So really? WOW killer?

[Kelenan]

It should have done well, but the poor policies, and the extremely bad choices by the development team, and the blatant denials that there are any problems has definitely made it so this game shall never meet the potential it once had.

[asbalana]

This game DID have that potential but was utterly mismanaged. Right now Blizzard is having a non-stop party as they prepare for their next expansion, since TOR was the only real title that could have challenged them. Christmas bonuses all around for Blizzard this year. They should send BW/EA multiple fruit baskets this year in appreciation.

 

LOL, must agree with this.

 

I am somewhat new to the gaming world, but it does somewhat remind me of politics. It does not matter how bad you are or how many mistakes you make as long as the other guy is worse.

 

LOL again, after losing 2M or so subs, Blizzard is looking good. Scratches head and chuckles.

[Novaside]

Well, if it makes a difference, this game DID kill WOW for me. I just can't play that game anymore. I have like 4 level 85s and 6 75-84 toons, hundreds of hours played and logging into that game just feels wrong now.

 

^This. Unsubbed from WoW as soon as I got into this game. Love the game and the characters I have created. Will never be going back.

[Gokkus]

At least the some other QQ threads had more argumentation and insight......I disapprove of this thread.

[asbalana]

Well, if it makes a difference, this game DID kill WOW for me. I just can't play that game anymore. I have like 4 level 85s and 6 75-84 toons, hundreds of hours played and logging into that game just feels wrong now.

 

I usually don't post twice in a row, but this hit me.

 

I have five 85s and left WOW months before the swtor launch. I recently downloaded the free to play 20 level version and from time to time find myself logging off of swtor and onto WOW. WOW in some ways just feels so old and tired and I well know the end of the road and why I unsubbed. But geez, it is nice every so often to get on and feel an open world and see life (bunnies hopping around and cows mooing and birds flying overhead and so on). It is nice to walk once again through SW after spending time in the dark shopping mall like fleet. It is so so nice to actually feel responsive combat and know if I push a button, my cast will go off without my swtor SI having a few tick internal debate over whether or not to actually do what I told him to. Sometimes the debate does not go my way and the spell is never cast - I forgot what it felt like to fight and not mash buttons multiple times while yelling fire darn you fire.

 

Edit - I just remembered the stange feeling that I had the first time I logged onto WOW. Then I realized that my character actually had a shadow (beyond my 1 1/2 year old $ 4,500 rig in swtor).

Edited May 23, 2012 by asbalana

[Pexxle]

Well, if it makes a difference, this game DID kill WOW for me. I just can't play that game anymore. I have like 4 level 85s and 6 75-84 toons, hundreds of hours played and logging into that game just feels wrong now.

 

This quote sums up my thoughts exactly. Without being naive I have noticed a drop in players on my server. Either they were just bad at Swtor overall OR if they were "good" , they had an awkward issue such as "NO mic for ventrillo" which nullifies their use as main healers/ tanks. They are missed but easily replaceable by a more savvy player over time. Fyi i have witnessed numerous i have Vent but no mic" in Swtor. Sheer coincidence but weird none the less. Those people were always quick to Type out braggadocious claims of experience about games like WoW and during mishaps in operations YET have no mic/ no interest in buying a cheap replacement. I CALL SHENANNIGANS, good riddance to those types.

[Arunas]

No P2P MMO worth playing until Titan comes out probably

[Darkhosis]

This game DID have that potential but was utterly mismanaged. Right now Blizzard is having a non-stop party as they prepare for their next expansion, since TOR was the only real title that could have challenged them. Christmas bonuses all around for Blizzard this year. They should send BW/EA multiple fruit baskets this year in appreciation.

 

THIS and this again-^

 

SWTOR could have easily became huge but due to poor management it went south fast. The devs went off partying too hard after launch seemingly abandoning the game for 2 months. When they got back it was already too late.

 

It was hard to watch. Another potentially wonderful game woefully mismanaged.

[JediElf]

Well, if it makes a difference, this game DID kill WOW for me. I just can't play that game anymore. I have like 4 level 85s and 6 75-84 toons, hundreds of hours played and logging into that game just feels wrong now.

 

Same here, 4 level 85's, and I tried to get out of that annual pass contract yesterday, they didn't let me. I can't even really log into the game anymore...it's so.....so...I can't describe it....but my interest in WOW is now completely gone.

 

This is the only MMO that I ever want to play now, this is it.

[Kurfer]

This quote sums up my thoughts exactly. Without being naive I have noticed a drop in players on my server. Either they were just bad at Swtor overall OR if they were "good" , they had an awkward issue such as "NO mic for ventrillo" which nullifies their use as main healers/ tanks. They are missed but easily replaceable by a more savvy player over time. Fyi i have witnessed numerous i have Vent but no mic" in Swtor. Sheer coincidence but weird none the less. Those people were always quick to Type out braggadocious claims of experience about games like WoW and during mishaps in operations YET have no mic/ no interest in buying a cheap replacement. I CALL SHENANNIGANS, good riddance to those types.

 

I like how your post when off on a completely random and totally off-topic rant about vent and not having mics.

 

Odd fellow is odd.

[Darth_Victus]

There is no such thing as a WoW killer, until Titan comes out

 

Titan was canceled.

 

Supposedly it was a Halo based MMO that was to take place after the games. But since Bungie sold the Halo title to Microsoft, and Microsoft is not working on 3 more Halo games; so with that it through the project out the window. Blizzard is no focusing more on WoW expansions.

 

Which explains whip MoP looks very refreshing and more creative then its last 2 expansions.

[Ashlian]

I agree that I shouldn't have hyped the game up as much but it's SW and it's an MMO. I'm not ranting saying "I told you so" as I really do wish this game had that enjoyment some games have which gives them staying power. I just unsubbed and still have 85 days game time to try see a turn around but IMO the game is fundamentally flawed.

 

Missing features and bugs is something I can deal with in a new MMO but too many of the core functions of the game are just poorly designed. Traveling to a planet takes way too long, expertise was IMO a bad way to go in PVP, Orange gear vs cosmetic gear/dyes, story/hard/nightmare as progression is a cop out, legacy is nothing but a credit sink, linear planet progression, space combat... The list goes on.

 

Looking at what 1.3 entails it just seems like more of the same with a group finder. Ohh and 1 last thing, the community is horrible. When I left WOW it was largely due to what the community had become and here , that is where the community has started. I shudder to think of what it will be like in 6 months time. Seriously, scroll up and read a few of the posts above mine (and likely after) and get a decent cross section of the community.

 

The community on the forums is rarely reflective of the community in the game. Since so few people actually post anything here. I have a friend who posts any issue through some form of ingame customer service and gets actual live chat replies. She hates the forums with the fiery passions of hell because of the constant vitriol and lack of constructive feedback (this game sucks, it's dying and only doing THIS, RIGHT NOW!!@!@! is not constructive feedback) and she relies on me to tell her anything important regarding announcements.

 

As for your list of poor design decisions, I don't find most of them troubling to the long term health of the game, barring a few caveats. Orange gear can work as long as the available pool keeps expanding, which it is. As long as features available to character regarding gear become available to the companions, which they've stated they will, like match to chestpiece and hood down toggle when it's in.

 

Addition of more difficult endgame content, I wouldn't expect until after the base game was released anyway, and likely not until the first true expansion. All endgame content in a first release has to take into consideration the learning curve for people for whom it might be completely new territory. Later expansions can assume they had the earlier content to learn on. I know that's tough for the veteran gamers, and they tried to spice it up with nightmare for you, but you have to assume as a dev designing a game that SOME PEOPLE have just not played this type of game before. We actually do have in our guild a couple of people who haven't played MMO's, therefore never raided. They're fast learners, but the ease of the curve on initial content does exist for that very reason. Not everyone IS a hugely fast learner, and you can't just write them out of your business model.

 

It doesn't take any longer to travel from my ship to another location than it did for me to UNLOCK the bells that were EQ2's first travel option and had unlocking quests tied to them past the starter zones for the first six months or more of the game. Or to travel from bell to griffin to bell to get to where I was going. I wish they'd fix the planets where travel to ship is broken and I wish they'd let you travel straight from ship to planet. But it's funny......they made it take a bit of time to get on the ship and travel places because one of people's biggest complaints is that really fast and easy travel makes travel seem trivial. That it SHOULD take time. I thought they did a pretty good job balancing the time, myself, but that's just me, having seen both the travel forever and instaclick sides of the spectrum.

 

Space combat.....they've stated repeatedly they have something big in the works with that that couldn't make it into launch, and I believe them on that. I would rather see it released workable and polished than rushed and broken so that more people would come complaining on the forums about how the end of SWTOR is near. I'm looking forward to seeing their project and hope it really does turn out to be enjoyable.

 

The game itself though......other than the usual freshman bug fixes and content not in game at launch that is being added, I really like the game. It's definitely focused on class and story and if you find them boring quickly, I think the game would bore you brainless before long. No MMO is ever going to actually please all gamers out there. I have no plans to touch GW2 with a ten foot pole, because it's not my style. But I know that up front, and I wouldn't go play GW2 and then sit there talking about how much the game sucks because of features not meant for my playstyle (like Legacy is obviously meant for a certain set of players - my guildies are mostly having fun with it), and how every other coming MMO will be SO MUCH BETTER.

 

Not everyone likes the same things. The world is wonderful that way. And the people who do like the game, Legacy, the class stories, what to us is the great replayability with different classes, and the voice acting, are pretty much the target audience. Not fanbois, I didn't even follow the game, until my brother shoved it into my hands in February for my birthday, as I was off MMO's since SOE"s EQ2 security debacle a year or so ago. I just like it for what it is, but then I had no expectations I'd built up. Do I want more....of course, particularly fixes in PVP that SHOULD be a priority, and I hope ARE, but more is coming, more always does in MMO's. I'm looking forward to seeing what.

[Excorsion]

Wows development map on wiki is only scheduled tll 2014 project titan is the next deal from them according to that. only wow can kill wow but unfortunately it seems to have set a bar for what we expect from games at launch it also created the entitlement generation where work is meh want epics now is the slogan.

 

setting the bar for what to expect from a game at launch? Really... are you blaming a game company because they don't have what wow does 7 years after wow was launched?

 

How about we nit pick wow about what they didn't have when swtor was launched...

 

A rich experience in lore.... you don't just sit on the sideline... your class story makes you feel like you are actually making a difference...

 

How about companions..... Nope not a single companion on wow.... unlessd you count pets which honestly is weaker than swtor companions

 

How about moddable gear.. not transmogging or what ever they call it... you get a moddable piece of gear soon as you finish your first planet.. yet in wow you have to make it to 85 to tweak your stats... and then it's a limited tweak.

 

So go ahead... try pointing the blame at bioware... because they don't have everything that wow does.... Just remember... wow don't have everything swtor does either...

 

This is coming from a raid lead of wow for 7 years... was ranked 53th in the world for guild progression thru BC.

Wow had it's moments but it's dated and what they are coming out with now is nothing but a cycle of gutting a system and redoing it. Swtor is stilol trying to bring new stuff out.. like legacy...another thing WOW will prolly rip off from swtor.

[Vankris]

Same here, 4 level 85's, and I tried to get out of that annual pass contract yesterday, they didn't let me. I can't even really log into the game anymore...it's so.....so...I can't describe it....but my interest in WOW is now completely gone.

 

This is the only MMO that I ever want to play now, this is it.

 

just a side note, blizzard does not control your bank account, you are still free (in most country) to use your money however you like. If you oppose to the monthly fee, blizzard will have no choice to freeze your account. They will not permanently close it, they never do, it has always be their business strategy to let the door open for costumer to come back, its part of what has made their strengh. You might however lose the licence of diablo 3 and access to the MoP beta.

[solidkjames]

No P2P MMO worth playing until Titan comes out probably

 

Though there is a vested interest in making Titan B2P and adding a cash shop. Yet since peope think it is an MMORPG there is no way for people to know that. Blizzard is looking hard at that structure for Titan as they are trying to cater to the casual facebook user and not the "mainstream" MMORPG veteran. Don't be surprised if the game is B2P with a cash shop targeting Zynga customers. Though in people's minds they are dreaming of this awesome follow up hit to WoW, it just isn't going to happen. If SWTOR fails then all you are going to have in the next 5 years is TES online or stick with WoW and it's child like gameplay.

[Sharpiie]

See ya! Another forum poster that I don't have to see post anymore about how much his life sucks because SW's isn't what he wanted it to be.

 

lol the more people that leave the worse, look at the servers already, they really can't afford losing people. LMAO

[dvrocc]

And why are you comparing 6 month old swtor to 7+ year old wow? sure has been a lot of that around here lately.

 

WoW doesn't need help to kill itself its already heaing that way, I feel blizzard is tailoring to the saian market with the kung fu panda theme because american subs are droping like flies to other MMO's if blizzard wants to keep folks they need to full adapt the "free 2 play" style fully at max level and offer the micro-stransactions.

[MMornard]

It's Star Wars. It's Old Republic.

 

I play because it's Star Wars. I like it, but I learned long ago that the secret to happiness is management of expectations.

 

Thinking it was going to be a "WoW Killer" is, at best, incredibly naive.

 

Why not just enjoy it for what it is?

[MMornard]

lol the more people that leave the worse, look at the servers already, they really can't afford losing people. LMAO

 

The only ones leaving are the whiny crybabies. The game has only become better as they have left.

 

If I need to do group content, that's why I have friends in real life.

[solidkjames]

lol the more people that leave the worse, look at the servers already, they really can't afford losing people. LMAO

 

Yet coming to the forums and acting like 3 year olds will fix the game how? If something is inherently missing from this game for people there is nothing going to fix it but time. Not crying, threatening to quit, murder or trolling. The simple fact is the game is still growing, features will be added, some will suck some will be great. Server transfers are coming to curb the "I'm playing alone people". Many people will return, then they wille expect new content. HOpefully Bioware can release a new raid and rated warzones before the summer. Then by the time MoP comes out you will have the choice of playing this game with 90% of all the things people are asking for or playing something else.

 

In the meantime all of these, OMG the sky is falling, the game is failing, I told you so posts are just going to continue to no avail. It doesn't change the fact that MMO's need time to change and the sooner the idiots realize this, the sooner these forums will start getting visited by Bioware. I don't blame them one bit for not catering to trolls because when my kids show their *** I don't give them attention, I ignore them until they act right. The faster the forums clear of the kids the sooner the adults can get back to work on SWTOR. The sad part is we will probably have to lose most of these people crying but they will be back, they always come back.

[rymah]

I kinda feel stupid for ever expecting this game to do well. I honestly believed that the masses would flock to it and appreciate it as a far superior game to what's currently on the market. Turns out it's WAR all over again, with lackluster implementation ruining an otherwise brilliant opportunity. The game is no giant slayer & I'm pretty curious to see if it will weather the storm of MMOs coming out this year with a lot of potential.

 

The only people who claim any new MMO is a potential WoW killer are either the players who put the game on too high of a pedestal or the developers who are really reaching beyond their grasp. In SWToR's case, the players are to blame for the hype, myself included...unless a game can launch with 5 million subs and grow from there, the only thing that's going to bring down the behemoth that is WoW, is WoW itself. And that by no means is an ideal situation for any new MMO to look forward to.

 

As for myself, I'm going to continue to play this game and see where it goes, at least until it stops being enjoyable and starts to be work.

Edited May 23, 2012 by rymah

[Veluthurk]

I usually don't post twice in a row, but this hit me.

 

I have five 85s and left WOW months before the swtor launch. I recently downloaded the free to play 20 level version and from time to time find myself logging off of swtor and onto WOW. WOW in some ways just feels so old and tired and I well know the end of the road and why I unsubbed. But geez, it is nice every so often to get on and feel an open world and see life (bunnies hopping around and cows mooing and birds flying overhead and so on). It is nice to walk once again through SW after spending time in the dark shopping mall like fleet. It is so so nice to actually feel responsive combat and know if I push a button, my cast will go off without my swtor SI having a few tick internal debate over whether or not to actually do what I told him to. Sometimes the debate does not go my way and the spell is never cast - I forgot what it felt like to fight and not mash buttons multiple times while yelling fire darn you fire..

 

I've had a very similar experience, multiple 85s, etc. Two months into Cata most of my guild had wandered off due to the boring same ol, same ol so I handed to the keys to the guild to a trusted friend and un-subbed. On a lark I did the digital DL on Christmas day because I was bored and needed my MMO fix.

 

I too miss the open world and the constant activity going on in it. Have had several long conversations about the responsiveness their game has compared to others. Despite these I don't intend to ever go back to WoW.

 

For me the main fly in the ointment is virtually no one I know picked up TOR. They are all playing the beta for GW2 or wasting time on Steam waiting for the second coming of something, etc.

Edited May 23, 2012 by Veluthurk

[Sharpiie]

Yet coming to the forums and acting like 3 year olds will fix the game how? If something is inherently missing from this game for people there is nothing going to fix it but time. Not crying, threatening to quit, murder or trolling. The simple fact is the game is still growing, features will be added, some will suck some will be great. Server transfers are coming to curb the "I'm playing alone people". Many people will return, then they wille expect new content. HOpefully Bioware can release a new raid and rated warzones before the summer. Then by the time MoP comes out you will have the choice of playing this game with 90% of all the things people are asking for or playing something else.

 

In the meantime all of these, OMG the sky is falling, the game is failing, I told you so posts are just going to continue to no avail. It doesn't change the fact that MMO's need time to change and the sooner the idiots realize this, the sooner these forums will start getting visited by Bioware. I don't blame them one bit for not catering to trolls because when my kids show their *** I don't give them attention, I ignore them until they act right. The faster the forums clear of the kids the sooner the adults can get back to work on SWTOR. The sad part is we will probably have to lose most of these people crying but they will be back, they always come back.

 

You realize server transfer won't save this game? Sure it will feel awesome for a month or two. In time you will figure how bad they are really doing, why the majority of the people have quit or complain about the game, there is almost no positive threads out there. I have been supporting this game hard before it came out, when people said it was going to fail I told them they didn't know what they were talking about, how wrong I was. I loved the game, had much potential, but it was ruined.

[Rhysling]

Well it won't be this game and I don't see anything else in the near future that looks promising.

[Lord_Ravenhurst]

MMORPG players will not be the target market for Titan and this has been stated by Blizzard 100 times. People still keep thinking it's going to be WoW 2.0 but what they don't realize is Blizzard is targeting facebook mom's across America. There is no segment of game that is currently targeting this market outside of Zynga games and considering Zynga made more money than WoW last year I would say it's a good market to go after. If you think WoW is easy mode wait til you see Titan. This game will be the last Triple AAA current gen MMO launched for quite some time so let's all hope Bioware can stick to the grind and get this game going. It needs content and reasons for people to log in. That is the main achilles heel right now.

 

No one´s thinking Titan will be WoW 2.0. It´s intended to co-exist with WoW. Blizzard would be stupid to do that same old stuff one more time anyway.

Honestly, it´s about time the MMORPG genre as it was popular the last decade dies a quick and painless death.

EVERY other genre, I mean EVERY other genre has evolved over the years, except the dreaded button mashing gear grinding brainless concept of MMORPG.

Not following the TOR beta or any early reports on it, I was taken by surprise how incredibly oldschool TOR was designed. Compared to SWG it was a backstep in innovation. But hey, there are still games coming out following the very same old WoW concept, which in fact was already dated and ripped off even older games, when "Vanilla WoW" came out.

Looking into the future of MMOs - all I read about Titan, it´s about to become a massive multiplayer RPG/FPS in a new lore universe and it will be revolutionary and focusing on social aspects. That is what I expected from TOR and they failed, next year we´ll see if Blizzard fails too, but I doubt that.

Edited May 23, 2012 by Lord_Ravenhurst