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From Lvl 50 to 51 Caused Massive Stat Drop?


Galsarus

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Hi,

 

I am hoping someone will be able to explain this a little bit more to me as I'm relatively new to the tanking arena-

 

I have been leveling a Vanguard Tank to serve as Ops Off-tank for my guild. Using my DPS alts, I managed to get full Basic Comms set for him (using Legacy armor and weapons to smuggle them). ran some lvl50 HMFP and got incredibly lucky to get relics, BH Mk-3 shield and implants.

 

After reset, I went on to do the dailies and hit lvl 51. That's when I got a massive:eek:. At lvl 50, I was packing 53.54% Dmg reduction, 23% Defense chance, 45.98% Shield Absorption and 40% Shield Chance.

 

As soon as I hit 51, my damage reduction went down to 51.24%, defense chance at 20%, Shield Absorption at 40% and Shield Chance at 36% (I literally shouted W.T.F and woke up my kids). between 50 and 51 - The only thing that changed was my lvl and acquisition of Shoulder Cannon. Is this the normal progression? Am I correct in assuming at at this rate, at lvl 55, my (based on current gear as a baseline) Dmg reduction will be 44.34%, Defense Chance 11%, Shield absorption at 22% and Shield Chance at 16%?

 

2nd Part of the query -

 

Lvl 50 + Gear has some stats which I am at a loss to understand why I'd need them If someone could please explain, that would be fantastic.

 

1) Accuracy - Why do I, as a tank, need accuracy :rak_02: I thought my role was to be an annoying fly and keep the target's focus on me while the DPS burn him down. as far as I'm aware, hitting the target successfully is not as important as maintaining his focus on me, and as my rotation includes taunting, I can't imaging successful hits are a big concern of mine.

2) Alacrity - I have no channeling skills other than Pulse Cannon, which can become a 1.5 sec channel with a skill from the Shield Spec tree. so why do I need Alacrity?:rak_02: I'm seeing most lvl 53-55 Enhancements pack alacrity. Is there any inherent advantage to packing Alacrity at the sacrifice of Shield Absorp and or Def Rating (this seems outrageous to me as they dictate my survivability)

3) Lack of Absorption Rating Mods - do they exist past lvl 50 Makeb mods?

 

Any help would be highly appreciated.

 

Cheers.:D

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Hey there Galsarus! Let me see if I can help you.

 

Am I correct in assuming at at this rate, at lvl 55, my (based on current gear as a baseline) Dmg reduction will be 44.34%, Defense Chance 11%, Shield absorption at 22% and Shield Chance at 16%?

 

Bioware did redo the stat curves for gear from level 50 to level 55. Level 51 is where you first encounter the new curve. It is also the largest drop to be had. You won't continue the downward trend similar to the Titanic's first voyage, but your stats will continue decreasing assuming the same rating.

 

When you do get to 55 initially focus on raising your defense to the 18-20 percentage area. This is in the 550-700 range. After which you can start rebuilding your absorb. Shield will climb independently for the most part with your gear progression because it typically does not compete with defense/absorb.

 

I left my 63 armorings on to preserve my set bonus. If you do have the 4 piece make sure you keep it. The minor health/aim you'll gain by upgrading to the non-set armorings is simply not worth it. I was sitting around the 48% DR as a newly arrived 55. It improves as you're able to pick up those armorings to return over 50, but will not see the 53%+.

 

tldr: They won't completely get screwed. Build defense first to set point, then focus on absorb. Keep your set bonus if able.

 

 

2nd Part of the query -

 

Lvl 50 + Gear has some stats which I am at a loss to understand why I'd need them If someone could please explain, that would be fantastic.

 

1) Accuracy - Why do I, as a tank, need accuracy :rak_02: I thought my role was to be an annoying fly and keep the target's focus on me while the DPS burn him down. as far as I'm aware, hitting the target successfully is not as important as maintaining his focus on me, and as my rotation includes taunting, I can't imaging successful hits are a big concern of mine.

 

Pick up the accuracy talent on the first tier of Tactics, otherwise say no to accuracy. You are not a DPS. Accuracy competes with Shield for stats. At no point should you trade Shield for Accuracy. You play DPS so you know that they made Tech/Force resistible by Golds+. This will largely not affect you though. Most importantly taunts never resist.

 

2) Alacrity - I have no channeling skills other than Pulse Cannon, which can become a 1.5 sec channel with a skill from the Shield Spec tree. so why do I need Alacrity?:rak_02: I'm seeing most lvl 53-55 Enhancements pack alacrity. Is there any inherent advantage to packing Alacrity at the sacrifice of Shield Absorp and or Def Rating (this seems outrageous to me as they dictate my survivability)

 

As above Alacrity competes with Shield. It is a terrible stat for tanks. Never use. Ever.

 

3) Lack of Absorption Rating Mods - do they exist past lvl 50 Makeb mods?

 

They do! Though most of your comm Arkanian level gear is defense. The set pieces are mostly absorb. When you get into the Black Market/Verpine gear, your comm gear is largely absorb. The set pieces are also largely absorb.

 

Cheers!

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It's my understanding that all stats now use 3 different formulas for determining how much of a benefit you see from them.

 

1 formula for levels 1-50, another for 51-54, and a third set of formulas for level 55.

 

Even with end game gear, I don't think we'll ever see the same stats (shield chance, defense chance, etc.) that we used to.

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Hey there Galsarus! Let me see if I can help you.

 

 

 

Bioware did redo the stat curves for gear from level 50 to level 55. Level 51 is where you first encounter the new curve. It is also the largest drop to be had. You won't continue the downward trend similar to the Titanic's first voyage, but your stats will continue decreasing assuming the same rating.

 

When you do get to 55 initially focus on raising your defense to the 18-20 percentage area. This is in the 550-700 range. After which you can start rebuilding your absorb. Shield will climb independently for the most part with your gear progression because it typically does not compete with defense/absorb.

 

I left my 63 armorings on to preserve my set bonus. If you do have the 4 piece make sure you keep it. The minor health/aim you'll gain by upgrading to the non-set armorings is simply not worth it. I was sitting around the 48% DR as a newly arrived 55. It improves as you're able to pick up those armorings to return over 50, but will not see the 53%+.

 

tldr: They won't completely get screwed. Build defense first to set point, then focus on absorb. Keep your set bonus if able.

 

 

 

 

Pick up the accuracy talent on the first tier of Tactics, otherwise say no to accuracy. You are not a DPS. Accuracy competes with Shield for stats. At no point should you trade Shield for Accuracy. You play DPS so you know that they made Tech/Force resistible by Golds+. This will largely not affect you though. Most importantly taunts never resist.

 

 

 

As above Alacrity competes with Shield. It is a terrible stat for tanks. Never use. Ever.

 

 

 

They do! Though most of your comm Arkanian level gear is defense. The set pieces are mostly absorb. When you get into the Black Market/Verpine gear, your comm gear is largely absorb. The set pieces are also largely absorb.

 

Cheers!

 

Hey Cae- thanks very much for that. I've been reading through your guide on Van Tanking and been following where ever I could (its a little difficult transition going from unnoticed DPS to a very popular chew toy for bosses) and go by what you just explained (which sits straight with what I was thinking about Tanking specs).

 

If its possible - I'd like to run a general rotation by you (I am aware its mostly situational, but this is something along the lines of what I have been using thus far...may be I'm way off the mark, I dont know)-

 

I'll usually load up missiles before I go in a fight, wait until full load, then run in> Stock Strike > Explsive Surge >Couple of Hammer Shots >Ion Pulse> Explosive surge (my thinking - get 2 free ones from the storm/charge whatever that skill is called, so may as well use them) Weave in Pulse Cannon if it procs> Few more Hammer Shots> Taunt > Energy Blast on every Proc> HiB> few more hammer shots (I use this a lot to make sure I don go below 80% energy to maintain max regen)> Weave in missiles in between (I time it around the 80%>50%>20% mark at their HP)> Rinse & Repeat. with the exception, I prioritize Energy blast and Pulse Cannon on every proc.

 

In between the rotations, I'll drop Reactive Shield (I try to time it with the Shield proc from Energy blast - though not always as successful:D)

 

This might read as the worst rotation with possible replies that I give up tanking to people who understand tanking. But that is exactly the reason why I'm asking.

 

Thanks for you help mate :D

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...

I'll usually load up missiles before I go in a fight, wait until full load, then run in> Stock Strike > Explsive Surge >Couple of Hammer Shots >Ion Pulse> Explosive surge (my thinking - get 2 free ones from the storm/charge whatever that skill is called, so may as well use them) Weave in Pulse Cannon if it procs> Few more Hammer Shots> Taunt > Energy Blast on every Proc> HiB> few more hammer shots (I use this a lot to make sure I don go below 80% energy to maintain max regen)> Weave in missiles in between (I time it around the 80%>50%>20% mark at their HP)> Rinse & Repeat. with the exception, I prioritize Energy blast and Pulse Cannon on every proc.

...

 

Been awhile since I tanked on my Vanguard, but shouldn't you be Stockstriking on cooldown or whenever "Static Shield" refreshes the Stockstrike cooldown? I only see you mention Stockstrike once...

 

Because of "Ion Overload", Stockstrike will trigger your Ion Cell (reducing target's damage by 5% and increasing your damage reduction by 2%). Triggering your Ion Cell will also help to build stacks of Power Screen leading to more Energy Blasts. Not to mention that Stockstrike is your hardest hitting ability.

 

What am I missing? Lately I've seen a few Vanguard tanks not using Stockstrike at all...:confused:

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Been awhile since I tanked on my Vanguard, but shouldn't you be Stockstriking on cooldown or whenever "Static Shield" refreshes the Stockstrike cooldown? I only see you mention Stockstrike once...

 

Because of "Ion Overload", Stockstrike will trigger your Ion Cell (reducing target's damage by 5% and increasing your damage reduction by 2%). Triggering your Ion Cell will also help to build stacks of Power Screen leading to more Energy Blasts. Not to mention that Stockstrike is your hardest hitting ability.

 

What am I missing? Lately I've seen a few Vanguard tanks not using Stockstrike at all...:confused:

 

Hey Zero -

 

Sorry I typed this while at work so dont think I gave out full info:p. I use Stock strike whenever its available, from what I understand- Stock Strike and ES allows me to generate and maintain aggro. the rotation I put up there is a general one I weave, but as soon as Stock Strike, Ion Cannon or Energy blast becomes available I use them.

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Hey Zero -

 

Sorry I typed this while at work so dont think I gave out full info:p. I use Stock strike whenever its available, from what I understand- Stock Strike and ES allows me to generate and maintain aggro. the rotation I put up there is a general one I weave, but as soon as Stock Strike, Ion Cannon or Energy blast becomes available I use them.

 

No worries. Like I said, lately I've seen a few Vanguard tanks not using Stockstrike at all, so I was beginning to think something had changed.

 

Seems those Vanguard tanks were just bad... :)

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If its possible - I'd like to run a general rotation by you (I am aware its mostly situational, but this is something along the lines of what I have been using thus far...may be I'm way off the mark, I dont know)-

 

No problem Galsarus! But Troopers are not really driven by a rotation, and are more driven by a priority system due to procs. I plan to actually add this to my thread but let me outline it here first, and I'll transfer it to there after.

 

I'll usually load up missiles before I go in a fight, wait until full load, then run in> Stock Strike > Explsive Surge >Couple of Hammer Shots >Ion Pulse> Explosive surge (my thinking - get 2 free ones from the storm/charge whatever that skill is called, so may as well use them) Weave in Pulse Cannon if it procs> Few more Hammer Shots> Taunt > Energy Blast on every Proc> HiB> few more hammer shots (I use this a lot to make sure I don go below 80% energy to maintain max regen)> Weave in missiles in between (I time it around the 80%>50%>20% mark at their HP)> Rinse & Repeat. with the exception, I prioritize Energy blast and Pulse Cannon on every proc.

 

There are typically two ways to open a fight as a Vanguard. Those two ways are entirely dependent on whether or not this single skill is on cooldown or not.

 

1. Mortar Volley -> Storm -> ES -> SS -> HiB -> (EB) -> (PC)

 

Mortar Volley is your strongest skill and its a pain in the *** to place while tanking. However you should take full advantage of it any pull you can. Every boss fight starts with my Mortar Volley as it gives you such a huge threat base to start off of. Storm to close and give you the two ES procs. Stockstrike to get its reset cooldown rolling and proc your Ion Cell. Your HiB is now open due to your DoT from Ion Cell. Between HiB and SS you now should have two stacks of Power Screen. As soon shield one attack you will have your three stacks required for Energy Blast which will always be fired on cooldown. Pulse Cannon is almost always procced by now, but even if it isn't you should use it. Its a very high damage skill even withoutt the proc.

 

2. SG -> Storm -> As Above.

 

If Mortar Volley is on cooldown, use Stick Grenade as your opener. Because it's a doubly delayed (Travel time + delayed damage) the NPC's won't react until your already flying through the air from Storm. They'll start closing around you, your explosive surge will give you a threat base, followed very shortly by your delayed blast from sticky.

 

Priority System

 

1. Energy Blast

 

2. Stock Strike

 

3. HiB

 

4. Static Field debuff (which should be maintained at all times)

 

5. Pulse Cannon

 

6. If all of the above are on cooldown, or you are ammo starved, Hammershot.

 

Other notes?

 

1. You have top regen until 60 cells, not 80.

 

2. Shoulder Cannon is a very difficult skill to make use of effectively. You either have to look at it as extra threat, or healing. At the start of a boss fight I'll use it as extra threat, spamming the missiles during the opening rotation. As they function off cooldown they are not noted above. All other times I'll use it for the self heal. Make sure you load it as soon as its off cooldown for that reason. If there is a big hit or set of attacks coming my way I'll want to have 4/4 missiles readied. Because I'm using it most often for the 20% health over 2s, I can not tell you when you should use it otherwise.

 

3. Make sure every rotation, especially in the opening stages, you effectively taunt boost. I'll use neural jolt on cooldown if the fight allows from the 5th skill pressed on. Only holding it in reserve if there is a tank swap, or threat drop.

Edited by Justcae
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