Commando – Gunnery Compendium

[NamesAllTakenQQ]

This is a compendium for my thoughts on Commando Gunnery, a tree that has been much improved with 2.0. Please feel free to add any thoughts you have to this thread.

 

1. Mirror move list (translation to Mercenary)

• A. Hammer shot – Rapid shots
  
• B. Electro net – Electro net
  
• C. Demolition round – Heatseeker missles
  
• D. High impact bolt – Rail shot
  
• E. Full auto – Unload
  
• F. Gravity round – Tracer missile
  
• G. Plasma Grenade – Fusion missile
  
• H. Mortar Volley – Death from above
  
• I. Tech Override – Power Surge
  
• J. Reserve power cell – Thermal sensor override.
  

 

2. Skill Tree

http://i43.tinypic.com/2u4hukj.jpg

 

Why heavy trooper for endurance instead of the knockback? Well, this one is simple. It's simply situational and in most cases in PVE content, you will never need a knockback which can root. The endurance boost just comes in handy here. However, there are a few fights like HM SV Dash'Rode where a knockback that can root can come in handy. In that case, you can swap heavy trooper for concussive force.

 

3. Opening rotation, Priority, Resource managment.

Opener:

 

• A. Gravity Round (Applies gravity vortex)
  
• B. Electro-Net
  
• C. Demolition Round
  

 

Priority List:

 

• A. Demolition Round ( With Gravity Vortex)
  
• B. High Impact Bolt ( With 5 stacks of charged barrell)
  
• C. Electro-Net
  
• D. Full Auto (Curtain of Fire)
  
• E. Gravity Round (Maintain gravity vortex, and to proc curtain of fire)
  
• F. Full Auto (Without Proc. If it becomes off cooldown, then you have horrible luck). Use it if it's next on the priority list because it's very ammo efficient.
  
• G. Hammer Shot
  
• *H. Mortar Volley + Reserve Powercell if below 65%
  
• *I. Plasma Grenade + Reserve Powercell if below 75%
  
• *J. Recharge Cells if below 30%
  

 

* Used for resource management purposes, they belong on the top of the priority list, but are listed at the bottom for ease of use and to make the list easier for people new to Gunnery.

 

4. Stats

Now this section will be under progress for quite a bit as it is under debate almost everywhere you go. The most argued thing will be critical rating, how much, or if it should be used at all.

 

I previously used a build with critical rating, but found my DPS in operations was too reliant on chance, and have swapped to a critical ratingless build which has proven more reliable, and has slightly higher parses.

 

Accuracy: You will need 440 accuracy rating to obtain the optimal 100%/110% accuracy for ranged and tech damage.

• A . You will get a 1% boost from the legacy perk from having max affection from Tanno Vik.
  
• B. You will get a 3% boost from "Target Locked" in the Assault Tree
  
• C. 440 Accuracy takes about 4 enhancements with a few augments.
  
• D. The Enhancements you get should be accuracy/surge
  

 

Criical Rating: You will need 0 critical rating to achieve about 20% critical change.

• A. You will receive 5% from lucky shots
  
• B. You will receive 1% from the legacy perk from having max affection from Aric Jorgan
  
• C. You will receive a 3% boost from "Field Training" in the Combat Medic Tree
  
• D. The rest will come from your Aim and Cunning ( If you really want to Min/Max, try to get all the cunning datacrons as well).
  
• D*. With 3300 Aim, I get about 25% Critical rating with my current build, most people will have a lower number unless they have been gearing well.
  

 

Surge:

• A. All of your enhancements other than the four with accuracy should be Power/Surge.
  

 

Alacrity:

• A. You do not need Alacrity. With the 2% from weapons calibration, along with the 3% for using armor piercing cell you will have enough to lower all your cast times by .1
  

 

Power:

• A. All of your power should come from mods and enhancements.
  

 

5. Gearing

 

Relics:

This is still being debated as well, but it comes down to two options:

 

Option 1:

• The Partisan relic of serendipitous assault
  
• The Conqueror's relic of serendipitous assault
  

 

Option 2:

• Underworld Relic of Boundless Ages
  
• Arkanian Relic of Boundless Ages
  

 

I have not yet tried having the two click relics, but I have tried having both of the PVP relics. Hopefully, I will have better luck when raiding with my group.

 

To properly use the PVP relics, you will need to be able to get a "quad" proc. You will get a double proc for doing a damaging attack, and then you can get another proc for a healing move. Both healing and damaging moves respect different cooldowns for the procs.

 

To properly use the PVE relics, you will have to well... click them.

 

I've been told by many other commandos on my server that having two click relics is superior and I believe it to be true as well. Not many moves can be used by a commando with a 6 second buff to power, especially when you can't control the time at which it happens.

 

Armoring:

Under Construction

 

Mods:

Under Construction

 

Enhancements:

Under Construction

 

Augments:

Under Construction

 

Ear Pieces:

Under Construction

 

Implants:

Under Construction

[NamesAllTakenQQ]

Post is reserved for further information if needed.

[NamesAllTakenQQ]

Post is reserved for the Commando Gunnery Leaderboard.

 

This post will contain parses and builds for the gunnery tree. Please post your parses, and let me know how your build runs so I can update this thread with accurate information.

 

 

1. NotAHealer - Hit and Run - Begeren Colony

 

http://www.torparse.com/a/246403

 

2689

 

100/110 accuracy, no crit. Mostly 69s.

Edited May 25, 2013 by NamesAllTakenQQ

[AMightyKnight]

Opener:

If i want to max DPS and the beginning (not the best choice everytime and currently not neccessary):

Adrenal

Tech Override

Grav Round

Demo Round

Electro Net

Reserve Powercell

Plasma Grenade

Full Auto

Grav Round

 

Priority List:

In my opinion its mostly unnecessary to go into the detailed energy level stuff. Try to use Demo Round and HIB on cd, always use proc Full Auto asap and keep your APM high with the ocational Hammershots. Don’t run too low on energy, use your recharge abilities and damage buffs as often as possible and you can handle everything the game currently throws at you.

For example, doing Full Auto proc attack before Demo round really doesn’t matter at all in an actual fight atm. Just don’t get too low.

The new nightmare mods might look different but even there it mostly comes down to getting maximum dps in before a mechanic stops your rotation.

 

Stats:

395 accuary rating resulting in 99.51% accuracy is enough. But you are correct, you can throw in an Accuracy augment, just don’t sacrifice another surge enhancement

It doesn’t hurt you at all if you have a small amount of crit (up to 100 crit raiting). Based on rng you might very well do better than with all power. In any case, the difference is very small, you wont notice it in actual fights. I’m almost BIS and I use one nimble 31A mod and one acute 31 enhancement for and additional 84 crit.

 

Relics:

You got that wrong. Current BIS setup is the Underworld Relic of Boundless Ages and one Underworld Relic of Serendipitous Assault or Underworld Relic of Cerulean Nova.

Look here for the latest information on that topic: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=624205&page=9

Double proc relic works with one PVE and one PVP but its slighty inferior to what I mentioned above.

[Jherad]

I'm not really a PvEer, so I'll leave most of your post alone, but two things jumped out:

 

First, I think you're perhaps a little confused as to what Concussive Force actually does.

 

Why heavy trooper for endurance instead of the knockback? Well, this one is simple. It's simply situational and in most cases in PVE content, you will never need a knockback which can root. The endurance boost just comes in handy here. However, there are a few fights like HM SV Dash'Rode where a knockback that can root can come in handy. In that case, you can swap heavy trooper for concussive force.

 

It doesn't give our knockback a root, it gives stockstrike a root and increases the distance that concussive charge knocks back. Still, as you say, probably of limited use in PvE.

 

Also, as of next patch, PvP relics of SA won't stack (ie, you won't be able to get multiple procs from them).

 

You might want to add to your mirror move list:

 

K. Hold The Line – Hydraulic Overrides.

Edited May 25, 2013 by Jherad

[NamesAllTakenQQ]

Opener:

If i want to max DPS and the beginning (not the best choice everytime and currently not neccessary):

Adrenal

Tech Override

Grav Round

Demo Round

Electro Net

Reserve Powercell

Plasma Grenade

Full Auto

Grav Round

 

Wit that opener, your gravity vortex won't be applied by the time demo round hits, if you're at 30M based on the stupid animation. Unless you meant grav round x2 which would make more sense with the tech override.

 

 

Relics:

You got that wrong. Current BIS setup is the Underworld Relic of Boundless Ages and one Underworld Relic of Serendipitous Assault or Underworld Relic of Cerulean Nova.

Look here for the latest information on that topic: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=624205&page=9

Double proc relic works with one PVE and one PVP but its slighty inferior to what I mentioned above.

 

It's still not proven that the click and cerulean nova are BiS for commandos/mercs. Some of the highest commando parses are using two clicks.

 

Also, a PVE and PVP relic will only get the double proc assuming the PVE one procs first ( I might've mixed it up and it might be PVP one first.)

 

It doesn't give our knockback a root, it gives stockstrike a root and increases the distance that concussive charge knocks back. Still, as you say, probably of limited use in PvE.

 

Also, as of next patch, PvP relics of SA won't stack (ie, you won't be able to get multiple procs from them).

 

You might want to add to your mirror move list:

 

K. Hold The Line – Hydraulic Overrides.

 

Err.. I actually meant a snare, and not a root. That was my mistake. I was referring to the further knockback along with the 50% slow you get from using concussive charge to begin with. It becomes very useful in fight where knockbacks/roots/snares are applicable.

Edited May 25, 2013 by NamesAllTakenQQ

[AMightyKnight]

It's still not proven that the click and cerulean nova are BiS for commandos/mercs. Some of the highest commando parses are using two clicks.

[/Quote] That doesnt mean anything. Ist a mathematical question and not a very complicated one. One click relic and either SA or CN is BIS.

On a sidenote, the top parse i have seen around here - which is over 3000 dps - doesnt use two click relics.

[NamesAllTakenQQ]

That doesnt mean anything. Ist a mathematical question and not a very complicated one. One click relic and either SA or CN is BIS.

On a sidenote, the top parse i have seen around here - which is over 3000 dps - doesnt use two click relics.

 

 

Please refer to the first line of this thread. It's a compendium of my thoughts.

 

Criticism is openly welcomed, as it's often added to my thoughts, and my writing but you've come into this thread with only the intent to e-dick around.

 

Having high DPS isn't referring to hitting a stationary dummy or fleet for five minutes. Real applicable dps comes from real boss fights with mechanics. In most DPS intensive fights, the click relics are more applicable since there are typically burn phases, or points in time where you want to have a higher output.

 

You must be someone who only cares about his dummy dps, and not the success of his group with your mindset.

[OKandrew]

Power or Aim Augments?

[AMightyKnight]

Please refer to the first line of this thread. It's a compendium of my thoughts.

 

Criticism is openly welcomed, as it's often added to my thoughts, and my writing but you've come into this thread with only the intent to e-dick around.

 

Having high DPS isn't referring to hitting a stationary dummy or fleet for five minutes. Real applicable dps comes from real boss fights with mechanics. In most DPS intensive fights, the click relics are more applicable since there are typically burn phases, or points in time where you want to have a higher output.

 

You must be someone who only cares about his dummy dps, and not the success of his group with your mindset.

wut?

All i did was to point out that your relics are not regarded as an optimal setup. I fail to see how that would amount to "e-dicking" or whatever. The parse i mentioned isnt from me but from odawgg. Look it up yourself either on the merc forum or mmo champions. He knows and plays the class way better than i ever will.

 

As for the rest, i actually agree. DPS isnt about hitting the dummy. Real fights are different. Sometimes it is about burst damage between mechanics, sometimes about constant high dps. Its different not only in every fight but also in every guild or raid group. Its possible that you could do better with two click relics in some fights. In others or with other People / tactics another relic might be better. But unless you switch them around, there should be one setup that will work in most cases. Thats the SA/CN - BA setup according to the guys who actually did the math on the hole the subject and simulated thousands of dummy fights.

In the end, as already said, do what you want to do. It doesnt matter at all what relic you use if you can play your class. The DPS requirements for TFB HC and S&V HC are laughable for good raiders.

[Sylvane]

Underworld Relic of Serendipitous Assault is 73.73dps

Underworld Relic of Boundless Ages is 63.30dps

Underworld Relic of the Kinetic Tempest/Underworld Relic of the Cerulean Nova is 57.82dps

 

For a 300 second fight that is.

[odawgg]

To OP, great guide man, I'm a merc and I share a lot of the same ideas for Rotation/Priority System. I do feel SA/CN with BA is BiS but don't think it matters all that much in the whole scheme of things. Did you confirm the BAs even work together though? I always figured they shared the same cd. I just don't feel there's any true burn phase in end game operations right now so I prefer the increased sustain damage of the proc relics.

 

Stat gearing all looks good to me, I do the 5 pieces of Surge and 5 with Accuracy and swap 1 reflex augment for an accuracy for 99.9% acc, good enough for me and keeps my surge as high as possible, only sacraficing 32 aim.

 

Underworld Relic of Serendipitous Assault is 73.73dps

Underworld Relic of Boundless Ages is 63.30dps

Underworld Relic of the Kinetic Tempest/Underworld Relic of the Cerulean Nova is 57.82dps

 

For a 300 second fight that is.

 

not quite sure where u get those numbers, do you have a source? My calculations are quite different.

 

UW SA...procs on avg 14 times in 5minutes...so 14*550*.23*6(seconds)*(1+.2262*.7108)/300(seconds) = 41.12 DPS. Average coefficient is about 1.2 bringing this to 49.3 dps.

 

UW CN = 45dps, can look at any dummy parse for this, no need for calculation.

 

UW BA = 5 minutes is 425*(90/300)*23 for base damage then add in (1+crit*surge) bringing total equation to 425*(90/300)*23*(1+.2262*.7108) = 34 dps...avg coefficient is about 1.2 so bringing this to about 40.8dps.

 

All 3 of these have the same Static Power so I didn't add that in. The Ark BA i haven't calculated, but it's worse than the old DG BA relic because of the static power on it. The BA relics in general will lose value if the fight goes to 6 minutes since that's another minute with no power buff, but would gain in value if it were reduced to 4 1/2 minutes (slightly).

 

So they all pretty close, but since SA doesn't work with CN gotta choose one or the other. If you want more burst, can go with OPs suggestion of two BA relics "if" they don't share cd that is. Is news to me if they don't.

 

The parse i mentioned isnt from me but from odawgg. Look it up yourself either on the merc forum or mmo champions. He knows and plays the class way better than i ever will.

 

Awww, just had to say thank you for the compliment

 

Again, OP nice guide, you asked for merc feedback so I thought I'd stop in. If you haven't already feel free to check out the merc guide in my sig to compare notes.

Edited May 27, 2013 by odawgg

[Leira_Kheren]

two ba dont stack together, they never have as far as I know, but however - they 2xBA wouldnt be BIS. CN and SA are stronger

[Flying-Brian]

I played around with the 2 x BA to see what he ment. While I did not have 2 DG versions to test, I did find an old campaign one in my bank. When the DG BA relic is used, it started it's normal 2min CD, while the campaign went on a 45 sec CD. So the 2nd BA relic was able to be used 45 sec after the 1st one, and it started it's normal 2min CD after it's 1st use.

[Sylvane]

I cant really break down the relic numbers as i did not do them, Inovisible did a spreadsheet for some people and has it all broke down and its the numbers he got in full BiS gear on paper. He has our final dps being 3236dps in completely ideal situtations on a dummy, if you want to see if your numbers end up the same in the end. I can ask for his math on relics later though.

[Leira_Kheren]

I cant really break down the relic numbers as i did not do them, Inovisible did a spreadsheet for some people and has it all broke down and its the numbers he got in full BiS gear on paper. He has our final dps being 3236dps in completely ideal situtations on a dummy, if you want to see if your numbers end up the same in the end. I can ask for his math on relics later though.

 

yea why not, I have my own Sim over at mmo-mechanics.com and I'm at over 3340 in BIS now

[RGimeldo]

Hi, nice guide

 

Yesterday I modified my skill tree to match yours, this is the skill tree I used for long time:

 

http://s1298.photobucket.com/user/RG2550Z/media/skilltree1_zpsc0905bd7.png.html

 

I have been pvping since and I havent seen any noticeable change in survivality or DPS output, but still I have a few questions...

 

1.- Are you sure is worth to put those 2 points in "Weapon Calibrations"? I didn't even notice that 0.1 sec.

2.- This may sound stupid but, "Havoc Rounds" applies for Grav Round, Full Auto, HIB or/and Demolition Round? I say because I dont use Charged Bolts at all.

3.- "Reflexive Shield" lowers the cooldown of Reactive Shield which is very nice but, but you could use Diversion (with "Decoy skill") to avoid great damage like right before Smash or while getting sniped. What's your opinion on that? Let me now if I'm making a great mistake with the Diversion thing xP.

4.- My english is terrible, also I'll try to make an hybrid between both sets of skills, post here later if I have good results.

[GeckoOBac]

1.- Are you sure is worth to put those 2 points in "Weapon Calibrations"? I didn't even notice that 0.1 sec.

2.- This may sound stupid but, "Havoc Rounds" applies for Grav Round, Full Auto, HIB or/and Demolition Round? I say because I dont use Charged Bolts at all.

3.- "Reflexive Shield" lowers the cooldown of Reactive Shield which is very nice but, but you could use Diversion (with "Decoy skill") to avoid great damage like right before Smash or while getting sniped. What's your opinion on that? Let me now if I'm making a great mistake with the Diversion thing xP.

4.- My english is terrible, also I'll try to make an hybrid between both sets of skills, post here later if I have good results.

 

1) Either there or first responder usually. It may not be a huge buff, but it's still a buff in dps.

2) havoc rounds applies to Grav Round, Charged Bolts, Demolition Round, Explosive Round. That's it. HIB and Full auto are untouched by the talent

3) I'd take decoy only in pvp and ONLY if you are very skilled. I have a long experience in pvp and I still think it's a very situational skill and while it can be a life saver, it requires a deep knowledge of other specs and good reflexes. In PVE Reflexive shield is, hands down, better as most fights will benefit from more than one reactive shield plus the energy redoubt procs ALL THE TIME. In the end I think it's best for pvp too, as decoy is extremely situational, while reactive shield works really against anything.

4) Don't, really. Commando hybrids don't really work at all, with very few exceptions. Look at the "Spamcaster" thread for one build that works, but that it's basically an assault build without assault plastique.

[Abbrachmann]

Has anyone thought of the Matrix Cube Relic. Because of the bolstering system in PvP it gives it a nice Aim boost. Plus with our talent to gain extra percent on main stat......Was wondering if anyone did the numbers for that as well.

[GeckoOBac]

Has anyone thought of the Matrix Cube Relic. Because of the bolstering system in PvP it gives it a nice Aim boost. Plus with our talent to gain extra percent on main stat......Was wondering if anyone did the numbers for that as well.

 

Cube hasn't been BiS in ages. It may work in pvp (no idea) due to bugs to the bolster system, but that's it.

[DariusCalera]

Has anyone thought of the Matrix Cube Relic. Because of the bolstering system in PvP it gives it a nice Aim boost. Plus with our talent to gain extra percent on main stat......Was wondering if anyone did the numbers for that as well.

 

For PvE, it is not really usable at 55.

 

For PvP, I know a few people use it because of the bolstering system and because there seems to be an issue with the second relic slot not procing when it should.

[RC-Scorch]

Could someone enlighten me as to why Surge would be prioritized over Crit? OP is saying (and I agree) that Power would be first choice, and accuracy up to 100%, but why advocate 0 crit but more surge? Wouldn't a balance of Crit/surge be more efficient? Not questioning the math, just genuinely wondering.

[AMightyKnight]

You can choose between power and crit or surge, accuracy and alacrity but not crit and surge.

And power just gives your more dps than crit, even if you max surge.

[GeckoOBac]

And power just gives your more dps than crit, even if you max surge.

 

This is the reason mostly. Due to the returns curve of crit, point per point power simply gives more damage than crit for any realistic amount of surge, at least in the current gearing iteration.

 

I've read that some classes may want to add a modicum of crit with lvl 75 items, as power by then will be slightly less rewarding. We're still talking of under 100 values for crit rating though.

[Powerinfusion]

[*]C. 440 Accuracy takes about 4 enhancements with a few augments.

 

Are you saying gunnery commandos should augment for accuracy? So 4 accuracy enhancements + 4 accuracy augments?