JackNader Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 Dude your flat wrong. If it was AS you stated then there would not be any issue at all with shroud. The fact is people are always getting through shroud because the mechanic is actually as I stated. There is no inherent 5% chance to miss with all abilities. I don't know where people pulled that from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gondolindhrim Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 Didn't you just tell me not to have 100% faith in tooltips yourself a couple of posts higher? Yes, the character sheet shows a 20K resistance value for barrier. Doesn't necessarily mean a thing. It might not even be used for anything. Case in point: shroud shows 200% and attacks still get through. I meant ability tooltips. The character panel is generally pretty accurate. Should've clarified, apologies. It still doesn't make any sense for Shroud behaving differently than Barrier or Evasion, but I agree that these abilities should be tested as well. I'll bug a friend of mine in-game and see if he's up for wailing at my Sage on his Marauder for a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharee Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 Dude your flat wrong. If it was AS you stated then there would not be any issue at all with shroud. The fact is people are always getting through shroud because the mechanic is actually as I stated. There is no inherent 5% chance to miss with all abilities. I don't know where people pulled that from. Check the OP. There is a link to a dev response. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EatenByDistance Posted July 10, 2013 Author Share Posted July 10, 2013 (edited) Even if it is working as intended, the very low chance that something hits through it in a mainfight will rarely make the difference, so why would it work that way? On the other hand, if it means that I get unfairly sapped...That isn't skill. That's just atrocious luck. This is an MMO, I expect there to be RNG like crits and procs and the like, but there is a limit. This is it. It shouldn't work this way. It's not a matter of "I think this class is overpowered nerf please." It's a matter of needless luck. If shroud is currently working "as intended," then the intended way is dumb and should be changed. Edited July 10, 2013 by EatenByDistance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommytwotoes Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 where im from 100% means 100%. shroud needs to be fixed cuz now sifu thinks he's good and thats not ok Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoom_VI Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 The officials MUST refine their post. Cause IF they ninja made constant 5 % hit chance in hit result table, than: 1. There must be 5 % chance to penetrate sorc/sage force barrier, which is totally based on dodge/resist (gives 20 000 % dodge/resist). Yet I have not managed to hit through it, and there is no reports about it. 2. There must be 5 % chance to hit with white attack through dodge/evasion (gives 200 % ranged/melee dodge). Yet I have not managed to hit through it, and there is no reports about it. 3. There must be 5 % chance to penetrate sniper's covered escape (gives 200 % dodge/resist). Yet I have not managed to hit through it, and there is no reports about it. If I remember correctly resilience worked 100% up until either 1.2 or 1.3 then the bugs started. However 95% chance of working is still exceptionally good considering that resilience is one of the most BS cooldowns in both pve and PvP, maybe the 5% was added to discourage pve raiders who would run sins just so they could cheese mechanics. But then again there's also apparently a 5% chance for a jugg to force push a trooper using HTL off the VS bridge too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gondolindhrim Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 Completely agree. Abilities like Force Shroud, Evasion and Force Barrier should be completely foolproof no matter what. if they aren't, what's the point? You need to be able to rely on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anwg Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 Tooltip says it's 100% resistance increase instead of immunity. A dev says its not supposed to be immunity. IN-GAME evidence shows it's not immunity. What more do you need? Well for one, being confident of having devs that actually know *** they are talking about would be good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L-RANDLE Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 While I deplore abilities not working correctly, stating that it is breaking the current PVP build is laughable... Do these OP sin/shad think they are the only ones with DFCD not working? Open a ticket in game and post in the bug forum... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morde_ Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 While I deplore abilities not working correctly, stating that it is breaking the current PVP build is laughable... Do these OP sin/shad think they are the only ones with DFCD not working? Open a ticket in game and post in the bug forum... The only reason that game was lost was because of a broken/questionable mechanic. It doesn't break the WHOLE game, but it breaks individual games, as the OP's video shows. Play ranked sometime and you might understand more about PVP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L-RANDLE Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 The only reason that game was lost was because of a broken/questionable mechanic. It doesn't break the WHOLE game, but it breaks individual games, as the OP's video shows. Play ranked sometime and you might understand more about PVP And other players on different ACs don't have to deal with the same **** during ranked games? Got ya. PS: My **** been broke for months and hasn't been touched, but I don't try to act like my AC is game breaking whether on a global or individual basis. Hell half the people here don't know what the chance to hit formula is... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morde_ Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 (edited) And other players on different ACs don't have to deal with the same **** during ranked games?. Not to the same match-changing extent as the most important node guard cooldown in a game where the maps are so stalemate-turtley that losing a node is a sure loss. If you disagree with this, you're clearly delusional and/or don't play RWZs. Edited July 10, 2013 by Morde_ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foxmob Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 Force shroud is not resisting abilities in key moments of warzones. This is not working as intended and creates a huge imbalance in a CC-dominated metagame. the problem is you didn't roll sniper. you see, only snipers can have an abil that's immune to EVERYTHING. they spay-shall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L-RANDLE Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 Not to the same match-changing extent as the most important node guard cooldown in a game where the maps are so stalemate-turtley that losing a node is a sure loss. If you disagree with this, you're clearly delusional and/or don't play RWZs. And also disregard all the events prior to the loss? Sure buddy... And I play ranked and when snipers bypass my 100% on Saber Ward, I have to deal with the same ****, but I am not here blowing smoke up people asses claiming its gamebreaking when not only all sin have to deal with it, other ACs have similar issues... But keep trying... It's cute.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jadescythe Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 Not to the same match-changing extent as the most important node guard cooldown in a game where the maps are so stalemate-turtley that losing a node is a sure loss. If you disagree with this, you're clearly delusional and/or don't play RWZs. Cause leap only getting you halfway to your target and dying in fire isn't gamebreaking, the bug is working as intended. But sins are on a whole other level of importance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morde_ Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 (edited) And also disregard all the events prior to the loss? Sure buddy... And I play ranked and when snipers bypass my 100% on Saber Ward, I have to deal with the same ****, but I am not here blowing smoke up people asses claiming its gamebreaking when not only all sin have to deal with it, other ACs have similar issues... But keep trying... It's cute.. It doesn't win/lose the game when you take an extra shot from a sniper. It loses the game when a node guard gets flashed through shroud. You've confirmed that you have little to no clue about the competitive (I use that word loosely in regards to what Bioware has given us) part of this game. Edited July 10, 2013 by Morde_ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morde_ Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 (edited) Cause leap only getting you halfway to your target and dying in fire isn't gamebreaking, the bug is working as intended. But sins are on a whole other level of importance Don't jump when you use leap. The mechanic works much much much more reliably if you jump from the ground. You are correct through, that leap being broken is stupid too. I've got a jugg that I get nervous on in Huttball when I have to leap. Edited July 10, 2013 by Morde_ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DimeStax Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 All of L-Randle's posts are nonsense, and I'm completely convinced he's a solo-que warrior who hasn't played a single Ranked game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
funkiestj Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 You can't have blind faith in tooltips. They're supposed to explain to players what an ability does, not how. QFMFT Force Barrier accomplishes its perceived immunity by granting the caster so much defense/resistance that no incoming attack will land. What BambulaGTS is saying is spot on. If there's "always a 5% chance to be hit", that should apply to Evasion and Force Barrier too, but I don't know of anyone who's ever seen that happen. I don't buy it. This really needs to be addressed. What is the current intended mechanic? Was there a stealth change to the intended mechanic a while back? Is there a bug or is it working as intended? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NogueiraA Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 While I deplore abilities not working correctly, stating that it is breaking the current PVP build is laughable... Do these OP sin/shad think they are the only ones with DFCD not working? Open a ticket in game and post in the bug forum... So, you're saying that your toon has some broke defensive cooldowns too? How this is not a gamebreak? Why don't you help the players instead of saying that sin or shadow are OP? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sithloardbob Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 all i have to say is, it happens several time a game on huttball.... and ive personally been sapped through shroud and so has grezecka.... if its intended to work this way its dumb and needs to be different Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cycao Posted July 11, 2013 Share Posted July 11, 2013 I can say sure sure that shroud worked flawless prior to 1.4. After that patch knock backs seem to bypass shroud. I still get stunned through with electrocute and the occasional flash bang but knock backs happen often. I also play one of the weakest specs in the game so yes I rely on this ability often and it sucks when it fails. I keep seeing the tool tip get brought up and that it only offers 100% chance to resist and accuracy and what not but as I said this was a non issue prior to 1.4 and all of a sudden players must be stacking accuracy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L-RANDLE Posted July 11, 2013 Share Posted July 11, 2013 It doesn't win/lose the game when you take an extra shot from a sniper. It loses the game when a node guard gets flashed through shroud. You've confirmed that you have little to no clue about the competitive (I use that word loosely in regards to what Bioware has given us) part of this game. No.. It means I know how the game mechanics work. Force Shroud has no immunity mezzes. He situationally broke without full resolve and got flashed. On top of that, Flash is not even classified as a force or tech attack, so there is no roll in the "chance to hit" calc of accuracy/resistance. Dare I say L2Understandmechanics/L2P? You would think the Bastion elite would know these basic things....... smh inb4 I get flamed for that one; tongue/cheek And yes, if a sniper get a takedown through that prevents me from preventing a node cap, then it has just as much "value" as something like this, but at least in my Guardian's case, its a verifiable bug. I have posted in this forum and others about it, but not once did I state that it breaks pvp. I can still do my job with this obvious bug (in addition to leap), and it does not prevent me from playing. Sensationalize all you want, but I already called Kimberly-Clark to issue new boxes of Kleenex shaped like R2D2 for these situations. gamechanging ≠ gamebreaking oh and this: But sins are on a whole other level of importance Have a good day!! So, you're saying that your toon has some broke defensive cooldowns too? How this is not a gamebreak? Why don't you help the players instead of saying that sin or shadow are OP? See above. Its annoying as hell but calling it "gamebreaking" is laughable. I am more than sure every class has similar issues and regardless of when it happens, the fact that it does is an issue. I stated that I deplore the lack of acknowledgement of such things, but this one is lol. I am more than willing to post about ingame issues, and most people here know I post many of things meant to be somewhat lighthearted that people take the wrong way. It's a curse I live with... All of L-Randle's posts are nonsense, and I'm completely convinced he's a solo-que warrior who hasn't played a single Ranked game. So when did BW give you clairvoyance to see stats on players from other servers? I find your lack of faith disturbing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vikassi Posted July 11, 2013 Share Posted July 11, 2013 Out of all the things wrong with this game, you pick force shroud? QQ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JP_Legatus Posted July 11, 2013 Share Posted July 11, 2013 (edited) Its not a bug its working as intended. Weather we like it or not is a different story. Accuracy decreases ppls defenses EG If I have 105% accuracy and hit someone with 20% defense the target has effectively 15% defense (read the tool tip) the same with force tech accuracy. If i have 105% Force accuracy and someone hits shroud they have 100% resist so their EFFECTIVE resist is 95%. thats the 5% chance to bypass shroud First of all, shroud gives you 200% to your resist so regardless how much extra accuracy you have there is no ability that should bypass the shroud mechanic, ever. So EVEN IF the scoundrel healer had 200% accuracy, which he doesn't (healers use the base 90-95%), it wouldn't bypass shroud anyways (200-100 = still 100% immunity). This doesn't even take into account natural base dodge/resist chances. Second, here's a list of abilities that work properly and are similar in effect to shroud: Evasion (though it's not total immunity it's just 100% dodge) Blade turning (Jugg passive that makes saber ward work like evasion for 2s) Force barrier Hydraulic overrides Covered escape Entrench Fadeout (sorc talent that adds immunity onto force speed) Saber reflect (doesn't grant effect immunity but I've never seen reflect fail to reflect the damage) Unstoppable (jugg immunity talent) I was legitimately surprised and slightly raged when the dev response was a bunch of ******** about how abilities always work 5% of the time even if you have immunity. I have never heard of any of these other abilities having problems, EVER. What a load of garbage. Edited July 11, 2013 by JP_Legatus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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