Jonfendm Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 I did one of those today. It was very very laggy with 80 people in the group. Oh, you guys call this Op CZ-198. Please acknowledge that you understand its nearly impossible to have the patience to do this daily and that you plan to bring the instance threshold in line with Makeb. It was clearly very poorly thought out squeezing so many imps and pubs in one place. Making them need 8 of 2 different objectives. Only putting 14 or so of each of those objectives in the whole place. I think this underscores the need for more people to use the pTS. I will assume, and give EA the benefit of the doubt, that they could not have foreseen this lag in this area or this nonsense competition for the same objectives (some competition is ok, this is absurd though).. because the PTS was never under heavy load in CZ-198.
Arlon_Nabarlly Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 (edited) A. What did you expect with an 80 man OPs group on this engine? B. Clearly I have the patience since I've done them at least 6 times since they came out. C. It's very well thought out and one of the best thing to be put into the game in long time, if you don't like it you can skip those quests. Believe it or not, not ever single thing in this game is catered to your personal preferences. Edited August 12, 2013 by Arlon_Nabarlly
MisterBlackJack Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 I'm not having trouble with lag in the area as it was at the beginning. And I am for the competition for control over objectives. This is great for pvpers cause its a nice concentrated area where you can get a bunch of people together. I hope Bioware makes more of these
ninjonxb Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 I did one of those today. It was very very laggy with 80 people in the group. Oh, you guys call this Op CZ-198. Please acknowledge that you understand its nearly impossible to have the patience to do this daily and that you plan to bring the instance threshold in line with Makeb. It was clearly very poorly thought out squeezing so many imps and pubs in one place. Making them need 8 of 2 different objectives. Only putting 14 or so of each of those objectives in the whole place. I think this underscores the need for more people to use the pTS. I will assume, and give EA the benefit of the doubt, that they could not have foreseen this lag in this area or this nonsense competition for the same objectives (some competition is ok, this is absurd though).. because the PTS was never under heavy load in CZ-198. 1. You can't have more than 24 in a group so what are you talking about... As for the new daily area. It is meant to be a contested area. As in it is expected that you can't just walk in and not see anyone. It is the entire point!
Quraswren Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 (edited) I did one of those today. It was very very laggy with 80 people in the group. Oh, you guys call this Op CZ-198. Please acknowledge that you understand its nearly impossible to have the patience to do this daily and that you plan to bring the instance threshold in line with Makeb. It was clearly very poorly thought out squeezing so many imps and pubs in one place. Making them need 8 of 2 different objectives. Only putting 14 or so of each of those objectives in the whole place. I think this underscores the need for more people to use the pTS. I will assume, and give EA the benefit of the doubt, that they could not have foreseen this lag in this area or this nonsense competition for the same objectives (some competition is ok, this is absurd though).. because the PTS was never under heavy load in CZ-198. LOl I know your pain. CZ-198 for me is such a failure for a daily zone when it can't even handle the people just running around for spawns and killing NPC mobs. Hell, I'm glad I don't see pvp for fear of the game engine coming to a crashing halt. As far as getting the quest objectives, it's now a free for all. Just steal them from others as I think that is what BW wanted and intended. A way of sorts to kick off pvp. Why else would there be so few but so many people needing them? It was designed to cause chaos and friction - So, steal them from others by whatever means. PVP or PVP server. Do not play fair in that area. While I like the area, it's a terrible experience to actually play due to it's design, development, Implementation and the poor performance the area has with the number of people there. It's got potential but as of now, it's nothing more than a headache. Edited August 12, 2013 by Quraswren
aeterno Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 (edited) It's gonna suck for the first couple of weeks but after that it's gonna be a LOT more user friendly. SectionX vs Black hole. I'll have more of BH/CZ stuff tyvm. When I do a set of dailies I prefer a quick in and out not a 1.5 hour ordeal. Only issue with it atm is the curious decision to have instance caps so high. Edited August 12, 2013 by aeterno
Jonfendm Posted August 12, 2013 Author Posted August 12, 2013 I'm not having trouble with lag in the area as it was at the beginning. And I am for the competition for control over objectives. This is great for pvpers cause its a nice concentrated area where you can get a bunch of people together. I hope Bioware makes more of these Being great for PVPers does not make it great overall. There are designated areas for PVP. The only thing that could be attractive to PVPers here is the chance to kill players who accidentally get flagged and do not want to pvp. The reality is, the instance threshold is too high. It seems to be around 100 (combined imp and pub).. Much larger places like Makeb , that could HANDLE that kind of load without punishing middle of the road GPU users, ironically have their instance threshold set near 30. So what it looks like is a giant middle finger to the largest segment of the player base (players with medium GPU's) and an "attaboy" to the folks who sit on makeb and switch between 5 or 6 instances every 30 minutes to farm the chests on Gravity Hook 7. Im not calling for anything radical in terms of changes, just an instance threshold that makes sense for such a small area, and that makes sense for such a large % of the player base.
TUXs Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 1. You can't have more than 24 in a group so what are you talking about... This is where I tuned out the OP as well. Limit is 24.
TUXs Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 Being great for PVPers does not make it great overall. There are designated areas for PVP. The only thing that could be attractive to PVPers here is the chance to kill players who accidentally get flagged and do not want to pvp. The reality is, the instance threshold is too high. It seems to be around 100 (combined imp and pub).. Much larger places like Makeb , that could HANDLE that kind of load without punishing middle of the road GPU users, ironically have their instance threshold set near 30. So what it looks like is a giant middle finger to the largest segment of the player base (players with medium GPU's) and an "attaboy" to the folks who sit on makeb and switch between 5 or 6 instances every 30 minutes to farm the chests on Gravity Hook 7. Im not calling for anything radical in terms of changes, just an instance threshold that makes sense for such a small area, and that makes sense for such a large % of the player base. Designated areas for PvP? LOL! Your PvE server isn't the only type. There are also PvP servers where this new zone has gone over extremely well. They're quick, easy daily missions...if you're scared about being flagged or the lag is bothering you, head to one of the 4+ other daily areas that nobody else goes to. You aren't forced to do any of this.
Jonfendm Posted August 12, 2013 Author Posted August 12, 2013 Designated areas for PvP? LOL! Your PvE server isn't the only type. There are also PvP servers where this new zone has gone over extremely well. They're quick, easy daily missions...if you're scared about being flagged or the lag is bothering you, head to one of the 4+ other daily areas that nobody else goes to. You aren't forced to do any of this. 1st off, to your prior post, the 80 man op thing was an analogy. I didnt think it was that hard to spot. Maybe I was wrong. 2nd... are you literally trying to make the argument to me that lowering the threshold from ~100-120 to ~50-60 would really make it less fun for PVP servers? Thats absurd. So you only have 30 targets in that small room instead of 50? I would argue it might even ENHANCE PvP.
TUXs Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 (edited) 1st off, to your prior post, the 80 man op thing was an analogy. I didnt think it was that hard to spot. Maybe I was wrong. 2nd... are you literally trying to make the argument to me that lowering the threshold from ~100-120 to ~50-60 would really make it less fun for PVP servers? Thats absurd. So you only have 30 targets in that small room instead of 50? I would argue it might even ENHANCE PvP. 1st off, if you're going to make a satirical point, make it obvious. As I said, I stopped reading. 2nd...what the hell are you talking about? I was commenting on your ridiculous statement "There are designated areas for PVP." (you said that). Then you went on to claim "The only thing that could be attractive to PVPers here is the chance to kill players who accidentally get flagged and do not want to pvp."...which is again, stupidly false. I don't want accidental PvPers, I want people who know what to expect and are ready for it. I'm fine with them lowering the number of players, but I believe it's fine as it is right now. I had no difficulty there this weekend and we camped the named NPC for hours, preventing Imps from ever looting him. Edited August 12, 2013 by TUXs
Ashenti Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 The population caps of the new zone appear to have been dropped to 50. In my opinion, this could probably do with being lowered to 30. My system isn't great, but runs SWTOR well and I get very little lag (any I do get is generally in busy areas of Makeb and then only minor). With 49 people in the new zone the lag was quite bad. The small area and respawn rates of the objectives bought out the worst behaviour in MMO's, little to no respect for others. I know many argue that no-one owns a spawn, first click gets the prize - all is fair. But, I strongly believe that it's wrong to click an objective when someone else is obviouslly clearing their way to it. Don't get me wrong, I don;t get all bent out of shape and irate if someone does it to me (I tend to click before killing anyway) but, that doesn't mean I will stoop to such behaviour myself. This has led to a situation where many players are just camping one spot, clicking and waiting for a respawn, not much fun there. As others have pointed out, you don't have to do these quests, you can ignore them and do something else. Quite true and this is what I will be doing from now on. Hopefully things will calm down over time or the cap will be lowered a little and then I'll pick them up a bit. p.s I did have some fun for a short while. I don;t usually PvP outside arenas but noticed a few flagged players running around so flagged myself. For about an hour it was quite fun. Fighting for control of areas etc.. But then someone discovered a new way to 'have fun' and the information seemed to spread quickly. For the last couple of days there has a been several cloaked players who don't fight, just roam around waiting for a flagged player to approach am objective and stun them. They keep this up for as long as possible. Once someone manages to uncover them they just run for the protected area. This , to me, is not pvp, its griefing plain and simple.
CmdrShpd Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 I did one of those today. It was very very laggy with 80 people in the group. Oh, you guys call this Op CZ-198. Please acknowledge that you understand its nearly impossible to have the patience to do this daily and that you plan to bring the instance threshold in line with Makeb. It was clearly very poorly thought out squeezing so many imps and pubs in one place. Making them need 8 of 2 different objectives. Only putting 14 or so of each of those objectives in the whole place. I think this underscores the need for more people to use the pTS. I will assume, and give EA the benefit of the doubt, that they could not have foreseen this lag in this area or this nonsense competition for the same objectives (some competition is ok, this is absurd though).. because the PTS was never under heavy load in CZ-198. OP, try switching instances. If your serve is similar to mine (Harbinger), your lag should be reduced substantially.
MaximilianPower Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 1st off, to your prior post, the 80 man op thing was an analogy. I didnt think it was that hard to spot. Maybe I was wrong. fwiw, I got it and thought it was fairly obvious. can't speak to your main point, though.
ApostleThirst Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 You know, I actually think an 80 man warzone, 40 for each team, battling over 4 objectives, would be insanely great. Anyone else think so?
LordArtemis Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 I get your point. Perhaps they could have limited the population a bit more. I think it will drop off with time naturally. To the title, I imagined what an 80 man group would be like...the closest thing to that was 40 man raid groups on Dathomir in SWG. Loved it. I think a real 80 man group in this game would break the internet.
TUXs Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 You know, I actually think an 80 man warzone, 40 for each team, battling over 4 objectives, would be insanely great. Anyone else think so? Absolutely that would be great....if the game could handle it...but it can't. 40v40 would just be a cluster funk of lag and crashes.
ApostleThirst Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 Absolutely that would be great....if the game could handle it...but it can't. 40v40 would just be a cluster funk of lag and crashes. The fleet has more people in a single instance!... and is super laggy, you're right
KyaniteD Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 (edited) OP, try switching instances. If your serve is similar to mine (Harbinger), your lag should be reduced substantially. Great idea, if switching instances is available. I was in in the zone Thursday or Friday and it showed 62 players of my own faction, with no option to switch instances (there was only one instance). It was unplayable. What helped me was to reduce visible character limit to the lowest possible. Makes me see people fairly late, but at least I get to run around at more than 2 FPS. Edited August 12, 2013 by KyaniteD
AshlaBoga Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 (edited) Great idea, if switching instances is available. I was in in the zone Thursday or Friday and it showed 62 players of my own faction, with no option to switch instances (there was only one instance). It was unplayable. What helped me was to reduce visible character limit to the lowest possible. Makes me see people fairly late, but at least I get to run around at more than 2 FPS. 2 FPS? 62 people (unless the other faction had 80) wouldn't explain that. I do have something helpful to suggest: disable FRIENDLY nameplates. Really helps me when I'm on fleet with +150 people. (Fleet does NOT like +150 people ). Edited August 12, 2013 by AshlaBoga
MaximilianPower Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 Absolutely that would be great....if the game could handle it...but it can't. 40v40 would just be a cluster funk of lag and crashes. That could be one of the objectives: merely surviving a WZ at 2 fps with frequent crashes. Sounds like a fun challenge. Excuse me a moment, I'm going to go simulate the experience by playing with my monitor off.
uniz Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 the op has a point. on the pts I found it to be a pain when 10 of us was in there. today there were more pcs than mobs let alone quest items. Saturday and sunday wasn't much better. pvp is nice but most of us don't pvp in there as we are on pve servers for a reason. I couldn't imagine pvpers even getting the quests done with that many players. yes op like myself on a pve server back in early black hole I again had to camp a quest item clearing mobs around it and waiting for it to respawn. then and now it wasn't fun. but it was changed. we can only hope this gets changed too.
AshlaBoga Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 That could be one of the objectives: merely surviving a WZ at 2 fps with frequent crashes. Sounds like a fun challenge. Excuse me a moment, I'm going to go simulate the experience by playing with my monitor off. Game can handle 16 vs 16 but it starts lagging as soon as you hit 20 vs. 20. Was in a 24 vs 24 a month or two ago. FPs dropped down to 9.
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