TyrKartelos Posted April 8, 2013 Share Posted April 8, 2013 Just wondering if anyone has put any thought into using missile blast now that we can fire off three in a row for 0 heat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PerinnAybara Posted April 8, 2013 Share Posted April 8, 2013 They changed that. It's just two blasts that do 10% more damage than live version. So no, not viable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TyrKartelos Posted April 8, 2013 Author Share Posted April 8, 2013 is there still a heat cost? And when did they change that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Choffware Posted April 8, 2013 Share Posted April 8, 2013 it was never 0 heat. The heat penalty got tacked on after the 3rd missile. But they changed it because the mechanic didn't really work in practice. Most players couldn't get 3 missiles off before the heat penalty kicked in... Now when you press it 2 missiles auto fire with the damage of 2 normal missiles + 10% and but less heat than of 2 normal missiles but i don't remember the heat difference... might be 50%... Either way it has marginal and small situational benefits but nothing great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daemonson Posted April 8, 2013 Share Posted April 8, 2013 Just wondering if anyone has put any thought into using missile blast now that we can fire off three in a row for 0 heat. It is essentially a 25 heat cost ability that hits for less than TM/PS. It is not free and not viable at all in most situations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkXXIV Posted April 8, 2013 Share Posted April 8, 2013 (edited) how is no one fired over merc? what in the hell is going on... the devs can't seriously be this stupid. People have been telling them to fix this freakin class for months and months. The devs even responded 6months+ ago and most recently 2-3weeks ago. this is just awful, is it really that hard to make a class not suck? They seem to know how to balance some of the specs just fine, just none of mercs... I don't think they even care because there is no excuse for this. I don't care if they got a 4 year old or a dog balancing the classes for pvp, its been how many months?... Hire one of the players, Im sure they can easily find someone who can actually fix the class and would be willing to do it for free. I wanted to get my merc level 50 during 2x but didn't even bother wasting my time on a class that the devs don't even care about. I feel like the 2x was planned just so that mercs could reroll another class, I sure as hell did. Edited April 8, 2013 by MarkXXIV Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daemonson Posted April 8, 2013 Share Posted April 8, 2013 how is no one fired over merc? what in the hell is going on... the devs can't seriously be this stupid. People have been telling them to fix this freakin class for months and months. The devs even responded 6months+ ago and most recently 2-3weeks ago. this is just awful, is it really that hard to make a class not suck? They seem to know how to balance some of the specs just fine, just none of mercs... I don't think they even care because there is no excuse for this. I don't care if they got a 4 year old or a dog balancing the classes for pvp, its been how many months?... Hire one of the players, Im sure they can easily find someone who can actually fix the class and would be willing to do it for free. I wanted to get my merc level 50 during 2x but didn't even bother wasting my time on a class that the devs don't even care about. I feel like the 2x was planned just so that mercs could reroll another class, I sure as hell did. If you don't have a merc that you play regularly then you really can't complain... about anything. My main has been merc since pre-release. As an arsenal merc I consistently top DPS charts in PvE running HM TFB/ NiM Denova and in PvP I have few issues. Merc is an incredibly useful class in pvp if you know what you are doing. As a person with lots of experience playing merc I can say that mercs are getting guite a few good upgrades for PvP, not much to complain about here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkXXIV Posted April 8, 2013 Share Posted April 8, 2013 (edited) If you don't have a merc that you play regularly then you really can't complain... about anything. My main has been merc since pre-release. As an arsenal merc I consistently top DPS charts in PvE running HM TFB/ NiM Denova and in PvP I have few issues. Merc is an incredibly useful class in pvp if you know what you are doing. As a person with lots of experience playing merc I can say that mercs are getting guite a few good upgrades for PvP, not much to complain about here. I had a merc but im not stupid enough to level it to 50.( i started this game about a month ago merc has sucked since long before I started playing, I have a life and haven't had time to level a class that is worthless for serious pvp). You say merc is fine? Tell that to the other 50 merc and people doing ranked war zone. I don't care about pve, pve is easymode, and I play on a pvp server. Endgame is all about pvp for me and probally most players(at least on my server). I don't want merc to suck it is probally my favorite class and I would like it to be as good as powertech is pre 2.0 but merc is probally the worst pvp class in the game its really not that hard to figure out. This is how I found out merc sucks for pvp. -No serious team is taking merc to ranked warzone -Merc have by far the most pvp complaints in the forums -Just comparing it to other classes myself(skills/trees, what other classes say about themselves) -Compare it to sniper and compare the sniper threads to the merc threads. Its pretty depressing even though I have a 50 sniper. -Talked to players who have experience with merc in level 50 warzones( most 50 merc will tell you the class is bad for pvp, not because they don't like the class but because it sucks, they admit it, and they want something done about it). http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=548897 http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=615624 http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=617025 http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=154657 Tell these people that merc is fine for pvp... People like you confusing the devs is probally the reason why merc will never be rwz viable ever again. Thanks to people like you confusing the devs I have a 50 sniper now instead of a merc... I doubt merc will be fixed in 2.0 but if powertech is no longer as strong as it is now, then I will roll a merc since I like the class slighty more than powertech and I need the legacy skills anyway. Edited April 8, 2013 by MarkXXIV Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthBloodloss Posted April 8, 2013 Share Posted April 8, 2013 (edited) This guy above is such a troll. All he does is post in every Merc topic about how bad they will suck until the end of time. No one cares man, its a game!!! ------------------ And the new Missile Blast is huge in PvP, especially as an opener (or even just a snare). Considering you used to use Incendiary Missile (horrible damage / high heat) just to get the target burning, as an opener. Now, the new opener still sets them on fire, but also: -deals more damage -100% chance for snare -same heat So you decide for yourself. (Can also be used as 30m snare...its not just an opener) Edited April 8, 2013 by DarthBloodloss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkXXIV Posted April 8, 2013 Share Posted April 8, 2013 (edited) This guy above is such a troll. All he does is post in every Merc topic about how bad they will suck until the end of time. No one cares man, its a game!!! ------------------ And the new Missile Blast is huge in PvP, especially as an opener (or even just a snare). Considering you used to use Incendiary Missile (horrible damage / high heat) just to get the target burning, as an opener. Now, the new opener still sets them on fire, but also: -deals more damage -100% chance for snare -same heat So you decide for yourself. (Can also be used as 30m snare...its not just an opener) thats funny, the merc forum must be full of troll threads to you then huh? It must be one big troll, merc is fine guys mybad sorry about that. Ima go get mine level 50 now and go get a rwz team because every rwz team needs a merc! Brb dropping my sniper for a merc because merc are way better than sniper in every way possible... Its a game that some of us care about and some of us like the merc class and some of us want it to be a good pvp class. powertech is an example of a good pvp class(hopefully it doesn't suck after the 2.0 nerf). If you say its just a game and you don't care what happens in it, then why are you even posting? Alot of us including myself care and thats why we still play this game and why we use the forums... Fyi this is a proper troll http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=617025 Its not a troll wondering if it might be 2014 or 2015 before mercs pvp issues are resolved. its been 6months+ and not much has changed. Edited April 8, 2013 by MarkXXIV Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoomazir Posted April 8, 2013 Share Posted April 8, 2013 Leave these pugs alone, they don't even dare to come anymore on the pvp forum because after all their e-peen talk about how mercs are awesome they still don't have anything to back it up. As always, in PVE the merc is okay, in PVP... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anfo Posted April 8, 2013 Share Posted April 8, 2013 (edited) If you don't have a merc that you play regularly then you really can't complain... about anything. My main has been merc since pre-release. As an arsenal merc I consistently top DPS charts in PvE running HM TFB/ NiM Denova and in PvP I have few issues. Merc is an incredibly useful class in pvp if you know what you are doing. As a person with lots of experience playing merc I can say that mercs are getting guite a few good upgrades for PvP, not much to complain about here. LOLOLOLOL, nice troll, Either you play against bads or you are one yourself to not recognize how bad mercs are in rated PVP, that's why there are no rated pvp mercs. Gotta be a troll , no one could be this herp/derp. Edited April 8, 2013 by anfo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthBloodloss Posted April 8, 2013 Share Posted April 8, 2013 thats funny, the merc forum must be full of troll threads to you then huh? It must be one big troll, merc is fine guys mybad sorry about that. Ima go get mine level 50 now and go get a rwz team because every rwz team needs a merc! Brb dropping my sniper for a merc because merc are way better than sniper in every way possible... Its a game that some of us care about and some of us like the merc class and some of us want it to be a good pvp class. powertech is an example of a good pvp class(hopefully it doesn't suck after the 2.0 nerf). If you say its just a game and you don't care what happens in it, then why are you even posting? Alot of us including myself care and thats why we still play this game and why we use the forums... Fyi this is a proper troll http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=617025 Its not a troll wondering if it might be 2014 or 2015 before mercs pvp issues are resolved. its been 6months+ and not much has changed. Dude. He asked about missile blast. What are you even responding to? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkXXIV Posted April 9, 2013 Share Posted April 9, 2013 (edited) Dude. He asked about missile blast. What are you even responding to? Quote: Originally Posted by DarthBloodloss This guy above is such a troll. All he does is post in every Merc topic about how bad they will suck until the end of time. No one cares man, its a game!!! thats what i was responding to. Save the merc! Edited April 9, 2013 by MarkXXIV Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthBloodloss Posted April 9, 2013 Share Posted April 9, 2013 (edited) how is no one fired over merc? what in the hell is going on... the devs can't seriously be this stupid. People have been telling them to fix this freakin class for months and months. The devs even responded 6months+ ago and most recently 2-3weeks ago. this is just awful, is it really that hard to make a class not suck? They seem to know how to balance some of the specs just fine, just none of mercs... I don't think they even care because there is no excuse for this. I don't care if they got a 4 year old or a dog balancing the classes for pvp, its been how many months?... Hire one of the players, Im sure they can easily find someone who can actually fix the class and would be willing to do it for free. I wanted to get my merc level 50 during 2x but didn't even bother wasting my time on a class that the devs don't even care about. I feel like the 2x was planned just so that mercs could reroll another class, I sure as hell did. He asked about Missile Blast and this is your response. A wall of text complaining about everything EXCEPT Missile Blast. Edited April 9, 2013 by DarthBloodloss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkXXIV Posted April 9, 2013 Share Posted April 9, 2013 (edited) He asked about Missile Blast and this is your response. A wall of text complaining about everything EXCEPT Missile Blast. i wrote that after reading the first few post. the class has enough problems and the dam missile blast isn't even fixed according to the first few posters. Im just kinda hoping a dev reads these threads and runs into my post and maybe decides to work on the class... Im not really sure what else I can do to have an impact on the class being fixed for pvp. I want to play it now but I will not play a class that no one wants for rwz. I might level it to 55 though if pt is no longer powerful and then shelf my merc. Edited April 9, 2013 by MarkXXIV Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthBloodloss Posted April 9, 2013 Share Posted April 9, 2013 Yea I thought they were pretty wrong about missle blast in the first few posts. But then I realized they are just talking about PvE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cody-licious Posted April 9, 2013 Share Posted April 9, 2013 i wrote that after reading the first few post. the class has enough problems and the dam missile blast isn't even fixed according to the first few posters. Im just kinda hoping a dev reads these threads and runs into my post and maybe decides to work on the class... Im not really sure what else I can do to have an impact on the class being fixed for pvp. I want to play it now but I will not play a class that no one wants for rwz. I might level it to 55 though if pt is no longer powerful and then shelf my merc. So let me get this right: 1. you don't have a level 50 Merc, 2. you have never played a level 50 Merc, and 3. don't intend playing a level 50-55 Merc? Now, your reasons for all 3 of these scenarios may be valid in your own mind, but they don't give you authority to pontificate about the positive or negative status of the Merc in either endgame PvE or PvP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthBloodloss Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 (edited) (IMO) The best use of Missile Blast in PvP (for Pyro Merc): Missile Blast and Incendiary Missile are very similar abilities. Im at work so my numbers may be a tad off, but here's how I look at it: (note that my numbers are from level 51 in PvE gear, further adding to slight deviation) Incendiary Missile: Does about 700 direct damage, and then about 1800(?) as a DoT over 18 seconds. Missile Blast: Does about 900 direct damage, and then about 1000 as DoT over 9 seconds (from the proc). So we see here that as far as damage is concerned, the IM has a slight advantage. But when you factor in the ability for Railshot to refresh the Missile Blast DoT, this brings their damage even closer since it almost doubles the burn damage (due to extra duration, bringing it about equal to IM). So basically, the damage is not the deciding factor. Its weather or not you need to snare the opponent. Default Opener: Incendiary Missile Opener to use on a non-leaping melee class (Operative, Powertech, Assassin): Missile Blast Opener on a leaping class that has already lept at you: Knockback, followed by Missile Blast Opener on a leaping class that has NOT yet lept at you: Incendiary Missile (or skip that and start with Thermal Det), and then wait for the leap so you can Knockback and Missile Blast. **If your Knockback is not available at this point, use Stun Dart (and Chaff/Degauss if needed) and just run away. I save these 3 abilities strictly for melee toons that got too close. When someone leaps at you, its your first priority to react defensively. Don't try to squeeze in another Thermal....just use defense and get out of there. And we haven't even BEGUN to have fun with Electro Net yet... Edited April 10, 2013 by DarthBloodloss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkXXIV Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 (edited) So let me get this right: 1. you don't have a level 50 Merc, 2. you have never played a level 50 Merc, and 3. don't intend playing a level 50-55 Merc? Now, your reasons for all 3 of these scenarios may be valid in your own mind, but they don't give you authority to pontificate about the positive or negative status of the Merc in either endgame PvE or PvP. i could make a lv50 merc in 1-2weeks if i wanted one. ive done enough research to know that it would be a waste of my time even though i like the class which is why i dont have a 50 merc. I am assuming merc dps still sucks in 2.0 but i have now decided to roll the class anyway and just wait for a fix. I will have a 50 merc shortly unless i decide to quit it and get my pt 50 instead. stop acting like this game is so complicated, i can use the internet... not that hard to obtain information and sort it out... Edited April 10, 2013 by MarkXXIV Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaosmadness Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 I had a merc but im not stupid enough to level it to 50.( i started this game about a month ago merc has sucked since long before I started playing, I have a life and haven't had time to level a class that is worthless for serious pvp). You say merc is fine? Tell that to the other 50 merc and people doing ranked war zone. I don't care about pve, pve is easymode, and I play on a pvp server. Endgame is all about pvp for me and probally most players(at least on my server). I don't want merc to suck it is probally my favorite class and I would like it to be as good as powertech is pre 2.0 but merc is probally the worst pvp class in the game its really not that hard to figure out. This is how I found out merc sucks for pvp. -No serious team is taking merc to ranked warzone -Merc have by far the most pvp complaints in the forums -Just comparing it to other classes myself(skills/trees, what other classes say about themselves) -Compare it to sniper and compare the sniper threads to the merc threads. Its pretty depressing even though I have a 50 sniper. -Talked to players who have experience with merc in level 50 warzones( most 50 merc will tell you the class is bad for pvp, not because they don't like the class but because it sucks, they admit it, and they want something done about it). http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=548897 http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=615624 http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=617025 http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=154657 Tell these people that merc is fine for pvp... People like you confusing the devs is probally the reason why merc will never be rwz viable ever again. Thanks to people like you confusing the devs I have a 50 sniper now instead of a merc... I doubt merc will be fixed in 2.0 but if powertech is no longer as strong as it is now, then I will roll a merc since I like the class slighty more than powertech and I need the legacy skills anyway. How can you say this ***** about Mercenary class if you DON'T have a lv 50 Merc ? lol.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macroeconomics Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 Missile Salvo is almost worthless. Using it rather than IM is a huge mistake. That is because the CGC burn is separate from the IM burn. So by using Missile Salvo first you just eliminated most of the benefit of using Rapid Shots, which becomes solely a heat shunt. I can't take seriously the opinions of anyone who thinks Missile Salvo is a good opener for a single target attack pattern. The correct use of Missile Salvo is to rapidly target a separate enemy when your main target has applied a high effectiveness defense cooldown, then switch back to your main target. That's because Missile Salvo's CGC effect will apply to a second target, in contrast to CGC from other direct ranged attacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthBloodloss Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 (edited) Somewhat of a new rotation I have been considering. Not enough time to fully test yet but here's the basics. I'm trying to find a way to have the CGC burn during the whole fight, and use as little Rapid Shots as possible. (Yes I realize this is slightly heat intensive but in PvP you aren't planning for a 5 min encounter): 1) Incendiary Missile 2) Missile Blast (You COULD use Rapid Shots here, but why risk it not proccing CGC) You now have 6 seconds to Rail Shot and keep the burn going 3) Thermal Det (-1.5s) 4) Explosive Dart (-3s) 5) Fusion Missile (Normally I use this later in the rotation, but using it here lets the CGC burn 1 more time before refreshing) (-4.5s) 6) Railshot (refreshes CGC) 6s timer starts again 7) Unload (-3s) 8) Rocket Punch (Normally I use this later in the rotation, but using it here lets the CGC burn 1 more time before refreshing) (-4.5s) 7) Railshot (refreshes CGC) 6s timer starts again 8) Rapid Shot (-1.5s) 9) Rapid Shot (-3s) 1) Back to the top, starting again with Incendiary Missile (-4.5s) 2) Missile Blast (refreshes CGC) etc I realize that there are several potential hiccups in this rotation. Its not a standard 100% useable thing. For one, Unload may not refresh Railshot. Another thing is that you can only use this exact rotation on the first pass. After you cycle back to the top, heat should be starting to build as well as Fusion Missile won't be ready to use. For extended fights, I may be popping vent heat midway through the first rotation. And as habit I always use Power Surge + Thermal Override on Fusion Missile. (not always required but its just habit) Edited April 10, 2013 by DarthBloodloss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthBloodloss Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 The last thing Im trying to do here is start an arguement lol...but heres more randomness from me: The correct use of Missile Salvo is to rapidly target a separate enemy when your main target has applied a high effectiveness defense cooldown, then switch back to your main target. That's because Missile Salvo's CGC effect will apply to a second target, in contrast to CGC from other direct ranged attacks. If we are talking about temporarily hitting a secondary target and then switching back to primary, wouldn't it just be best to use IM on the secondary target since it does more damage even when you factor in CGC on the Missile Blast? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killmaimburn Posted April 11, 2013 Share Posted April 11, 2013 i could make a lv50 merc in 1-2weeks if i wanted one. ive done enough research to know that it would be a waste of my time even though i like the class which is why i dont have a 50 merc. I am assuming merc dps still sucks in 2.0 but i have now decided to roll the class anyway and just wait for a fix. I will have a 50 merc shortly unless i decide to quit it and get my pt 50 instead. stop acting like this game is so complicated, i can use the internet... not that hard to obtain information and sort it out... So you're saying you do not have a max level mercenary? And you are posting here because? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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