The Empire seems to have better writing

[Lium]

I post this as a die hard Republic player. And the JK story is, in my opinion, the best of the best. I also have a 50 shadow, and am currently leveling a GS.

 

But on the other side, I have a 53 sorc that I'm currently taking through Makeb. And the story is just so much better than the pub version. Without getting into spoiler territory, as an imp you actually get to know your team members a bit and why they are actually on the planet. They are greatly humanized. And if you're playing LS (which is FAR MORE BETTER then playing a derpy dark sider) you really get some insight into what's going on with the Empire.

 

You are basically the underdog on a pub world that has something that you desperately need not to win the war, but to survive it. Your side is losing and you are told this the moment you arrive on Makeb. Additionally, there are concerns about the missing emperor and rumors abound.

 

The writing is just so much better here. Truly.

 

I can't even remember the pub story on my sentinel. I just remember being frustrated at the quest on those platforms with the dome structures. So, without this devolving into BW showing imp bias, why do you think - with a couple of exceptions - that the storytelling and writing is just so much stronger on the imperial side?

 

I have my own theories but am looking for a few others.

[joshohelp]

It has to do with the nature of each side...

 

the light/ dark - good/ evil thing.

 

 

I have a lot of characters on a ton of servers. I learned to accept the writing for what it is. The republic writing is one of courage and heroism and helping the little man.

 

While the imp writing is the do whatever, kill people, choke people, and do bad things and try to help people.. somewhat. meh.

[Drudenfusz]

It has to do with the nature of each side...

 

the light/ dark - good/ evil thing.

 

 

I have a lot of characters on a ton of servers. I learned to accept the writing for what it is. The republic writing is one of courage and heroism and helping the little man.

 

While the imp writing is the do whatever, kill people, choke people, and do bad things and try to help people.. somewhat. meh.

Maybe you should go back to the game and take a look on the Imperial Agent story, that feels much more heroic then the republic ones, and has very little to do with wantever your fancy is. Playing that class light side in an evil empire felt great. By the way, the light and dark side options are on both sides, and both can have interesting choices there, if you always do with Sith equals dark side and Jedi equeals light side, the stories automatically become far less interesting.

 

I think the empire works better, because the stories can evoke more emotions, the republic is often to rational and very few choices really feel like choices. One of the few stories I liked on republic side is the companion story the trooper gets with Aric Jorgan. While the empire, pertty much everyone meets Thana Vesh and most end up loving or hating her. The emotional build up is there better. As republic you get pretty much told from the beginning you are awesome, so my character has less of an arc, while being a slave on the empire and watch me rise to power feels different. And then of course all the revenge stories, I am a sucker for those (Hamlet is still my favourite story), and the empire has plenty of them. While the Sith you kill as a Jedi rarely mean anything, they just feel like cannon fodder, and that includes all the losrs and whathaveyou. Maybe Kilran and Malgus are the rare exceptions, but both are in flashpoints and one can be killed by both factions.

Edited September 3, 2013 by Drudenfusz

[Lium]

My point exactly. I think it transcends SWTOR and just has a lot to do with the nature of the sides. For example, it's much easier and more interesting to write for Batman than it is for Superman.

 

One character is human whose parents were murdered in front of him. He has no special powers or anything like that, and is in a constant war with himself to control his darkness. He also lives in Gotham City, a place known for having some of the most criminally insane minds in the world.

 

The other character is basically a god. He's not human, has unlimited powers and abilities and can essentially do whatever he wants. He's also perfect. Has zero flaws and represents a near unrealistic ideal of goodness without sin of any kind.

 

As a writer, which character sound more interesting to write for?

[Vis-Tecum]

I would have to agree

 

I am way more a republic fan then a empire fan lore wise, not a fan of fascist, racists, evil or power over allies, I am not a bane fan, not a maul fan, exar, vader, and palpatine are pretty cool though but

malgus killing his wife in deceived

was just... so wrong on so many levels, im paragon in mass effect and strongly believe compassion and allies are the true signs of strength which is totally against everything the sith stand for and hate reading from the sith characters point of view who thinks everything sacrificed for more power. the only thing I put empire above republic is fashion and design lol. star tours as a kid walking through those hallways with the fog and red lights was awesome, the imperial ranks on the officers is so cool and though x wings are ****** who doesn't like a tie fighter or want a star destroyer.

 

that said I rolled a imp character first [ I thought I would get used to the game first before I rolled my main as a pub and did not want to spoil any story] and I was for the empire ever since, played through all 8 classes through makeb and even have seen the story on both sides of oricon on pts and yep empire all the way. in swtor there is no competition the imp stories and characters are just so much better, not that the pub side doesn't have its gems but overall I just cant get into the republic side at all. I believe its the writing, not that the writers don't write for both sides but it is what it is

 

outside swtor I may still be for the republic but in swtor its IMP all the way

Edited September 3, 2013 by Vis-Tecum

[Hyfy]

To be honest the only one I found seriously lacking was the Consular story arc, after 17 levels I was ready to toss myself in front of a fast moving train. JK is great and what I believe would've been the story for KOTOR 3 had they made it instead. Smuggler was a bit disjointed after chapter 1 but overall not bad. Trooper is kinda the same thing. And the rest were superb, especially the Agent arc, which I'm replaying now as a Sniper as we speak.

[Drudenfusz]

As a writer, which character sound more interesting to write for?

Even though it might be easier to write for batman than for Superman, I still would pick superman. Why? The challenge! There are a few really good superman stories out there. I for my part love the ones that deal with his farm upbringing in contrast to the big city life he is living now (which make Loise and Lex as contrast to him so great). While Batman delves to often in the just dark elements. I prefer stories with contrasts, and the empire does that in SWTOR better than the Republic.

 

Look at the Dark Knight movie, Joker sees himself as the same kind of freak like Batman, and to some extent he is right. If the script would not have that brilliant idea that Joker tricks Batman into saving the wrong person, it would much less good. Because it takes the moral choice and runs with it. It is the same where the sequeals for Matrix fail. The decision between the loved one and the greater good. That decision is too often clear now in mpvies, that the hero these days goes for the love interst. And like that most choices feel in SWTOR meaningless. You cannot lose a companion (sure you can lose characters like Ave Jaxo, another little story that made the trooper story work for me), so I had no issue to send Felix Irreso on a possible deadly mission with my consular, I knew he wouldn't die. On, the other hand empire stories are far more about losing, betrayel and such things. they are not just dark, they have interesting contrast. Like I said playing a light side agent who is always on the edge between doing the right sing and doing save choices, never sure who to trust, even your own companions are not so clear cut. Or the sith warrior, with Jaesa Williams develops very differently when you go light or dark side with her. Sure, some decisions in the empire feel like the dark side option is just stupid destruction, while the light side is the better for you and the empire (I am still amused that when I played my sith Warrior as an evil mastermind who is friendly like palpatine to get the trust and always things about getting something back for it, how light side that game considers that approach, man Palpatine in the movies must be light V, since the intentions are not asked only the words I use)... but in the end dark and light side do not matter in the game at all, and maybe the stries would have been better if BioWare would not have included it or if it would actually have some impact on the story. Sure, the Jedi Counsil compains about Jedi player who are pretty dark, but it has no consequences, no story no attunement no nothing follow it. And here too, the empire has storeis that deal with that, like the whole revenite thing already on Dromund Kaas.

[Drudenfusz]

To be honest the only one I found seriously lacking was the Consular story arc, after 17 levels I was ready to toss myself in front of a fast moving train.

Jedi Consular, my main class, has the worst story in SWTOR. The first too worlds are just fetch some holocrons, then the next four worlds are again repetitive, look for some crazy Jedi. No surprises, no interesting choices, nothing! Then chaper two brings at least some variations, but still not very intersting, I only liked the 3rd chapter because with all the folks on board, my ship felt alive and I could feel like a general in war on Correlia, diciding how to move troops, that had a good Obi-Wan in clone wars vibe, but was from a story point of view still weak... and funny, I am to this day not sure if I am now in the Jedi Counsil or not, I didn't killed Syo Bakarn, and there was talk about it, but I think the game never said clearly what my possiotion is now with the Jedi. Anyway, never looked back on that, and mostly just played PvP after that.

[Vis-Tecum]

Jedi Consular, my main class, has the worst story in SWTOR.

 

from a lore point of view I really enjoyed the consular story, I felt it had more nods to the old republic time line then any of the classes. I know its not a popular story but I really did enjoy it, low on the list but worth a play through

Edited September 3, 2013 by Vis-Tecum

[Drudenfusz]

from a lore point of view I really enjoyed the consular story, I felt it had more nods to the old republic time line then any of the classes. I know its not a popular story but I really did enjoy it, low on the list but worth a play through

Sure, there are gems there. I liked to see Nomi Sunrider for example (who is called Nomi Da-boda in the game, which I think is idiotic since why she would go back to her maiden name after death? I thought the naming issues with that character had been solved already). Anyway, all those little easter eggs for fans still don't make it a good story.

[Euphrosyne]

I thought that the Consular story was pretty decent, but the flat voice-acting and mediocre slate of companions made it seem worse than it really was. It certainly wasn't as bad as the Bounty Hunter's story. Viewed as a whole, I think that the class stories are more or less a wash between Imp and Pub.

 

Imp faction stories are a bit trickier. Usually, the Pub planet quests are ones that I have a hard time imagining my character not wanting to do. (Although Voss has a faction quest that's fairly incongruous for non-Force users, but that applies to both Imps and Pubs.) Generally speaking, both light-side and dark-side Pubs are united by a common goal: defeat the Empire. Makes 'em easier to write for. Whereas the Imp ones frequently end up placing characters at odds with their own story arcs.

 

If I'm playing as, say, a light-side Sith Warrior who wants to reform the Empire from within (or even just destroy it), why in blue blazes would the character want to, say, go free the Dread Masters from confinement? Isn't it laughably hypocritical for a Bounty Hunter who never misses an opportunity to mention that he's a free agent to basically be the Empire's personal troubleshooter and go-to guy? If your Sith Inquisitor is on the run from the Powers That Be on the Dark Council, why in the galaxy is she spending almost all her time personally working for...the Dark Council? Stuff like that. These things aren't just some role-playing difficulty, but in-game story content that actually contradicts other in-game story content.

Edited September 3, 2013 by Euphrosyne

[AshlaBoga]

I thought that the Consular story was pretty decent, but the flat voice-acting

 

Yeah, the ONLY class in-game where I disliked both the male AND female voice-acting:(

[joshohelp]

i'm going through the consular story as we speak and I LOVE it. it's not about action it's about knowledge and understanding the force.

 

I can think of one way to describe it. it's like a Yoda story/ Obi-wan story. you start at wise but you still have A LOT to learn.

 

But, im partial to the trooper story its a military blockbuster and it's amazing.

 

but its about he nature of each side truly.. the republic is more respectful and fair while the empire weeds out the weak and forces you to prove your worth or be nothing. the empire runs on human fear, no certain purpose beyond ego.

 

also the consular voice acting was great for what it was meant to convey

 

the consular character is a young but wise jedi. Also the consular did not act on emotion nor convey it in tone. Yh

It was intentional because the mood of the story and tone of the character was different then all the others

Edited September 3, 2013 by joshohelp

[Danylia]

Somewhat off-topic, but could the topic creator add [spoilers] to the title? They are running rampart and without the tags here, especially in Drudenfusz's posts. Thanks.

[AlexDougherty]

The Imperial stories are better written, there is no doubt about that.

 

The problem is that they don't want to offend anyone with the republic stories, yes they'll offfend with the non-class stories via corrupt troops etc, but the class stories lack some punch. The Republic stories are supposed to be about the good guys (you can play them bad, but they're supposed to be good), but the writers avoid defining morality, which leaves the goodness of the heroes empty and hollow.

 

Meanwhile the writers for the Imperial side (who are supposed to be the bad guys), have been having a field day with moral questions in their stories, which give the imperial stories depth. The evilness of the Sith (and allies) is clearly defined by the opportunities they have to be good, this makes the imperial characters more well rounded and complete. My Sith marrauder is a selfish evil pillock, but there is no doubt about his evilness, or his selfishness, or his pillockness either. My Sage on the other hand feels a bit lacking, he behaves like a saint, but hasn't really had any temptations, nor has my trooper, etc.

[Lunafox]

The Imperial side, does have better writing in my opinion. All the stories are enjoyable and exciting. On the Republic side, only Jedi and Smuggler are interesting enough, to make me not want to claw out my own eyes from the boredom. There may be those who enjoy the JC and Trooper stories, but I'm not one of them.

[morfius]

JK - Superhero story

JC - hardly falling in casual categories - missing some tweeks.

Smuggler - Comedy

Trooper - Action movie

 

SW - Super "hero" story

SI - hardly falling in casual categories - missing some tweeks.

BH - Comedy

Imp Agent - Spy movie

 

That is the main reason so many complain about JC / SI stories - they don't lye in clear categories.

They miss some tweeks - JC miss some real force learn twist & some more diplomatic ones, SI miss some power play, but as I am seen till now - all stories miss some things.

 

Light / Dark ... are not same things in Republic & Imperial stories - light for Empire is lesser selfish & more patriotic/honorable, light for Republic is in Jedi norms - help the little one & don't kill subdued enemy.

Dark empire is more - kicking puppies, dark republic is more - warhound killer ... still both have expected selfish choices.

 

Makeb - Imperial is closer to Agent spy story, Republic is closer to Trooper Action one...

[Glumish]

After playing through SI I found it very odd that there was little to no diplomacy involved, and I kind of expected a lot more manipulation of people to establish a power base and win allies. Instead it was just chasing after artifacts and the like the make myself more powerful in that respect.

 

I mean, wasn't the class modeled after the Emperor? Feels weird when your class can't even corrupt a companion.

 

That's the only one I have at 55, I'm working on my JK right now and it feels like I'm chasing after WMDs so far.

Edited September 3, 2013 by Glumish

[saremun]

Since day 1 the game have been in the favore of the Empirial side in almost everything from animation desgin to armor design etc...

 

I dont really like to be the evil guy and i dont agree with the empire and sith BUT because of the lame armor design and Lame animation of the Jedi knight(the only class i would play besides the trooper) i found the empirial side (every class really) just apealing...

 

I really wish they redo the animations for the Jedi knight, it still bugs me that a Jedi knight dont have the title Master...

Edited September 3, 2013 by saremun

[Laris_Rai]

Isn't it laughably hypocritical for a Bounty Hunter who never misses an opportunity to mention that he's a free agent to basically be the Empire's personal troubleshooter and go-to guy?

 

Because the Empire pays better and doesn't hamper bounty hunters with anywhere near as much red tape as the Republic. The EU spells it out pretty clearly.

[FeniceNera]

Jedi Consular, my main class, has the worst story in SWTOR. The first too worlds are just fetch some holocrons, then the next four worlds are again repetitive, look for some crazy Jedi. No surprises, no interesting choices, nothing! Then chaper two brings at least some variations, but still not very intersting, I only liked the 3rd chapter because with all the folks on board, my ship felt alive and I could feel like a general in war on Correlia, diciding how to move troops, that had a good Obi-Wan in clone wars vibe, but was from a story point of view still weak... and funny, I am to this day not sure if I am now in the Jedi Counsil or not, I didn't killed Syo Bakarn, and there was talk about it, but I think the game never said clearly what my possiotion is now with the Jedi. Anyway, never looked back on that, and mostly just played PvP after that.

 

Spoiler alert maybe ? I just arrived on Corellia, damn

[AlrikFassbauer]

It has to do with the nature of each side...

 

the light/ dark - good/ evil thing.

 

No.

 

It has to do with something entirely different :

 

Evil Is Cool

 

Good Is Boring

 

Once you see it, it becomes far too obvious.

[Heal-To-Full]

The Republic clearly got the short stick here. I don't think it's just that it's harder to write for the light side.

Compare an Agent and a Smuggler: Agent's signature ability, Snipe, looks great, he/she gets in cover, aims, and shoots. The Smuggler just sits there awkwardly for a second.

The spec everyone in PvP complains about is the Smash spec. No one calls it Sweep spec, it's Smash - catchier and makes more sense.

 

Writing has been discussed already.

What if feels like, overall, is that the Empire's side was made first and its Republic mirrors added later, some of them outright in a rush. Deliberate, thought-out, proactive class lines; detailed and original planet stories.

Most of the Republic's stories are reactive. "The Empire is doing what? We must go there and stop them!"

 

It's always more fun to be the one who puts things in motion than the one who stops them.

Not necessarily evil things. Anything. Establishing something good can be just as fun.

But in this world, the Empire is a force of change and the Republic a force of preservation and stagnation.

 

 

 

There's also another issue - I've always found it pretty hard to play a Light Side character for the Republic and actually feel like one. It's just the amount of mostly unnecessary violence you have to dish out. You get to kill thousands of people, most of whom don't deserve to die... and somehow, you just don't seem to care.

 

If your adventures happened in a flesh and bone world, your light side Jedi would be walking around with blood dripping from his garments. When you chop people up, their vascular system kinda tends to lose confinement. That lame quest on Coruscant where you help a little girl find her brother or something? If she didn't run away on sight, she would at least be physically scared, not "hello mister".

 

The Sith get to wear a lot of dark red and black, just perfect for hiding these stains. And even so, playing through Sith storylines, I've encountered a lot more opportunities to spare people's lives than in the Jedi story. Spare some Republic troops here, Organa guards there, let a named character go... your Jedi meanwhile rarely gives it a second though.

 

As a Sith, I can choose to play as a bloodthirsty killer or as a merciful and honorable warrior. As a Jedi, my character feels like a psychopath either way.

Edited September 3, 2013 by B-Dick

[morfius]

Since day 1 the game have been in the favore of the Empirial side in almost everything from animation desgin to armor design etc...

 

I dont really like to be the evil guy and i dont with the empire and sith BUT because of the lame armor design and Lame animation of the Jedi knight(the oly class i would play besides the trooper) i found the empirial side (every class really) just apealing...

 

i really wish they redo the animations for the Jedi knight, it still bugs me that a Jedi knight dont have the title Master...

 

Titles of Knight

 

Light sided knights get Master title at the end of their story... dark I thing - General.

 

 

[morfius]

The Republic clearly got the short stick here. I don't think it's just that it's harder to write for the light side.

Compare an Agent and a Smuggler: Agent's signature ability, Snipe, looks great, he/she gets in cover, aims, and shoots. The Smuggler just sits there awkwardly for a second.

The spec everyone in PvP complains about is the Smash spec. No one calls it Sweep spec, it's Smash - catchier and makes more sense.

 

Writing has been discussed already.

What if feels like, overall, is that the Empire's side was made first and its Republic mirrors added later, some of them outright in a rush. Deliberate, thought-out, proactive class lines; detailed and original planet stories.

Most of the Republic's stories are reactive. "The Empire is doing what? We must go there and stop them!"

 

It's always more fun to be the one who puts things in motion than the one who stops them.

Not necessarily evil things. Anything. Establishing something good can be just as fun.

But in this world, the Empire is a force of change and the Republic a force of preservation and stagnation.

 

 

 

There's also another issue - I've always found it pretty hard to play a Light Side character for the Republic and actually feel like one. It's just the amount of mostly unnecessary violence you have to dish out. You get to kill thousands of people, most of whom don't deserve to die... and somehow, you just don't seem to care.

 

If your adventures happened in a flesh and bone world, your light side Jedi would be walking around with blood dripping from his garments. When you chop people up, their vascular system kinda tends to lose confinement. That lame quest on Coruscant where you help a little girl find her brother or something? If she didn't run away on sight, she would at least be physically scared, not "hello mister".

 

The Sith get to wear a lot of dark red and black, just perfect for hiding these stains. And even so, playing through Sith storylines, I've encountered a lot more opportunities to spare people's lives than in the Jedi story. Spare some Republic troops here, Organa guards there, let a named character go... your Jedi meanwhile rarely gives it a second though.

 

As a Sith, I can choose to play as a bloodthirsty killer or as a merciful and honorable warrior. As a Jedi, my character feels like a psychopath either way.

 

Smugler story is closer to BH one, not to Agent one (even they are mirrors).

Both Jedi & Sith could be wrapped light & dark ... lightsabers burn wound and there - no blood.