Dear BW: Please nerf Scamper/roll with Huttball

[ViciousFett]

Rolling while charring the Huttball is way overpowered. If I use Force Barrier, or stealth while carrying it I drop the ball, the same should apply to rolls.

[cycao]

Roots and snares.

[stringcat]

Rolling while charring the Huttball is way overpowered. If I use Force Barrier, or stealth while carrying it I drop the ball, the same should apply to rolls.

 

If you're willing to drop the ball when you force speed, or warriors jump, sure. And people you pull should drop the ball too.

 

TLDR: Non-light saber classes get to play huttball too now. OH NOES.

 

Lightsabers not entitled to be the only classes effective in huttball. Just because you guys have been OP in huttball since the beginning doesn't make it a frickin entitlement.

Edited May 20, 2013 by stringcat

[ViciousFett]

Roots and snares.

 

Usually out of range before anyone can.

[Jayshames]

I was just thinking to myself.. there really hasn't been enough nerf scoundrel/operative threads recently. Thanks.

[ViciousFett]

If you're willing to drop the ball when you force speed, or warriors jump, sure.

 

Force speed lasts 2 seconds, you kidding?

[stringcat]

Force speed lasts 2 seconds, you kidding?

 

It gets you through the fire. That's long enough. Since it only lasts two seconds, it shouldn't be a big deal to give it up. Right?

 

"A roll is 6m with the huttball, you kidding? "

[TUXs]

If you're willing to drop the ball when you force speed, or warriors jump, sure. And people you pull should drop the ball too.

 

TLDR: Non-light saber classes get to play huttball too now. OH NOES.

 

Lightsabers not entitled to be the only classes effective in huttball. Just because you guys have been OP in huttball since the beginning doesn't make it a frickin entitlement.

 

Agreed! I find it funny how many people complain now that their class isn't the absolute best for HB.

 

However...you're both right - it's ridiculously OP as the OP suggests...but it's no more OP than the force leapers/pullers have been since launch.

 

/shrug

[ViciousFett]

An op with full energy can pick it up and roll all the way to the endzone, force run works for about 10m, so yeah, you're crazy if you think that compares.

[Skyhigh]

[Jorojus]

I agree about the roll beeing a little bit too much for overall objective play.

 

As operative I think its really too easy to get ahead in hutball. f.e. rolling over fire in stealth and it doesn't break stealth wich isn't rly logical.

 

Also for voidstar its a bit too easy to wait in stealth till the doors open and roll ahead, plant while team slows, rince and repeat.

 

A cooldown will fix this, no operative in his righteous mind will care about a cooldown on it, we still got alot of other utility.

 

I disagree about the roll beeing OP for hutball while carrying the ball, you already have a slow on you so that doesn't rly make sense ...

 

Besides passing wins Hutball, not rolling.

Edited May 20, 2013 by Jorojus

[islander]

Usually out of range before anyone can.

 

I root rollers mid-roll at least twice every huttball.

[Yeochins]

Sniper roll is fine.

 

Operative/Scoundrel roll is broken. The ability to chain them in rapid succession along with the free energy grant skill allows Operatives to chain at least 6 successive rolls with the huttball. If you don't apply a slow, then they can roll 72 meters (the hutball natural slow effect doesn't seem to count as a "movement impairing effect"). If you apply a slow they can roll 36 meters, but are nearly immune to physical roots following the first use of scamper.

 

Due to the glitchiness of roll and server lag, pulls often don't work due to LOS detection.

 

After having my fun rolling around with my Scoundrel, I'm content with having a 1-3 second delay between rolls. It will solve most of the complaints about roll, and still allow me to escape everything that isn't tech/force-based.

 

In the grand scheme of fights though, the roll is broken from the sense that Scoundrel/Operatives get to:

 

1. Pick their fights
   
2. Open their fights
   
3. Escape
   

 

It's just bad PvP design. If you get to pick and open your fights, you shouldn't get the option to run away. If you don't get to pick your fights you should be given the option to escape.

 

In my opinion, Scamper should be a skill specific to the healing tree's of the Operative/Scoundrel. DPS operatives/scoundrels should not have been given Scamper as they didn't really need it. Emergency stealth was their escape, that they could gamble on a second opener. Now you don't need to gamble your escape because you have Scamper.

Edited May 20, 2013 by Yeochins

[Tankqull]

simply make the ball carrying snare affect scamper(like other snares), problem solved.

[Choffware]

Sniper roll is fine.

 

Operative/Scoundrel roll is broken. The ability to chain them in rapid succession along with the free energy grant skill allows Operatives to chain at least 6 successive rolls with the huttball. If you don't apply a slow, then they can roll 72 meters (the hutball natural slow effect doesn't seem to count as a "movement impairing effect"). If you apply a slow they can roll 36 meters, but are nearly immune to physical roots following the first use of scamper.

 

Due to the glitchiness of roll and server lag, pulls often don't work due to LOS detection.

 

After having my fun rolling around with my Scoundrel, I'm content with having a 1-3 second delay between rolls. It will solve all the complaints about roll, and still allow me to escape everything that isn't tech/force-based.

 

This.... I have two problems with the roll. It can be chained. None of these other "fast travel" abilities can be chained except the Marauder one that can fired twice but that's on a long cool down. I also have a problem with OPS jumping in the middle of the roll and reaching overhead scaffolding. I don't know if it's lag or a hack but I have chased them from one level to another on my Marauder.

Edited May 20, 2013 by Choffware

[Jorojus]

This.... I have two problems with the roll. It can be chained. None of these other "fast travel" abilities can be chained except the Marauder one that can fired twice but that's on a long cool down. I also have a problem with OPS jumping in the middle of the roll and reaching overhead scaffolding. I don't know if it's lag or a hack but I have chased them from one level to another on my Marauder.

 

Jumping and rolling at the same time is bollox. At least I have never been able to do it.

 

It is possible tough to roll over the pit from platform floor 1 after first fire towards middle. But you can do that with force speed too, so I don't see a problem there.

 

You probably see an operative roll, fall through the floor and a few seconds later back on the floor. That is simply the engine that can't handle the roll somehow. Same bug as jumpers falling through floors to appear back up a few seconds later.

Edited May 20, 2013 by Jorojus

[Jadescythe]

I root rollers mid-roll at least twice every huttball.

 

At least as far as I've been told by ops, the roll works as a teleport, so they are never in between where they start and stop physically. That's why they take no damage from the fire pits rolling through. So even if you did root or stun them, they'd make it to the other side still, which is the real issue. "It uses all my energy in 4 rolls though!". Cool story, feel free to score your goal, stealth out, and start over. Please change this to an ability that is actually helpful to the class and not a HB only gimmick.

 

You can compare this to Force Speed, but you can still be CC'd in traps using it (exception being with Shroud, but that's a separate CD) and take fire damage while going through it. You can compare it to leap, but it requires your derpy team to stand there for them to leap to. Snipers have always been the most underrated Huttball players since they can negate the leaps while defending and are by far the most superior mid holders. PTs have the pull into fire option. Operatives have always had stealth to help with getting some sneaky goals. Mercs have really been the only ones on the short end of the straw in HB. Just because your job wasn't carrying the huttball doesn't mean other classes were OP.

[Jorojus]

At least as far as I've been told by ops, the roll works as a teleport, so they are never in between where they start and stop physically. That's why they take no damage from the fire pits rolling through. So even if you did root or stun them, they'd make it to the other side still, which is the real issue. "It uses all my energy in 4 rolls though!". Cool story, feel free to score your goal, stealth out, and start over. Please change this to an ability that is actually helpful to the class and not a HB only gimmick.

 

You can compare this to Force Speed, but you can still be CC'd in traps using it (exception being with Shroud, but that's a separate CD) and take fire damage while going through it. You can compare it to leap, but it requires your derpy team to stand there for them to leap to. Snipers have always been the most underrated Huttball players since they can negate the leaps while defending and are by far the most superior mid holders. PTs have the pull into fire option. Operatives have always had stealth to help with getting some sneaky goals. Mercs have really been the only ones on the short end of the straw in HB. Just because your job wasn't carrying the huttball doesn't mean other classes were OP.

 

You do have to keep in mind that as operative you can spec into a 30 procent chance on a short evasion wich removes all effects. That is only for concealment operatives.

[ViciousFett]

I know when I'm on my scoundrel it doesn't feel like a long distance, but when you see someone else doing it it gives you a whole new perspective.

[islander]

At least as far as I've been told by ops, the roll works as a teleport, so they are never in between where they start and stop physically. That's why they take no damage from the fire pits rolling through. So even if you did root or stun them, they'd make it to the other side still, which is the real issue. "It uses all my energy in 4 rolls though!". Cool story, feel free to score your goal, stealth out, and start over. Please change this to an ability that is actually helpful to the class and not a HB only gimmick.

 

You can compare this to Force Speed, but you can still be CC'd in traps using it (exception being with Shroud, but that's a separate CD) and take fire damage while going through it. You can compare it to leap, but it requires your derpy team to stand there for them to leap to. Snipers have always been the most underrated Huttball players since they can negate the leaps while defending and are by far the most superior mid holders. PTs have the pull into fire option. Operatives have always had stealth to help with getting some sneaky goals. Mercs have really been the only ones on the short end of the straw in HB. Just because your job wasn't carrying the huttball doesn't mean other classes were OP.

 

Yeah, this is probably true (the teleport). I know when I sniper roll through fire, I almost always proc one tick of it though - I guess its a different mechanic? Seems strange.

[Astarica]

The biggest problem with the roll is that you can use it to get the ball before anyone else can and there's nothing besides the same ability that can stop it.

 

The second problem is that since the game considers roll as a teleport as opposed to just moving really fast (like Force Speed), it is impossible to trap someone in mid fire. More importantly, the teleport nature of the roll makes grapple abilities randomly fail, as if you grapple someone in mid roll, what would happen is you grapple them from their limbo mid roll state, only to see they teleport back to their destination when the roll finishes and it's as if you never grapple them. This means the two primary method to deal with high mobility has no effect on rolling. The latter case is especially bad as roll basically ends up having an 'immune to physics' effect except that's not what it's supposed to do. If I pulled you, you're supposed to end up where I pulled you, not magically roll back to your previous destination.

[TUXs]

The biggest problem with the roll is that you can use it to get the ball before anyone else can and there's nothing besides the same ability that can stop it.

 

Huh...couldn't the same be said about force speed prior to 2.0?

[LetoAtreidesII]

I think the biggest problem with roll in general (not just in Huttball) is that unlike other classes' abilities, it has no cooldown, and the energy cost isn't sufficient to prevent it from being spammed until you're all the way across the map.

[Cretinus]

I think the biggest problem with roll in general (not just in Huttball) is that unlike other classes' abilities, it has no cooldown, and the energy cost isn't sufficient to prevent it from being spammed until you're all the way across the map.

 

Agreed. This is the reason why comparison with force-speed and leap is an eyewash. Give roll a CD and I'll be happy to accept the force-spead / leap argumentation line.

[Astarica]

Huh...couldn't the same be said about force speed prior to 2.0?

 

Various 30m abilities at least prevents the Force Speed/Predation guys from getting away and killing the ball carrier at that spot creates a very advantageous position for your team. The guy with roll is always going to get away without a roll on your own side and is under no risk.