Do you think we are overpowered?

[gaangdar]

I mostly roll with my healer sorc, for people who say you should know how to handle us, I'll give you this senerio from earlier today. I had a sent run up to me in VS because I was alone in the back healing (good on him! Finally someone goes after the healer) I saw him coming and slowed him then force sped back, he leaped and snared me I cleansed and knocked him back and slowed again than ran (not force speed) he lept again and snared me then stunned me. The whole time I am also healing my team which he interupted occationaly. His damage output was good and unlike my offensive abilities, you cant just run through a sent and he stops casting. Anyway, I ended up not even trying to get away becase I couldn't so I just sat there and healed my self for a while until I ran out of force then I died.

 

There are few things here, one is that the class is not very easy to kite, had I'd been a dps sorc I would have just folded beacuse of all the Defense they have mixed with their damage. The second is a lesson for others I actually did an alright job because he was trying to roll me and I just kept healing keeping him out of the match long enough to get the bomb on the door. I got medals for healing and he got to swing at me so look at it that way.

 

On the other side of the argument I have a couple dps classes I play with and I have noticed that sent and maras have an annoying ablity to heal themselves quite a bit. As a dps class, you really should need a healer (call me old fashioned). You shouldn't be able to withstand damage like a tank, cloak like a rouge, self heal like a healer, and dps like a champ. I have grouped with a mara for torvix and we two manned it because he could heal the both of us pretty well and when I mentioned it he said ""yeah I can almost solo this"". And pvp wise, its just annoying that it takes 3 of us to burn down one guy who just slips away before death (which is why I try to have someone that can detect stealth pop their ability right before the sent/mara dies). I can see where people get pissy, I mean as a BM Sniper I can't take three people on with ease and as my BM Merc well he is just a joke.

 

I have a 36 mara that I had since pre launch. He has most the above abilities so far. I haven't played him since pre 1.2 because they were terrible in PVE and would just die. I don't remember him having half the things people talk about now (maybe they improved them) but I do remember being accused of speed hacking because of preadition. I am only bringing this up because with all the things being said half of it is just class myths so trying rolling one and see if its true. Also always go after the healer! When I am healing a Mara in PVP he can be pretty much a god and the people will just leave me alone and let me heal away.

 

 

 

Possible tags for this post: TL;DR, L2P, Noob, ect.....points for anything new

Edited July 22, 2012 by gaangdar

[Monterone]

I mostly roll with my healer sorc, for people who say you should know how to handle us, I'll give you this senerio from earlier today. I had a sent run up to me in VS because I was alone in the back healing (good on him! Finally someone goes after the healer) I saw him coming and slowed him then force sped back, he leaped and snared me I cleansed and knocked him back and slowed again than ran (not force speed) he lept again and snared me then stunned me. The whole time I am also healing my team which he interupted occationaly. His damage output was good and unlike my offensive abilities, you cant just run through a sent and he stops casting. Anyway, I ended up not even trying to get away becase I couldn't so I just sat there and healed my self for a while until I ran out of force then I died.

 

That's exactly one of the biggest issues.

 

For anyone who has played both melee and ranged in this game -- they know it is FAR easier to stay inside of someone's melee range than to keep them outside of yours.

 

Throughout beta people who did not know how to play melee complained that ranged was too hard to get to, so knockbacks, slows, roots, etc got nerfed... in the end we are left with melee classes with as many or even MORE stuns, roots and slows than even some ranged classes have. Pretty retarded.

 

Add to that that raged classes have to stop and hard cast WHILE kiting, and it creates a very melee friendly game.

 

I'll say it here but it's been said before --if you are melee and you are having problems with ranged, it is YOU who needs to learn to play. You have it made, you just don't know how to use it, the rest of us do.

 

 

EDIT: Note to devs -- it would be FINE to have both melee and ranged have even EQUAL number of roots, stuns, slows etc IF both had instant non castable damage. When you have one class that needs to stop for a 2 or a 3 second cast to even be remotely effective, you need to add double the amount of slows and roots to allow for kiting. If I'm just countering melee slows and roots and leaps just for the sake of kiting, while unable to do anything else, what's the point? Really?

Edited July 22, 2012 by Monterone

[Berrian]

We are perfectly balanced, I (anni spec marauder full stock WH and auged)pretty much only die to like 3 mara/sents (all of which are anni spec and all outgears me) and one (1) tankasin on my server.

 

This is from 1v1 defending/invading experience.

 

I die plenty when I try to solo a node being defended by 2 to 3 people. Vs 3+ I usually kill 1 of them then get killed. Vs 2 a lot of time I kill them both but if I am capping the side node I wont have enough HP left when they come back from their side speeder (and ofc I will die), at that point I use all my CDs to delay my death and hope my ally reinforce me..

 

lol....perfectly balanced? riiiggghhhhtttt!!!!

[Xerain]

You know what would make mara/sents balanced? A 4 second stun where we can keep doing 100% damage and take 0 damage.

[Helistin]

We are perfectly balanced, I (anni spec marauder full stock WH and auged)pretty much only die to like 3 mara/sents (all of which are anni spec and all outgears me) and one (1) tankasin on my server.

 

This is from 1v1 defending/invading experience.

 

I die plenty when I try to solo a node being defended by 2 to 3 people. Vs 3+ I usually kill 1 of them then get killed. Vs 2 a lot of time I kill them both but if I am capping the side node I wont have enough HP left when they come back from their side speeder (and ofc I will die), at that point I use all my CDs to delay my death and hope my ally reinforce me..

 

Love this post also.

"Usually i win when facing two players at once, and i die sometimes when trying to solo 3 people at once so i think the balance is perfect"

 

[MalakDawnfire]

This thread certainly delivered on laughs.

[iTryHard]

I posted this in another thread but I got laughed at told that I was a bad QQer and then the thread got closed... But this is basically what I said.

-Remove GBTF/UR, it's an incredibly cheesy invincibility button for 5 seconds (a long time in pvp) that no other class has in the game. It helps the bad players (see clickers, backpedalers, and keyboard turners) by giving them a crutch, this ability lets me come up to a node, take out the 2 guarding it, and take the node with ease.

-Extend the CD on force camo to 1 minute or longer, as it is, this ability is quite cheap in that you only need 4 seconds to LoS behind an object and run away, it's still probably needed though since Maras/Sents are in the thick of everything so will be FF'd down more than some other classes. (Plus it's a threat dump for any that care about PvE).

-If these above nerfs aren't enough, lower the damage done by Cauterize/Rupture and Overload/Deadly Saber by 1-6% (slight nerf)

P.S. I DO have a Sentinel but I'll probably be told I don't, whatever though.

P.P.S. I do not click, backpedal, or keyboard turn.

P.P.P.S. I'm not a bad QQer, these abilities are legitimately stupid.

[Jaspless]

Without survivability what would we be though? if we keep dying we put out no dps...

 

You'd be a Sorcerer.. oh wait, nope, you still out-dps them too. Haha.

[PowerReaper]

You'd be a Sorcerer.. oh wait, nope, you still out-dps them too. Haha.

 

Haha back at you, the only difference is they can attack from a 30m range or longer, can heal (not to mention a aoe heal), can stun, and have a aoe. We are up in the field of fire taking the most damage but we have none of that You can't compare us to anyone who can attack from 30m of range... so why do we out DPS them again?

Edited July 23, 2012 by PowerReaper

[PowerReaper]

I posted this in another thread but I got laughed at told that I was a bad QQer and then the thread got closed... But this is basically what I said.

-Remove GBTF/UR, it's an incredibly cheesy invincibility button for 5 seconds (a long time in pvp) that no other class has in the game. It helps the bad players (see clickers, backpedalers, and keyboard turners) by giving them a crutch, this ability lets me come up to a node, take out the 2 guarding it, and take the node with ease.

-Extend the CD on force camo to 1 minute or longer, as it is, this ability is quite cheap in that you only need 4 seconds to LoS behind an object and run away, it's still probably needed though since Maras/Sents are in the thick of everything so will be FF'd down more than some other classes. (Plus it's a threat dump for any that care about PvE).

-If these above nerfs aren't enough, lower the damage done by Cauterize/Rupture and Overload/Deadly Saber by 1-6% (slight nerf)

P.S. I DO have a Sentinel but I'll probably be told I don't, whatever though.

P.P.S. I do not click, backpedal, or keyboard turn.

P.P.P.S. I'm not a bad QQer, these abilities are legitimately stupid.

 

After GBTF is up your basically dead without a healer, i'd like someone a Sentinel to show me one time they used GBTF and without a healer they didn't die. The best thing you can do with GBTF and Camo is put it on a longer cooldown. I personally can do without Camo in situations when i run because most of the time i run they already have about 3 dots on me so i die when Camo is not on. But removing it? that's a little to much imo.

Edited July 23, 2012 by PowerReaper

[iTryHard]

After GBTF is up your basically dead without a healer, i'd like someone a Sentinel to show me one time they used GBTF and without a healer they didn't die. The best thing you can do with GBTF and Camo is put it on a longer cooldown. I personally can do without Camo in situations when i run because most of the time i run they already have about 3 dots on me so i die when Camo is not on. But removing it? that's a little to much imo.

 

Eh, there's been plenty of times that that 5 seconds has allowed me to pop a medpac and zen and heal back to 50ish health (12% health from zen and 35% from medpac (warzone one that is)) and then won a 1 v 1 or a 1 v 2. But I agree, we're very squishy when we do not have our CDs up, making the CD on GBTF 2 minutes 30 seconds would be more than ample to lessen the use of it and make it less of a crutch. We'll see though.

[PowerReaper]

Eh, there's been plenty of times that that 5 seconds has allowed me to pop a medpac and zen and heal back to 50ish health (12% health from zen and 35% from medpac (warzone one that is)) and then won a 1 v 1 or a 1 v 2. But I agree, we're very squishy when we do not have our CDs up, making the CD on GBTF 2 minutes 30 seconds would be more than ample to lessen the use of it and make it less of a crutch. We'll see though.

 

That's a little to harsh considering not everyone can heal and not everyone is Watchman, whenever i use GBTF its either kill him while i have those 5 seconds or be killed without a healer. All he has to do is really kite me around or stun me and when that time is up i am basically dead . . . people need to learn while that ability is up they are invincible to damage not stuns, not slows, not kites...

Edited July 23, 2012 by PowerReaper

[iTryHard]

That's a little to harsh considering not everyone can heal and not everyone is Watchman, whenever i use GBTF its either kill him while i have those 5 seconds or be killed without a healer. All he has to do is really kite me around or stun me and when that time is up i am basically dead . . . people need to learn while that ability is up they are invincible to damage not stuns, not slows, not kites...

True true, but if GBTF isn't to go, what is? Most of the people on these forums are whining loads about sents/maras, so what exactly makes them OP?

[PowerReaper]

True true, but if GBTF isn't to go, what is? Most of the people on these forums are whining loads about sents/maras, so what exactly makes them OP?

 

The fact that people don't know how to handle them? that's why they are OVERPOWERED!

 

http://www.roflcat.com/images/cats/270913946_efa38ec3d8.jpg <<<

[Xerain]

The fact that people don't know how to handle them? that's why they are OVERPOWERED!

 

http://www.roflcat.com/images/cats/270913946_efa38ec3d8.jpg <<<

 

The fact that most people are bad and blow all their hard CC's on someone right away and then don't know how to use soft CC's effectively to slow a marauder down is terrible.

[PowerReaper]

The fact that most people are bad and blow all their hard CC's on someone right away and then don't know how to use soft CC's effectively to slow a marauder down is terrible.

 

I couldn't agree more . . .

[ArchangelLBC]

The fact that people don't know how to handle them? that's why they are OVERPOWERED!

 

http://www.roflcat.com/images/cats/270913946_efa38ec3d8.jpg <<<

 

You know what Cristine? I've tried to be reasonable and you've been nothing but a troll. I'd tell you to die in a fire but you'd probably just GBTF out of it and then claim it's totally not OP.

 

L2P is only viable when there's a reliable counter that's trule LTP. I'm already using my knockback to interrupt your ravage/master strike, and my CC to either stun you during GBTF, or try to get you before you use it and hope I have the burst ready to finish you. Not much else I can do after that.

 

edit: In restrospect I let my frustration at this conversation get to me. I apologize for that.

Edited July 23, 2012 by ArchangelLBC

[Xerain]

You know what Cristine? I've tried to be reasonable and you've been nothing but a troll. I'd tell you to die in a fire but you'd probably just GBTF out of it and then claim it's totally not OP.

 

L2P is only viable when there's a reliable counter that's trule LTP. I'm already using my knockback to interrupt your ravage/master strike, and my CC to either stun you during GBTF, or try to get you before you use it and hope I have the burst ready to finish you. Not much else I can do after that.

 

you should probably force them to pop UD/GBTF then use the stun instead of putting all your eggs into one basket to let it fail...

[ArchangelLBC]

you should probably force them to pop UD/GBTF then use the stun instead of putting all your eggs into one basket to let it fail...

 

It varies for me based on what's off CD. HiB ready to go and Ionic Accelerator off cooldown (most likely means AP is off CD as well)? Then around 30% or 7k, whichever comes first, Incend Round(for the burn) > Cryo Grenade > HiB > FA (75% chance to Proc IA) > HiB. If AP is up I'll probably try and throw that before all of that too. Unless I am completely out geared that should kill them, but if I'm completely outgeared I'm dead anyway in all liklihood.

 

If HiB isn't up yet, or it just procced off an IA and so I don't have have a chance to get 2 HiBs off in the space of 3 GCDs, I'll Cryo them during the GBTF and spam hammer shot (for the burn), and as soon as that burn starts proccing full damage I'll drop whatever I can find to try and finish them off (might go with pulse cannon. It does good damage anyway and hopefully they're now low enough that it only takes a tick or two to kill them).

[BobyDigital]

Cute thread Power but this is like asking Americans "Do you think we are rich?"

 

Almost all will say no, and go to wallstreet and talk about being the 99%, yet if your household makes 40k a year then they're in the top 1% of all wage earners in the entire world.

 

 

Sent/Maras saying they don't feel overpowered because if they try to take a node being defended by two people they can't kill both and cap the node before the people they killed come back is pretty hilarious.

 

What's that? If you try to take on people 3v1 you can only seem to kill two of them before you die?

 

My heart bleeds.

 

 

edit: RedRing, I personally, and I may be in the minority here, would just like your force camo removed, or put on at least a 2m cooldown. Making Guarded reduce all healing received by 99% is an interesting idea though.

 

what?

[Truescopes]

You know what Cristine? I've tried to be reasonable and you've been nothing but a troll. I'd tell you to die in a fire but you'd probably just GBTF out of it and then claim it's totally not OP.

 

L2P is only viable when there's a reliable counter that's trule LTP. I'm already using my knockback to interrupt your ravage/master strike, and my CC to either stun you during GBTF, or try to get you before you use it and hope I have the burst ready to finish you. Not much else I can do after that.

 

edit: In restrospect I let my frustration at this conversation get to me. I apologize for that.

 

There's no point in arguing with them, they have no clue. Anyone with half a brain knows sentinel/marauders are OPd right now (Yes I have a lvl 50 sentinel).

[PowerReaper]

You know what Cristine? I've tried to be reasonable and you've been nothing but a troll. I'd tell you to die in a fire but you'd probably just GBTF out of it and then claim it's totally not OP.

 

L2P is only viable when there's a reliable counter that's trule LTP. I'm already using my knockback to interrupt your ravage/master strike, and my CC to either stun you during GBTF, or try to get you before you use it and hope I have the burst ready to finish you. Not much else I can do after that.

 

edit: In restrospect I let my frustration at this conversation get to me. I apologize for that.

 

Your awful, if you cannot stun us while we are in GBTF and then kite us around and after that kill us after we sacrificed about 50% of our current Hp (we where already low anyway) then your bad. And still with the complaining about the double edged sword GBTF . . . (And its not overpowered because after we come out its really over without a healer if they player has half a brain and knows what he's doing)... again we're a melee class your a range class...

Edited July 23, 2012 by PowerReaper

[Kontraz]

Think about it this way, most other dps classes can do more then just do damage. Example a Commando, they can heal, aoe, support, etc. All we can do is really damage, so without survivability we can't do that.

 

you didn't just compare the class with the absolute lowest survivability in the game to a marauder... XD

[poosticks]

Your awful, if you cannot stun us while we are in GBTF and then kite us around and after that kill us after we sacrificed about 50% of our current Hp (we where already low anyway) then your bad. And still with the complaining about the double edged sword GBTF . . . (And its not overpowered because after we come out its really over without a healer if they player has half a brain and knows what he's doing)... again we're a melee class your a range class...

 

If anyone is awful it would be you. You have plenty of tools to keep you in me-lee range; charge (from zero distance if talented) or predation negate the dead-zone for kiting, deadly throw can snare (if talented), or failing that just use camo, you also have slows, or you if you are rooted you could use force choke. Trying to justify the necessity of a stun in order to compete is just ridiculous, for all other classes stuns/snares/mezzes are largely used to give you the upper hand in a fight not shield you from them.

 

For the record i am fine with the damage output of a marauder, your damage reduction cds are bearable but you should not have a vanish - particularly one that is on a 45s cd, can be used without any regard to what DoT effects are on you as damage will not break the stealth, increases your movement speed, and renders you completely invisible. It can also be talented to extend its duration, movement speed and damage reduction.

[PowerReaper]

you didn't just compare the class with the absolute lowest survivability in the game to a marauder... XD

 

No crap, i was giving an example of what other dps classes can do not comparing what are you on?

Edited July 23, 2012 by PowerReaper