schranz Posted July 6, 2013 Share Posted July 6, 2013 (edited) Hi all,.. so i tried to see what would happen if i just sugested to have us in PVP gear bolstered in ops just like they do with the PVE gear in warzones,.. Just for the record i think it would be a horrible idea just as bad as PVP being bolstered,..but hey i just had to see how they responded as they seemed to litter the PVP forums with utter B-crap that PVP is all about skill and we shouldnt have a gear difference,..if that is what EA wants with this game then il go play LOL they do that better tbh,.. but,..i want gear , i want to be able to work hard and get gear that yes i admit gives me an edge over someone who has never set foot in a wz (other then knowing tactics ofc) Just look at their responses, some jewels like" PVP is a minigame worth 0,5% of the game" Double standards galore,.. read and laugh at the people defending their right to have their cake and eat it too,.. http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=658041 Edited July 6, 2013 by schranz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timadan Posted July 6, 2013 Share Posted July 6, 2013 Bolster for pvp isn't necessarily about pver's being able to pvp. The purpose is to level the playing field between those who have nothing but hours to sit and grind gear and those who's real life work and commitments only give them a very small window of time to play. I would imagine though that you op are one of those who gets a big hard on rofl stomping people who don't have any gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polymerize Posted July 6, 2013 Share Posted July 6, 2013 Bolster for pvp isn't necessarily about pver's being able to pvp. The purpose is to level the playing field between those who have nothing but hours to sit and grind gear and those who's real life work and commitments only give them a very small window of time to play. I would imagine though that you op are one of those who gets a big hard on rofl stomping people who don't have any gear. All of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schranz Posted July 6, 2013 Author Share Posted July 6, 2013 I think that having free PVP starter gear sent to you would be good enough, if people where not stupid enough to sell it , MMO's are not and never will be about even playingfield. If that was the case PVE players wouldnt be elitist in their choice of tanks and healers. If i want a game where everyone gets the same stats i would play an FPS or so , in my opinion MMO PVP is about skill for a big part yes, but also about min/maxing your gear and working hard at obtaining said gear to be better at playing the role you chose. How can you justify that a piece that takes a week of farming to get has lower stats then something you buy of the GTN after doing one set of daylies on Makeb? Maybe i'm wrong and thats how this game should be but then i know a lot of true MMO PVP-ers,..the ones who like to do some effort to become better geared, will move on to a game that actually gives a **** about them and not only about their youtube reinactors Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schranz Posted July 6, 2013 Author Share Posted July 6, 2013 And ofc i should roflstomp players without gear,..imagine getting into the ring with a heavyweight boxer who has trained all his life, yes he knows what to do better then you (tactics) but he will probably be in far better shape and hit harder (gear) then you. What would you ask of in that situation? to have him blindfolded,..as your small window of opurtunity to train leaves you in a disadvantage? There is pre 55 PVP, basicly if you have the time to level a 55 character you could have geared too, be it in the leveling process by saving coms or by gearing your character. As you have the time to level, you should have the time to gear too.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timadan Posted July 6, 2013 Share Posted July 6, 2013 The recruit set was absolute garbage. Any free set would have to be very close to on par with partisan gear that was not augmented. In which case the 'pros' would cry that they had to 'work so very hard' for basically the same gear that was given to the how do you call them oh yeah 'care bears'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schranz Posted July 6, 2013 Author Share Posted July 6, 2013 Why should you get a free partisan set? Augment the free stuff then to close the gap...Where is my free basic coms gear so i can get into ops without working towards it. The logic is just missing, if you want to perform then work for your gear like you do in ehm,.i dont know PVE maybe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timadan Posted July 6, 2013 Share Posted July 6, 2013 I don't do ops, I don't do flash points. I barely have time to try and complete my daily pvp missions a couple of times per week. The thing is in that limited time I have to play I like to compete against other players not artificial intelligence in scripted instances. My sub money is as good as yours, why should I have to play at a disadvantage because I have to work 60 hours a week, and still take care of my family? If you have the time to grind up a full set of augmented conq gear you have the time to go through all the scripted progression that is pve. Also they are right you know, we are a mini game in this game, if you doubt that just look at the content releases. Number of flash points, ops, mission arks etc versus the amount of pvp released content. The thing is most (not all) hard core pvp'ers for some reason have the egotistical view that the game revolves around them. I'd like to sit here and continue this banter, however I have a 2.5 acre yard that needs cut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timadan Posted July 6, 2013 Share Posted July 6, 2013 The one thing I will add though on my way out the door is this. Bolster does not belong in Rated Play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schranz Posted July 6, 2013 Author Share Posted July 6, 2013 If they would remove bolster from rated play i would be so happy, or maybe they could give us level 72 gear but with expertise, so that we can aug it for PVE if we like and make expertise augs so you can aug your PVE gear, it wouldnt be as good as auged PVP gear of the same level for PVP and the PVE gear would be BiS when augmented too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarielle Posted July 6, 2013 Share Posted July 6, 2013 And ofc i should roflstomp players without gear,..imagine getting into the ring with a heavyweight boxer who has trained all his life, yes he knows what to do better then you (tactics) but he will probably be in far better shape and hit harder (gear) then you. What would you ask of in that situation? to have him blindfolded,..as your small window of opurtunity to train leaves you in a disadvantage? There is pre 55 PVP, basicly if you have the time to level a 55 character you could have geared too, be it in the leveling process by saving coms or by gearing your character. As you have the time to level, you should have the time to gear too.... Worst analogy ever. All professional sports set limits on what kind of gear competitors can wear. IE, a goalie in hockey can't wear shinpads that are 3 feet wide and cover the whole net. They ban certain substances that give an unfair advantage (albeit, much of this is poorly enforced). What they don't/can't limit is experience, smarts, natural talent and conditioning, which is the MMO equivalent of practicing and getting better at your class/learning other classes. A boxer doesn't hit harder because of what he's wearing, he hits harder because he trained (practiced) and knows what kind of punch to throw when, and where (learning his class/other classes). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cycao Posted July 6, 2013 Share Posted July 6, 2013 Bolster for pvp isn't necessarily about pver's being able to pvp. The purpose is to level the playing field between those who have nothing but hours to sit and grind gear and those who's real life work and commitments only give them a very small window of time to play. I would imagine though that you op are one of those who gets a big hard on rofl stomping people who don't have any gear. I could say the same thing about pve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarielle Posted July 6, 2013 Share Posted July 6, 2013 I could say the same thing about pve. PvE is cooperative, not competitive. Someone else I'm playing with having super gear can only HELP me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cycao Posted July 6, 2013 Share Posted July 6, 2013 PvE is cooperative, not competitive. Someone else I'm playing with having super gear can only HELP me. And PvP is not cooperative??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarielle Posted July 6, 2013 Share Posted July 6, 2013 And PvP is not cooperative??? Don't be coy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cycao Posted July 6, 2013 Share Posted July 6, 2013 Don't be coy. Don't be narrow minded. Everything you said is dead to rights the same as PvP. One requires gear (pve) one requires on the fly skill (pvp), both are cooperative and both are competitive (hello world first and blah blah blah deh took er jobs). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarielle Posted July 6, 2013 Share Posted July 6, 2013 Don't be narrow minded. Everything you said is dead to rights the same as PvP. One requires gear (pve) one requires on the fly skill (pvp), both are cooperative and both are competitive (hello world first and blah blah blah deh took er jobs). There is no direct competition between players for world firsts. World First Group 2 can't somehow make the PvE content harder for World First Group 1 by what they', Group 2, are wearing. Thus, don't be coy. Honestly though, I think gear grinds are stupid regardless of the medium (PvP OR PvE), so I'd be totally fine making only skill the emphasis on PvE as well. Gear gates only separate the community. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schranz Posted July 7, 2013 Author Share Posted July 7, 2013 Then they should remove expertise and make level 72 gear available through pvp, it should be harder to get then partisan ofc, that way you have 2 paths to achieve the same level of gear. But bolstering one type of gear only isnt leveling the playingfield at all. It just caters to one type of player having the best of both worlds. I can handle it when someone who has worked hard to get the highest tier of raidgear is on par with the highest pvp gear, i dont however want to be forced to raid to get the bis gear. But what really gets to me is that if i play warzones for days/weeks to get partisan gear i still get lesser stats then with crafted weapons of level 53. Bolster is broken, please remove it in its current form Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MidichIorian Posted July 7, 2013 Share Posted July 7, 2013 (edited) Bolster for pvp isn't necessarily about pver's being able to pvp. The purpose is to level the playing field between those who have nothing but hours to sit and grind gear and those who's real life work and commitments only give them a very small window of time to play. I would imagine though that you op are one of those who gets a big hard on rofl stomping people who don't have any gear.News flash, this affects everything in life. Do you expect to instantly gain 30 lbs of muscle the second you enter a gym or become the best in a sport the moment you sign up? And you seem to be forgetting that it took those with time on their hands the exact same (active) amount of time to gear up. It's not like you get the gear for free just because you can play 100 hours per week. So one guy has a rough time over the course of two days while someone with less time has it spread over four weeks, on behalf of not being able to spend full days on it. In the end they've played the same amount of warzones (actually, the guy who only plays a little each week probably has the faster grind since it will include more weeklies). Hence, it has nothing to do with it being "unfair", it's just a question of entitlement and wanting things for free and it's ruining things for those who actually have time to play a lot. So how about this, if you don't have a lot of time on your hands, realize that it isnt a hobby for you instead of trying to change the system to fit your needs. MMO'es have a history of involving grinds so I'm not saying that just because I happen to find the time. I didnt sign up just so that some carebears could turn it into some insta-reward game. If you only have ten minutes to play every now and then, on behalf of other things being more important, then I suggest that you spend it on something more productive. Or play a FPS where you can just jump in and be on equal footing with the rest. Edited July 7, 2013 by MidichIorian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schranz Posted July 7, 2013 Author Share Posted July 7, 2013 That is so true haha i love the gym analogy i love going to the gym like 4 -5 days a week but if i would stop growing muscle i wouldnt think it would be fun and i dont think i would go anymore. I wantthat carrot at the end of the stick, i think most people would quit their jobs if they wouldnt get paid too. Everything in life is about input vs reward Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperGrunt Posted July 7, 2013 Share Posted July 7, 2013 And PvP is not cooperative??? Have you ever played a match of PVP in this game? For real? No one co-operates, they don't read chat, and heaven forbid someone suggests a strategy that will win a match, they get flamed more than a hamburger at a Burger King that is burning to the ground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schranz Posted July 7, 2013 Author Share Posted July 7, 2013 so the fact that i drive at 300kmh means that there is no speedlimit? Or try beating a 8 player premade with a pug and still say its not about teamplay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperGrunt Posted July 7, 2013 Share Posted July 7, 2013 If they would remove bolster from rated play i would be so happy, or maybe they could give us level 72 gear but with expertise, so that we can aug it for PVE if we like and make expertise augs so you can aug your PVE gear, it wouldnt be as good as auged PVP gear of the same level for PVP and the PVE gear would be BiS when augmented too. I agree with you 100%, Bolster should be removed from Ranked, don't get me wrong, it was hilarious the one time my guild actually queued for Ranked and won, but seriously no just no, ranked should be geared vs geared. I also think that they need to add another tier of PVP gear, and would also rather that they separate groups and solo queues in unranked WZs. Although I suspect I have a better chance of watching a pig grow wings and fly than of BioWare admitting the screwed the pooch by adding Bolster to Ranked, or allowing 2 Premades to ROFLStomp 8 PUGs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helig Posted July 7, 2013 Share Posted July 7, 2013 (edited) Bolster for pvp isn't necessarily about pver's being able to pvp. The purpose is to level the playing field between those who have nothing but hours to sit and grind gear and those who's real life work and commitments only give them a very small window of time to play. I would imagine though that you op are one of those who gets a big hard on rofl stomping people who don't have any gear. You're making excuses. I have 1 fulltime and 1 part-time jobs, write articles and practice sports in my spare time, and devote time to my girl. And I have 2 mains decked out in optimized Conquerer (ok, 1 optimized, second has some Partisan enhancements). It's not as much about the amount of time that you have but how efficiently you use it. That said, I do welcome Bolster, and I think that it's a great addition, because the lack of gear no longer discourages new players, and actual player experience and skill become greater factors then how much someone spent grinding. However, this does not mean that Bolster is perfect and does not have anywhere to grow. I don't think it should bolster the stats, per say, but should normalize them, without touching the PvP parts. Ergo, if you have grade 31 PvE pieces, they get toned down to grade 27X, and given appropriate Expertise. Worth mentioning that the OP's tone in both threads could use improvement. Edited July 7, 2013 by Helig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schranz Posted July 7, 2013 Author Share Posted July 7, 2013 I wish you worked at bioware:), they must really hate PVP there,.. maybe they will replace it with a pazaak minigame where you have to buy your cards on the cartel market Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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