Electro net doesn't hinder people from leaping

[Individual]

Getting leaped to all the time with it on someone. Thought it was suppose to hinder this.

[DarthBloodloss]

Or they could use their stun breaker I believe

[Gyronamics]

Or they could use their stun breaker I believe

 

Takes them 1-2 CD to realise they have a net on them. Which you are of course using usefully.

 

Then once they break and leap to you, you stun them and finish them off.

 

Unless they had the presence of mind to pop GBTF first they're dead.

[Jayshames]

I cannot use leap when I have electro net on me. And as the above poster said, it often takes me a few seconds to realise I have it on me lol.

 

Fighting a Merc or Commando then bashing the hell out of leap about to start screaming then realise I've got a net on me.

Also, is it the net that causes the sound effect and animation that looks like the end of grav round? when the vortex lands on you or something.

[Gyronamics]

Looks a bit like a grav yeah.

 

You see a thing flying at you but the effect of snare is on you instantly before it lands.

[Macroeconomics]

Takes them 1-2 CD to realise they have a net on them. Which you are of course using usefully. Then once they break and leap to you, you stun them and finish them off. Unless they had the presence of mind to pop GBTF first they're dead.

 

Except that strategy doesn't work vs. two of the three Jugg/Guardian subclasses. And even for the other melee classes, you are not going to be able to burn them down in a single 4 sec stun phase. Because if you could, the much simpler and more effective strategy would be to stun them first, and burn them down while they are saving their cc breaker for EN - which is the correct strategy for melee, exactly because you aren't going to hurt them that badly in 4 seconds.

 

The correct use of EN is to hold it back in reserve and force your enemy opponent to eat all your stuns, mezzes and roots because he doesn't want to use his cc breaker. Gunnery/Arsenal has a stun, 2 mezzes, a root, a KB initiated snare and a snare via Unload. If you land all of those, you are going to beat 80-90% of the melee in a 1v1 scenario.

[Gyronamics]

Except that strategy doesn't work vs. two of the three Jugg/Guardian subclasses. And even for the other melee classes, you are not going to be able to burn them down in a single 4 sec stun phase. Because if you could, the much simpler and more effective strategy would be to stun them first, and burn them down while they are saving their cc breaker for EN - which is the correct strategy for melee, exactly because you aren't going to hurt them that badly in 4 seconds.

 

The correct use of EN is to hold it back in reserve and force your enemy opponent to eat all your stuns, mezzes and roots because he doesn't want to use his cc breaker. Gunnery/Arsenal has a stun, 2 mezzes, a root, a KB initiated snare and a snare via Unload. If you land all of those, you are going to beat 80-90% of the melee in a 1v1 scenario.

 

The correct use of EN is to use it whenever needed and to know what you're using it on.

 

Above all if you're trying to kill someone who can leap you need to press net before he can press leap because it can't stop a leap once it's started.

 

Now they can eat it or they can break it and whatever their other talents, will still leave them vulnerable to being hard stunned if they choose to leap.

 

Everything you mentioned is a defensive tool, which has its place when you are at melee range already. You missed out HTL/HO which when engaged causes leapers to miss and smashers to hit nothing because you're moving fast and not getting stopped by their roots.

 

The scenario I mentioned was one I used to steal a turret from a marauder the other day.

 

Peeked over the wall of snow and hit ENet on him about 25m away before he could leap.

Grav. Demo

He realises, breaks, leaps.

Full length stun, Insta/Free Plasma Grenade, Full Auto, HiB and its over.

 

If, as you say I just let him leap to me so I could muck about with my other, short range or pointless (60s mezz for what?) hinderances I could have got into a drawn out fight in which he would almost certainly have remembered his defensive CD.

 

And that perfectly illustrates why if you want a melee dead you need to net him first to destroy one of his options.

Edited May 16, 2013 by Gyronamics

[Akfourtys]

Gunnery/Arsenal has a stun, 2 mezzes, a root, a KB initiated snare and a snare via Unload. If you land all of those, you are going to beat 80-90% of the melee in a 1v1 scenario.

Electrocute, concussion, ..., rocket punch root, jet boost snare, pin down feat, yep.

Cant imagine what do u count as second mezz for gunnery/arsenal. Do u talk about cybertech nade?

 

I need some clarification. Just saw marauders and sents went camouflage being netted, did they just shoot their unleash anti-cc off?

Edited May 16, 2013 by Akfourtys
typo

[Zorash]

Electrocute, concussion, ..., rocket punch root, jet boost snare, pin down feat, yep.

Cant imagine what do u count as second mezz for gunnery/arsenal. Do u talk about cybertech nade?

 

I need some clarification. Just saw marauders and sents went camouflage being netted, did they just shoot their unleash anti-cc off?

 

The marauder/sent probably used the 2m CC break because I know my operative cant stealth with electronet on me.

[Macroeconomics]

The scenario I mentioned was one I used to steal a turret from a marauder the other day.

 

Peeked over the wall of snow and hit ENet on him about 25m away before he could leap.

Grav. Demo

He realises, breaks, leaps.

Full length stun, Insta/Free Plasma Grenade, Full Auto, HiB and its over.

 

Glad that worked for you. But it's not a viable strategy against a good player. If he was on his game, he could have used his cc breaker, leaped to you and put on Obfuscate before you could Stun him. That's not a win for you. EN, like much of the Merc dps' portfolio of abilities can be especially effective if the enemy makes a mistake. And so using EN early really plays to that. Use it early against a weak player and it can work wonders. But against a strong player it's not a good strategy. I mean seriously, if the guy just stood there and ate the full 9 sec EN, but popped Saber Ward, Cloak of Pain and his warzone adrenal and called for help, he'd still have a ton of HP left and could stop a second enemy player from capping, if it was a 1v2. Now I guess you could counter that early EN use might work against a strong player with all his defensive abilities on CD. That's certainly true. Having no defensive abilities sort of converts him from a strong player to a weak one. But usually you don't count on that when you approach an enemy side node where the guard presumably has had some downtime.

[Luckeyduckey]

These nets are so trollish. On my marauder, I don't know what to do when I get hit. If I move, I'm taking a **** ton of damage. If I stand still, I get mauled by tracer missiles. Curses.

[Gyronamics]

Glad that worked for you. But it's not a viable strategy against a good player. If he was on his game, he could have used his cc breaker, leaped to you and put on Obfuscate before you could Stun him. That's not a win for you. EN, like much of the Merc dps' portfolio of abilities can be especially effective if the enemy makes a mistake. And so using EN early really plays to that. Use it early against a weak player and it can work wonders. But against a strong player it's not a good strategy. I mean seriously, if the guy just stood there and ate the full 9 sec EN, but popped Saber Ward, Cloak of Pain and his warzone adrenal and called for help, he'd still have a ton of HP left and could stop a second enemy player from capping, if it was a 1v2. Now I guess you could counter that early EN use might work against a strong player with all his defensive abilities on CD. That's certainly true. Having no defensive abilities sort of converts him from a strong player to a weak one. But usually you don't count on that when you approach an enemy side node where the guard presumably has had some downtime.

 

Obfuscate, a offensive/defensive ability which reduces ranged and melee accuracy by 90%.

 

So he pops that and I still stun him for full duration and again he dies.

 

Yeah sure, this situation can theoretically extend into a massive 2 minute duel where we both have all possible CD and consumables available but realistically the warrior who gets netted before he can leap is marked for death.

[Macroeconomics]

Obfuscate, a offensive/defensive ability which reduces ranged and melee accuracy by 90%. So he pops that and I still stun him for full duration and again he dies.

 

And what are you going to do to him in 3 GCDs that will kill him? You can't. Hell against a god melee, even a full 9 seconds of EN will not let you kill them.

[Gyronamics]

No, I expect at least 5 GCD at the end of which I expect them to be dead or in an unrecoverable HP deficit.

 

The number of melee who realise instantly that they have been crippled by a net is 0, they think they're somehow not pressing their jump, they are pressing their jump but it's not til they check the icon that they'll see its grey.

 

Decision time for them. I'm already finishing a grav cast with a chained demo

 

I don't even see why this is a discussion, EN turns melee and stealth classes into helpless targets and leaves them no cheap option to counter it, the only good thing about it for them is it's got a long cooldown.

Edited May 19, 2013 by Gyronamics

[Flintfire]

It's also useful escape tool. Pop that sucker, then Hydraulic Override in the other direction for a bit more speed and no slows and stuns, and you are probably not going to be caught. On one of my other characters I got hit with one, and it really hinders you. I couldn't imagine pursuing anyone with that on me. It also does more damage when you are moving, so its best to just sit there and wait it out.

[Macroeconomics]

The number of melee who realise instantly that they have been crippled by a net is 0

 

Your server has a lot of bad melee then.

 

Decision time for them. I'm already finishing a grav cast with a chained demo. I don't even see why this is a discussion, EN turns melee and stealth classes into helpless targets

 

You don't understand because as you've stated above, you face bad melee exclusively. After your grav round and demo charge, the Mara will come out of your hard stun before you can get off another cast, and hit you with a 9k smash. So now you've used your two best defensive abilities (EN and stun), your best offensive ability (Demo charge) and you haven't even done any more damage than he has to you.

[Gyronamics]

Your server has a lot of bad melee then.

 

You don't understand because as you've stated above, you face bad melee exclusively. After your grav round and demo charge, the Mara will come out of your hard stun before you can get off another cast, and hit you with a 9k smash. So now you've used your two best defensive abilities (EN and stun), your best offensive ability (Demo charge) and you haven't even done any more damage than he has to you.

 

You're not understanding a tactic because you're not reading.

 

Because of that you are assuming something ridiculous. You say I can't kill someone in 3GCD, I say I have 5GCD minimum and explain why, you say 1GCD (time taken to cast grav+demo)... What?

 

This is how it WILL play out if I wanted to use a net on a melee, Variations apply if melee is not a warrior.

 

1) Enet

2) Grav+Demo

3) Reactions of a "good" melee causes them to fully understand and they make the decision to break and leap.

4) Hard Stun (variation of kite for 4s with HTL then stun vs unstoppables)

5) Any combo of Grav/HiB/FA/Plasma Grenade for duration of stun

 

 

And that all assumes he chose to use a CC break and assumes he even had it available.

 

I challenge you to record a melee you have no links with in a random WZ who reacts so fast that you are totally unable to get the grav+demo off before he breaks and leaps.

 

Your grav will be halfway cast before the net graphics even land.

Edited May 20, 2013 by Gyronamics

[odawgg]

I find it interesting Macro that you rarely (if ever) have anything good to say about mercs. Why do you play one? Or are you just pessimistic by nature, which I can understand, a lot of people have this characteristic.

[paowee]

Since you guys were talking about mercs in pvp.. I am constantly getting big chunks of my life blown away by some mercs i see in warzones. is this a combo or a cooldown? or just a lucky crit on a tracer missile? Please enlighten me

[odawgg]

Since you guys were talking about mercs in pvp.. I am constantly getting big chunks of my life blown away by some mercs i see in warzones. is this a combo or a cooldown? or just a lucky crit on a tracer missile? Please enlighten me

 

well I don't pvp, but arsenals are quite bursty at the beginning of an encounter when we have all our abilities off cd.

[DarthBloodloss]

Since you guys were talking about mercs in pvp.. I am constantly getting big chunks of my life blown away by some mercs i see in warzones. is this a combo or a cooldown? or just a lucky crit on a tracer missile? Please enlighten me

1) Tracer 2k-4k

2) Heatseeker 4k-9k

3) Tracer/Fusion Missile 2k-4k

4) Rail Shot 3k-5k

Edited May 22, 2013 by DarthBloodloss

[Gyronamics]

Since you guys were talking about mercs in pvp.. I am constantly getting big chunks of my life blown away by some mercs i see in warzones. is this a combo or a cooldown? or just a lucky crit on a tracer missile? Please enlighten me

 

 

The opening move from a Commando is this:

 

Grav Round

Demolition Round

 

You won't get any warning and they land almost at the same time.

 

Grav can hit for about 4k, it then puts a debuff on you which lowers your armour and buffs the Demo for 25% more damage in the split second before it lands.

 

Demo is what cuts you in half, my biggest hit is 10300 so far but remember a Grav round landed just before that too.

 

Against you I wouldn't use Full Auto or High Impact Bolt unless I was behind you or you left cover to try and escape, I'd facetank you with defensive CD and chain cast Grav, use Mortar Volley, Sticky Grenade and if close enough, HTL, Pulse Cannon, knockback

 

All tech attacks your cover and dodge will do nothing against.

 

Also, because I only need 1 Grav on you to leave that armour debuff and 25% boost for 45s, if the fight goes on long enough (15 seconds) demo round will come off CD again and hit just as hard as the first time.

 

 

If you are out of cover and someone opens up with a boosted Full Auto on you (Curtain of Fire proc from casting Grav) it will slow you to 30% and tick 3 times over 3 seconds with each tick hitting as hard as one grav round.

 

That's the other lethal attack.

 

 

The only other DPS spec is Assault and that's nowhere near as dangerous as Gunnery, it does weak DoT and all the hitters are ranged energy attacks which are horrible vs cover.

Edited May 22, 2013 by Gyronamics