Did Paper Just Meet Scissors (DPS Ops)

[saido]

In the 30-54 bracket, I fought the same DPS Operative across 4/5 warzones I played today -- I was consistently decimated in each encounter; it's stun and then 'whap / whap / whap' -- followed by dead. Incredible burst. This isn't a call for a nerf, more for suggestions as to how to counter a DPS Op. Is it a case of surviving that first wave of burst?

 

In most fights, I can throw down a Kolto, fire off all my instants and in close quarters rocket-punch, flame thrower. None of these burst as such but they're good steady damage, against a high-burst melee DPS Op, whatever I throw back won't mitigate how fast I burn down.

 

If anyone's got any strategies -- please share. Reviewing an encounter like this, it's a good way to improve.

[DarthBloodloss]

I use this strategy when there is a particular nasty stealther that seems to be in love with me:

 

Save your Stun Breaker just for this guy. When he pops out of stealth and knocks you down, just Stun Break and Knockback at the same time. And then Hydraulic Overrides to put distance as you open up on him.

 

His rotation is huge if he is next to you, but his whole plan goes out the window if you get off that early knockback. If you do this to him every time he messes with you, he will likely look for easier targets eventually.

[Jenzali]

There's a number of options.

 

The first thing you should try to do is try to prevent them from getting the opener on you by pulling them out of stealth. This isn't always possible but if you've played a stealth class you can start to anticipate some patterns.

 

In a more practical situation, have your stealth scan keybound to something very easily accessible. This is because the only thing worse than them getting the opener on you is getting the opener on you twice by vanishing. As soon as you see them vanish immediately drop a scan to pull them out of stealth. You should also have this key at the ready when attacking an Operative at low health. It's usually quite predictable when they're going to vanish, and with practice you can pull them out of stealth every time to prevent them from escaping.

 

So assume they get the first opener on you. Spam Jet Boost while you are knocked down so it will immediately knock them back when you get up. If they managed to stun you a second time with Debilitate, use your CC breaker. At this point, they are far away from you. Most will try to crouch and use Explosive Probe, you have a 1.5 second window to cleanse this (it only explodes the next time you take damage) because it is their hard-hitting ranged ability. You could also try to mez them with Concussion Missile at this point and move on to another objective, or wait until they get close and use Electro Dart, hoping they'd use their CC breaker on that and then Power Surge + Concussion Missile.

 

If you're 51 or higher instead of CCing them you can use Electro Net to prevent them from rolling to you or vanishing, but I usually save that exclusively for killing healers. It should guarantee a victory in a 1v1ish battle if you kite them successfully. The key to kiting is to use Hydraulic Overrides to prevent their backstab root from keeping you in place and Jet Boost whenever possible. You can also use HO to prevent yourself from being knocked down by Hidden Strike if they do succesfully manage to vanish. If you're Arsenal, you can also use the Rocket Punch + Explosive Dart combo while kiting (the reason to use Explosive Dart rather than another instant is because Rocket Punch's root breaks after 2 seconds if they take damage, so the dart delays the damage taken and allows them to be rooted for a full 4 seconds assuming no one else is attacking the Operative)

 

If you still lose, don't worry. Operatives are the most powerful 1v1 class as proven by a lot of server tournaments And unfortunately there's no specific sequence of abilities that they will use or that you should use against them, since the entire point of stealth classes is to be unpredictable. With a little practice you should be able to beat most Operatives but the very best ones will probably still kill you every time as they have dozens of tricks up their sleeve.

Edited May 3, 2013 by Jenzali

[Jenzali]

When he pops out of stealth and knocks you down, just Stun Break and Knockback at the same time.

 

This is pretty risky - depending on who's faster, an Operative could still get their Debilitate off just as they are knocked back giving them ample time to close the gap again while you are a sitting duck. Also in my experience, CC breaking a knockdown has never really worked for me as you will keep rubber-banding back to the same position for even longer than the intended duration of the knockdown (2-4 seconds). It may be just me though.

Edited May 3, 2013 by Jenzali

[DarthBloodloss]

I never have a rubber banding problem. My toon will go from laying down to directly into the knockback animation. And if done fast enough, in theory you should always get off the knockback due to their GCD. But I do realize its a waste of a stun breaker for just the knock down but I do it for psychological reasons. I want their opening rotation to fail as miserably as possible. The idea is to convince them to look for other targets. (like I said before, I only waste the stun breaker like that when its the same guy coming after me time after time) Edited May 3, 2013 by DarthBloodloss

[Macroeconomics]

If both players (Merc Arsenal, Op Concealment) are at full health and all abilities off CD, the Operative should not be able to kill you. Well at least not easily. Yeah he will get the first strike. Yeah it will hit hard. But the Merc Arsenal will have something like 33k health. He's not going to drop you with his initial volley of abilities.

 

But even in the more realistic scenario where both players have some of their abilities on CD, the Arsenal should have a SOMETHING available to counter the initial knockdown by the Operative. RocketPunch, JetBoost, Concussion+PowerSurge, ElectroDart, ElectroNet - all of these are a significant road block to the Operative and should cause him to use up his cc breaker. You just need to manage his resolve bar.

[HexDecimalUK]

Pyro gives you a nice buff on cure if your particularly hating them, as soon as your stunned trinket and cure their dots and debuffs (these are whats killing you, the ops will get you to half health and then be stood looking at you awkwardly while start setting him on fire, then you have to be aware of the resistance they have which sheds the dots, as soon as it ends surge/CC them and heal yourself (8seconds use 2 rapid scans and 1 heal scan) they will be screaming at you while you do this and then you should have your TD/FM back and enough time to stick them while they are still sleeping and enough of their lesser dots still on you that they cant use the same tactic bwahaha, beat the hell out of them like a Powertech on a jawa while the burn ticks their life off. rarely fails

 

arsenal just run away less you have electro net.

[Flintfire]

I play an operative and a merc, so based on my own rotations, heres what I would do,

 

They come out of stealth. That is all of their openings. Two of their hard hitting attacks are when they are behind you. Stalth scan is a powerful tool and cost no heat. Use it whenever you can, and in places that are off to your side because a good stealther knows if they are seen, you do not want to be in front of your target. They always try to sneak around back, remember that. If you knock them out far enough away, as a 30m dps class, you can do substantial damage to them before they do anything. Also remember kolto missile and healing scan are two great moves to quick heal yourself, use that because an operative at that distance really only has explosive probe as a 30m major attack, though that is a really hard hitting one. Assuming that you are on pyrotech, heres what you do. If you get the better of them, they will try to vanish. But you want that kill. Thermal detonator and explosive dart still stick to them when they vanish, and when they explode, it pulls them out of stealth. It is a lot of luck, but if you can time it right, get one on them to pull them out. Dont use them both at once cuz if they are on cool down when they try to vanish, you lost them unless you can quickly stealth scan or AOE the surrounding area to shreds. Really, you can get a good kill if you can stop them at the root while they are stealthing. If you see one in stelath and miss it, put TSO on instantly, so their opener wont stop you. Jet Boost their ***, and go to town with your standard roation. I wont tell you any specific rotation cuz you probably know your own rotation, lol. And dont be afraid to rocket punch and run if they come close, thats kind of our own secret knockback.

[Choffware]

Basically you need to be ready for it and do what others have said. I don't use my electo net at all when burning targets... I save it for classes that turn on me. I don't use it in my general dps rotation. So like the other tips... your first order of business is to escape the OP then if you can get away and heal hit him with the net and open up on them while kiting...