How un-subbing doesn't help population

[DarthTHC]

If it's payback you're looking for, perhaps you should take it out on early access' petulant nerd ragers that all but forced Bioware to add those 70+ new servers at launch. Had BW ignored them (their fear was repeating Blizzard's debacle with WoW's release) and stuck to their plan instead of graciously giving the mob what it wanted, this wouldn't even be a topic.

 

Had BioWare ignored them the queues for the servers at startup would have been 3-5 HOURS. how quickly we forget...

Edited May 28, 2012 by DarthTHC

[thomasgallant]

Had BioWare ignored them the queues for the servers would have been 3-5 HOURS.

 

had they slowly increased the number of people per sever ( like they are now) instead of adding new servers as a stop gap measure we wouldnt be in this problem

[kriegheld]

Isn't this thread suppose to be about blaming the droves of people leaving?

 

Clearly long log-in queues are no longer an issue. Why is that?

Edited May 28, 2012 by kriegheld

[Staalker]

Let's not pretend that alot of these MMO players today are WoW players looking for that WoW killer MMO to pull them from thier addiction of it. When that MMO doesn't come with all the bells and whistles like a 7+ year old game, they whine, whine, whine then move on the NEXT new MMO and rinse and repeat. Destroying that new MMO. I have seen this BS happen to ALL new MMOs I have play. And I expect this to happen to any future MMO, no matter how great it is. People want Ez-mode MMOs now with fast food add-ons you can think of.

 

PvP can be little distraction for a bit for these band-wagon players. But after a few months when the players who actually perfect the PvP gameplay and gear up. The casuals, these fairweather players, will start the whine posts and threaten to quit because they can't compete anymore in the few hours they play a week. Or the hardcores who level to max in a few weeks and complain that there is nothing to do.

 

Blizzard treats thier players like moody spoiled brats that just want things handed to them. Giving in to whatever demands thier player base wanted. And what gets hurt at the end is the MMO community as a whole. When a noisy 14 year old teen holds alot of power in a given MMO forum and the sheep follow along to influence the devs to changing a game. That is a sign that the MMO gaming industry is slowly die.

 

Yup. Blizzard can't do anything but cater to "babies" anymore. Just look at Diablo 3. The only challenging thing in that game is getting online and staying connected.

 

They have taken the challange out of gaming. Remember when Mario died and had to redo the WHOLE level. No save points. Gaming changed at the turn of the century because some guy in a suit said, "let's just make a ton of money...who cares if people have fun anymore."

 

For any company to copy anything Blizzard does since WoW makes you want to have them checked for inbreeding. (no offense to any inbred gamers out there).

 

At least a few companies are willing to stick with the challenge aspect of gaming, even if they sell fewer copies and get slammed for it.

[Robert_Guiscard]

No, unsubbing might not help the population, but Bioware is providing me with no reason to play, much less pay, for SWTOR. If that changes, great. But just as I wouldn't continue to shop at a store that consistently sold me subpar products and hoping that changed if I just kept giving them more money, I shall not continue to give Bioware my money for something that is not worth paying for.

 

As far as blaming CUSTOMERS for the problem - given the amount of hype over the game, and releasing it during the holidays, having server capacity to deal with the massive influx of players is logical. Do you think people would have stuck around to play if they had to wait 4 hours to log in? Do you think EA and its shareholders would have been happy about it? I seriously doubt it. Bioware's failure was a failure of not knowing history. As with all MMOs, they should have expected a contraction in numbers after people tried it and decided it wasn't for them/didn't have time to play when the holidays were over/whatever other reasons they might have had. At that point, they should have had a feasible plan on how to consolidate the population and close down servers. Instead, they worked on the Legacy system - a feature that would have been suited for a stable game without major issues. The fact that they're still flailing around on this (and ironically, that the ill-timed Legacy system is what is probably taking so long) shows that Bioware really didn't do their homework on what to expect. But this is the fault of the players, apparently.

Edited May 28, 2012 by Robert_Guiscard

[Limedust]

Yup. Blizzard can't do anything but cater to "babies" anymore. Just look at Diablo 3. The only challenging thing in that game is getting online and staying connected.

 

They have taken the challange out of gaming. Remember when Mario died and had to redo the WHOLE level. No save points. Gaming changed at the turn of the century because some guy in a suit said, "let's just make a ton of money...who cares if people have fun anymore."

 

For any company to copy anything Blizzard does since WoW makes you want to have them checked for inbreeding. (no offense to any inbred gamers out there).

 

At least a few companies are willing to stick with the challenge aspect of gaming, even if they sell fewer copies and get slammed for it.

 

And where are these paragons who are willing to stick with the challenge? They aren't here, that's for sure. No, instead, the inbreeders (as you called them) that copied WOW are the ones running the forums, (mis)designing the game, and continuing to administrate SWTOR. Look no farther than the skills in your hotbar and tree for proof . . .

[ZudetGambeous]

For months it was all... "if you don't like it then just LEAVE!!!"

 

Now that pretty much everyone has... it's all... "It's all you stupid players fault for leaving, come back so I can play!!!!"

 

lol. Its so sad it's almost funny.

[Bluerodian]

And where are these paragons who are willing to stick with the challenge? They aren't here, that's for sure. No, instead, the inbreeders (as you called them) that copied WOW are the ones running the forums, (mis)designing the game, and continuing to administrate SWTOR. Look no farther than the skills in your hotbar and tree for proof . . .

 

I think that was his/her point.

 

For months it was all... "if you don't like it then just LEAVE!!!"

 

Now that pretty much everyone has... it's all... "It's all you stupid players fault for leaving, come back so I can play!!!!"

 

lol. Its so sad it's almost funny.

 

What's funnier is that back in the beta forums before the mechanics were announced it was all "They won't copy world of warcraft. This won't be WoW in space. Bioware is going to be doing things totally new!"

 

After the mechanics were announced, the tone switched to "They were right to copy WoW. It would be stupid to do anything different than WoW."

 

It was comedy gold to watch how quickly people waffled. If the TOP beta forums were a movie, it would have been directed by Mel Brooks.

Edited May 28, 2012 by Bluerodian

[Lordgeneral]

Are you suggesting that we should continue to support this game and company?

 

Don't blame the smart ones that see the writing on the wall. MMO veterans know exactly what is happening.

 

 

mmo veteran = no life

 

You a cod king to?

 

A minecraft war hero?

Edited May 28, 2012 by Lordgeneral

[kriegheld]

mmo veteran = no life

 

You a cod king to?

 

A minecraft war hero?

 

Cute. Don't look now, but your game is dying........

Edited May 28, 2012 by kriegheld

[Lordgeneral]

Cute. Don't look now, but your game is dying........

 

 

I had no part in creating the game, not my game. Hell I don't care if it does die or not, i enjoyed it for the time I had on it.

[kriegheld]

I had no part in creating the game, not my game. Hell I don't care if it does die or not, i enjoyed it for the time I had on it.

 

Don't worry, I didn't literally expect you to take any responsibility. I was generally speaking.

[Xatasha]

My two cents: Doesn't matter what a game has or doesn't has if you don't like it then don't play it. Offer some feedback on what would make it more fun for you.

[Deewe]

Seriously is this thread for real?

 

Let me run you through a few points of this game development and launch.

 

Before even beta players pointed BioWare at many issues they should avoid like:

• 2 separate faction will means population imbalance: we have this issue right now
  
• Killing the bada** Jedi in the cinematic and keeping making the Empire side cooler = less players on the Republic side (Answer see above)
  
• Putting too much emphasis on Story vs rest of others MMO elements = brings many issues. Many game elements are less polished than in other MMO or simply lacking
  
• Making the space sim not as a free roaming one = boring an unappealing. (yes I know the numbers tells them people do play that, but it does not tells them it's only because it's a fast XP/cash grin, most of the players I know admit it's boring.)
  
• Not preparing for sever merge and character transfers before launch = empty servers (Yes we told them before even launch and even the Beta started)
  
• Keeping Jetpacks and force jump for combat only = no you won't have 3D exploration and you won't grin using them. Especially since NPC and your companions do this as good as you do.
  
• Color locked planet and classes = game feels on rail and the world feels very much static
  

 

Then in beta:

• Poor body choices & very few nice body features = twin wars
  
• No Dual specs, nor AC to AC respec = shortage of healers
  
• Mods system and unify color = messy mods system that's a pain to maintain and still not as handy as appearance tab, nor even gear dyes.
  
• Too many loading screens, useless orbital stations = enjoy your ride wasting time moving around.
  
• Mandatory companions for being efficient = no you won't have companions skills kits.
  
• Lack of world PvP due to the game core design = one big boring instanced planet.
  
• Lackluster NPC AI = even the mobs are static
  

 

Then in the following patches:

• Mandatory legacy names = no you won't have separated last names
  
• Caping a specific specie = enjoy playing the same speice again on you alt, or pay. And have fun rerolling your characters because you can't switch your species.
  
• Legacy unlocks = enjoy spending millions of credits on barely useless perks
  
• Ship mail box, repair droid, training dummy, Neutral GTN = you can't even recall to your space ship and yes there's a free mail box next to your space ship docking station. Enjoy!
  
• Break the feeling of playing supposedly iconic classes allowing Jedi in Huttball, giving force powers to non force power users.
  
• Nerfing classes without really balancing them contrary to what the players were asking = get owned in PvP and useless in PvR
  
• Adding ugly looking gear = be happy looking like a an AoC, War, Rift, Gi-Joe character
  

 

Now for the events:

• Make sure to surprise the players with the Rackghoul event so if they don't start it day 1 they can't do all the quests and gets all the gear parts. And well don't send emails nor advertise it well.
  Also make sure to put the vendor in a non neutral area so others can grief players who are trying to trade their tokens.
  Be also certain to remove the vendor after the event and only announce it a couple of hours before removing it.
  Not to forget on PvE server do your best to flag players not interested in PvP at all.
  And finally make available nearly the exact same crystal others got as reward from buying expansive hardware.
  Almost forgot: do you best to copy a Wow event so it does not looks like SW too much especially a "zombie" one and certainly not around Halloween!
  

 

 

Seriously un-subbing people are helping the game more than you think because they are sending BioWare and others MMO a clear message: you have to get it right and do listen to the player base.

Edited May 28, 2012 by Deewe

[Mashy]

Last I checked, it was Bioware, not the Community that were slow to open Server Transfers, fix bugs and basically released a game still in it's Beta.

Bioware is paid to keep customers satisfied.

The Community pays to play.

 

So whose fault is it if people are leaving the game again?

 

^^This. Would you keep buying the same rotten tomatoes from the same supermarket or go somewhere else?

[Adderdin]

Look we are giving Bioware time.

 

Just not the money.

Edited May 28, 2012 by Adderdin

[JerokTalram]

Understatement of the Year nominee

[GalacticKegger]

Had BioWare ignored them the queues for the servers at startup would have been 3-5 HOURS. how quickly we forget...

Dev had it fixed in less than 4 weeks, with higher pop servers being handled first. The players who screamed queue hell for more servers in early access got their way, then rerolled onto the fresh servers - stranding themselves & thinning populations out in the process. So they bailed, probably laughing like hell on their way out. You should thank them for giving you reason to rant - if you can find 'em. Edited May 28, 2012 by GalacticKegger

[Dokar]

They had it fixed in less than 4 weeks, especially on the high pop servers. The players who screamed queue hell for more servers in early access got their way, then rerolled onto the fresh servers - stranded themselves & thinning populations out in the process. Then they bailed, probably laughing on their way out. You should thank them for giving you reason to rant - if you can find 'em.

 

So people who are quitting because it takes hours to form groups because of popluation are going to stay after paying for the game but hardly being able to play it at all because of queues for thier entire starter month?

[Culdor]

If it's payback you're looking for, perhaps you should take it out on early access' petulant nerd ragers that all but forced Bioware to add those 70+ new servers at launch. Had BW ignored them (their fear was repeating Blizzard's debacle with WoW's release) and stuck to their plan instead of graciously giving the mob what it wanted, this wouldn't even be a topic.

 

Every major game in recent memory has had this issue, and thus it is hardly one that should be a surprise to someone developing an MMO. What is a surprise is that the game company didn't have transfer code written/tested/in place before the release of the game.

 

.

[Satans_Puppet]

End of the day this is a paid subscription game, intial guilds were allocated a server which were full from the get get. BW/EA should have been keeping an eye on population levels and started rolling transfers/merges so the job wasn't so big when things suddenly dropped off which they always do with MMO's.

 

The population is unsubbing because they're not being treated like a paying customer, there is no flow of information. The latest 1.3 video told us what was coming without telling us when or how or even to what extent the features could be used.

 

We're a paying customer base... treat us like one, don't treat us like a cash cow! Mind you having been burned by the digital deluxe scam I shoulda seen this coming... that was a waste of money!

[CrunkShizzle]

in a way unsubbing does

 

that means 1 less crybaby the community has to tolerate

[eclipce]

un-subbing and roaring on the forum tells us one thing even if we play it or not, like it or not. Hopefully BioWare notices - what we know fore sure is that they notices their sub vs-un-sub "metrics" and will strive to adjust it in their favor.. making a better game.

[JerokTalram]

Formatting messed up and you couldn't easily read my post so I just deleted it. Edited May 28, 2012 by JerokTalram

[Velgar]

I do not understand folks that defend Bioware with statements about how wow did not have this or that on release. I am sorry, but in business you have to compete your competitors as they exist today, not seven years ago. Coming late to the market means you start at a disadvantage of having to incorporate all the lessons your competition has already learned and all the innovations they have already incorporated into their product. Bioware failed miserably at this task. There is no defense for building a product that competes with where your competition was years ago. And that is why I am very disappointed with the game, which it turns out was grossly over-hyped.