(From Taugrim.com)SWTOR Has Repeated RIFT’s Mistakes in Endgame PVP

[DweezillKagemand]

I stopped reading that post when he said he bought the WH weapon lololol.

 

Also, you can get full BM in like 3 days.

Edited May 21, 2012 by DweezillKagemand

[GrumpySwe]

What you are talking about is called experience, and i purposely left it out, because he has 20 freaking years of it.

 

And experience is essentially RAW DATA, it takes mental ability to turn it into something actually useful.

Not the point I was making, probably didn't explain well

My point was that someone can be really good in theory countering abilities and strategies correctly but be completely incapable of doing the same when actually playing the game.

Often capability in theory goes hand in hand with capability in practise but not always.

 

So feel free to ignore this guys conclusions just don't ignore opinions simply because they isn't coming from a "pro".

Hope I made that understandable

[Dmasterr]

I for one SUCK in the worst way when it comes to anything 'twitch.'

 

You mean reflex? you do realize that there is a 1.5 seconds global cooldown which essential levels the playing field. (save for very few abilities that are off gcd)

 

This isn't starcraft where apm (actions per minute) and reflex actually matters.

 

If it takes longer than 1.5 seconds to translate thought into action,that is not normal and i suggest you visit your local physician.

[Orangerascal]

If gaming was a physical sport, then yes. coaches have the knowledge but lack the physical ability that comes with extensive training.

 

Sadly for him, and your bad analogy, gaming is all about knowledge and how to apply it. If he lacks that, he can't comment on game balance.

 

You see, physical sports are two dimensional, they require mental ability and physical ability. You may lack one and excel at another, Gaming however only has 1 dimension, mental ability . If you lack that, well you're screwed.

 

Err, yeah ... Whilst I think mmo's are pretty faceroll, play an rts or fps and tell me they don't require the physical ability.

 

A friend of mine stated this about Star Craft a few years ago: It requires the dexterity of a pianist while having the wit of a chess player. As a high diamond sc2 player (quit before master level came out), I have to agree with him.

 

But you're right 50% of the fight in mmo's are gear, 25% is comp/build, 15% is rng and then you're stuck with the 10% thats actual skill. These numbers are anecdotal (from my time in multiple mmos) and completely made up by me in case the scientific rules lawyers start trolling.

Edited May 21, 2012 by Orangerascal

[Payneintherear]

I should start a blog since i've played plenty of MMO's just for the pvp over the last 10 years... maybe I can be considered credible for that too.

 

That ship sailed when you started defending Marauder's and Sentinel's OP status in every thread (lately you have been arguing that changes to their defense would affect pve balance?).

 

Start your blog early the next game you play.

[Xerain]

is so great and fun. It's a unbalanced grind from hell for FOTM players.

 

Did i really just read this? What is up with all these "gimme gimme gimme!" players in MMO's these days? You want to be a lone wolf and "pwn noobs" right away go back to first person shooters.

[Xerain]

That ship sailed when you started defending Marauder's and Sentinel's OP status in every thread (lately you have been arguing that changes to their defense would affect pve balance?).

 

Start your blog early the next game you play.

 

It actually would. A dead dps is doing no dps and not helping the raid at all. Wish everyone that pulled aggro could get a button that would avoid death like that but you see MMO's not everyone gets the same skill sets, what makes it diverse and fun. (Using your skill set to counter others skill sets). Also it was just for Undying rage.

[Lord_Karsk]

Did i really just read this? What is up with all these "gimme gimme gimme!" players in MMO's these days? You want to be a lone wolf and "pwn noobs" right away go back to first person shooters.

 

No it should not take hundred of wz and weeks upon weeks before a player can enjoy the

game in a fun competetive way.+ many players who want to enjoy the game dont have 18 hours a day

to grind for gear.

[Raansu]

He claims post 1.2 pvp gearing is grindy? REALLY!? My main took like 2 months to get full BM pre 1.2 because I'd never get the damn tokens. I'd open 30 bags before I got one single token, and 4 times I got a token for a piece I already had. Only reason it picked up near the end was because they added the tokens to the pvp vendor and I could trade my wz/merc comms for a bm token. I got my last 2 pieces using that method.

 

Post 1.2?

 

You have recruit gear to start out with. Yes the stats suck but at least you have easy access to a full set of gear with a good chunk of expertise in it. Pre 1.2 when you first hit 50 you'd have 6 bm bags that got you a few pieces of cent gear and you had to full the rest with modded slots and grind a crap ton of pvp before 50 to buy the pre 50 pvp weapons and strip the mods out of them since they had some expertise on them.

 

Saving all your comms can get you about 3 pieces of BM gear right off the bat + recruit gear if you buy it and you will have over 900 expertise easily. My alt was in full BM in less then a week...and I had 2 pieces of war hero within 2 weeks. What exactly is grindy about pvp gear in 1.2? Its freaking easy mode right now.

[Xerain]

No it should not take hundred of wz and weeks upon weeks before a player can enjoy the

game in a fun competetive way.+ many players who want to enjoy the game dont have 18 hours a day

to grind for gear.

 

It doesn't take weeks upon weeks. I just had a friend hit 50 two days ago and he's already full BM besides the two implants. War Hero gear isn't that big an upgrade over BM. Yes he did it fast, go outside noob imo. But you can get full BM rather quickly.

[Raansu]

No it should not take hundred of wz and weeks upon weeks before a player can enjoy the

game in a fun competetive way.+ many players who want to enjoy the game dont have 18 hours a day

to grind for gear.

 

The difference between WH and BM isn't that big of a gab and it takes very little time to get full BM. And out of complete boredom I rolled into a match with recruit gear for a couple of days on my main and did pretty damn well given the drop from WH/BM mixed gear.

 

So your excuse of not being able to be competitive is a moot point. Find yourself a premade because atm going solo is suicide.

[Xerain]

The difference between WH and BM isn't that big of a gab and it takes very little time to get full BM. And out of complete boredom I rolled into a match with recruit gear for a couple of days on my main and did pretty damn well given the drop from WH/BM mixed gear.

 

So your excuse of not being able to be competitive is a moot point. Find yourself a premade because atm going solo is suicide.

 

Mid feb i hit 50 on swiftsure and got full cent gear pretty fast and i was rolling over noobs with all their BM gear. Player skill does help tons.

[LenrocNewDawn]

My alt trooper dinged 50 Friday evening 05.18.12. After he dinged I got on my main for a guild OP. Played him Saturday and Sunday for about 8-10 hours total. Now I have 2 pieces of WH (earpiece+implant) and 4 pieces of BM (main armor pieces bar chest piece which I'll get today). I did saved coms before dinging but still I wouldn't call this a grind. My trooper is healer (since everybody said they are trash post 1.2 I had to re-roll one) and I never felt useless in a WZ. Hmm, maybe in a couple where we got rolled over by a powerful premade but I was just as useless as everybody else .

Also there is a big difference between being guarded by a real tank, one that uses his taunts and his damage mitigation skills, and a hybrid one, that puts his guard up and then goes about his business swinging his blade at the enemy. Big BiG BIG difference for a healer. First case I can keep both tank and me well and dandy soaking damage and throw some heals to other people around us. Second case I struggle to keep him up while chasing him around the map sometimes ignoring more important players around (my decision making in the matter is improving though ). I do feel some classes are a bit over the top in 1.2 but since is all opinion w/o any hard proof I will let the pros that have access to metrics to better judge those cases .

 

TL;DR version 1.2 is a step in the right direction but there is still plenty room for improvement . <- OPINION

Edited May 21, 2012 by LenrocNewDawn

[Cempa]

Mid feb i hit 50 on swiftsure and got full cent gear pretty fast and i was rolling over noobs with all their BM gear. Player skill does help tons.

 

I smile as I read your post, first because you play Marauder and second because you use the word 'skill.'

[anticept]

No it should not take hundred of wz and weeks upon weeks before a player can enjoy the

game in a fun competetive way.+ many players who want to enjoy the game dont have 18 hours a day

to grind for gear.

 

Actually have to disagree with you here i enjoyed pvp with orange moddables vs champ/bm and then champ vs bm and then bm vs bm the gear didn´t make the game any less or more enjoyable 1.2 made the game unenjoyable.

[anticept]

I smile as I read your post, first because you play Marauder and second because you use the word 'skill.'

 

Shh don´t break his bubble..

[Xerain]

I smile as I read your post, first because you play Marauder and second because you use the word 'skill.'

 

Oh yes because this game is so full of skill and mara/sent got all these magic buffs that weren't in the patch notes that made them godlike op'ed right?

 

 

Guy is probably a pre 1.2 sorc who spammed lightning and waited for the proc for chain lightning right.

[nallard]

What you are talking about is called experience, and i purposely left it out, because he has 20 freaking years of it.

 

And experience is essentially RAW DATA, it takes mental ability to turn it into something actually useful.

 

Yes Taugrim has experience and he is using his mental ability to turn it into something useful. He has thought about what he has experienced and taken the time to make a lengthy and constructively critical argument about the current state of PvP.

 

You can do the same if you disagree with his conclusions. So far you haven't tried to refute anything he has said, you have only criticized him for not meeting some arbitrary standard that you have set. Your opinion of his ability, or lack thereof, has no bearing on the actual discussion.

 

If all you want to do is feel like you're better and more important than everyone else, then I'd suggest therapy to resolve your feelings of insecurity. Perhaps that insecurity is why you've set your color to yellow - you might feel that nobody will pay attention to what you have to say unless you find a way to make yourself more visible.

 

Do you actually have anything to say about PvP in 1.2 or do you just hate everyone who garners more attention than you?

[Daxun]

Just a big EL OH EL to the people asking who is Taug and why they should care what he has to say...

 

"he's not a top player" lol?! *** does that even mean...

 

He's spot on as usual. BW repeated mistakes made by many others. They might not have a chance to recover though. While the new games coming out might not be the sole reason people are leaving, they will be the reason people do not decide to come back after BW "fixes" things.

[Sookster]

And yeah i think most of us agree.Good blog by Taugrim as always.This man knows more

about your own PvP BioWare then your PvP team.

 

http://taugrim.com/2012/05/20/swtor-has-repeated-rifts-mistakes-in-endgame-pvp/

 

Not really, considering he skipped picking up BM pieces for a shiny weapon.

[tynt]

I love it when people say there is no skill to playing SWTOR. Those are the same people that are free kills in any 1v1 situation with any class.

 

Also LOL at the above thread. I agree I have played all classess 40+ and marauders are no difficult than the other melee classes except for the fact that they do more damage and have better defense (lolwut).

[sonofchiefy]

My main claim to PvP experience is with a top 20 guild for around 2 years in Guild Wars. There was no "gear" thing at all, you just rolled a fully equipped character and played.

 

I don't get these games where you need to earn PvP gear and stats, it doesn't make any sense. Who would think this is a good idea, it's just weird to me.

 

Roll a fully equipped character, join your team, go PvP. That is all.

[cyvaris]

Not really, considering he skipped picking up BM pieces for a shiny weapon.

 

Or skipped picking up MULTIPLE BM pieces. That's why you save comms, not so that you can grab a Warhero piece right away.

 

Personally I think it would be nice if Bio brought back a Valor requirement for both types of gear. For one this would stop the idiots who refuse to buy Recruit, since then the grind to BM would be a bit longer/they would be out of luck longer since they did not buy their Recruit gear. A Valor requirement on BM gear would also mean Bio could up the stats on Recruit just a touch since people would be in it longer.

[Xerain]

My main claim to PvP experience is with a top 20 guild for around 2 years in Guild Wars. There was no "gear" thing at all, you just rolled a fully equipped character and played.

 

I don't get these games where you need to earn PvP gear and stats, it doesn't make any sense. Who would think this is a good idea, it's just weird to me.

 

Roll a fully equipped character, join your team, go PvP. That is all.

 

It gives more reason to play... Just owning people over and over is getting boring and i'm not full war hero yet so i've slowed down so i can keep playing.

[cerberias]

Think you'd be surprised Dmasterr at how bad some people fail when it comes to basic co-ordination. My dad for example, when he played WoW, he'd know the rotations and work out how to get the most damage for mana, heals for mana, burst healing etc.. but then he straight up couldn't press the buttons in time while moving around. He just couldn't press the buttons properly under and sort of pressure - I know some of my friends do the same sort of things where they press the wrong buttons consistently because they play different games all the time and they bring over reflexes from each game to another.

 

Its perfectly legitimate for someone to be a good strategist but simply not have the mindset or co-ordination to pull it off under pressure or to adapt quickly to the changing environment that is PvP. Someone with 20+ years of experience I would expect more of course.