So what did BW get RIGHT? Hard to tell.

[Inhalcator]

If you really want to stay with it, fine.

 

Most people eat at a restaurant once. If it's bad they certainly won't come back. If it happens to be really good they just might. First impressions are all-important in the gaming industry as well. Right now the first impression of TOR anyone with a bit of experience in the field might get isn't very good. Solid, but not good enough to pay for on a regular basis.

 

That's really my only point. The OP doesn't like the game. Bummer for him. Others do. Yay for us.

 

He shouldn't try to change my Taco Bell into a Dell Taco. I like Taco Bell.

Edited December 21, 2011 by Inhalcator

[Beatmiser]

Right now the first impression of TOR anyone with a bit of experience in the field might get isn't very good. Solid, but not good enough to pay for on a regular basis.

 

Funny, the group I've played with and people who I know are having a really good time. I think you might want to take your generalization of MMO vets elsewhere.

 

Seriously, I'm having fun... that makes me a fanboy? I don't like Florence and the Machine, but my girlfriend does. Does that make her a fangirl? If she tells me I should like the music and I tell her why I think it's crap- does that make her enjoyment of it any less valid?

 

I think some of you are so eager to have people agree with you that you are avoiding reality which is... for most of us playing, it's just a game, something we do for fun. When we stop having fun, we'll do something else.

[Baizak]

Anyone that uses the term casual, hardcore, fanboy, hater, etc... is not worth arguing with. They are incapable of formulating an original thought, and just regurgitate what they read on various and sundries blogs written by people that do not know their elbow from their ear.

 

They are not able to back up anything they say and when you call them out or disagree with them they resort to the name calling.

[Billabus]

First of all this game isn't a MMO, it's a SP game with some MP aspects and heavy instancing, on par with Guild Wars if not worse.

 

- Terrible controls: Clunky, unresponsive and heavy.

Where are you seeing this ? I have NO problems moving around in PvE or PvP. Mouse, keyboard and buttons very responsive.

 

- Everything is instanced to an extreme.

Having more than 1 copy of a zone is just good sense

 

- Terrible graphics: Lack of options too.

I personally don’t have a problem with the graphics. MMO can’t have detailed graphics of a SP game. Too many users with mid to low range systems. You have to strike a happy medium. Don’t even try the good system or get out argument. People have lives, families and bills and a high end rig does not become a priority

 

- No mod support: Recount etc is a must for end game content. However seeing PvE in this game is faceroll I guess it's not needed.

Thank you, BW for no mods ! Recount is a must is laughable. Recruit the player. If you know he is good by playing with him then end game takes care of itself. I wonder how high you have played to say that PvE is faceroll. You must not be playing the same 40+ level game I am.

 

- Companions are silly, why not make the character more powerful instead.

They add an element of immersion as well as being there so you don’t have to grind missions/

 

- NO DR in PvP: ROFL!

I presume you mean damage reduction ? Why do you need it ? That bad at it that you need a crutch

 

- No PvP brackets: 50's just dominate all.

As it should be. I vote for no PvP until 50

 

- No combat tab: Big ***?

YAY! Means no addons for epeen stroking

 

- Broken loot system: Anyone can need on anything, even if they can't use it.

THIS I agree with. Hopefully 1st patch fix ?

 

- Can't pick another advanced tree without leveling.

Pick another ? You only get 1 advanced class at 10. How is this a problem ?

 

- No LFG system - Spamming chat while also being in an instanced area.

LFG ruined WoW. The wisdom of BW to not allow it. Learn to play well with others.

 

- Terrible UI: Can't hide not used icon slots.

Truth. UI is aweful

 

- No target of target

Truth. 1st patch fix I pray

 

- Targeting is **** and placement of targets icon is even worse.

Target icon to right of bars ? Are you unable to look at it ? Pretty big icon

 

- Terrible in game map: Cant zoom or do anything

LOL yes you can.

 

- No UI scaling, actually pretty much no UI options at all.

True but they are working on it

 

- Terrible AH UI: Need I say more?

True. Dunno if they are working on this.

 

- 50's already with faceroll endgame raids.

50s yes. Faceroll endgame raids ? documentation of this please or shut up

 

 

Most if not all of these things are TOTALLY unacceptable, especially for a 2012 release.

This is BW’s vanilla. Things will improve with patches. The beauty of the MMO

 

Makes me wonder *** the beta was for? So many elementary things are broken, it's mind blowing.

Then why are you playing if you did not like beta ? you should have cancelled your preorder and not looked back.

[Alkiii]

If you really want to stay with it, fine.

 

Most people eat at a restaurant once. If it's bad they certainly won't come back. If it happens to be really good they just might. First impressions are all-important in the gaming industry as well. Right now the first impression of TOR anyone with a bit of experience in the field might get isn't very good. Solid, but not good enough to pay for on a regular basis.

 

I can assure you I've been around gaming much longer than 99% of the people on this planet. I purchased a Sears Pong system back in 1977 for my kids (followed by an Atari 2600, Colecovision and an Intellivision gaming console). I have played every MMO extensively since 1997. I think I have a bit of experience in the field. Don't you think?

 

My impression is a good one. It's solid and not only is it good enough to pay for on a regular basis, but it's good enough that I pay for 4 accounts for my family to play on a regular basis.

 

So quit making blanket statements and false assumptions. You do not speak for me, nor do you speak for the majority.

[FerrusPA]

That's really my only point. The OP doesn't like the game. Bummer for him. Others do. Yay for us.

 

People like the OP are paying customers too. Alienate enough of them and the game is dead on arrival. Something a lot of hardcore TOR apologists don't seem to grasp.

Edited December 21, 2011 by FerrusPA

[JustinxDuff]

Ctrl+t = target of target. Look at the damn key bindings ya dingus!

[FerrusPA]

So quit making blanket statements and false assumptions. You do not speak for me, nor do you speak for the majority.

 

But you do?

[Inhalcator]

People like the OP are paying customers too. Alienate enough of them and the game is dead on arrival. Something a lot of hardcore TOR apologists don't seem to grasp.

 

So make changes to satisfy the people having hissy fits on the forums and risk alienating the paying customers that are currently pleased?

 

I take it you are not a parent

 

Edit: APOLOGIST?! That is laughable. I'm not apologizing for crap. I like the game. It is fun. That word implies I am making excuses for something BioWare did wrong. Incorrect usage.

Edited December 21, 2011 by Inhalcator

[islander]

Ctrl+t = target of target. Look at the damn key bindings ya dingus!

 

yup!!

[Aloro]

Right now the first impression of TOR anyone with a bit of experience in the field might get isn't very good. Solid, but not good enough to pay for on a regular basis.

 

I completely disagree.

 

Try to limit your views to yourself; you don't speak for anyone else. YOU aren't impressed with the game; ok. That's valid.

 

Speaking only for myself, as someone who's subscribed to a dozen MMOs now and beta tested around 25... I'm really enjoying SWTOR so far. It's in need of some work, to be sure, but it has great potential. And yes, I obviously have a lot of experience in the field, but no, that doesn't mean anything when we're speaking about personal preference.

 

We can differentiate between subjective and objective judgements, which is helpful. So e.g. "The UI cannot be customized very much now; many players would prefer more control there" is a purely objective (and true) complaint. But then if you say, "This game sucks because it doesn't have damage meters" that's entirely subjective, based on your personal evaluation of damage meters. Objective judgements are a good basis for constructive criticism, while subjective judgements are a very poor basis for constructive criticism; instead they end up being rants that don't contribute anything.

 

Most people don't bother to differentiate the two, and treat subjective things as if they were objective. The OP was guilty of this in several places (e.g. "terrible graphics", "companions are silly", "broken loot system", "recount is a must for end game content" and so on). Sadly, that's not conducive to a good discussion, by and large, and is - regardless - in no sense constructive.

[iselb]

I don't understand why dedicated WoW players play other MMO's? Just to insult them...?

[Alkiii]

But you do?

 

If you had any type of reading comprehension ability you'd know that I was referring to me, only me, and no one else. It was a rebuttal to your statement of, "Right now the first impression of TOR anyone with a bit of experience in the field might get isn't very good. Solid, but not good enough to pay for on a regular basis."

 

You think that you speak for all of us who 'do' have the experience. However, you do not. Therefore my post reflected as such.

 

Quit making blanket statements please.

[slyons]

First of all this game isn't a MMO, it's a SP game with some MP aspects and heavy instancing, on par with Guild Wars if not worse.

 

- Terrible controls: Clunky, unresponsive and heavy.

Where are you seeing this ? I have NO problems moving around in PvE or PvP. Mouse, keyboard and buttons very responsive.

 

- Everything is instanced to an extreme.

Having more than 1 copy of a zone is just good sense

 

- Terrible graphics: Lack of options too.

I personally don’t have a problem with the graphics. MMO can’t have detailed graphics of a SP game. Too many users with mid to low range systems. You have to strike a happy medium. Don’t even try the good system or get out argument. People have lives, families and bills and a high end rig does not become a priority

 

- No mod support: Recount etc is a must for end game content. However seeing PvE in this game is faceroll I guess it's not needed.

Thank you, BW for no mods ! Recount is a must is laughable. Recruit the player. If you know he is good by playing with him then end game takes care of itself. I wonder how high you have played to say that PvE is faceroll. You must not be playing the same 40+ level game I am.

 

- Companions are silly, why not make the character more powerful instead.

They add an element of immersion as well as being there so you don’t have to grind missions/

 

- NO DR in PvP: ROFL!

I presume you mean damage reduction ? Why do you need it ? That bad at it that you need a crutch

 

- No PvP brackets: 50's just dominate all.

As it should be. I vote for no PvP until 50

 

- No combat tab: Big ***?

YAY! Means no addons for epeen stroking

 

- Broken loot system: Anyone can need on anything, even if they can't use it.

THIS I agree with. Hopefully 1st patch fix ?

 

- Can't pick another advanced tree without leveling.

Pick another ? You only get 1 advanced class at 10. How is this a problem ?

 

- No LFG system - Spamming chat while also being in an instanced area.

LFG ruined WoW. The wisdom of BW to not allow it. Learn to play well with others.

 

- Terrible UI: Can't hide not used icon slots.

Truth. UI is aweful

 

- No target of target

Truth. 1st patch fix I pray

 

- Targeting is **** and placement of targets icon is even worse.

Target icon to right of bars ? Are you unable to look at it ? Pretty big icon

 

- Terrible in game map: Cant zoom or do anything

LOL yes you can.

 

- No UI scaling, actually pretty much no UI options at all.

True but they are working on it

 

- Terrible AH UI: Need I say more?

True. Dunno if they are working on this.

 

- 50's already with faceroll endgame raids.

50s yes. Faceroll endgame raids ? documentation of this please or shut up

 

 

Most if not all of these things are TOTALLY unacceptable, especially for a 2012 release.

This is BW’s vanilla. Things will improve with patches. The beauty of the MMO

 

Makes me wonder *** the beta was for? So many elementary things are broken, it's mind blowing.

Then why are you playing if you did not like beta ? you should have cancelled your preorder and not looked back.

 

Thank you for saying what most of us are thinking. And to the original poster (and EVERYONE who posts like that), if you don't like the game, rather than whine and complain about it...LEAVE

[Baizak]

If you had any type of reading comprehension ability you'd know that I was referring to me, only me, and no one else. It was a rebuttal to your statement of, "Right now the first impression of TOR anyone with a bit of experience in the field might get isn't very good. Solid, but not good enough to pay for on a regular basis."

 

You think that you speak for all of us who 'do' have the experience. However, you do not. Therefore my post reflected as such.

 

Quit making blanket statements please.

 

indeed. leave your blankets on the beds people.

[Phaedrynn]

- Terrible controls: Clunky, unresponsive and heavy.

Agree

- Everything is instanced to an extreme.

Agree, though in a much less intrusive way.

- Terrible graphics: Lack of options too.

Opinion, graphics are fine to me /shrug

- No mod support: Recount etc is a must for end game content. However seeing PvE in this game is faceroll I guess it's not needed.

Mods really aren't *necessary*. Too many people have become dependent on them IMO.

- Companions are silly, why not make the character more powerful instead.

The companion system allows for much more versatility.

- NO DR in PvP: ROFL!

Since this affects both factions it balances out. Bring friends, communicate, adapt.

- No PvP brackets: 50's just dominate all.

What you mean is no warzone brackets. Cage fights (battlegrounds/warzones/whatever) are pointless. Stick with actual PvP (open world) and within a couple months it will balance out.

- No combat tab: Big ***?

Useful tool, but not required.

- Broken loot system: Anyone can need on anything, even if they can't use it.

Not broken. Most classes will (eventually) have a use for most items since you can equip companions.

- Can't pick another advanced tree without leveling.

Not sure what you mean. You can spend points in all three trees of your AC.

- No LFG system - Spamming chat while also being in an instanced area.

Get a guild.

- Terrible UI: Can't hide not used icon slots.

Agree the UI is less than stellar, but it is functional.

- No target of target

Agree

- Targeting is **** and placement of targets icon is even worse.

Agree

- Terrible in game map: Cant zoom or do anything

Agree

- No UI scaling, actually pretty much no UI options at all.

This belongs with the "Terrible UI" above.

- Terrible AH UI: Need I say more?

Again, UI issues can all be rolled into one.

- 50's already with faceroll endgame raids.

This is a result of the newer generation of MMO players who are too impatient. People would cry up a storm if it took months and months to hit the level cap as it once did in MMOs.

 

All in all, it's not broken so much as in need of refinement, which is perfectly understandable for a new release. The got core systems to a functional state for launch and will clean up those aspects that need it as time goes on. Frankly, I prefer this than to have a bunch ambitious attempts at various systems that are all broken/flawed/bugged.

[Aloro]

People like the OP are paying customers too. Alienate enough of them and the game is dead on arrival. Something a lot of hardcore TOR apologists don't seem to grasp.

 

The game is not dead on arrival, based on estimates of the size of the playerbase. Are you hoping it'll be dead on arrival? Or are you warning us just to be helpful - because you really REALLY think it's likely, and you're just being kind? Perhaps you see a horrible disaster looming and are trying to steer people away from it, for their own good?

 

Because that's not how it comes across at all, just fyi. You just come across as a rather bitter individual who doesn't understand that other people might like something that he doesn't, and wants to ruin their enjoyment so everyone can suffer together. Misery loves company, they say.

 

It's ok if you don't like this game. It's ok if I do like this game.

 

Your dislike of the game doesn't make you wise, or kind, or a good community member, any more than my enjoyment of the game makes me a fanboy or apologist; I'm neither.

 

Stop trying to force everyone to share your views. It's never going to work. If you'd like to try sharing specific constructive criticism about objective facts, then I for one welcome it. If you just want to keep telling us that this game sucks, nobody can possibly enjoy it, and anyone who says otherwise is just lying... save yourself the trouble.

[Maeh]

I'm still trying to figure out how this thread hasn't been closed. It's a troll fest from both sides.

[Inhalcator]

I'm still trying to figure out how this thread hasn't been closed. It's a troll fest from both sides.

 

Obviously, we paid the troll toll.

[Phaedrynn]

- NO DR in PvP: ROFL!

I presume you mean damage reduction ? Why do you need it ? That bad at it that you need a crutch

 

I assumed DR = Diminishing Returns (on CC effects)

[Zoma]

Most of what the OP said sounds more like exaggerated anger at the game. But I have to agree with the following:

 

- Terrible controls: Clunky, unresponsive and heavy.

 

- Broken loot system: Anyone can need on anything, even if they can't use it.

 

- Terrible UI: Can't hide not used icon slots.

 

- No target of target

 

- Targeting is **** and placement of targets icon is even worse.

 

- Terrible in game map: Cant zoom or do anything

 

- No UI scaling, actually pretty much no UI options at all.

 

- Terrible AH UI: Need I say more?

[Azraelor]

OP is probably a chick

Only women complain this much when they wander out of the kitchen.

[Alkiii]

Still can't get over this statement:

Originally Posted by FatherJeffrey

- Terrible graphics: Lack of options too.

 

You be the judge:

 

This:

http://i140.photobucket.com/albums/r4/Alkii/loldwarf-Copy.png

 

VS

 

This:

http://i140.photobucket.com/albums/r4/Alkii/SWTORpic-Copy.jpg

[FerrusPA]

The game is not dead on arrival, based on estimates of the size of the playerbase. Are you hoping it'll be dead on arrival? Or are you warning us just to be helpful - because you really REALLY think it's likely, and you're just being kind? Perhaps you see a horrible disaster looming and are trying to steer people away from it, for their own good?

 

Because that's not how it comes across at all, just fyi. You just come across as a rather bitter individual who doesn't understand that other people might like something that he doesn't, and wants to ruin their enjoyment so everyone can suffer together. Misery loves company, they say.

 

It's ok if you don't like this game. It's ok if I do like this game.

 

Your dislike of the game doesn't make you wise, or kind, or a good community member, any more than my enjoyment of the game makes me a fanboy or apologist; I'm neither.

 

Stop trying to force everyone to share your views. It's never going to work. If you'd like to try sharing specific constructive criticism about objective facts, then I for one welcome it. If you just want to keep telling us that this game sucks, nobody can possibly enjoy it, and anyone who says otherwise is just lying... save yourself the trouble.

 

I take it you are speaking to all critics in general by addressing me directly. Otherwise I applaud your deductive abilities since you seem to know a lot about me from the 3 or so posts I made thus far.

 

I haven't tried to force my views on anyone here so far. I'm not in a position to do so. Nobody around here is. What makes me bitter is seeing how the game turned out -Undeserving of an MMORPG circa 2011 - and how some people try their best to keep it that way. It's the same issue that always arises in DF or Recount threads: People don't want certain features because WoW has them. Which, apparently, means they are bad because WoW is bad. Or something.

 

I'm bitter because some aspects of the game are so hopelessly archaic and, more importantly, a direct contradiction to the supposed design philosophy that they suck my personal enjoyment out of the game. Point in case: I can't do FPs with my friend because there is no useable, server-wide LFG channel let alone a LFG tool. Yet there are without a doubt people in this very thread who would hail the current system as "bold" and "not like WoW" and "like it's supposed to be".

Edited December 21, 2011 by FerrusPA

[MadJerry]

First of all this game isn't a MMO, it's a SP game with some MP aspects and heavy instancing, on par with Guild Wars if not worse.

 

- Everything is instanced to an extreme.

 

- Terrible graphics: Lack of options too.

 

 

I agree with the quoted portions above. The toon customization options are seriously underdeveloped. I am guessing it will be no time at all until I see copies of myself everywhere.

 

As for the game being single player, I agree with this wholeheartedly. The way the story arcs work we are all the one special dude who is going to change the galaxy. That makes no sense. How can every non NPC in the Galaxy be the one special guy that makes a difference. That sounds like a single player plot. The whole story is basically a single player game that millions of people play all at once.

 

And am I the only person that thinks this game is almost exactly like WoW but with star wars art work? It totally feels the same to me, with some minor improvements in questing and combat.