Basreia Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 Oh i would like to see how the community will react if Bioware will release stims and buffs that give you an advatage. You know so casuals have better chances of clearing the NiM modes and in the same time they can make them harder for those progression guilds that don't want to use those BiS stims and buffs. Bioware should give it a try. This would also be a good training for their PR guys as they could try to write more awesome blog posts that explain that this is no P2W. I would guess that it is even ok to sell the best gear and make modifications and stuff available via cc so you can optimize you stats with real money. No need for crafters. You can sell everything in the GTN of course. As nothing that is PvE content can be P2W we should also add grade 8 space ship parts to cm only. And why bother with PvP sell the best stuff in the cm. PvP is secondary content anyways so why always the headaches with new gear. Just give everyone the best gear for money and all that is left is skill. I see great times for BW so much money to make. Stims and buffs are already available in game. You can get stims from the merchants and buffs are available through the different characters also your Legacy. If you have one of each character you can have a Legacy buffed player that is almost unstoppable. F2P players can unlock Legacy and work on the buffs from the other characters so that is no problem. I can see where you are getting, but BioWare would never put buffs in the shop that are from around the whole game so any class can use it at anytime. What would be the point of character buffs then? I see your point but remember, just don't take the examples too far Anything you can get in the Cartel Market to advance your character you can get in game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuuuuucky Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 (edited) Well the post was intended to be sarcasm and over the top. If not obviouse sorry for that. All was ment to be something that is cm only and even more powerfull than what we have. If Bioware is redefining their definition of P2W or simply scrap their restrictions on cm items theys set for themselfes (no more high end stuff after the space gear debacle) they could easely sell stuff that makes casuals ready for higher difficulty modes simply with the argument that they don't have to use it. I would love to see what would happen if they did something like that just for the lulz. Edited July 23, 2013 by chuuuuucky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUBBUH Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 it's not a demo it's way more than a demo would ever offer it's more than a lot of single player games even offer, 8 story lines with missions and side missions all of it for free And it's also barely playable. I highly doubt someone would go through awful combat mechanics just to see a two second tack on story that BW threw together. And before we get there, just because you are willing to deal with a nerfed mmo doesn't mean everyone else will. In fact most people haven't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Never_Hesitate Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 And it's also barely playable. I highly doubt someone would go through awful combat mechanics just to see a two second tack on story that BW threw together. And before we get there, just because you are willing to deal with a nerfed mmo doesn't mean everyone else will. In fact most people haven't. If you are not willing to play it with the restrictions, buy a subscription, it's that easy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUBBUH Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 If you are not willing to play it with the restrictions, buy a subscription, it's that easy Or get one of the far superior mmos out there completely free. Enjoy having a big EA logo stamped on your forehead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedip_enguin Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 Or get one of the far superior mmos out there completely free. Enjoy having a big EA logo stamped on your forehead. Tell us more about these magical MMOs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Propane Posted July 23, 2013 Author Share Posted July 23, 2013 (edited) So based on your examples of why TOR is P2W, let's look at some of the other freemium MMOs you mentioned in this thread: LOTRO is P2W because F2P players have a 2 gold limit, they only get a couple of trait slots, and cannot earn rest XP. Rift is P2W because subscribers get 15% more currency and daily XP/reputation boosts. Tera is P2W because subscribers get daily XP, gold, and reputation boosts. Aion is P2W because F2P players can only gather/extract a limited number of times each day, and their instance cooldowns are much longer. Subscribers will always get benefits that F2P players don't get; otherwise there would be no point in subscribing. Now you can argue that TOR has more restrictions than other games (and I would actually agree with you on that), but having restrictions doesn't make it P2W. Otherwise every freemium MMO would be P2W. Rift doesn't have subscribers. They have elite status like how swtor has it's "premium for those who paid 60$ for the game and who paid 5$ on the cartel market." And still in those MMO's you can get and wear all armor, unlike swtor where f2pers cannnot wear most high level armor and most purple armors. Edited July 23, 2013 by Propane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Propane Posted July 23, 2013 Author Share Posted July 23, 2013 (edited) Payments should only be used to broaden the gaming experience without affecting the core gameplay itself. Thank you guys for getting me to a 22 page post with a 7 word thread. Edited July 23, 2013 by Propane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 It is amusing how people use the term "Pay to Win" to present some kind of negative tone for a game. Just about any complaint now a days can become "P2W" as if that somehow destroys the appeal of a game. It's a pretty silly notion considering that, unless you are a sheep you can think for yourself and realize that most of it is diatribe. P2W is a title that folks use when they don't like something to try and persuade you to agree. I don't think it's going to have that effect. In other words....so what if it is P2W? Really....so what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Propane Posted July 23, 2013 Author Share Posted July 23, 2013 (edited) They minus as well as made the F2P single player and given the MMO parts as a demo, seeing how ALL the parts that make a MMO a MMO are all on a limit. Edited July 23, 2013 by Propane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yyrmega Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 Oh no, you silly! This game isn't Pay to Win It's Pay to B%$&h on the forums! 24 freakin' 7!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amaranth Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 Rift doesn't have subscribers. They have elite status like how swtor has it's "premium for those who paid 60$ for the game and who paid 5$ on the cartel market. http://www.riftgame.com/en/store/#patron $15 a month for "patron" status. Looks like a subscription to me. And still in those MMO's you can get and wear all armor, unlike swtor where f2pers cannnot wear most high level armor and most purple armors. Okay, so the reason TOR is P2W is only because of the armor restriction now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUBBUH Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 It is amusing how people use the term "Pay to Win" to present some kind of negative tone for a game. Just about any complaint now a days can become "P2W" as if that somehow destroys the appeal of a game. It's a pretty silly notion considering that, unless you are a sheep you can think for yourself and realize that most of it is diatribe. P2W is a title that folks use when they don't like something to try and persuade you to agree. I don't think it's going to have that effect. In other words....so what if it is P2W? Really....so what? Then the business itself evolves until every company is like EA. Mass effect having a good ending? lol nope. Call of duty needs innovation? lol nope. Just a few months ago i watched four of my favorite IP's die in front of me, Halo, GoW, Borderlands, and AC. I have 0 reason to buy a console now. And finally its partly the reason why the Xbox One came to fruition. Because casuals bought the Wii during its hype, it was a flash in the pan, lucky success and every console tried to copy it afterwards, failing. So continue buying up fast food gaming. Watch day one dlc's and pay to win become the norm. (As if its not already right now). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Propane Posted July 24, 2013 Author Share Posted July 24, 2013 http://www.riftgame.com/en/store/#patron $15 a month for "patron" status. Looks like a subscription to me. Okay, so the reason TOR is P2W is only because of the armor restriction now? That alone is pay to win. PAYING to be able to USE THE BEST ARMOR in the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Propane Posted July 24, 2013 Author Share Posted July 24, 2013 Then the business itself evolves until every company is like EA. Mass effect having a good ending? lol nope. Call of duty needs innovation? lol nope. Just a few months ago i watched four of my favorite IP's die in front of me, Halo, GoW, Borderlands, and AC. I have 0 reason to buy a console now. And finally its partly the reason why the Xbox One came to fruition. Because casuals bought the Wii during its hype, it was a flash in the pan, lucky success and every console tried to copy it afterwards, failing. So continue buying up fast food gaming. Watch day one dlc's and pay to win become the norm. (As if its not already right now). You can't argue with anyone here, people always gunna find something to make sure their 100% flawless EA system stays in place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 (edited) Then the business itself evolves until every company is like EA. Mass effect having a good ending? lol nope. Call of duty needs innovation? lol nope. Just a few months ago i watched four of my favorite IP's die in front of me, Halo, GoW, Borderlands, and AC. I have 0 reason to buy a console now. And finally its partly the reason why the Xbox One came to fruition. Because casuals bought the Wii during its hype, it was a flash in the pan, lucky success and every console tried to copy it afterwards, failing. So continue buying up fast food gaming. Watch day one dlc's and pay to win become the norm. (As if its not already right now). Your opinion is noted. I dismissed it as exaggerated hyperbole. Because, IMO, that is exactly what it is. I do get that you do not like casuals. Unfortunately they dominate the market. It is a simple fact of life. You can't argue with anyone here, people always gunna find something to make sure their 100% flawless EA system stays in place. ...and 100 points for exaggeration factor. You guys are funny. Especially if I'm getting classified as a fanboi or apologist. Edited July 24, 2013 by LordArtemis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexDougherty Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 That alone is pay to win. PAYING to be able to USE THE BEST ARMOR in the game. It's also not this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexDougherty Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 You can't argue with anyone here, people always gunna find something to make sure their 100% flawless EA system stays in place. Nobody thinks EA is flawless, or this game is flawless, they just don't agree with your arguement that it's pay to win, which it isn't. You keep ignoring people's arguements to call them EA fanboy's, which shows you can't frame an arguement, let alone execute said arguement successfully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Propane Posted July 24, 2013 Author Share Posted July 24, 2013 (edited) It's also not this game. http://www.swtor.com/free/features Scroll down to item equipping and highlight over the free to play bubble. Isn't that hard to read. "Cannot equip most purple items unless an authorization is purchased in CARTEL store." So basically if you didn't under stand that. You gotta pay to be able to use the best armors in the game. At higher levels, you need these purple items with expertise to be able to do some sort of help in PvP. If you don't you will be loosing. But because this is a glorified demo, the real parts that make up a MMO - PvP, Raids, Operations, - are limited to a number so they won't really be needing them will they? Edited July 24, 2013 by Propane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Never_Hesitate Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 (edited) http://www.swtor.com/free/features Scroll down to item equipping and highlight over the free to play bubble. Isn't that hard to read. "Cannot equip most purple items unless an authorization is purchased in CARTEL store." Purple equip is not important whilst leveling, is it? When you really want to play the endgame you have to pay (for example with weekly passes) to do ops, unlimited wz's/fp's. So you're telling me, that to only be able to wear equip, from content you can't really play, without paying is p2w? At higher levels, you need these purple items with expertise to be able to do some sort of help in PvP. If you don't you will be loosing. Not true anylonger with bolster (if you don't pay for anything you will stay in the 30-54 bracket and there you can't even buy gear with expertise) But because this is a glorified demo, the real parts that make up a MMO - PvP, Raids, Operations, - are limited to a number so they won't really be needing them will they? Just because you keep telling yourself "it is a demo" doesn't make it true. The story is a very real part of a story heavy mmo, even if you don't want to acknowledge that and a lot of people play the game for it's story Edited July 24, 2013 by Never_Hesitate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanHasell Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 So let me get this straight... There are folks who want to get everything a sub gets without paying a sub? And because they can't they say the game is PTW? I've been playing MMO's since they were text only. This is the whiniest, most entitlement-focused online community I have EVER come across. Deary me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Propane Posted July 24, 2013 Author Share Posted July 24, 2013 (edited) But you know - when you leave the swtor forums, everyone agrees on this pay to win situation because everyone here is subscribed and they don't really have to care about the free players. http://news.mmosite.com/content/2013-01-31/why_swtors_f2p_model_needs_help_1.shtml http://www.ign.com/articles/2012/10/17/star-wars-the-old-republic-f2p-restrictions-detailed http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/1249751-Star-Wars-The-Old-Republic-F2P-worth-it "As far as F2P games go it is the worst I have ever personally seen. Bioware/Swtor slaps so many arbitrary restrictions on you its ridiculous." "I tried it again as a preferred player but it just felt too restrictive and had the feeling that everything in the game was an ad trying to get met o buy cartel coins for every little upgrade or ability so I stopped after about 30 minutes." "I'd say SWTOR's F2P status is too restrictive for me to enjoy the game." Thanks for getting me 20+ pages of response of some agreeing and some trying to defend the perfectness of SWTOR f2p. Edited July 24, 2013 by Propane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Never_Hesitate Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 (edited) But you know - when you leave the swtor forums, everyone agrees on this pay to win situation because everyone here is subscribed and they don't really have to care about the free players. http://news.mmosite.com/content/2013-01-31/why_swtors_f2p_model_needs_help_1.shtml http://www.ign.com/articles/2012/10/17/star-wars-the-old-republic-f2p-restrictions-detailed http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/1249751-Star-Wars-The-Old-Republic-F2P-worth-it "As far as F2P games go it is the worst I have ever personally seen. Bioware/Swtor slaps so many arbitrary restrictions on you its ridiculous." "I tried it again as a preferred player but it just felt too restrictive and had the feeling that everything in the game was an ad trying to get met o buy cartel coins for every little upgrade or ability so I stopped after about 30 minutes." "I'd say SWTOR's F2P status is too restrictive for me to enjoy the game." I know a lot of f2p players who would disagree with these quotes I don't know where this mentallity comes from, that people who do not pay for something should get the same thing as the ones who do. Edited July 24, 2013 by Never_Hesitate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Propane Posted July 24, 2013 Author Share Posted July 24, 2013 (edited) I know a lot of f2p players who would disagree with these quotes I don't know where this mentallity comes from, that people who do not pay for something should get the same thing as the ones who do. Tell them to post on this forum! Oh wait... This mentality* comes from games where you can get the same gameplay experience from those who pay and those who choose not to. Edited July 24, 2013 by Propane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Never_Hesitate Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 (edited) Tell them to post on this forum! Oh wait... So what, the ability to write in the forum is now p2w as well? Edited July 24, 2013 by Never_Hesitate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts