We need our freedom

[Gorra-Syn]

So before the last update, I can see why things are set the way they are. But now with the change to armor and being able to look how you the player would like to look, why are we still stuck with our choice of weapon? Some people (myself included) have picked a class because of the weapon. I picked a Sith Sorcerer because Im not big on the double bladed saber, and I picked Sith Juggernaught because I dont want to duel wield. Im sure I'm not alone on this, but since armor doesn't set us apart and we now have an icon to show what class we are.. why not let us choose our own style of weapon? The dps is in the class,not in the weapon,and all the animations are already in game. Im not trying to say I want my Jedi to use a pistol.. but instead just imagine..

 

The Trooper with duel pistols...

The Bounty Hunter with a blaster rifle...

The Assasin with a single saber...

The Sage with a double bladed (still with very little melee attacks of course)...

Or the Operative with a single pistol...

 

I think you get the idea. It just seems to me that the weapon is cosmetic and the true ability of course comes in the AC and the abilities that come with it. Maybe you would like to play a Juggernaught with a double bladed saber or a Marauder with a single saber? Well why not... that Marauder is still going to be all dps, but it would be with animation for a single saber instead of duel. What do you think of this? I cant imagine it would be all that hard to add.

 

Cheers, and thanks for any feedback

Edited July 10, 2012 by Gorra-Syn

[Malstrades]

the problem is they coppied wow too much, if they had stuck with the kotor system, you would have been able to be a jedi with one or 2 sabers or a double saber, even as a knight sent or sage. you would have picked the abbilities YOU wanted and the gear YOU wanted.

 

the kotor system was fun because you could even heal yourself to a degree, evn multiple times with stims instead of only once a fight. you could make yourself a hybrid build or a pure tank or a pure dps, however you wanted.

 

unfortunatly biofail was kissing too much as at blizz HQ, so we got wow in space.

[Haggardbr]

So before the last update, I can see why things are set the way they are. But now with the change to armor and being able to look how you the player would like to look, why are we still stuck with our choice of weapon? Some people (myself included) have picked a class because of the weapon. I picked a Sith Sorcerer because Im not big on the double bladed saber, and I picked Sith Juggernaught because I dont want to duel wield. Im sure I'm not alone on this, but since armor doesn't set us apart and we now have an icon to show what class we are.. why not let us choose our own style of weapon? The dps is in the class,not in the weapon,and all the animations are already in game. Im not trying to say I want my Jedi to use a pistol.. but instead just imagine..

 

The Trooper with duel pistols...

The Bounty Hunter with a blaster rifle...

The Assasin with a single saber...

The Sage with a double bladed (still with very little melee attacks of course)...

Or the Operative with a single pistol...

 

I think you get the idea. It just seems to me that the weapon is cosmetic and the true ability of course comes in the AC and the abilities that come with it. Maybe you would like to play a Juggernaught with a double bladed saber or a Marauder with a single saber? Well why not... that Marauder is still going to be all dps, but it would be with animation for a single saber instead of duel. What do you think of this? I cant imagine it would be all that hard to add.

 

Cheers, and thanks for any feedback

 

I agree with this 1000%.

 

I'm playing an Imp Sniper because I like to use and the looks of a sniper rifle, but my main guild (made by me) and guildies are from the Republic side, so when I want to play sniper, I gotta play "lonely".

 

I would love to get my gunslinger and instead of dueal wield blaster pistols, I'd take a sniper rifle.

 

And yeah, operatives with a single handed pistol or maybe a scoundrel with rifles would be very cool.

 

Since now we have our freedom regarding the clothing, for sure we need our freedom regarding the weapon we would like to use.

 

But I'd say this when it comes to blaster rifles, pistols and cannons, because it would be really strange to see a trooper or a smuggler swinging a light saber around.

[Gorra-Syn]

I agree with this 1000%.

 

I'm playing an Imp Sniper because I like to use and the looks of a sniper rifle, but my main guild (made by me) and guildies are from the Republic side, so when I want to play sniper, I gotta play "lonely".

 

I would love to get my gunslinger and instead of dueal wield blaster pistols, I'd take a sniper rifle.

 

And yeah, operatives with a single handed pistol or maybe a scoundrel with rifles would be very cool.

 

Since now we have our freedom regarding the clothing, for sure we need our freedom regarding the weapon we would like to use.

 

But I'd say this when it comes to blaster rifles, pistols and cannons, because it would be really strange to see a trooper or a smuggler swinging a light saber around.

 

Just as you said it.. to be honest I would reroll my Sorcerer (LVL 50) to an Assasin in a heartbeat if I was able to use single saber. As for the rifle,really the only thing not the same between a sniper and blaster rifle is the look. I think the easy way is to simply let us choose weapon style after we pick our AC. So for me, I would pick Assasin.. then pick between single,double bladed,or duel wield (no gun option for force toons).. and off I go. This should have always been in the game imo.

[Haggardbr]

Just as you said it.. to be honest I would reroll my Sorcerer (LVL 50) to an Assasin in a heartbeat if I was able to use single saber. As for the rifle,really the only thing not the same between a sniper and blaster rifle is the look. I think the easy way is to simply let us choose weapon style after we pick our AC. So for me, I would pick Assasin.. then pick between single,double bladed,or duel wield (no gun option for force toons).. and off I go. This should have always been in the game imo.

 

Yeah I agree and liked your idea.

 

Let's say... I start a smuggler, when I arrive at Carrick Station I could choose between scoundrel and gunsliner. Ok until there.

 

THEN I should be prompted to choose from (I don't know) like 3 types of weapon masteries. I'd say to keep the pistols, use a rifle or a sniper rifle (cannons should stick to Commandos only and dual wield pistols only to GS / BH).

 

The same for Imp Agents, BHs, Troopers.

 

But in the same line of your thoughts, only force sensitives could be able to use light sabers and vibroswords ( and etc...) and vice-versa for "common" toons to only use blaster type weapons.

 

It wouldn't take much programming (maybe) and it wouldn't need to create more classes (like a SIS agent to use sniper rifles or an Imp Trooper as I suggested here http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=500580) since all the moves and things are already in the game and there wouldn't have the need to make more storylines.

Edited July 10, 2012 by Haggardbr

[WoruulKeei]

Done right this could be great, but it would be much harder than I think you believe it would be. Part of how these classes are supposed to be iconic is the weapons they use and the animations for using them. Some would be more difficult than others, for example clairvoyant strike. It is supposed to be the infiltration shadow's signature move, but it only exists as a doublebladed lightsaber animation. So now it comes down to are they going to do new animations for all these signature abilities each class gets? Are you going to instead get stuck with some animation originally designed for a different class? The most likely answer is the second because the first would take a lot of time and extra work on the part of Bioware when there are other big features they intend to focus on atm. Let's face it too, if they did this with the second option we can be sure everyone on the forums isn't going to be happy with some of their choices for the mirror animations used when using a different weapon. This more revolves around the force classes as an issue than blaster based classes.

 

Even further this would also effect the combat system. For example gunslingers and sentinels use two weapons, most of their damage comes from their mainhand, however a degree of their damage comes from the offhand as well which just doesn't hit as often because it has lower base accuracy. So for this change to occur either the weapon you use for animations would simply be cosmetic with you still equiping two lightsabers/blasters, or they would have to change the system around so the offhand merely looks pretty and all the weapons do same damage no matter if you are using one or two.

 

This was all much simpler to do in kotor due to the fact there was no accuracy stat you had to equip on your gear, and also there were much fewer special attacks and none of which were signature abilities to any particular class.

[Haggardbr]

Or they could simply tie the animations according to the weapon you choose.

 

Let's say... all classes have all the animations based on the type of class (force sensitive / non force sensitive) and only one "package" of animations and abilities would engage depending on the weapon you choose.

 

Per example I'm a smuggler and as an AC I choose gunslinger and for weapon I choose sniper rifles. Then I'd only use the animations that the IA Snipers use and so on for every other weapon as I said.

 

If as a force sensitive you want to use double "bladed" light sabers then only the animations and abilities regarding such kind of weapon would "engage" on your toon's animations.

 

I guess you got the idea.

[WoruulKeei]

They would still need to choose which animations go for which abilities for the different classes with each weapon set, more something with the more showy force classes than the ranged classes. And there are still different abilities which for some classes are supposed to be iconic signature stuff they would want to keep that way, like master strike. But even assuming all the animations were fine and dandy and all take care of this would take a large amount of coding to change the way all this is handled by the game currently.

[Gorra-Syn]

They would still need to choose which animations go for which abilities for the different classes with each weapon set, more something with the more showy force classes than the ranged classes. And there are still different abilities which for some classes are supposed to be iconic signature stuff they would want to keep that way, like master strike. But even assuming all the animations were fine and dandy and all take care of this would take a large amount of coding to change the way all this is handled by the game currently.

 

Even if it was a lot of coding, Ill bet the community would all go nuts if they did this. Maybe you and a friend have a Jango and Boba fantasy.. Your friend could just play a Merc with 2 pistols, and you could play a Merc with a blaster rifle. The community would go nuts for this change.Not to mention as I said before, some people (me included) would go as far as to re roll a 50 just so I could play the character I really would like to play.

[Haggardbr]

The community would go nuts for this change.Not to mention as I said before, some people (me included) would go as far as to re roll a 50 just so I could play the character I really would like to play.

 

Ditto.

[WoruulKeei]

Not saying something they shouldn't do, just saying it is something that would take a good deal of work and be a ways down the pipeline even if they decided to do it.

[Gorra-Syn]

Not saying something they shouldn't do, just saying it is something that would take a good deal of work and be a ways down the pipeline even if they decided to do it.

 

I dont think it would be hard as you think, but then I could be very wrong.

[Captain_Lurker]

Done right this could be great, but it would be much harder than I think you believe it would be. Part of how these classes are supposed to be iconic is the weapons they use and the animations for using them. Some would be more difficult than others, for example clairvoyant strike. It is supposed to be the infiltration shadow's signature move, but it only exists as a doublebladed lightsaber animation. So now it comes down to are they going to do new animations for all these signature abilities each class gets? Are you going to instead get stuck with some animation originally designed for a different class? The most likely answer is the second because the first would take a lot of time and extra work on the part of Bioware when there are other big features they intend to focus on atm. Let's face it too, if they did this with the second option we can be sure everyone on the forums isn't going to be happy with some of their choices for the mirror animations used when using a different weapon. This more revolves around the force classes as an issue than blaster based classes.

 

Even further this would also effect the combat system. For example gunslingers and sentinels use two weapons, most of their damage comes from their mainhand, however a degree of their damage comes from the offhand as well which just doesn't hit as often because it has lower base accuracy. So for this change to occur either the weapon you use for animations would simply be cosmetic with you still equiping two lightsabers/blasters, or they would have to change the system around so the offhand merely looks pretty and all the weapons do same damage no matter if you are using one or two.

 

This was all much simpler to do in kotor due to the fact there was no accuracy stat you had to equip on your gear, and also there were much fewer special attacks and none of which were signature abilities to any particular class.

 

WoruulKeei brings up the main crux of why this was not done at the beginning: so that each class had a true "iconic" look, and reduce the programing required for the animations for each class (which would be ALOT if each class had more than one weapon, especially 3 or 4 weapons). I also think there might some base damage differences with some weapons or between dual/single weapon situations that might have to be corrected. I do think with the fact that they had to add icons above each character to help identify each class for PvP and that they added adjusting((?) armor to the social armor allowing all classes to fight in a bikini they have kind of removed the "iconic" look ideology.

 

We do have to give them time to work on it (and I would rather see more end game things first: PvP, PvE, RP/social) and I personally think it should be part of the Legacy system. Set it up as a single character perk and start with one weapon option for each advanced class. I think some would be easy and popular switches like Sniper Rifle for Commandos and Blaster Rifle for Powertechs. Others might be more difficult like Gunslinger (dont know if there is much people would want other than pistols) or single-blade or dual Lightsaber for Shows/Assassins or double-blade or dual Lightsaber for Guardian/Juggernaught.

[Gorra-Syn]

Good points Lurker.. I think first the choice should be made when you create the caracter (otherwise you have 2 weapons) but also this would cover the RP aspect you talked about I feel. Edited July 12, 2012 by Gorra-Syn

[Helig]

They even added colour-coded class icons for the most brain-dead morons to be able to identify classes.

 

"Identifying ACs" is no longer a valid excuse to keep us from using weapons that *we* want. This also should pose a problem in terms of technical realization, since it's already in game, basically. Handguns have lower low end and higher high-end than rifles, net damage being the same (PT\Scoundrel vs VG\Operative), specialized weapons (ACs\sniper rifles) have roughly 30% more base damage than regular ones, while offhand weapons add 30% weapon's damage to your attacks. It's flat, and not multiplicative, so it *is* balanced as it is, and it should be interchangeable.

Edited July 12, 2012 by Helig

[hertzmatt]

They all ready had a good starting point, that was Star Wars Galaxies. You could choose what type of saber to use, a BH could use all weapons except LS. There was a larger choice of classes and weapons for the player to look like what ever they wanted to be. Surely it would not take too much to convert that system in to this game. Don't need all the crafting profs they had but a few from it would be nice. Space missions where more flight sim then what we have here, the hardest choice now is when to hit the space bar.

 

Ok thats my 2 cents worth.

Hope it makes sense.

[Mistress_Ivi]

I'll jump on board, simple reasons...

 

Every, single, freaking, cutscene... my Trooper, my Agent and Bounty Hunter will draw a pistol (or single in the merc case)... and the Sentinel/Maruader will only ignite a single lightsaber.

 

So it begs the question, why can't I actually use a pistol? Or any ranged weapon for that matter.

 

 

The smuggler and Bounty hunter alike, are self-taught, they would grab whatever weapon comes to hand... and specialise with what they want.

 

The Agent and Trooper would both have the training, or opt for it. I can easily see the Trooper's companion, for example, teaching the trooper how to use a sniper; cause you know... Aric was in the Dead Eye's *sniper* assassination squad.

 

The only weapon I would see, to be continued to be limited to perhaps only Troopers and Hunter alike, would be the Assault cannon... I just couldn't see a Smuggler or Agent sneaking around with those. In most cases, that cannon weighs as much as a smuggler!

[Tfranco]

This is not kotor bottom line. Yes in the wildly popular SINGLE player game had a great way of defining your weapon style. But this isn't kotor. Having set weapons is how they keep the loot system manageable I mean really. Having to take the time to make a single/double saber with stat combos for every kind on it (wp str end and secondary stats) and make one for every role is a hassle.

And you would probably say, just drop empty oranges. Well I hate to tell u not all of us can afford buying endgame mods or ripping mods out.

It's not Gunnar happen, it's like the damned thana debate. The game has set weapon types deal with it.

[Haggardbr]

I'll jump on board, simple reasons...

 

Every, single, freaking, cutscene... my Trooper, my Agent and Bounty Hunter will draw a pistol (or single in the merc case)... and the Sentinel/Maruader will only ignite a single lightsaber.

 

So it begs the question, why can't I actually use a pistol? Or any ranged weapon for that matter.

 

 

The smuggler and Bounty hunter alike, are self-taught, they would grab whatever weapon comes to hand... and specialise with what they want.

 

The Agent and Trooper would both have the training, or opt for it. I can easily see the Trooper's companion, for example, teaching the trooper how to use a sniper; cause you know... Aric was in the Dead Eye's *sniper* assassination squad.

 

The only weapon I would see, to be continued to be limited to perhaps only Troopers and Hunter alike, would be the Assault cannon... I just couldn't see a Smuggler or Agent sneaking around with those. In most cases, that cannon weighs as much as a smuggler!

 

You thought the same way I did.

 

Aric Jorgan could teach the troopers to use sniper rifles (since he was from the Dead Eyes) and Elara could teach how to use pistols, since she masters the use of them.

 

Anyway... the mechanics are already in the game, as you said we can see it through cutscenes, but we don't have that freedom to choose the guns we would like to use.

 

And I also agree that assalt cannons should be available only for troopers as well as light sabers for force sensitives due to obvious reasons.

[Terkov]

Exactly what I want! I love my trooper, but I can't look at those funny cannons. I'd sooo love to have sniper rifle for him!

[jepurv]

the problem is they coppied wow too much, if they had stuck with the kotor system, you would have been able to be a jedi with one or 2 sabers or a double saber, even as a knight sent or sage. you would have picked the abbilities YOU wanted and the gear YOU wanted.

 

the kotor system was fun because you could even heal yourself to a degree, evn multiple times with stims instead of only once a fight. you could make yourself a hybrid build or a pure tank or a pure dps, however you wanted.

 

unfortunatly biofail was kissing too much as at blizz HQ, so we got wow in space.

 

It wasn't WoW they copied on this issue, it was Warhammer. WoW classes are able to use different weapons (to a point) . In Warhammer there were mirrored classes and specific armor and weapons for each.

[erei]

It wasn't WoW they copied on this issue, it was Warhammer. WoW classes are able to use different weapons (to a point) . In Warhammer there were mirrored classes and specific armor and weapons for each.

Expected, since Mythic entertainment was include into "Bioware", for more sales, and are the one working on SWTOR.

[BanetheDarkLord]

Just thought about this earlier today. It would take a lot from Bioware to do this. Remember, its not just the abilities and talents that say specifically used if you have X weapons. THEY WOULD HAVE TO RE-DO A TON OF ANIMATION. Example, a marauder now can use a double bladed lightsaber, all the abilities used by the marauder that originally specific in animation for 2 single lightsabers now all have to be changed to having both hands only onto one double bladed saber.

 

Not saying I don't want this, I WOULD LOVE THIS! Although I know what it takes to get this done and it's going to take a chunk of Bioware's time and money into making this possible which could cut out other incoming stuff they had in mind.

[misterbeefy]

I'd freaking kill if my PT could use a blaster carbine, like Boba Fett. Even though PT plays awesome, I always feel gimped just using one small dinky little pistol.

 

 

Also, Smuggler with the blaster cannon, that'd be awesome... dunno how it'd work, but still be awesome.

[Gorra-Syn]

I'd freaking kill if my PT could use a blaster carbine, like Boba Fett. Even though PT plays awesome, I always feel gimped just using one small dinky little pistol.

 

 

Also, Smuggler with the blaster cannon, that'd be awesome... dunno how it'd work, but still be awesome.

 

A) I feel the same way with my PT.. and (B) From "cover" most of the time Im sure.