Are We Exploiting The Slow-release Medpac Bug? Or You Think It's Logical?

[SpacePiglet]

Hi,

 

I play my Scoundrel healer at WZ every couple of days (depends on when I finish work). I am pretty much at the top 1 or 2 of every WZ heal scores. I couldn't help but notice a few things about this class.

 

Particularly one of its healing skills - Slow-release Medpac.

 

Background:

Slow-release Medpac:

• Instant cast with no cooldown.
  
• Heals X amount over 18 seconds.
  
• Stacks up to 2 times.
  

 

Scenario:

I pop my slow-release medpac on a few players twice.

The slow-release medpac buff icon will have the number 2 on it, meaning it has stacked twice already. And the 18 seconds are ticking down.

 

Then while the 18 seconds ticking down to, say about 2 seconds (though it can be any time you like before it goes to 0), I pop another slow-release medpac on that player, the icon still has the number 2 but the timer has gone back to the beginning - 18 seconds again.

So I repeat the above steps.

 

In conclusion I am able to perform 2 Slow-release Medpac's stack effect infinitely with the cost of just 1 Slow-release Medpac.

 

Is this a logical design?

Edited June 28, 2012 by SpacePiglet

[RendValor]

So what exactly is the bug? that it stacks twice? or that the second stack costs no energy?

 

While it may be an exploit, saving 15 energy isn't really something to write home about *shrug*

 

Edit: I just checked the description and it explicitly states that you can stack it tiwce. I'm honestly not sure what your point is, if there even was one.

Edited June 28, 2012 by RendValor

[Leiralei]

Working As Intended and a nice little mechanic it is too.

[SpacePiglet]

So what exactly is the bug? that it stacks twice? or that the second stack costs no energy?

 

While it may be an exploit, saving 15 energy isn't really something to write home about *shrug*

 

Edit: I just checked the description and it explicitly states that you can stack it tiwce. I'm honestly not sure what your point is, if there even was one.

 

It says it can stack twice.

But while the stack is not finished, you can refresh the stack again by just spend one Slow-release Medpac.

Is it not a bug that the tick timer goes back to the beginning again? Especially while the previous 2 stack effect just about to finish and you can exploit it by just cast Slow-release Medpac again just once.

 

Get the 2 stack effect for the price of one is intended?

[RendValor]

It's not the only power that uses that mechanic, so I guess it's working as intended.

 

Take for example the BH's Tracer Missile, which has an armor debuff that lasts 15 seconds, stacks up to 5 times. Each stack resets the timer so you can keep it up indefinitely.

[Bazzoong]

It says it can stack twice.

But while the stack is not finished, you can refresh the stack again by just spend one Slow-release Medpac.

Is it not a bug that the tick timer goes back to the beginning again? Especially while the previous 2 stack effect just about to finish and you can exploit it by just cast Slow-release Medpac again just once.

 

Get the 2 stack effect for the price of one is intended?

 

All stacks in the game work this way. Whenever you apply a fresh stack the timer gets reset it is obviously by design and not a bug, another operative example for this would be tactical advantage (upper hand for you pesky smugglers).

Edited June 28, 2012 by Bazzoong

[Deganji]

Hi,

 

I play my Scoundrel healer at WZ every couple of days (depends on when I finish work). I am pretty much at the top 1 or 2 of every WZ heal scores. I couldn't help but notice a few things about this class.

 

Particularly one of its healing skills - Slow-release Medpac.

 

Background:

Slow-release Medpac:

• Instant cast with no cooldown.
  
• Heals X amount over 18 seconds.
  
• Stacks up to 2 times.
  

 

Scenario:

I pop my slow-release medpac on a few players twice.

The slow-release medpac buff icon will have the number 2 on it, meaning it has stacked twice already. And the 18 seconds are ticking down.

 

Then while the 18 seconds ticking down to, say about 2 seconds (though it can be any time you like before it goes to 0), I pop another slow-release medpac on that player, the icon still has the number 2 but the timer has gone back to the beginning - 18 seconds again.

So I repeat the above steps.

 

In conclusion I am able to perform 2 Slow-release Medpac's stack effect infinitely with the cost of just 1 Slow-release Medpac.

 

Is this a logical design?

 

It's intended. Look at skills like armor debuffs, they stack to 5 and are refreshed with one application. I'd imagine some other classes have stacking DoTs, not sure though.

[Daiyukie]

Lol @ Thread. Game mechanics are HAAAARRRD.

[Heezdedjim]

Working exactly as intended. "Exploiting" this feature is the cornerstone of your energy management strategy, and the overall energy budget for our rotation has this "exploit" priced in as a basic assumption.

 

This "exploit" not only allows you to maintain active double stacks of healing running for 1/2 the energy cost, but it also allows you, by dong so, to keep Upper Hand fully charged just from running multiple stacks on several people and getting most of your charges from the multiple SRMP procs. And passively maintaining a full stack of UH is also a baseline, priced in assumption of our healing rotation and energy budget, since it gives you costless Emergency Medpac casts to throw for routine small bursts, while saving the major heal (the ages-to-cast-huge-energy-cost Underworld Medicine) for those times when you are under the heaviest pressure.

 

If you're NOT using this "exploit," then you can expect to fail, wipe, or go OOM in cases where you and your team should have come through just fine, because you're doing it wrong.

[Daiyukie]

And passively maintaining a full stack of UH is also a baseline, priced in assumption of our healing rotation and energy budget, since it gives you costless Emergency Medpac casts to throw for routine small bursts, while saving the major heal (the ages-to-cast-huge-energy-cost Underworld Medicine) for those times when you are under the heaviest pressure.

 

Ages to cast? xD My UWM channels in 1.6 seconds.

[Anaemone]

No. Its not an exploit nor is it broken. SRM works the same way as a druid's lifebloom in WoW. You expend a lot of resources (in this case, energy) up front to get the maximum amount of healing possible because you have to stack it twice. But the advantage is that you can simply refresh it every 18 seconds for the cost of one. It allows for better regen and it gives you a choice in healing; do you stack it once and save energy because that player only needs a little healing to be stabilized or stack it twice (burn up front energy) and get 18 seconds of buffer heals while you heal through a heavy load of damage?

 

The only things that could make SRM work better is if it had a large heal at the end that could crit, giving you another choice in allowing it to go the duration or save energy by refreshing and/or allow alacrity to effect how quickly it ticks.

 

Hope that helps. =D

[Kaijan]

Ages to cast? xD My UWM channels in 1.6 seconds.

 

Which means you've got around 500-600 alacrity. Your surge must be crap D=

[Seront]

Which means you've got around 500-600 alacrity. Your surge must be crap D=

 

200 surge is already like 74%... 400 surge gets you to 78.... Surge is so unbelievably worthless due to the severe diminishing returns. I wish I could dump it for more alacrity, I just don't have the right mods/enhancements at the moment.

Edited July 1, 2012 by Seront

[Kaijan]

200 surge is already like 74%... 400 surge gets you to 78.... Surge is so unbelievably worthless due to the severe diminishing returns. I wish I could dump it for more alacrity, I just don't have the right mods/enhancements at the moment.

 

Eh, difference of play style, I guess. I do a lot of PvE so maybe that's the difference. I like that my Heal combination is largely energy neutral, which will change with too much alacrity. I think that at 1.7-1.8 is the lowest I'd be willing to go, especially considering how rarely I cast it in PvP, and how little I need the speed increase in PvE.

 

And I dunno; I'd rather my 79% surge to a 1.6 heal.

 

And it's 262 surge for 74% and 400 is 77.45%, but thats not the important part. Thinking on it, I think a good mix would be 75% surge (291 surge) and a 1.75 cast (270 alacrity). But it means I'd have to diagnostic scan more, which is annoying, but at that alacrity level, it'd be a 1.83 cast time so maybe it's not so bad.

 

I'll think on it. =)

[Thorriin]

while saving the major heal (the ages-to-cast-huge-energy-cost Underworld Medicine) for those times when you are under the heaviest pressure.

 

If UWM takes ages to cast, then why don't you go look at Deliverance and compare.

[Kaijan]

If UWM takes ages to cast, then why don't you go look at Deliverance and compare.

 

Well damn, with a name like Deliverance, it should have an amazing buildup! There should be drum rolls and trumpets, so a long cast time is needed! =P

[Daiyukie]

Eh, difference of play style, I guess. I do a lot of PvE so maybe that's the difference. I like that my Heal combination is largely energy neutral, which will change with too much alacrity. I think that at 1.7-1.8 is the lowest I'd be willing to go, especially considering how rarely I cast it in PvP, and how little I need the speed increase in PvE.

 

And I dunno; I'd rather my 79% surge to a 1.6 heal.

 

And it's 262 surge for 74% and 400 is 77.45%, but thats not the important part. Thinking on it, I think a good mix would be 75% surge (291 surge) and a 1.75 cast (270 alacrity). But it means I'd have to diagnostic scan more, which is annoying, but at that alacrity level, it'd be a 1.83 cast time so maybe it's not so bad.

 

I'll think on it. =)

 

Alacrity in PvP = godly. Alacrity in PvE = worthless. The best example is that you can have a heal that crits for 10 million, but if you can't land it because it takes too long to cast, its healing is actually zero. I increase my throughput in PvP by a large amount simply by shaving off almost half a second from the cast time, every time. Hitting UWM and EMP in nearly the GCD timer is vastly different than hitting them in 1.8 seconds and up. I've tried having all Power/Surge enhancements from the BM Eliminator Cannon and the missed casts hurt too much. EMP spam only helps so much on someone that's dying. When I pop them up to 32% and throw in a quick UWM, those 0.4 seconds are vital, from what I have seen from lots of live play experience.

 

I saw a healer who had the opposite philosophy and ran 40% crit and 79.97% Surge and he was consistently hitting slightly higher heals, but a few hundred hitpoints on a crit cast really won't make as much difference as landing several casts faster. Faster is always better in regards to PvP play, I just wish Alacrity had more of an effect. Then again, Bioware seems to hate secondary stats when you look at what they did with Surge, so...

[Kaijan]

Alacrity in PvP = godly. Alacrity in PvE = worthless. The best example is that you can have a heal that crits for 10 million, but if you can't land it because it takes too long to cast, its healing is actually zero. I increase my throughput in PvP by a large amount simply by shaving off almost half a second from the cast time, every time. Hitting UWM and EMP in nearly the GCD timer is vastly different than hitting them in 1.8 seconds and up. I've tried having all Power/Surge enhancements from the BM Eliminator Cannon and the missed casts hurt too much. EMP spam only helps so much on someone that's dying. When I pop them up to 32% and throw in a quick UWM, those 0.4 seconds are vital, from what I have seen from lots of live play experience.

 

I saw a healer who had the opposite philosophy and ran 40% crit and 79.97% Surge and he was consistently hitting slightly higher heals, but a few hundred hitpoints on a crit cast really won't make as much difference as landing several casts faster. Faster is always better in regards to PvP play, I just wish Alacrity had more of an effect. Then again, Bioware seems to hate secondary stats when you look at what they did with Surge, so...

 

That's a valid philosophy. If I ran pure Medic more, then I'd definitely at least drop my cast to a 1.75. On the other hand, I usually run a Medic/Conceal hybrid so it ends up being a wasted stat 50% of the time. Eh. It's something I'd need to consider, especially considering that I rarely cast UWM in PvP and primarily rely on my instant casts which works plenty well for me. The only time I use UWM is if I'm not trailing a marauder or two (rare) or if they're CCd. Situations are everything, I figure.

[angrydurf]

Well damn, with a name like Deliverance, it should have an amazing buildup! There should be drum rolls and trumpets, so a long cast time is needed! =P

 

Or banjos ...

[Daiyukie]

That's a valid philosophy. If I ran pure Medic more, then I'd definitely at least drop my cast to a 1.75. On the other hand, I usually run a Medic/Conceal hybrid so it ends up being a wasted stat 50% of the time. Eh. It's something I'd need to consider, especially considering that I rarely cast UWM in PvP and primarily rely on my instant casts which works plenty well for me. The only time I use UWM is if I'm not trailing a marauder or two (rare) or if they're CCd. Situations are everything, I figure.

 

You need peels, because just EMP and SRM ain't saving anyone against the burst damage coming in. Getting lucky crit strings on EMPs on people below 30% means you failed to heal in the first place, but IS an effective stopgap measure.