Jnight Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 While I agree that other people linking their meter is annoying, I do miss being able to easily track my own performance. Sure things die, but could they die more efficiently? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caelrie Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 Cool a lot of us were discussing that this morning on Google and if there is a discrepancy I think both sides deserve clarification on the issue. The file name in question is fan_sum_02_qa_georg_zoeller.mp3 Maybe you can look too and someone will have it cached. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imspecial Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 As soon as there is a way to read the combat log I will have a working meter for self use, RIFT had a meter LONG before addons where allowed. As long as the combat log is readable there is software out there from other MMO's that can parse it after You alter the spell names and player names in the software. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chambered Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 Totally agree, keep the DPS meters out. When you don't have numbers it makes everyone focus on the overall experience which is a much more positive thing. Vanilla WoW showed this in spades, and I'd agree that my experiences so far in SWTOR are the same. How often are those meters even accurate anyways? Like others have said, when you put meters in the game people start playing in different ways just to be at the top of the meters. So instead of a DPS holding back a bit and making sure to interrupt at every opportunity, you have them spamming every attack they can instead - end result being a harder fight for your party overall. If you can't notice the healer off in the corner picking his nose while his group constantly dies, or the DPS that breaks CC every fight, or the tank that can't hold aggro - you've got bigger problems, because you don't need meters to see that. You only need meters to see the minuscule differences between an elitist jerk, and a normal player. The only 'meters' I think there should be in-game are training dummies - similar to the ones in Rift. You attack the dummy, when it 'dies' it spits out stats to anyone that damaged it - you did X damage over Y time (DPS), you did this percentage of damage, this was your biggest hit, etc. That way you can test out builds and rotations for yourself, and figure out what works well for you without pulling all that baggage into actual groups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlpsStranger Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 Those are examples of us adapting to the world, not the other way around. We invented air conditioning to cope with hot weather, we did not in fact make the weather in that region cooler, same as the others. Fire was a discovery not an invention of man, it is a tool we use to help us adapt. This analogy is way past tortured. The fact is that theorycraft is part of the established MMORPG culture and we need numbers. This argument is over, your side is completely 100% wrong and has no merit whatsoever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeroburrito Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 i agree. i can finally watch tv and do other things while i do flashpoints and heroics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yfelsung Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 Those are examples of us adapting to the world, not the other way around. We invented air conditioning to cope with hot weather, we did not in fact make the weather in that region cooler, same as the others. Fire was a discovery not an invention of man, it is a tool we use to help us adapt. Yes, because we've never built an island. Never dug a lake. Never SPLIT TWO CONTINENTS BY BUILDING THE PANAMA CANAL. Never cleared entire forests and altered the elevation of the land. Never turned a swamp into a city (NOLA, anyone?) It's not like we don't have enough nukes to turn this place into any kind of desert we want. Again, where did you get your shunt installed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scerion Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 Bring the player, not the dps meter. Back in WoW I pugged a lot in dungeons and raids - my mage and DK could put out ridiculous DPS (could spike up to 50k dps on the mage - avg ~30k no joke). However, I would always rather be grouped with someone doing 10k who was polite to some ******e spamming recount and acting like a tool. In fact I did initiate vote-kicks multiple times against some idiot raging about someone elses DPS. If a dungeon only requires an avg of 30k between the group, and the healer/tank are fine, who the hell cares what the dps are doing? (I also played healer and tank up to the Firelands raids before I stopped playing) It's mostly the little kids who somehow think someone's getting something slightly easier than themselves so they start to pout, sulk and whine in groups. It's just pressing buttons - it's not life and death. I would say grow up, but a lot of them are just children and lack the maturity to understand how stupid they act. Combat logs = great tool to analyse problems in a raid.DPS meter = pressure on DPS to pop CDs and pull aggro, and healers to spamheal and waste mana - I've seen it time and time again. Groups that ignore DPS meters always have a lot more fun than the idiots who think MMOs are "serious business". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlpsStranger Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 i agree. i can finally watch tv and do other things while i do flashpoints and heroics. This isn't far from the truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myls Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 That's a false dilemma. You can't top the meters if you're dead, so the best players are doing everything you want AND playing their class well too. I didn't say anything about being dead.. Its a fact and I've seen it that you can output substantial dps while soaking unecessary damage, and a lot of people soak damage because they aren't paying attention to whats going on and watching a damage meter. We're arguing a mod, not stock in a game, is somehow better for its community because its supposed to optimize player performance and I'm telling you its not always the case because it leads to more issues, such as awareness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airinya Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 Its gonna be fun to guess who's AFK watching their favorite T.V. Program while trying to down heroics raids Yeah... can't tell the people who are doing that without damage meters... oh wait... yes you can... For a second I forgot people used to raid before meters... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayble Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 Hate to say it but if they removed cross faction tells because of people using them to harass other players, doubt they are going to ADD something to the game that people can use just as easily to ruin other gamers enjoyment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlpsStranger Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 Yeah... can't tell the people who are doing that without damage meters... oh wait... yes you can... For a second I forgot people used to raid before meters... I can remember parsing damage in like mid 2000. It wasn't a real time addon, but we did have hard numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stugotz Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 (edited) Damage meters are for the youngsters who think bragging about a video game means something. Others would rather just relax and play the game. Edited December 21, 2011 by Stugotz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokeytehpenguin Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 (edited) Those are examples of us adapting to the world, not the other way around. We invented air conditioning to cope with hot weather, we did not in fact make the weather in that region cooler, same as the others. Fire was a discovery not an invention of man, it is a tool we use to help us adapt. You are wrong. The vary nature of my ability to tell you that you are wrong is prof that you are, indeed wrong. Man, hungry....Man cold....Man evole in a way to adept to being cold and hungry? Man move away to warm weather? F THAT man manipulate the world around us to make fire, now man full and warm despite the cold. Edited December 21, 2011 by Pokeytehpenguin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurnea Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 Yeah... can't tell the people who are doing that without damage meters... oh wait... yes you can... For a second I forgot people used to raid before meters... And they often used to guess wrong at who wasn't performing. "Bill has been just auto-attacking the whole time, let's bring someone else." "What? No I wasn't, I was using my rotation the whole time!" "Oh yeah? Prove it." "Well, I can't with any real numbers because there are no meters..." "See, he's a baddie! Kick him out of the raid!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airinya Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 I can remember parsing damage in like mid 2000. It wasn't a real time addon, but we did have hard numbers. MMOS have been around since long before 2000 my friend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhit Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 It is so nice not having damage meters. No one can tell what a baddie I am. Love being carried by a group of three! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GalacticKegger Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 Yeah... can't tell the people who are doing that without damage meters... oh wait... yes you can... For a second I forgot people used to raid before meters...That mon ami scores a bullseye... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurnea Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 Damage meters are for the youngsters who think bragging about a video game means something. Others would rather just relax and play the game. Theory-crafting's been around for a long time. Remember the old discussions about how to best level a kensai/mage for maximum damage? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airinya Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 And they often used to guess wrong at who wasn't performing. "Bill has been just auto-attacking the whole time, let's bring someone else." "What? No I wasn't, I was using my rotation the whole time!" "Oh yeah? Prove it." "Well, I can't with any real numbers because there are no meters..." "See, he's a baddie! Kick him out of the raid!" Uhhh no.. no they didn't. Not sure what kind of group you used to raid with or why you think it's ok to externalize your poor experience to millions of players. One thing is fact though, people raided before damage meters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeelol Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 It is so nice not having damage meters. No one can tell what a baddie I am. Love being carried by a group of three! Yea im gonna start spamming normal attack all the way to winning every piece of loot that i don't even need. Many fun times ahead! =D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FerrusPA Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 MMOS have been around since long before 2000 my friend. True, Everquest, the first MMO with what can be called raids, came out in '99. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlpsStranger Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 MMOS have been around since long before 2000 my friend. Honestly, who cares about "The Realm" or "Meridian 59" when discussing something like this. We used to use graph paper in dungeon crawlers too, who the **** cares when discussing game design in 2011? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yfelsung Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 MMOS have been around since long before 2000 my friend. And back in those days we usually had an ABUNDANCE of data that we could filter into spreadsheets and do the math ourselves anyway. We don't have the mods and we don't have the data, we'd be fine with either. If we have the data, we can just make our own methods of parsing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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