Commando - Assault Spec Hybrid 2.0 PVE Guide

[LordKantner]

Plasma cell most def needs a change, it's way too nerfed that you need to properly sync the application during the filler, otherwise any lag or movement = no more DoT for a while. A 3 sec cooldown would allow you to keep it up while at the same time not make it super OP with abilities like Hail of Bolts or being able to tab and apply ea target with a near 100% chance with hammer shot.

[LordKantner]

As far as proc damage relics go, I'm not seeing anything better than SA and BA at this time. The Cerulean Nova I have yet to test but the Elemental Transcendence (Force Elemental) is not very useful. The dot allows HiB but it doesn't count towards the 9% damage buff on abilities for burning targets.

[Gyronamics]

ET doesn't do a DoT its a hit.

 

Also since there's no point playing Assault without someone else armour debuffing, CN > ET.

[oaceen]

ET doesn't do a DoT its a hit.

 

Also since there's no point playing Assault without someone else armour debuffing, CN > ET.

 

don't you need at least 30% armor penetration for CN to be worth more than ET though?

[Gyronamics]

Odd, I'm sure it worked out last time I tried it.

 

Checked just now and you need more than the 35% armour pen from AP cell to outdo the armour ignoring relics.

 

But once you have an armour debuff on it does 275 vs the 264 of internal relics. So kinda shafted whatever relic you go for as Assault.

[odawgg]

Odd, I'm sure it worked out last time I tried it.

 

Checked just now and you need more than the 35% armour pen from AP cell to outdo the armour ignoring relics.

 

But once you have an armour debuff on it does 275 vs the 264 of internal relics. So kinda shafted whatever relic you go for as Assault.

 

No damage relic option are as good for mercs as some of the other ACs, why I'm sticking to all power relics.

[odawgg]

I'm liking the Incendiary Missile heat cost reduction:

 

Before (Live parse cut down to 20 Minutes)

After (PTR parse cut to 20 mins)

 

35-40% less need for rapid shots, the flow is much nicer...dps similar

Edited August 18, 2013 by odawgg

[oaceen]

No damage relic option are as good for mercs as some of the other ACs, why I'm sticking to all power relics.

 

the elemental one is actually really good for assault (assuming it's tech damage), especially if you got all 36 points

with 3 dots, that's a lot of chances to keep it triggered pretty close to the ICD

[odawgg]

the elemental one is actually really good for assault (assuming it's tech damage), especially if you got all 36 points

with 3 dots, that's a lot of chances to keep it triggered pretty close to the ICD

 

what kind of dps have you seen from the elemental?

[LordKantner]

The elemental is force damage unfortunately. The only tech damage one is the Cerulean Nova.

 

I still think the best change to this spec is to get rid of or reduce the 6s internal CD on Plasma Cell/Combustible Gas Cylinder.

[Gyronamics]

The elemental is force damage unfortunately. The only tech damage one is the Cerulean Nova.

 

There are 4 proc damage relics

 

Tech Energy

Tech Internal

 

Force Kinetic

Force Elemental

 

There is no difference between energy/kinetic or internal/elemental.

 

The your tech or force crit rate is what matters to the relic which is why you need the right type.

[oaceen]

There are 4 proc damage relics

 

Tech Energy

Tech Internal

 

Force Kinetic

Force Elemental

 

There is no difference between energy/kinetic or internal/elemental.

 

The your tech or force crit rate is what matters to the relic which is why you need the right type.

 

the internal is force for arkanian / underworld / kell dragon after they swapped everything around from the dread guard relics

 

 

but for the elemental transcendance relic

 

arkanian ET: elemental TECH

underworld ET: elemental FORCE

kell dragon ET: elemental FORCE

 

 

i've submitted a couple bug reports about this, and AmberGreen even commented rather ambiguously to say that the tooltip issue was 'on [their] radar'

[Gyronamics]

Had a nice supportive raid set up last night with 2 gunnery, a slinger and guardian.

 

Also my first attempt on TWH in TFB NiM and even then I was a last minute sub due to RL and armour bug.

 

First try was over 3k but wiped on 50khp due to a tanking error, next two were 2.8, 2.85 but still errors.

 

Fourth try cleared on 2.9 and everyone immediately died in the add explosion as is traditional.

 

What spec? Straight Assault, 0/10/36.

 

 

Wasn't so obvious in that fight but when we tried Operator with the constant goddam AOE and I was looking at damage taken I was consistently taking 2-3% more damage than the gunnery specs. As I've always said we still have to pay a price to play Assault and it's really uncool in progression even when the DPS side works out.

 

 

Also did straight assault for HM SV just because, 2.3 dash, 2.4 titan, 2.7 thrasher, 1 operations chief, 1.8 orlok, 2.5 cartel, 2.5 styrak.

 

I'm leaning towards straight assault because the next patch looks skewed towards using AP.

Edited August 22, 2013 by Gyronamics

[Kaos_KidSWTOR]

The point of this spec confuses me. It's essentialy Full Arsenal without Assault Plastique. For my DPS merc my preferred Spec is this http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#800ZrfforzRkcZfhMrzoM.3 It works well for any situation, Has MORE HIB boosts, (20% Penetration from Grav Round, 30% damage from Charged Barrel, 30% penetration from High Friction Bolts, and Target Lock That's 80% penetration granted that a Guardian, or Gunslinger, or another Commando isnt around to add their penetrators. Plus 30% from Charged Barrel. So I think the net DPS of this spec may be higher than This proposed spec. And you can use Full Auto more often in my spec than this proposed one.)

[CJNJ]

The point of this spec confuses me. It's essentialy Full Arsenal without Assault Plastique. For my DPS merc my preferred Spec is this http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#800ZrfforzRkcZfhMrzoM.3 It works well for any situation, Has MORE HIB boosts, (20% Penetration from Grav Round, 30% damage from Charged Barrel, 30% penetration from High Friction Bolts, and Target Lock That's 80% penetration granted that a Guardian, or Gunslinger, or another Commando isnt around to add their penetrators. Plus 30% from Charged Barrel. So I think the net DPS of this spec may be higher than This proposed spec. And you can use Full Auto more often in my spec than this proposed one.)

 

Problem with that is you can't use grav round like you say, end up killing your ammo. Maybe if ya focus on just procing FA and HiB with the random GR/IR/Enet ect after HiB, then it can work, but if you can't proc then you are dead.

[oaceen]

The point of this spec confuses me. It's essentialy Full Arsenal without Assault Plastique. For my DPS merc my preferred Spec is this http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#800ZrfforzRkcZfhMrzoM.3 It works well for any situation, Has MORE HIB boosts, (20% Penetration from Grav Round, 30% damage from Charged Barrel, 30% penetration from High Friction Bolts, and Target Lock That's 80% penetration granted that a Guardian, or Gunslinger, or another Commando isnt around to add their penetrators. Plus 30% from Charged Barrel. So I think the net DPS of this spec may be higher than This proposed spec. And you can use Full Auto more often in my spec than this proposed one.)

 

have you actually tried this?

 

charged bolts and grav round at 19 ammo is completely unplayable

[ArchangelLBC]

The point of this spec confuses me. It's essentialy Full Arsenal without Assault Plastique. For my DPS merc my preferred Spec is this http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#800ZrfforzRkcZfhMrzoM.3 It works well for any situation, Has MORE HIB boosts, (20% Penetration from Grav Round, 30% damage from Charged Barrel, 30% penetration from High Friction Bolts, and Target Lock That's 80% penetration granted that a Guardian, or Gunslinger, or another Commando isnt around to add their penetrators. Plus 30% from Charged Barrel. So I think the net DPS of this spec may be higher than This proposed spec. And you can use Full Auto more often in my spec than this proposed one.)

 

Why would you do this? Please don't ever do this.

Edited August 22, 2013 by ArchangelLBC

[Gyronamics]

Only time I've ever done that was for giggles to see the damage of a powered up HiB with extra armour pen and that was with AP cell on.

 

Hits ok but less than a demo and that's its one trick which wasn't worth the downsides.

 

Utter garbage for rotating and yes 19ammo is horrible for our cast.

Edited August 22, 2013 by Gyronamics

[LordKantner]

The point of this spec confuses me. It's essentialy Full Arsenal without Assault Plastique. For my DPS merc my preferred Spec is this http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#800ZrfforzRkcZfhMrzoM.3 It works well for any situation, Has MORE HIB boosts, (20% Penetration from Grav Round, 30% damage from Charged Barrel, 30% penetration from High Friction Bolts, and Target Lock That's 80% penetration granted that a Guardian, or Gunslinger, or another Commando isnt around to add their penetrators. Plus 30% from Charged Barrel. So I think the net DPS of this spec may be higher than This proposed spec. And you can use Full Auto more often in my spec than this proposed one.)

 

 

I don't understand how my spec is "Essentially Full Arsenal" by going 12 points into the tree. Your spec is completely reliant on a lucky proc, if it isn't perfect you barely can break 2k DPS.

 

Show me some parses if you really think its viable. Your spec also does not have "More" HiB boosts, check the bottom of this post for more detail. An argument can be made that they're equal, but you definitely do not have more.

 

My spec also gets much of its damage from the damage multipliers and crit buffs on the Dots, not just HiB.

 

There is also a thread on the Merc forum pertaining to just how horrible your spec is:

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=670540

 

Had a nice supportive raid set up last night with 2 gunnery, a slinger and guardian.

 

Also my first attempt on TWH in TFB NiM and even then I was a last minute sub due to RL and armour bug.

 

First try was over 3k but wiped on 50khp due to a tanking error, next two were 2.8, 2.85 but still errors.

 

Fourth try cleared on 2.9 and everyone immediately died in the add explosion as is traditional.

 

What spec? Straight Assault, 0/10/36.

 

 

Wasn't so obvious in that fight but when we tried Operator with the constant goddam AOE and I was looking at damage taken I was consistently taking 2-3% more damage than the gunnery specs. As I've always said we still have to pay a price to play Assault and it's really uncool in progression even when the DPS side works out.

 

 

Also did straight assault for HM SV just because, 2.3 dash, 2.4 titan, 2.7 thrasher, 1 operations chief, 1.8 orlok, 2.5 cartel, 2.5 styrak.

 

I'm leaning towards straight assault because the next patch looks skewed towards using AP.

 

 

I'll be testing out AP more when the patch hits, but I'm still finding it hard to use in a rotation, because of either ammo or not lining up with a cooldown. It may be better in the future, but as far as raid DPS I find the hybrid spam better for me. Odawgg also went full assault, it may work better for some people.

 

I have yet to see a contending raid boss parse with full assault however.

 

For people who don't get armor pen from someone else you can always go 0/13/33 too, only losing 1% crit.

 

P.S.

 

As far as the whole HiB situation Kaos has a flat 30%, but I get a 15% flat in addition to a 30% damage increase on every Crit. Having 26% ranged Crit means that it goes up to 45% quite a bit.

[TimmehSolo]

I'd be interested to see what you guys think of this spec. http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#8000cZrcc0MZfhbrdRrccz.3

It's essentially the same as the OP, but it skips the CD reduction on RC/RP and the alacrity buff. It trades that for 3% more tech and ranged crit chance from the CM tree. I rarely have trouble with heat in an assault spec without AP, in fact I often find myself at 0% heat following a RS proc (countered by incendiary or PG). Essentially, I think that this will work better, but I can't test it because my gear is **** for dps.

 

On another note, the HiB proc resets its cooldown when it procs, not when you use railshot. So the CB vs FA debate as far as this is not correct. You see, if you use FA the proc triggers at the beginning(when it procs), and can be procced again six seconds after the proc, not when you fired HiB. I feel like it would be better to use FA to proc every other HiB because it doesn't delay the procs, it is far cheaper (half) than 2 CBs, it does and it does in fact have a slightly better chance of procing HiB, and (I believe) it does more damage than CBs. I think FA may be why I don't have heat problems in this spec.

 

Let me know what you think.

[oaceen]

On another note, the HiB proc resets its cooldown when it procs, not when you use railshot. So the CB vs FA debate as far as this is not correct. You see, if you use FA the proc triggers at the beginning(when it procs), and can be procced again six seconds after the proc, not when you fired HiB. I feel like it would be better to use FA to proc every other HiB because it doesn't delay the procs, it is far cheaper (half) than 2 CBs, it does and it does in fact have a slightly better chance of procing HiB, and (I believe) it does more damage than CBs. I think FA may be why I don't have heat problems in this spec.

 

i don't think you understand the actual debate that's going on.

 

if FA does not proc (25% of the time), you have to wait the full 3s channel then another 1.5s cast to try again.

if CB fails to proc, you can try again immediately with another 1.5s cast

 

 

what you said is completely true, but the criticism against FA is not about pushing back the reset timer when it does proc, it's about pushing back the chance to reset when it doesn't.

 

especially with charged bolts' near perfect ability to reset HIB, there's no reason to try to reset with FA. even if they fixed it, so that it's a true 45% chance, the mechanics of FA being a channeled attack that only resets at the beginning and the only other option resetting at the end of the GCD, the risk vs reward is just too high imo.

Edited August 23, 2013 by oaceen

[LordKantner]

Let me know what you think.

 

I find that the extra bit of alacrity helps a lot when it comes to squeezing abilities into that 6 second window in between HiBs. When you take into account lag, ability delay, etc, a 1.4 second cast will usually turn into 1.5 seconds anyway.

 

If you want the 3% crit I would simply go 3/10/33, and not use full auto at all.

 

Also I'm not sure if anyone ever said that HiB itself resets the CD, I believe I have always said Full auto procs the second the ability starts and Charged Bolts procs at the end of the cast.

 

Keep in mind that firing HiB itself is one GCD, and you only have 3 other GCD's in that time window before you are gaining unnecessary time.

 

There is also a higher chance of certain rotation fillers to proc the HiB better than others. Most of these are with a charged bolts, although Full Auto does say a 70% chance to proc, something with the RNG in this game makes it proc HiB less than the current fillers posted in the guide.

 

The best filler I have seen is Bolt, Hammer, Bolt..... or Bolt x 3. It will proc HiB nearly every time, certainly more than 45%.

[Gnimish]

Just wanted to post my results. Disclaimer: i am a healer that goes as dps from time to time gear is not bis or itemized still working on dropping crit and finishing augments. Still got a fee 22 reflex augments. Wearing 4 piece arkanian healer set bonus.

 

So with that being said dont laugh at my dummy parse

 

Full gunnery i was parse at 2070 over 5 mins.

 

Your build best i could manage was 1670. You rotation is new to me so do not have it perfected i was getting it timed better so every relic proc i was getting a HIB proc. didnt have problems keeping DOT up. I do not think burn out? If thats what it is called would make up dps gap or a armor pen im not sure. Also plasma grenade seems a waste think it totalled like 2% of my dps like 7k damage snd it is so expensive.

 

What i do like, ammo is very rarely a issue with your build and is alot more fun than straight gunnery.

I don't see a huge boost in mobility, still rooted for CB or FA sure you could break FA if you got a HIB proc but seems like a dps lost.

 

Well just some of my thoughts. Fun build

[LordKantner]

Plasma Grenade is good DPS, but only when you know how to use it at just the right time. I'd focus on meeting the HiB procs via the rotation fillers I have posted on the guide. It's a bit difficult at first adjusting to fitting in the abilities with when you should be applying dots.

 

As far as what you mean by Burnout I am a bit confused. Are you taking that in the tree? If not you really should, my spec is also posted on the guide.

 

If you have any questions feel free to post more, try to be a bit more specific though.

[LordKantner]

I actually got some gear, stats updated, and I'll be parsing later today to beat my numbers.