Merc Buffs Anyone?

[cashogy]

Well like I said, even if they fix the damage our lack of utility has to be addressed as well if we want to be truly ranked viable.

 

In the meantime we've been tossing around the same ideas for awhile, and lets admit it's mostly for cathartic purposes, so this is kind of a breath of freash air for me personally, and I like thinking of all the havoc we could wreak when properly utilized. I've said for awhile that I think abilities like awe and flash bang are absolute game changers, often overlooked because of flashier more in your face stuff.

 

well thinking about the trap and jump-back abilities: place the trap, and the position yourself behind it. if people leap to you, knock them back into the trap. or they run through it. so they are rooted brielfy, then slowed towards you, giving you a couple of seconds. they close the gap, then jump back, rooting them again. at that point get a slow on them (CGC or unload depending on spec) and youve got more time.

 

actually i like that. thank you for the ideas xerain

[Invictusthetaru]

I love the trap idea.

 

Would a insta cast 12-15 second 30m root be over the top at this point? If not that would be nice...

[Xerain]

1 trap. invisible to the enemy until triggered. 10m gtaoe. inflicts a medium amount of damage on detonation, roots targets briefly (like 2s, nothing extreme). applies slow effect, 50% for 6s (begins after root ends).

 

combine that with the disengage from the other thread (jump back 25 meters, enemies w/in 8m of your origin are rooted for 4s (breaks on damage after 2s)).

 

i could get behind those 2 abilities. if that is the kind of thing xerain is suggesting, then cool. but i would like to see Merc fixed w/out introducing all kinds of new abilities. it only means longer dev work time

 

I'm suggesting all those traps in the OP. In WoW you could stack them on one another so I would often stack the area snare trap and the area fire trap to light people up. Slowed and there's a dot ticking on them... GG awesome. Also It would be cool to give the merc/mando something unique like the mind numbing poison in the snake trap (of course that trap would have to be redone to be more star wars fitting)

 

for the disengage I wouldn't be opposed to it doing a 3 second root base. Doesn't break on damage, just like the marauder roots.

[Xerain]

well thinking about the trap and jump-back abilities: place the trap, and the position yourself behind it. if people leap to you, knock them back into the trap. or they run through it. so they are rooted brielfy, then slowed towards you, giving you a couple of seconds. they close the gap, then jump back, rooting them again. at that point get a slow on them (CGC or unload depending on spec) and youve got more time.

 

actually i like that. thank you for the ideas xerain

 

Yeah in WoW as a hunter i'd always be standing on an Freezing trap (the one that puts them into an ice block for 10 seconds) So if a melee cosed the cap on me, boom, they're stuck there for 10 seconds. Then I'd run max range away, drop a trap that does damage like the snakes or the fire and put a big casted ability into them and then maybe a few instants till I felt they were close enough, hit them with my snare, and start kiting away to keep that target running right at my trap!

In a 1v1 situation they're great.

 

 

In a group play situation as I said drop the slow and damage together and your healers can kite people over it, slow a whole group of people in huttball so your team and drop even more AOE on them, and if you position it right you can slow people from trying to switch nodes in ACW and Novare.

[cashogy]

I'm suggesting all those traps in the OP. In WoW you could stack them on one another so I would often stack the area snare trap and the area fire trap to light people up. Slowed and there's a dot ticking on them... GG awesome. Also It would be cool to give the merc/mando something unique like the mind numbing poison in the snake trap (of course that trap would have to be redone to be more star wars fitting)

 

for the disengage I wouldn't be opposed to it doing a 3 second root base. Doesn't break on damage, just like the marauder roots.

 

well, the trap sounds like it would be one of those abilities that would be good to get in a talent tree, and then be able to spec into different functions. so if someone wanted they could spec for it to do damage, root, slow and put a DoT on. or pick and choose.

 

or another way to go would be to give the mine ability as a baseline, and then have 3 different 1pt talent boxes, 1 in each of the tier 1 boxes for each tree. the combat medic tree could offer the slow, the arsenal tree could offer the root, and the pyro tree could offer the DoT. and then allow people to spec into how they want their mine/trap to work.

Edited January 11, 2013 by cashogy

[Xerain]

well, the trap sounds like it would be one of those abilities that would be good to get in a talent tree, and then be able to spec into different functions. so if someone wanted they could spec for it to do damage, root, slow and put a DoT on. or pick and choose.

 

or another way to go would be to give the mine ability as a baseline, and then have 3 different 1pt talent boxes, 1 in each of the tier 1 boxes for each tree. the combat medic tree could offer the slow, the arsenal tree could offer the root, and the pyro tree could offer the DoT. and then allow people to spec into how they want their mine/trap to work.

 

I'm down for giving them all baseline and then I'd say give the tree's talents to make them better.

 

The only real utility it seems merc has is the cleanse and knock back. They do need mroe.

[cashogy]

I'm down for giving them all baseline and then I'd say give the tree's talents to make them better.

 

The only real utility it seems merc has is the cleanse and knock back. They do need mroe.

 

well i still think just having the 1 mine, rather than separate ones. simplifies things a little bit. a single 10m gtaoe trap would pretty much cover any major pathway in any warzone i think.

 

now thinking about cooldown, maybe 25s, but can only have 1 mine out at a time.

 

in conjunction with that jump-pack disengage ability, merc would have enough utiltiy to actually fulfill a group role. they could guard a node, delay enemy movement, and generally not suck

[Knockerz]

The fundamental problem with commandos is they need to cast to heal/dps. This was a problem for holy paladins in bc, which is why they weren't very good in bc. The same is true of commandos. If commandos won't be given mobility, then they should be given interrupt immunity of some sort.

 

What happens with the healing or dps spec of commando is players will shut them down by stunning them and interrupting their casting. This is a problem for deep lightning sorcerers too. I have said it before, but given commandos a form of interrupt immunity is the only way I see them fix commandos without having to radically add new mechanism to the commando class like more escapes, snares, ect.

[Knockerz]

well i still think just having the 1 mine, rather than separate ones. simplifies things a little bit. a single 10m gtaoe trap would pretty much cover any major pathway in any warzone i think.

 

now thinking about cooldown, maybe 25s, but can only have 1 mine out at a time.

 

in conjunction with that jump-pack disengage ability, merc would have enough utiltiy to actually fulfill a group role. they could guard a node, delay enemy movement, and generally not suck

 

How about a jump? Like what warriors were given in Cataclysm? That would give commandos great utility. Perhaps have a talent that resets their aoe knock back when they use their jump. Only problem might be the game camera for your character might not be wide enough for you to jump like from base floor to second level like on huttball.

[Xerain]

well i still think just having the 1 mine, rather than separate ones. simplifies things a little bit. a single 10m gtaoe trap would pretty much cover any major pathway in any warzone i think.

 

now thinking about cooldown, maybe 25s, but can only have 1 mine out at a time.

 

in conjunction with that jump-pack disengage ability, merc would have enough utiltiy to actually fulfill a group role. they could guard a node, delay enemy movement, and generally not suck

 

If it was 4 abilities you'll learn more button management

[cashogy]

If it was 4 abilities you'll learn more button management

 

ive got enough button management already lol

[V-Serp]

Merc is too strong, buff Maras.

[Jherad]

Try reading my post again Xerain. If you still can't spot my reply, I'll highlight it in big letters for you.

 

Anyway, no I don't think traps will be anywhere NEAR enough on their own. Our fundamental problem (for people who obviously don't know the class, like Xerain) is the inability to apply damage equivalent to other DPS classes in competitive play (read RWZs) with the same level of utility and mobility.

 

In other words, we have to be equal in desirability to a shadow, or a smashmonkey, or a threefingered PT for ranked warzones.

 

Your damage can be fine, stop playing Arsenal/Gunnery in pvp please.

 

Because .... Oh right, you don't know what you're talking about. Out of interest, how much damage do YOU do Xerain?

Edited January 11, 2013 by Jherad

[DigitalDreamz]

Here's the only buff you'll ever need:

 

Armor override: While armor override is active you are immune to movement impairing effects and can cast while moving. Cannot be force charged while armor override is active. Lasts 10 seconds. (45 second cooldown)

 

 

Anything else beyond this you really need to L2P or pick a different class.

[ZirusZero]

Give back the REAL afterburners/concussive force back. Immobilization only just sucks.

[Xerain]

Try reading my post again Xerain. If you still can't spot my reply, I'll highlight it in big letters for you.

 

Anyway, no I don't think traps will be anywhere NEAR enough on their own. Our fundamental problem (for people who obviously don't know the class, like Xerain) is the inability to apply damage equivalent to other DPS classes in competitive play (read RWZs) with the same level of utility and mobility.

 

In other words, we have to be equal in desirability to a shadow, or a smashmonkey, or a threefingered PT for ranked warzones.

 

 

 

Because .... Oh right, you don't know what you're talking about. Out of interest, how much damage do YOU do Xerain?

 

More than you because I know how to play my class and what specs to use to pvp with.

 

 

I'm sorry but Gunnery/Arsenal has been bad since day 1. Just because other bads didn't know how to interrupt you to slow your damage down does not make that spec any better.

 

Cast Heavy?

No Mobility?

Lack of Escapes?

 

Those are all three things that arsenal/gunnery suffers from and they're 3 things you don't want when playing a ranged class.

 

Sorry you can't get your damage off because the tree you want to play in pvp revolves around the one ability really to make everything else better to get damage off.

 

 

So what ranged classes did you play in other MMO's?

Edited January 11, 2013 by Xerain

[cashogy]

tbh, i think that a mine/trap + a jump-back disengage skill would make even Arsenal viable.

 

put trap/mine down. back up a bit behind it; start pewpewing. your enemies are going to either run into it, or you can use the knockback to push them into it. they take some damage, and are rooted. run back a bit, and pewpew while they are slowed. when they reach you, use the jump-back disengage. now they are rooted again so you can pewpew some more. hit them with Unload for the slow, and you can pewpew a couple more times before they reach you.

 

that sounds like a legitimate way to combat melee opponents imo. both the trap/mine and the disengage would have a lot of utility uses as well.

 

compare this to the Run and Gun ability i had suggested. while that provides a direct way to combat melee opponents, it doesnt bring anything in the way of utility. a trap and jump-back provide both

Edited January 11, 2013 by cashogy

[Jherad]

I'm sorry but Gunnery/Arsenal has been bad since day 1. Just because other bads didn't know how to interrupt you to slow your damage down does not make that spec any better.

 

Still hearing this 'I don't know jack about commandos' vibe from you.

 

Your turn to answer the question man. I want to know if you're anywhere near as good on your monkey as I am on my gunnery commando.

Edited January 11, 2013 by Jherad

[Xerain]

Still hearing this 'I don't know jack about commandos' vibe from you.

 

Your turn to answer the question man. I want to know if you're anywhere near as good on your monkey as I am on my gunnery commando.

 

Go read through my posts in this thread and you'll see what i've played as far as ranged in other MMO's.

 

 

You've probably played a gunnery commando and that's as far as your MMO experience goes, like so many others.

[Jherad]

Go read through my posts in this thread and you'll see what i've played as far as ranged in other MMO's.

 

 

You've probably played a gunnery commando and that's as far as your MMO experience goes, like so many others.

 

No, the question I asked in my last post. How much damage do you do on your marauder in RWZs?

 

As you obviously can't read that well, I'll help you out with my response to you - I've played plenty of ranged classes. If you want specifics, My two mains in Wow were a warlock (heh) and a huntard (after initially playing a shaman). I also had a mage, but didn't really like the playstyle.

 

Now, care to talk SWTOR?

[antiheroxi]

Seriously your ranged dps experience is so limited that youre complaining about that.... Believe it or not these are legitimate ways to address concerns you all have. All you need are the tools to kite and help others kite.. You dont need to be immune to interrupt... I shudder to think how pathetic your complaints would of been in an actual hard ranged experience like the hard interupts found in daoc, the incredible pushback of eq1 etc. Xerain is actually correct here and the changes he suggested would make arsenal effective for those that know how to prekite and kite. You just want to be remade into the rediculius status that you were before people figured out interrupt. that said they need to do something but this is as viable a change as any

 

Gotta love

[Jherad]

Seriously your ranged dps experience is so limited that youre complaining about that.... Believe it or not these are legitimate ways to address concerns you all have. All you need are the tools to kite and help others kite.. You dont need to be immune to interrupt... I shudder to think how pathetic your complaints would of been in an actual hard ranged experience like the hard interupts found in daoc, the incredible pushback of eq1 etc. Xerain is actually correct here and the changes he suggested would make arsenal effective for those that know how to prekite and kite. You just want to be remade into the rediculius status that you were before people figured out interrupt. that said they need to do something but this is as viable a change as any

 

Gotta love

 

Sweet, thanks bro - obviously you know all about me (not sure how, but hey!). Which class do you play? The more coming in here telling commandos/mercs how to play the merrier.

 

PS - If you want I can run a masterclass on smashtarding. I only have a level 47 sentinel and a level 43 guardian, but that's more experience playing those classes than most of the idiots suggesting things here have with mercs. I sure you'll improve if you just listen to me.

 

I adore the attitude some of the people who don't play mercs have towards class balance, It's cute. 'Oh, if ONLY the right people were playing the class they'd do awesome! Oh if only you knew how to play, you'd be great! Why don't I play one? Oh well you see, I could, but I choose not to - my class isn't FOTM I'm just great. All those ranked teams would TOTALLY be filled with mercs if people like me played them.'

Edited January 11, 2013 by Jherad

[mandoforlife]

Xerain, if you remember, you proposed the trap idea in a previous thread which I opposed. But, I've been thinking about it... and it seems like a pretty good idea, so I owe you an apology.

 

The traps (mines as cash calls them; much more fitting for a mercenary) could bring a really unique tool to this class, which I feel has been lacking. It'll also improve our problem with lack of utility. Coupled with a jet pack escape ability, I can think of quite a few set up that could be both fun and effective. I agree with your ideas whole-heartedly

[Jherad]

I'm curious as to what role you see a merc/mando playing with these traps in a ranked warzone (and in specific warzones) that isn't done better or made obselete by existing classes (and grenades).

[Anishor]

Have a list of things that merc/mando should have stolen from the WoW Hunter. If not all of them then a good majority of them.

 

Snake trap

-When triggered, releases ~14 Venomous Snakes and Vipers with around 125 health. These snakes afflict the following debuffs:

 

Crippling Poison - Reduces movement speed by 50% for 12 seconds

Mind-numbing Poison - Reduces cast speed by 30% for 12 seconds

Deadly Poison - Deals nature damage every 2 seconds. Stacks up to 5 times.

 

Ice Trap.

 

Freezing trap

 

Explosive Trap

 

Last time I played WoW on my Hunter if I remember correctly, back in TBC, the two frost traps shared a cool down and the snake trap and explosive trap could be casted on their own.

 

Click all these links and read the abilities for the traps.

 

A real snare they can cast even if it is a 50% slow for 3 seconds on an 18 second CD.

 

Also last thing merc should get is some form of this: Disengage! Make it a cool rocket pack ability dammit!

 

I would call them proximity mines for trooper, but that with an Anti-leap for gunnery wouldn't be that bad an idea at all.