abhaxus Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 It is poor because there is no communication about a gameplay type a significant portion of the subscriber base plays exclusively. The fact that people are on here trolling saying they don't believe novare corner capping or /stuck exist is probably even worse than the lack of communication from the devs. People make me sad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilora Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 I think its less about them actually saying stuff about things and more about they are not adressing some of the more serious issues. Sure with transfers coming into the forefront the posts are gonna be about FAQs and that nonsense. New stuff will always get attention. HOWEVER There are issues that have been around for awhile now and are being swept under the rug and we want to hear more about them. Maybe I'm just giving Eric too much of a benefit of the doubt. . . But, when he says "I'll keep you updated." or "I have no more information at this time." I tend to believe him. Maybe it's because I understand PR, and essentially, Eric is a PR rep. Even still, I don't think issues are being "swept under the rug." I think the team probably has a larger backlog of bugs than could be fixed in the next 5 years -- and they keep adding new bugs into the mix. If you had to prioritize them, what would you do? Fix the new bug that thousands are complaining about, or fix the old one that has almost been forgotten? Definitely not OK to have to "live" with bugs -- but it makes sense. They can't fix them all, and they can't handle the workload given to them. I just hope, for the future, that EA realizes you have to continuously pump money into an MMO for it to be prosperous. You can't just give it a small budget, and say "Here! Keep this thing afloat as long as you can. Try to throw em a few bones!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesDeuce Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 They made a post about having more communication, but that lasted for about a week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yodawizard Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 (edited) Maybe I'm just giving Eric too much of a benefit of the doubt. . . But, when he says "I'll keep you updated." or "I have no more information at this time." I tend to believe him. Maybe it's because I understand PR, and essentially, Eric is a PR rep. Even still, I don't think issues are being "swept under the rug." I think the team probably has a larger backlog of bugs than could be fixed in the next 5 years -- and they keep adding new bugs into the mix. If you had to prioritize them, what would you do? Fix the new bug that thousands are complaining about, or fix the old one that has almost been forgotten? Definitely not OK to have to "live" with bugs -- but it makes sense. They can't fix them all, and they can't handle the workload given to them. I just hope, for the future, that EA realizes you have to continuously pump money into an MMO for it to be prosperous. You can't just give it a small budget, and say "Here! Keep this thing afloat as long as you can. Try to throw em a few bones!" So you have gone from saying "there are no bugs" to "they cant fix them all". Why not, why can they not fix them all? Sure updates will probably introduce new bugs, but why not then fix those bugs before releasing new ones on top of them? I would be plenty patient if their known issues list actually reflected what bugs exist and that they crossed bugs off as they went through patch cycles but that isn't the case. They introduce new bugs on top of existing over and over. If they keep this cycle going the way they are in a time not so distant from now this game will be a bug ridden joke. Edited June 4, 2013 by Yodawizard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uaintjak Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 If based off of the previous community team, then yes this team is outstanding. Could it be better? Sure, but it is much better than last year. A slightly larger turd is still a turd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jadescythe Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 So you have gone from saying "there are no bugs" to "they cant fix them all". Why not, why can they not fix them all? Sure updates will probably introduce new bugs, but why not then fix those bugs before releasing new ones on top of them? I would be plenty patient if their known issues list actually reflected what bugs exist and that they crossed bugs off as they went through patch cycles but that isn't the case. They introduce new bugs on top of existing over and over. If they keep this cycle going the way they are in a time not so distant from now this game will be a bug ridden joke. They can't cross any off the list because they're never gone. The misfiring GCD bug got fixed in 2.0... right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilora Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 (edited) So you have gone from saying "there are no bugs" to "they cant fix them all". Why not, why can they not fix them all? Sure updates were probably introduce new bugs, but why not then fix those bugs before releasing new ones on top of them? I would be plenty patient if their known issues list actually reflected what bugs exist and that they crossed bugs off as they went through patch cycles but that isn't the case. They introduce new bugs on top of existing over and over. If they keep this cycle going the way they are in a time not so distant from now this game will be a bug ridden joke. Where on earth did I say there are no bugs? Because I've NEVER made that claim. I said the "gamebreaking" issues you claim exist, I've never witnessed. And, upon other people explaining some issues -- I pointed out that most of the ARE NOT gamebreaking. There are some major bugs, yes -- but they aren't gamebreaking. You really think you'd be patient? If they spend the next 4 months doing nothing but fixing bugs, do you realize how many people would leave? And would you really stay playing the game, with absolutely nothing but bug fixes? Funny, almost every single patch I've seen has fixed a good portion of bugs. In fact, we recently had an entire patch dedicated to bug-fixes, with a rather lengthy patchnotes. They ARE fixing them. And, for the most part they've fixed more than they release. But, they are still going so slowly that, if we want to see any type of new content in this game, they have to ignore a large chunk, or make us wait 4+ months without a single update. They can't cross any off the list because they're never gone. The misfiring GCD bug got fixed in 2.0... right? Yep! They've NEVER fixed bugs. We certainly haven't seen lists of bug fixes in every patch. Like companion window issue? Definitely not fixed. Issues disappear. Just because they aren't being fixed quickly, or the ones you care most about aren't fixed yet, doesn't mean they aren't ever gone. Edited June 4, 2013 by Kilora Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistols Posted June 4, 2013 Author Share Posted June 4, 2013 I can tell you if I was in his position I would either be fired by now or there would be more communication because I would not sit back idly waiting for devs to talk to me. Yeah, who knows though, maybe Gabe will come in and brief us! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yodawizard Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 They can't cross any off the list because they're never gone. The misfiring GCD bug got fixed in 2.0... right? Exactly, it is getting to the point I can't even remember all the bugs that are annoying me every day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yodawizard Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Yeah, who knows though, maybe Gabe will come in and brief us! Dear pvp community. Cartel market blah blah blah blah blah , taun tauns blah blah blah blah, RPing is fun, blah blah blah, Austin Peckinbaugh is busy! blah blah blah, no pvp updates for 3 more years, SORRY! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yodawizard Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Where on earth did I say there are no bugs? Because I've NEVER made that claim. I said the "gamebreaking" issues you claim exist, I've never witnessed. And, upon other people explaining some issues -- I pointed out that most of the ARE NOT gamebreaking. There are some major bugs, yes -- but they aren't gamebreaking. You really think you'd be patient? If they spend the next 4 months doing nothing but fixing bugs, do you realize how many people would leave? And would you really stay playing the game, with absolutely nothing but bug fixes? Funny, almost every single patch I've seen has fixed a good portion of bugs. In fact, we recently had an entire patch dedicated to bug-fixes, with a rather lengthy patchnotes. They ARE fixing them. And, for the most part they've fixed more than they release. But, they are still going so slowly that, if we want to see any type of new content in this game, they have to ignore a large chunk, or make us wait 4+ months without a single update. Yep! They've NEVER fixed bugs. We certainly haven't seen lists of bug fixes in every patch. Like companion window issue? Definitely not fixed. Issues disappear. Just because they aren't being fixed quickly, or the ones you care most about aren't fixed yet, doesn't mean they aren't ever gone. Yes I would be patient, if they had a bug fix priority list, and gradually checked off bugs as patches were released I would be patient. Their known issues list does not represent known issues. They are systematically ignoring issues that have been around since launch and not ever addressing them. I am not asking for all bugs to be fixed within 4 months. I have been playing this game since launch and I am in it for the long haul, I want to see systems in place to fix known bugs that have existed since launch. I want to see communication from the devs and community team about why changes are being made and where this game is headed. I want to see them care about this game as much as I do, sue me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
islander Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 (edited) I can tell you if I was in his position I would either be fired by now or there would be more communication because I would not sit back idly waiting for devs to talk to me. You'd be fired then. Not trolling either. You can only vote with your wallet at this point. Makes me angry too... Edited June 4, 2013 by islander Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jadescythe Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Yep! They've NEVER fixed bugs. We certainly haven't seen lists of bug fixes in every patch. Like companion window issue? Definitely not fixed. Issues disappear. Just because they aren't being fixed quickly, or the ones you care most about aren't fixed yet, doesn't mean they aren't ever gone. You realize I was being sarcastic and the GCD bug happens all the time... right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yodawizard Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 You'd be fired then. Not trolling either. I completely agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Well I can't put that on him with fact, as I'm not sure what he is/isn't told by the team, lol. Could be they throw arrows to his knees when he asks for some clarification! I think it would be awesome if there were "Go to people" for each gameplay aspect. I hate pinning this on Eric, cause I'm sure he's trolling all sub-forums trying to help...but I do believe he's overwhelmed...I dunno just an opinion. Maybe Andryah could apply for the job, heard she knows a lot about the game! I agree with this. Eric does a phenomenal job communicating imo. Given what we've had in the past vs. what we have with him, the amount of information we're getting is borderline absurd. When he can post information, he seems to. When an issue is called to their attention, he seems to respond. We may not like all he tells us, it may not be as fast as many of us wish it were, but I truly believe he's the best CM we've had and I think we're fortunate to have him working to get us info. Don't shoot the messenger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenaZane Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 (edited) Where on earth did I say there are no bugs? Because I've NEVER made that claim. I said the "gamebreaking" issues you claim exist, I've never witnessed. And, upon other people explaining some issues -- I pointed out that most of the ARE NOT gamebreaking. There are some major bugs, yes -- but they aren't gamebreaking. You really think you'd be patient? If they spend the next 4 months doing nothing but fixing bugs, do you realize how many people would leave? And would you really stay playing the game, with absolutely nothing but bug fixes? Funny, almost every single patch I've seen has fixed a good portion of bugs. In fact, we recently had an entire patch dedicated to bug-fixes, with a rather lengthy patchnotes. They ARE fixing them. And, for the most part they've fixed more than they release. But, they are still going so slowly that, if we want to see any type of new content in this game, they have to ignore a large chunk, or make us wait 4+ months without a single update.. Companions being desummoned bug- 3+ months Crash to Desktop- 2+ months Random invites from strangers-3+ months Mail bugs and attatchment bugs- 4+months GCD bugs-4+months Crash to desktop when /stucking- 2+ months Shall I continue? BTW I have also filed reports with the EXACT things that lead to said bugs happening. This helps them pinpoint what is going on when bugs happen. I have barely gotten responses to any of these, Edited June 4, 2013 by SenaZane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yodawizard Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 I agree with this. Eric does a phenomenal job communicating imo. Given what we've had in the past vs. what we have with him, the amount of information we're getting is borderline absurd. When he can post information, he seems to. When an issue is called to their attention, he seems to respond. We may not like all he tells us, it may not be as fast as many of us wish it were, but I truly believe he's the best CM we've had and I think we're fortunate to have him working to get us info. Don't shoot the messenger. I agree that he is the best CM we have had for SWTOR, I have played other MMOs and had far better CMs and what felt like a much more direct line to the community team and devs as a result when I played DAOC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ELRunninW Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 There are some MAJOR issues atm in the game PvP wise, some would even call them game-breaking. Some would call problems with Raven's armor game breaking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rankyn Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 This again? It's not that they aren't communicating... it's that they aren't telling YOU what YOU want to hear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenaZane Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 (edited) This again? It's not that they aren't communicating... it's that they aren't telling YOU what YOU want to hear. Yes god forbid we want our game fixed. God forbid we want to hear informaton about issues regarding some of the more severe bugs and exploits being worked on. I don't think anyone here (I know I havent) has really said they aren't communicating and you are absolutely right. It isnt what WE want to hear because WE would rather hear about things more important things than the color of the next taun taun! I have too many of those things btw... Anyone care to open up a pet rescue with me on POT5? Pistols I know you would. Edited June 4, 2013 by SenaZane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilora Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Companions being desummoned bug- 3+ months Crash to Desktop- 2+ months Random invites from strangers-3+ months Mail bugs and attatchment bugs- 4+months GCD bugs-4+months Crash to desktop when /stucking- 2+ months Shall I continue? BTW I have also filed reports with the EXACT things that lead to said bugs happening. This helps them pinpoint what is going on when bugs happen. I have barely gotten responses to any of these, What are you getting at? I've never said there aren't any bugs. And, the Companion bug and CTD during hyperspace are the only issues from this I've ever experienced in-game, so I can't speak to it being "gamebreaking." Believe it or not, bug fixes aren't simple. People can claim all they want that they are simple, and they've given the devs enough information -- but that doesn't mean squat. As I've pointed out numerous times, we clearly have a Dev team that isn't experienced with MMOs -- or even seasoned programmers. We've seen some stupid bugs. We've seen a sad excuse for QA. None of that means they are ignoring it -- it means they aren't capable of doing the job as well as they should be. Obviously, us complaining about it isn't changing anything. Unless they hire better devs/leads, and/or expand the team, I don't think we will see any improvements to pace or quality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistols Posted June 4, 2013 Author Share Posted June 4, 2013 Some would call problems with Raven's armor game breaking. And I think it should be fixed of course, but that issue doesn't hinder PvP or PvE (maybe roleplay I guess). But yeah I've seen this come-up often enough, and do hope that it gets attention ASAP. This again? It's not that they aren't communicating... it's that they aren't telling YOU what YOU want to hear. Yeah, that's it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yodawizard Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 What are you getting at? I've never said there aren't any bugs. And, the Companion bug and CTD during hyperspace are the only issues from this I've ever experienced in-game, so I can't speak to it being "gamebreaking." Believe it or not, bug fixes aren't simple. People can claim all they want that they are simple, and they've given the devs enough information -- but that doesn't mean squat. As I've pointed out numerous times, we clearly have a Dev team that isn't experienced with MMOs -- or even seasoned programmers. We've seen some stupid bugs. We've seen a sad excuse for QA. None of that means they are ignoring it -- it means they aren't capable of doing the job as well as they should be. Obviously, us complaining about it isn't changing anything. Unless they hire better devs/leads, and/or expand the team, I don't think we will see any improvements to pace or quality. I don't think anyone thinks these issues are easy to fix, that doesn't mean we will accept them being ignored completely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilora Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 I don't think anyone thinks these issues are easy to fix, that doesn't mean we will accept them being ignored completely. And I'm trying to get you to understand. . .. We have absolutely no way of knowing they are being ignored. Same as we have absolutely no way of knowing they aren't being ignored. Silence =\= ignored. While not communicating isn't a great thing -- it doesn't mean they aren't actively working on the issues, and it doesn't mean they aren't aware they exist. Occams Razor. To me, it appears the most likely reality is that >-- Devs aren't capable of fixing these in a reasonable time frame, so they get bumped way down the priority list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jadescythe Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 And I'm trying to get you to understand. . .. We have absolutely no way of knowing they are being ignored. Same as we have absolutely no way of knowing they aren't being ignored. Silence =\= ignored. While not communicating isn't a great thing -- it doesn't mean they aren't actively working on the issues, and it doesn't mean they aren't aware they exist. Occams Razor. To me, it appears the most likely reality is that >-- Devs aren't capable of fixing these in a reasonable time frame, so they get bumped way down the priority list. The reality is, they should hire more people or better people so that they are fixed in a reasonable timeframe. And definitely shouldn't hide behind the "not releasing it before it's perfect" clause when there is plenty that was released imperfectly simply because they thought it was necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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