Time to ungimp assassins

[Neoforcer]

Your request for Assassin/Shadow DPS buffs are respectfully declined.

 

Signed,

 

All non-stealth classses.

 

Your request for Assassin/Shadow DPS buffs has been approved that coming from the devs saying the class is way lower then any other dps class so come 2.5 2.6 buff time Signed, the DEVS

[mmjarec]

Here's the problem with this thread it doesn't start out articulating the issues, which to be taken seriously it should. The community is tired and sees the multiple threads across forums asking for as whining, they see us in regs being regstars blowing up bads and blowing all stuns to get a quick kill and they hate it. There is no sympathy really. If we get more substained in Deception we will loss burst in the end whether its at the same time or later. The best bet is to ask for madness to be changed for PvE DPS since it has little burst compared to Decep.

 

The other issue is people that play the class are prone to exaggeration now when they really have no idea they just jump on the QQ train. 1 poster, who posts a lot negatively, asking for buffs didn't even know what all the abilities are. Others say they can't tank Hard mode 50 FPs lol. We need to stop that and stay to the facts and prove the point through hard factual evidence. Stretching the truth will get us no where.

 

I am not talking about you OP but your thread would recieve a better response if it sticks to the basics and evidence. However we will end up losing some things for whatever we gain.

 

Anyway trolls troll on an op rage on, good luck on your quest.

 

How did i not articulate the issues i said dps parses too low and nightmare tanking is too hard comparitively. Those are the issues. Its not a debate on if sins are gimp or not its been proven they are its a thread about getting them fixed so dont say i didnt articulate the issue correctly when you didnt understand the purpose of the thread to start

[mmjarec]

Your request for Assassin/Shadow DPS buffs has been approved that coming from the devs saying the class is way lower then any other dps class so come 2.5 2.6 buff time Signed, the DEVS

 

Yeah but lip service is one thing why do sorcs get adressed instantly and sins get placated so people think they are getting buffed and then they nerf us. Doing the exact opposite

[Gomla]

Yeah but lip service is one thing why do sorcs get adressed instantly and sins get placated so people think they are getting buffed and then they nerf us. Doing the exact opposite

 

It's a conspiracy.

 

True story.

[AlexThomasG]

In regards to deception...

 

I've played deception/infiltration since early access. I've never felt gimped. And, if fun isn't enough reason to play one, what exactly is your hope? I play one because it's a lot of fun - and always has been. I play one because I know what they can be, when played properly. I also know that they're rarely played properly. I won't comment on the other specs, but this is a l2p issue. If you check my earliest post history, you'll see that near the start of the game I was saying the same exact thing to a much older group of people who needed to l2p.

 

Sorry, but I have no issue with my sin and shad, nor have I ever (with the exception of one group of temporary changes that never made it off the test server). I really don't understand the QQ, a lot of which, you seem to be behind. Good luck, though, with your quest to right a ship that isn't in any real danger.

 

This is exactly why I knew Xin would be elected our rep, and then fail at it. Nothing like countless videos of you wrecking people, only to waste half your time complaining about how tough we have it. Get real. Deception is fine.

 

I agree. I play endgame with a deception assassin and have no problem in either storymode or hardmode. There are a few issues but its not as bad as some make it out to be.

 

When someone uses the training dummy it doesnt take into account the below 30% move the assassin gets and thats only one of the issues with basing everything off numbers from a training dummy.

Edited September 15, 2013 by AlexThomasG

[kybotica]

Personally, I haven't seen ANYTHING wrong with my shadow. I haven't played the imperial version, but I presume, and correct me if I am wrong, that it plays the same. My shadow absolutely obliterates most players in PvP, and does well enough in PvE. In PvE I cannot solo things as well as on a tank class, and I haven't tried the tank spec out, so I cannot speak for its viability or lack thereof. If you state which spec is broken, that might help. As far as I can tell (level 36) , shadows are capable of ruining any other player's day in PvP, even some geared out players. I usually end up scoring top in my war zones, or at least top five.

[mmjarec]

I agree. I play endgame with a deception assassin and have no problem in either storymode or hardmode. There are a few issues but its not as bad as some make it out to be.

 

When someone uses the training dummy it doesnt take into account the below 30% move the assassin gets and thats only one of the issues with basing everything off numbers from a training dummy.

 

If anything the assinate abilty below 30 is a dps boost so it makes no sense to say they are fine cause of assinante when they parse for more with it and still 500 dps below other classes

 

Why do i play assassin for fun of course but be ause they are fun doesnt make them competative. So far everyone bases their argument about sins being fine based off how fun you thonk they are instead of using fact based numbers to compare and thats what parses do.

 

Dont beleive in parses? Fine ill put my mara or sorc up against any sin with same gear and dps spec and kill mobs twice as fast. If you dot get a stealth jump ur dps is even worse spamming voltaic at two or three thousand per hit when i can spam massacre that does triple that dmg an not to mention ravage or on sorc a lightning blast or proc in madness. Either way factoring in a one shot initial burst at the begning of a fight that barely hits for more than other classes abilities that can be spammed isnt even a contest

 

Besides once again this thread devolved into if sins are gimp which isnt even the topic of this tread we are past deciding if they are gimp or not Its about getting them a much needed boost to get them within the 10% range of other dps classes as devs stated they should be

 

Tryig to change the purpose of the thread wont work as i will just redirect back on point and re affirm the fact its already established that they are a joke

 

Me and my friends play and i like sins thus they are fine is hardly a credible argument when its already acknowledged they are gimp

[Reno_Tarshil]

But there's no point in un-gimping something that isn't gimped..

 

Sins are fine.

[mmjarec]

But there's no point in un-gimping something that isn't gimped..

 

Sins are fine.

 

According to who? Obviously not to bioware or anyone who plays them objectively. Nice proof. Oh wait its just your opinion with no evidence to back you up

[Reno_Tarshil]

According to who? Obviously not to bioware or anyone who plays them objectively. Nice proof. Oh wait its just your opinion with no evidence to back you up

 

Who needs to provide proof if someone else looked at these so called parses and said Sins were fine and you refused it.

 

Nothing anyone says is gonna change your stubborn little jawa troll mind.

 

Please re-roll so I don't have to feel icky when playing my Baby sin character, you give the class a disgrace.

[mmjarec]

Who needs to provide proof if someone else looked at these so called parses and said Sins were fine and you refused it.

 

Nothing anyone says is gonna change your stubborn little jawa troll mind.

 

Please re-roll so I don't have to feel icky when playing my Baby sin character, you give the class a disgrace.

 

Because the way it works is you provide evidence to backup your statement if you want people to actually beleive you but i doubt anyone would beleive anyone who provides no proof and verbally assaults other people who did provide proof.

 

No you wont change my mind because i have read facts from parses that actually provide the proof they are gimp. Just because you said you saw something doesnt make your assertion true

[magi_melcior]

Sure Shadows overall DPS numbers are generally lower than those of a Sentinel or Commando, but I always felt they were supposed to be. Infiltration in particular is a very burst heavy build and if played well can be devastating especially in DPS burn phases when you need to put out a lot of damage in a short time. My Shadow can easily pull 2.4k DPS against Dread Master Styrak HM and that is still with some 69 gear and PvP relics.

 

Shadow tank spikeyness is an issue and does need to be fixed, but generally the class feels OK to me. Shadows may well be the most difficult class to master, but if you do they can be deadly.

 

Could their DPS be improved, YES. Will I stop playing on mine if it doesn't improve, NO

[Reno_Tarshil]

Because the way it works is you provide evidence to backup your statement if you want people to actually beleive you but i doubt anyone would beleive anyone who provides no proof and verbally assaults other people who did provide proof.

 

No you wont change my mind because i have read facts from parses that actually provide the proof they are gimp. Just because you said you saw something doesnt make your assertion true

 

Let me ask you this.

 

Do you honestly think everyone else, including myself, telling you that sins are fine, don't have any experience to them?

 

Because if you don't and you think everyone is out to troll you, than you are lost.

 

We don't provide proof because we have experience playing the class, where as all you've done is provide a parse for a training dummy that doesn't even let you use the sin's execute ability. That is incomplete and should not be looked at for how DPS is doing for classes with an execute.

 

Now, here's what you're gonna do. You're going to call off these shenanigans and wait for the class answers for Sins and Shadows and if Bioware say there and only there, that they are gimped. Then you can continue, but until then give it a rest, because at 9 threads all about poorly you think sins are that you've made, it's considered spamming the forums and you don't want to risk getting an infraction now do you?

[Hockaday]

Let me ask you this.

 

Do you honestly think everyone else, including myself, telling you that sins are fine, don't have any experience to them?

 

 

People more knowledgeable than you have stated there is a problem. No one is saying they can't tank, but there is an imbalance. Please, read about the class you claim to play. Or just simply observe other tanks, that you also claim to play. If you did play them, you should understand the differences. Yes, all three can tank, but it's painfully obvious the problems with sins.

 

This is why I don't believe you play any tank class besides at most a Jug or PT.

 

Also, afaik the devs have admitted that there is a problem.

Edited September 15, 2013 by Hockaday

[Reno_Tarshil]

People more knowledgeable than you have stated there is a problem. No one is saying they can't tank, but there is an imbalance. Please, read about the class you claim to play. Or just simply observe other tanks, that you also claim to play. If you did play them, you should understand the differences. Yes, all three can tank, but it's painfully obvious the problems with sins.

 

This is why I don't believe you play any tank class besides at most a Jug or PT.

 

Also, afaik the devs have admitted that there is a problem.

 

Come to Jedi Covenant and I will show you all 3 of my tanks, if you want proof. And trust me, I read all the supposed Shadows are bad threads when I was leveling mine, yet my experience in playing one has told me they're just fine.

Edited September 15, 2013 by Reno_Tarshil

[Hockaday]

Come to Jedi Covenant and I will show you all 3 of my tanks, if you want proof.

 

If you do have all three, then you just show ignorance to the reality of the current tank balance. You may decide which is better of the two accusations.

[mmjarec]

Your request for Assassin/Shadow DPS buffs has been approved that coming from the devs saying the class is way lower then any other dps class so come 2.5 2.6 buff time Signed, the DEVS

 

Where did they say that?

[Reno_Tarshil]

If you do have all three, then you just show ignorance to the reality of the current tank balance. You may decide which is better of the two accusations.

 

My first tank was my Vanguard which is alright. My second tank is my Guardian, which is good. My third tank is my Shadow and he is great and the most fun to play and does fine in OPs.

[kidatwood]

Isn't the assassin the jack of all trades master of none. I would assume that if this class a hybrid class was good at everything then why would we play any other class. Way back they did this to a certain class called Druid in then game that should not be named and it turned the class from a utility class to a op class. I trust that if this class is gimped that bioware would make a tweak.

[discoklaus]

Isn't the assassin the jack of all trades master of none. I would assume that if this class a hybrid class was good at everything then why would we play any other class. Way back they did this to a certain class called Druid in then game that should not be named and it turned the class from a utility class to a op class. I trust that if this class is gimped that bioware would make a tweak.

 

rigth now the assassin is the jack of no trades. he is subpar in tanking, subpar in dpsing. but hey we got stealth and phasewalk to make up for it

[Hockaday]

My first tank was my Vanguard which is alright. My second tank is my Guardian, which is good. My third tank is my Shadow and he is great and the most fun to play and does fine in OPs.

 

This would point to your skill in tanking with the other 2 tanking classes. You don't mention the level of OPs you are doing either.

 

I have all three, I love and enjoy Sin tanking the best. I clear HM content with him (looking forward to nightmare). But I can tell you, that a properly geared Jug, or even an under geared jug, can do the job just as well if not better. The skill check more often comes for the healers when a Sin tank is tanking, which is fine. But still, there are problems that exist.

 

Remember, just because you -clear- content doesn't mean there aren't problems. I suggest taking your Same geared Jug through the same ops, hell, S/V...at least in SM you can face tank sunder on a Jug who isn't even properly geared. Not so much on a Sin.

 

Of course, that isn't the best example, it is extreme...but it shows you the startlign differences. Hell, even HM -flashpoints- will show you the differences in the tanks.

 

No one expects a sin tank to not be spikey, they're supposed to be spikier than Jugs and PTs (jugs are supposed to be spikier than PTs) but they are currently -too- spikey.

[Reno_Tarshil]

This would point to your skill in tanking with the other 2 tanking classes. You don't mention the level of OPs you are doing either.

 

I have all three, I love and enjoy Sin tanking the best. I clear HM content with him (looking forward to nightmare). But I can tell you, that a properly geared Jug, or even an under geared jug, can do the job just as well if not better. The skill check more often comes for the healers when a Sin tank is tanking, which is fine. But still, there are problems that exist.

 

Remember, just because you -clear- content doesn't mean there aren't problems. I suggest taking your Same geared Jug through the same ops, hell, S/V...at least in SM you can face tank sunder on a Jug who isn't even properly geared. Not so much on a Sin.

 

Of course, that isn't the best example, it is extreme...but it shows you the startlign differences. Hell, even HM -flashpoints- will show you the differences in the tanks.

 

No one expects a sin tank to not be spikey, they're supposed to be spikier than Jugs and PTs (jugs are supposed to be spikier than PTs) but they are currently -too- spikey.

 

Funny you should mention Sunder. I've tanked that fight on both my Guardian and Shadow (I'll be honest my VG isn't as geared as those two). And both times I kite Sunder and on my Shadow it's much more easier to Kite and keep aggro with Force Pull and Force Speed, than it is to kite on my Guardian even though, it's still doable with Guard Speed Boost and Saber Throw.

 

But you mention Face tank, which isn't something I do since I kite.

[kidatwood]

rigth now the assassin is the jack of no trades. he is subpar in tanking, subpar in dpsing. but hey we got stealth and phasewalk to make up for it

 

That's why he would be an off tank not a main tank. An off healer not a main healer. Ect. Your class is a utility class if you want a main tank role one.....

[Hockaday]

Funny you should mention Sunder. I've tanked that fight on both my Guardian and Shadow (I'll be honest my VG isn't as geared as those two). And both times I kite Sunder and on my Shadow it's much more easier to Kite and keep aggro with Force Pull and Force Speed, than it is to kite on my Guardian even though, it's still doable with Guard Speed Boost and Saber Throw.

 

But you mention Face tank, which isn't something I do since I kite.

 

There is no reason to kite sunder on a Jug. You kite him while waiting to kill, then use your cds in proper manner. He doesn't focus, it's like a normal fight. It is a bit harder on the healers perhaps, but easier as a whole. I have not tested this in HM, but I believe it could be done just the same. I cannot speak for NM.

[Hockaday]

That's why he would be an off tank not a main tank. An off healer not a main healer. Ect. Your class is a utility class if you want a main tank role one.....

 

This is again inaccurate.