter their rolls with slows and roots if possible.

 

Snipers: A good Sniper will always try to be as far from the fight as possible. Do not try to approach them directly, because that is exactly what they want to you to do. Once they have you squarely in their sights, they will root you, Ambush you and make your life miserable. A direct approach always favors the Sniper. If possible stealth or go around or just pick an easier target for the time being, leave Snipers for last. An unsupported Sniper is minced meat, they are very squishy. If you can try to DoT the Sniper, DoTs are the bane of the Sniper class. Without healer support and cleanses, you can play hide and seek with them and just whittle their HP down. Specs like Pyrotech, Lethality and Madness can be very effective against a lone Sniper. In fact, when playing my Gunslinger, I came to hate Madness/Balance Sorcs/Sages more than anything. They just hide behind something and kill you with DoTs.

The Sniper is probably the most balanced class in the game, the reason Snipers seem overpowered is because Sorcerers and Mercenaries are nowhere near as powerful as Snipers. Sorcs and especially Mercs are underpowered jokes in serious PvP, the solution is to buff them, not to nerf Snipers.

 

Sentinels: Sentinels are the unquestioned best melee class in the game imo. A well played Sentinel is far more dangerous than a well-played Guardian, Vanguard, Scoundrel or Shadow. I really cannot give advice against Sentinels because in my opinion they're often the best dueling class in the game. They have so many defensive cooldowns, stealth, pacify, speed boost, damage boost that I often see Sentinels successfully killing 2v1, sometimes even 3v1. If there is an overpowered DPS class, it's the Sentinel. It does the highest sustained damage in Watchman and the highest burst in the Combat/Focus. Only attack Sentinels 2v1 and if possible only from far away. You really don't want to face an angry Sentinel/Marauder 1v1, that is a sure death sentence.

[VulgarMercurius]

Lol snipers are not OP, if anything they're the most predictable class. Judging by what you're saying you apparently don't know how to use the many tools in your arsenal to deal with them. (we have an answer for everything that class brings basically, as sentinels/marauders). The fact that you let him get shots off of you after his initial knockback is bad. Thats what camo is for, once you see them channel. What spec are you playing? The easiest ones to beat snipers on are watchman and combat. Focus is a joke. Read up on your class and spec abilities, I gave you an example on how to get around your initial problem but the rest is up to you. You claim to be a good player, you shouldn't be having problems with snipers unless you're running focus/smash. Sorry to say but players like you are the reason for the false assumption that snipers can beat sentinels/marauders, when in fact its only dual wielders who don't know how to play their class right. I strongly encourage you to read up on it thoroughly. Also practice dueling a sniper. Even roll one. The best way to gain knowledge on countering a class is knowing what they have to use against you, and when its most appropriate for them to do so. Nothing will help you better than to roll one yourself, then take that knowledge back to your sentinel when you play him again. Good luck!

 

Doesn't seem that you are actually reading his posts. He said he doesn't claim to be good, just not bad, and with some experience. AND he said he doesn't have force camo yet...

[MasonMc]

For operative, I think you are mixing between stun and mez. Stun means you are can't move or attack and anyone can attack you. These can't be used and the target stay in stealth. Mezes are out of combat CCs where theeffect is the same, but breaks on damage. Both assassins and operatives have the out of combat 8 sec mez. The mezes are meant to slow down people from attacking nodes solo, not for offensive purposes. Unfortunately in Hyper Gate WZ, some genius in BW devs decided to make pylons cap 6 secs not 8 like everything else. Why? No one knows, and it serves no strategy in competitive play as well.

 

Regarding having "strategy" while attacking snipers, you need strategy while attacking every single class. If you don't, they will continuously out gun you. You go and "smash" you aint going to win, especially solo. You need to understand what other classes are capable of and how they can retaliate, otherwise you are shooting blind. This comes with experience. Again, snipers are anti-melee class. They are supposed to win against melee classes. They are the paper for your rock. Stealth and some ranged classes have edge on sniper, so they are the scissor for that paper.

 

Just to give you an idea, operative dps is considered one of the worst in end game competitive PvP and snipers are deemed balanced for the most part, so no they do not need a nerf. Are snipers annoying for melee classes? Ya, but you have to learn to adjust. Some classes have edge on yours and you will have edge on others.

 

Okay, what you said actually sense. Maybe Snipers aren't "OP" but they are annoying, same with Operatives. So instead of OP, I'll just use this, extremely unfair. Maybe I just came off the wrong way, you're right. Their damage is nothing special. I have no problem with their damage output. It's the stuns that piss me off. Heck, I'd be happy if they got a damage boost but a nerf to stuns.

[branmakmuffin]

Okay, what you said actually sense. Maybe Snipers aren't "OP" but they are annoying, same with Operatives. So instead of OP, I'll just use this, extremely unfair. Maybe I just came off the wrong way, you're right. Their damage is nothing special. I have no problem with their damage output. It's the stuns that piss me off. Heck, I'd be happy if they got a damage boost but a nerf to stuns.

What it still boils down to is what others have posted many times: you don't know the tactics required to fight against the class(es), so you claim they have an unfair advantage. You subscribe to the definition of "op" so many do: "Any ability possessed by a class that I do not play." Goes hand in had with "nerfed" meaning "any ability possessed by a class I play." If you lay the foundation for the perception of an uneven playing field which disfavors you, failures are easily excused and minor achievements become towering victories.