Fixes for PvP!

[Tragamite]

I feel I have brought a few ideas to help PvP out.

 

Expertise vs Gear:

I know 2.0 is bringing a new look expertise and bolster system but many people feel that gear is an unfair advantage for a seasoned PvPer against a new PvPer. Well to limit this gap is offer expertise gear sets from 10-55 and let bolster system match a player based on PvP gear level to player. Additionally the type of gear should effect PvP stats. Tank gear should effect defense first then damage and lastly healing while healers gear effects heals first then defense and lastly damage and a DPS set effects damage first then healing and lastly defenses.

 

Queueing and group finder:

Part of PvP is experience and we have a means of knowing that experience using Valor. Now currently that only speaks for that character and not the player. Add a legacy valor system that could be used to match players better based on overall WZ experience. Utilize the PvE role selector to PvP allowing players to match with players looking for better composition.

 

WZs vs RWZ:

Ranked War Zones are offered as a means for guilds to PvP together or establish a good cohesive group to match up against other organized groups. WZs should not be q stomping ground for these groups waiting to be matched in RWZs. Add a group queue for WZs for 3-8 man groups. Solo queues would be limited to 2 or less to be matched together. Add solo queues to ranked in the same fashion as preseason and the seasons are for organized groups of 8 and eventually 16.

 

Quitter penalty vs reason to stay:

Most of us agree it is wrong to punish someone who has to leave a WZ for RL issues or is forced out to no fault of their own but it should not be celebrated that leaving a WZ in progress is ok so what is the incentive to stay? The MVP system could be revamped to award players better. Maybe a voting system or give each player 3 MVP votes and the one with the most gets a PvP bonus bag.

[Tragamite]

WZ Voidstar:

One of the most challenging difficult and frustrating place to play. Personally I don't feel like this WZ needs a fix. To me it is the best combat oriented WZ. When good teams match up and no one makes progress it can be frustrating to receive a loss. It is the only WZ that needs a tie finish as that is a completely probable result. Progressing TO the point the other team did even at a faster pace should not seal the victory you should need surpass the other team for a victory. 1st team made it to 3rd blockade 2nd team should still need to beat the 4th obstacle to secure the win or face a tie!

 

WZ Civil War:

The most contested WZ with fleeing and come backs. The WZ has a nasty habit of forcing a team to 3 cap to make a comeback. This forces many people to give up and others to flee the WZ in hopes of a better match up. What I could see is if the center gun did exactly the same damage as the two side guns combined then the objective of owning mid would be very important. A team down could take the center gun and then deal 3x the damage to catch up and even win quickly.

 

WZ Huttball:

This game is perfect as is. Teams can score quickly either to win or come back.

 

WZ Novare Coast:

Another game that has a capability to go from devastating loss to victory if players can adjust tactics and not just sounder and give up. It is just a matter of players will.

 

WZ Ancient Hypergate:

One of the more confusing WZs in that there are multiple ways to score and win. It confuses a lot of players who think that others are playing the WZ incorrect even though they are trying to bring the team a victory. It would help to have an intro to the map that shows the map the objectives and briefing on ways one makes points in the match. We have a cut scene for NC and VS whynot were

[jolleebindu]

What do you want the tiebreaker for VS to be? You say you don't want the timing to be it, so what would be better?

 

On a side note though, I don't think 1 roll should be greatly favored over all others for team comp for any "round" during a wz. The fact that, on defense, your team is better off with >1/2 healers is a problem. That is not to say I have any particular fix for it, outside of a dynamic trauma debuff.

 

 

I could see an educational intro for AH being helpful to new players, good idea.

Edited March 27, 2013 by jolleebindu

[Tragamite]

What do you want the tiebreaker for VS to be? You say you don't want the timing to be it, so what would be better?

 

On a side note though, I don't think 1 roll should be greatly favored over all others for team comp for any "round" during a wz. The fact that, on defense, your team is better off with >1/2 healers is a problem. That is not to say I have any particular fix for it, outside of a dynamic trauma debuff.

 

 

I could see an educational intro for AH being helpful to new players, good idea.

 

In the event of progression in VS ties would still be decided by time or they could be ended as a tie. The latter should be the case in a 0-0 match as no one clearly won the match. If team A makes it across the bridge and gets stopped then team B goes and opens the bridge the match should not end at that moment I think team B should still need to open the second set of doors to stop the timer and win at that moment however who ever progressed further in less time could be awarded a victory in a 2-2

[Briggs_Knightly]

The fix for PVP in SWTOR is to play a different game.

 

The developers have failed to offer a game with any balance.

They have failed to act in a reasonable time to things that everyone else knows.

(well except for to 5% that will argue against anything no matter how obvious it is)

Each time they try and fix something, they make things worse somehow.

 

And the big kicker... they fail to listen to their subscribers.

Why would they now listen to you???

[Tragamite]

Thanks for your constructive comments I'm sure they will help progressing the game.

[MidichIorian]

I would like to tweak the hell out of VS and to some degree AHG too.

 

VS, it's an extremely random and boring map in the majority of normal warzones. As a player with a "above average" clue of what's going on I'm still not able to be everywhere at once, to make up for my random team mates shortcomings. The luck with the barrier is more often then not determining the outcomes of games and this could be prevented by instead of having a barrier add some form of path and drop-down in the area where the mid fence is open. It would give cappers time to cap but also make sure that spawn times were consistent. No one plans deaths according to the barrier in normal warzones so it's stupid that you lose/win just because one team was lucky enough to get really short spawns while the other had full barriers a couple of times. I wouldnt mind going back to the old "open" version of VS too.

 

AHG, the spawn barrier is taking way, WAY, too long and it makes up for one of the most boring game mechanics I've ever expereinced. Worst is if you're unlucky enough to die close to round-reset. Then you'll first have to wait for the barrier and then probably for the bomb to go off too. Having to wait for 30 secs shouldnt be on the table.

They also need to work out a system that people understand. I have on several occassions been two-capped in normal warzones and still had team mates running for orbs in the next round. They fail to realize that they could run 200 orbs and it still wouldnt turn the game. And the warzone is in theory so easy to win as long as everyone is on the same page; own mid, ignore orbs and you can be pretty sure that the other team will have atleast have two people trying to run orbs and by doing so are becoming easy targets that you can farm kills from. There's really no point in playing the "objective" other than grabbing and keeping one pylon in normal warzones. Outcome; really random and boring warzone.

[Tragamite]

VS, it's an extremely random and boring map in the majority of normal warzones. As a player with a "above average" clue of what's going on I'm still not able to be everywhere at once, to make up for my random team mates shortcomings. The luck with the barrier is more often then not determining the outcomes of games and this could be prevented by instead of having a barrier add some form of path and drop-down in the area where the mid fence is open. It would give cappers time to cap but also make sure that spawn times were consistent. No one plans deaths according to the barrier in normal warzones so it's stupid that you lose/win just because one team was lucky enough to get really short spawns while the other had full barriers a couple of times. I wouldnt mind going back to the old "open" version of VS too.

 

Personally I think this map has the most action to it. While I can agree with you that MANY times it is luck with the barrier that allows a win/loss. Granted one could time the barrier but it is difficult to really plan your own death in most cases. I would like to see a tunnel from the defender attack points with multiple drop out points but that go from the spawn point accross the zone. It would make it interesting if the defenders could attempt to get accross on the barriers rather then just having to wait for the bridges to open and the enemy rush.

 

AHG, the spawn barrier is taking way, WAY, too long and it makes up for one of the most boring game mechanics I've ever expereinced. Worst is if you're unlucky enough to die close to round-reset. Then you'll first have to wait for the barrier and then probably for the bomb to go off too. Having to wait for 30 secs shouldnt be on the table.

They also need to work out a system that people understand. I have on several occassions been two-capped in normal warzones and still had team mates running for orbs in the next round. They fail to realize that they could run 200 orbs and it still wouldnt turn the game. And the warzone is in theory so easy to win as long as everyone is on the same page; own mid, ignore orbs and you can be pretty sure that the other team will have atleast have two people trying to run orbs and by doing so are becoming easy targets that you can farm kills from. There's really no point in playing the "objective" other than grabbing and keeping one pylon in normal warzones. Outcome; really random and boring warzone.

 

While I understand your take on this and I'll agree on the respawn waiting I find it rather eventful. What tweeks would you make to this WZ? Remove the respawn barrier? Change the game mechanic for objectives?

[MidichIorian]

While I understand your take on this and I'll agree on the respawn waiting I find it rather eventful. What tweeks would you make to this WZ? Remove the respawn barrier? Change the game mechanic for objectives?

The vast majority of "normal" players seem to think that running orbs is the best strategy, regardless of current score, so the easiest approach would simply be to make it just that. I believe they've already tweaked the objective points on orbs in atleast one patch but it's still not good enough since people still run orbs to no avail. Non-orb-carrier kills should have no effect on the outcome, other than indirectly when establishing control, all points should be based on gathered orbs and kills of orb carriers. Scoring orbs should obviously be worth more than killing a carrier, otherwise you'd only have to take the lead and camp mid without ever touching an orb again.The thing BW was going for with this gametype is too complex for its own good and it will always be a challenge to distribute points in an ideal way. This is one of the reaons to why i think they should completely let go of the idea of creating plausible scenarios. Story is for PvE and 99 % of all PvP'ers couldnt give a rats *** why they have to go get a flag or whatever.

 

As for the barrier, i don't feel that the barrier on AHG has a huge impact on the outcome of normal warzones, it's just incredibly annoying. I don't think having a much shorter barrier would have any major impact on the outcome either so I would shorten the duration.

Edited March 28, 2013 by MidichIorian

[jolleebindu]

I think he made a good point about the re-spawn timers in the new WZ. I normally play as a sorc or shadow so I can force speed to the middle just before the wave reaches mid, however as any other class, that would suck.

 

Come to think of it, i have no idea why there is a door for that wz, it is spread out enough that you have a while before running back - sorta like ACW but without the speeders

 

One last side note, i would also remove the "fast, side" speeders from ACW. As that WZ is it gives too much of an advantage to the defending team, and there isn't a lot of back and forth with the caps (in many of the WZ's, though not all). Lastly, i would like to see the mechanism for capping nodes replaced by presence of players - especially for ACW - instead of clicking a node.

 

A possible activation method that is closer to their current tech level might be something as follows...

 

To cap you go and click the activation panel and get a buff, which you keep while in given range of the terminal. A visual effect of this might be helpful. Whichever team has a greater number of the buffs or greater by a given amount would start to cap the node.

Edited March 28, 2013 by jolleebindu

[Tragamite]

I think he made a good point about the re-spawn timers in the new WZ. I normally play as a sorc or shadow so I can force speed to the middle just before the wave reaches mid, however as any other class, that would suck.

 

Come to think of it, i have no idea why there is a door for that wz, it is spread out enough that you have a while before running back - sorta like ACW but without the speeders

 

One last side note, i would also remove the "fast, side" speeders from ACW. As that WZ is it gives too much of an advantage to the defending team, and there isn't a lot of back and forth with the caps (in many of the WZ's, though not all). Lastly, i would like to see the mechanism for capping nodes replaced by presence of players - especially for ACW - instead of clicking a node.

 

A possible activation method that is closer to their current tech level might be something as follows...

 

To cap you go and click the activation panel and get a buff, which you keep while in given range of the terminal. A visual effect of this might be helpful. Whichever team has a greater number of the buffs or greater by a given amount would start to cap the node.

 

That is an interesting idea. If the turret control could be activated like the data node in VS to queue the gun to start possession for a side the more people who click the turret the faster it turns if an opposing player clicks the node it begins to swing thwarting other way. So it would essentially be based on the number of players attacking and activating the node. Someone could still ninja cap by clicking the console and start the gun turning.

 

I think the side speeders would be fine if the center gun did double damage cause it would be the important gun to own either to win quick or make a comeback.

[jolleebindu]

That is an interesting idea. If the turret control could be activated like the data node in VS to queue the gun to start possession for a side the more people who click the turret the faster it turns if an opposing player clicks the node it begins to swing thwarting other way. So it would essentially be based on the number of players attacking and activating the node. Someone could still ninja cap by clicking the console and start the gun turning.

 

I think the side speeders would be fine if the center gun did double damage cause it would be the important gun to own either to win quick or make a comeback.

 

I like that idea, it would be cool to see how it changed the player dynamic and strats...

[Tragamite]

I like that idea, it would be cool to see how it changed the player dynamic and strats...

 

Really would change the dynamics of CW.

[HeetCrusher]

Well the PVP in this game i think needs a whole work over. Team death matches for a MMO is sad to say the least. When you are paying for a MMO you should expect something more complex. There are a lot of different things they could have done but team death match just seems to me like a simple after thought and no time was put into it. This game really is not a MMO but just a big story line xbox game. Here is a thought. make the planets conquerable with valuable resources and everything on market pretty much can be made from them. Now there will be Imp/Rep planets only. That way not everyone will be doing the same side all the time. One side gets loaded up will leave a big void to make credits for others. Also some planets will be available to both (pvp). Also let guilds become more of a factor. Keep WZ as something to do rather than the be all for pvp. Also put limits to guilds so it is not just a recuiting war. But rather talent will have a impact. This to me would become a lot more interesting , intriguing and fun.

 

Space missions need to be scrapped. They look like an old atari version. Again seems to be a after thought with very little time spent on it. To me if you are going to do something do it right or just do not do it at all. If you want a idea for space I would recommend looking at EVEONLINE. I think they have done a great job there. And add pvp to space. I remember the game is called STAR WARS after all.

 

Yes I know these things would be difficult and would take time. The easiest ways are not always the best ways. But if you want to be around and sustaining it is worth doing. Another thing I would recommend if you got the money to buy or recruit and open a EURO office to help get a fresh perspective. Maybe you already have one not sure.

Edited April 3, 2013 by HeetCrusher

[DarkLiccioso]

You mentioned some really nice ideas and I do hope BW PvP staff can take it under consideration. The idea of having Legacy valor rank is definatelly good and right. They should do it. And, by doing this, not only a player could be recognized no matter what level of a character but they could create separations between beginners and pro based on valor rank! This would probably solve the bolster and balance "jebedeez"!

They should also find a damn solutions for quitters but more than everything else they should think about QoL in PvP and actually DO something FOR PvP in this game. I just can't understand how PvP can be one year old now.