It's Time

[randiesel]

Don't hold your breath waiting for a reply. I play an Op and when we were hit with the nerf bat this patch we heard nothing from the devs. However a few Mercs voiced their opinion about tracer missile spamming and the devs jumped all over that. Shows where their loyalties lie, and right now they're not returning ANY calls.

[Sparklehorse]

Greetings everyone,

 

We know that our community is very interested to hear new information about what the developers are planning for Star Wars™: The Old Republic™. Associate Online Community Manager Joveth Gonzalez recently addressed player concerns about developer communication:

 

 

 

As for the issue of server transfers, we talked about those in our most recent Weekly Q&A. Here's what Dallas Dickinson (Senior Producer, Live Services) had to say on the subject:

 

 

We hope this sheds some light on the matter. We are always looking for ways to improve our communication to our players, so please let us know if there is a way we can better serve our community in this area.

 

Thank you for your feedback!

 

 

Don't make the mistake of assuming I am not aware of and don't avail myself of all of these methods of information. I do. I have for years and will continue to do so.

 

This is basically the same method that was used, to great effect, prior to release of the game.

 

The situation is certainly different now . The goal now is to retain customers and foster a community. Do not make the mistake of thinking community only means the players. If we want this game to thrive and the community to grow more positive, the players need to feel like they are invested in a product that is worthwhile.

 

A huge part of this is the humanization of the developers. Currently they are such easy targets aren't they. We get these "communiques" from on high and some generalizations of upcoming features. This feels way to close to the state of CCP and their development processes prior to the Incarna debacle, wherein the developers were very forthcoming about future features and announced them in several places and their answer to every person who questioned anything was to refer them to the developer trackers or to the other information outlets.

 

What they didn't pay attention to, was the growing feeling of the player base that they were not being listened to. There was a huge contingent of players who were very concerned about the implementation of Incarna and what it would mean to the game. Their posts were often rude, belligerent, full of hyperbole and easily dismissed. A CCP dev even said in an interview "this is one of those cases where we will watch what the players do and not what they say."

 

What did happen? You might ask. Incarna was released and within 24 hours a third of the community rebelled, literally. Those that did not unsub in disgust began a protest in game that involved a direct attack on the most popular trade hub in the game. This protest continued for days, literally shutting down the trade hub and making world wide news.

 

It was only then that CCP made changes in the ways they communicated with their players and they made them fast. The dev blogs, which prior to incarna were much more like little articles about incoming features (sound familiar?) became more of a glimpse into the development process. They began directly communicating with the players about the work that they were doing, the issues that were popping up, if something was taking a little longer than expected, they explained why.

 

I understand SW:TOR is not Eve and I am thankful for that. The changes the developers made to that game came too late for me, when I unsubbed, I didn't look back and simply moved on (after six years mind you.)

 

I guess my point is, it's not the information that is lacking. We do know what is coming. We even have a vague idea of when. There are still, many unanswered questions.

 

I for one would like to know what the plan is for the implementation of the top three current promises and how these three things will interact with each other. We currently know that we will soon be getting server transfers, ranked pvp, and an improved LFG tool. We don't even know what order these things are being implemented in and this is important information considering all three will eventually interact with each other in the game environment.

 

For example, what good is a single server LFG tool or ranked pvp if they occur before server transfers? If the plan is to implement them after, then this means ranked pvp isn't coming until early summer? Perhaps the plan is to release them all as one uber patch early summer. This is in direct conflict with prior statements that patches would come faster after 1.2 and I'm not even complaining about that but I can't lie, I would like to know what happened to change this.

 

Perhaps I ask too much. Seems much of the community thinks so and maybe they are right. I just felt it important to point out something that troubles me before acting upon it. The truth is, I am in charge of what I choose to spend my disposable income on and in the end, this is what we are all left with. If Bioware and the community feel they are communicating enough then so be it. I will be happy with this until I am not and then I will move on.

 

I personally can't shake the feeling though that they could be talking to us more and that by doing so, they would go a long way toward humanizing themselves and developing a climate of less hostility within the community.

[Jaavik]

It's time Bioware. Turn the lights on. You cannot sit silently by and expect the community to wait forever. I feel like, and I fully submit I could be wrong, the community has been more than patient while we wait for some news.

 

Please, let us in on the plans. I thank you sincerely for the 30 days free and I'll be completely honest here, there's probably no risk of my sub going anywhere for at least the next few months. There are many, however, that are viewing this 30 days as a watermark for Bioware. The silence, to me at least, is extremely disconcerting.

I think this is one of the most rational and well-presented criticisms of the game I've seen presented on here.

 

I wish more people on here could present their issues in as mature a manner.

 

I agree completely with everything you have said. I hope Bioware is paying attention to this thread.

[Zannis]

Food for thought from another gaming board.

 

Remember Dallas Dickinson? In 2005, he was Senior Producer for SWG at SOE.

 

He pushed through the disastrous NGE and was eventually canned for its catastrophic failure and had to leave SOE. Two weeks after the launch he was giving interviews like this on Stratics.com ( http://swg.stratics.com/content/?Cat=264&uid=633 ). His forum name is 'Slothrop'.

 

The link to this article gives me no interview, just a blank space background. On two browsers.

Edited May 11, 2012 by Zannis

[Jaavik]

Until then, discussing a bunch of tentative plans would probably create all kinds of disappointment if/when things don't turn out as projected. When there's a release date for the next big patch, I'm sure BW will communicate every last detail you're asking about, because they'll actually know at that point.

 

Agreed. I've seen enough of the posts on here to realize that nothing the developers do will ever make many of these people happy. If they were specific about release dates and if (for any reason) they had to delay that date, the forums would be lit up with complaints of being lied to, the devs don't care, etc.

 

Let's face it... it's "cooler" to sit in the safety of anonymity behind a computer screen and be as overtly nasty as possible to people we've never met. Makes you feel like a bad-***...

 

Not to overly-defend Bioware. I definitely agree that many of these options should have been ready at launch. The voice acting in game is awesome, but I don't think it should be the heart of the game. The game should have had the BEST of the MMO features that are available out there now and should have built UP from that foundation. I was surprised that things like a "group finder", sidekicking system and higher capacity servers (rather than additional servers) weren't available at launch.

 

That being said. I still LOVE this game. I still have VERY high hopes that Bioware will turn this around bring many of the unsubs back into the fold. Or at the very least, bring the rest of us that like the game together so we can play and not feel like we're wandering through ghost-towns.

[philefluxx]

While server transfers isn't a issue with me I imagine they want to make sure that it works right the first time.That takes time.If people lose their chrs during a transfer you will see some very unhappy folks.

 

I keep seeing people post this and I just want to point out that they just allowed transfers to the new Aussie servers a few weeks back. Obviously it *********** works..... So what are they waiting on?

Edited May 11, 2012 by philefluxx

[Kubernetic]

Don't make the mistake of assuming I am not aware of and don't avail myself of all of these methods of information. I do. I have for years and will continue to do so.

 

This is basically the same method that was used, to great effect, prior to release of the game.

 

The situation is certainly different now . The goal now is to retain customers and foster a community. Do not make the mistake of thinking community only means the players. If we want this game to thrive and the community to grow more positive, the players need to feel like they are invested in a product that is worthwhile.

 

A huge part of this is the humanization of the developers. Currently they are such easy targets aren't they. We get these "communiques" from on high and some generalizations of upcoming features. This feels way to close to the state of CCP and their development processes prior to the Incarna debacle, wherein the developers were very forthcoming about future features and announced them in several places and their answer to every person who questioned anything was to refer them to the developer trackers or to the other information outlets.

 

What they didn't pay attention to, was the growing feeling of the player base that they were not being listened to. There was a huge contingent of players who were very concerned about the implementation of Incarna and what it would mean to the game. Their posts were often rude, belligerent, full of hyperbole and easily dismissed. A CCP dev even said in an interview "this is one of those cases where we will watch what the players do and not what they say."

 

What did happen? You might ask. Incarna was released and within 24 hours a third of the community rebelled, literally. Those that did not unsub in disgust began a protest in game that involved a direct attack on the most popular trade hub in the game. This protest continued for days, literally shutting down the trade hub and making world wide news.

 

It was only then that CCP made changes in the ways they communicated with their players and they made them fast. The dev blogs, which prior to incarna were much more like little articles about incoming features (sound familiar?) became more of a glimpse into the development process. They began directly communicating with the players about the work that they were doing, the issues that were popping up, if something was taking a little longer than expected, they explained why.

 

I understand SW:TOR is not Eve and I am thankful for that. The changes the developers made to that game came too late for me, when I unsubbed, I didn't look back and simply moved on (after six years mind you.)

 

I guess my point is, it's not the information that is lacking. We do know what is coming. We even have a vague idea of when. There are still, many unanswered questions.

 

I for one would like to know what the plan is for the implementation of the top three current promises and how these three things will interact with each other. We currently know that we will soon be getting server transfers, ranked pvp, and an improved LFG tool. We don't even know what order these things are being implemented in and this is important information considering all three will eventually interact with each other in the game environment.

 

For example, what good is a single server LFG tool or ranked pvp if they occur before server transfers? If the plan is to implement them after, then this means ranked pvp isn't coming until early summer? Perhaps the plan is to release them all as one uber patch early summer. This is in direct conflict with prior statements that patches would come faster after 1.2 and I'm not even complaining about that but I can't lie, I would like to know what happened to change this.

 

Perhaps I ask too much. Seems much of the community thinks so and maybe they are right. I just felt it important to point out something that troubles me before acting upon it. The truth is, I am in charge of what I choose to spend my disposable income on and in the end, this is what we are all left with. If Bioware and the community feel they are communicating enough then so be it. I will be happy with this until I am not and then I will move on.

 

I personally can't shake the feeling though that they could be talking to us more and that by doing so, they would go a long way toward humanizing themselves and developing a climate of less hostility within the community.

 

I understand your need for full disclosure. It would be great if we could know everything. But what you need to realize is that we are players, not development managers. Sometimes they have reasons for not revealing all of their "implementation plans" for major projects, no matter how much you want to know about them.

 

If you're unhappy with the Terms of Service and your relation to the company as a paying subscriber rather than a development manager, then the means for rectifying that situation exist and are available to you.

 

Otherwise, you'll have to accept your position as a player, and players aren't entitled to full business plans and implementation schedules just because they want to be.

[SliggXx]

I get the feeling that the reason they don't announce anything is because they are in way over their heads and really don't want to pin themselves down to deliverables. Basically, I don't think they know the when and the how as it relates to the population issues. When it does get delivered, I would be stunned if they did it right. I have a feeling they will allow 2-3 already dead servers to merge at a time, servers like Helm of Graush which feel empty and underpopulated, yet still hit "Standard" population thresholds will probably get nothing and we will still have a bunch of half empty servers.

 

These devs don't understand their playerbase in the slightest and, as evidenced by the attitude of one dev in particular, are too arrogant to even try.

 

We'll see, but I have 0 faith it will be done poperly.

[Darkhosis]

The free 30 days was for Bioware - not us. BW are obviously waaay behind in their original plans and are sidelined by current issues.

 

As you can see by my join date that I've follow and supported this game too. But I am now bored since BW has let too many things go - like server merges. We're 5 months out now, and even though it would have been embarassing, BW should have merged servers 2 months ago.

 

Then throw us a Legacy system that nobody can afford. I've had enough slaps to the face from them. The lack of real communication is just icing on the cake.

[FeelFlow]

I have to admit, the OP is right.

 

We have had snippets about what is coming in 1.3 and I do understand that the devs don't want to get burned about announcing features before they are ready, but...

 

As the OP states, it would be a great idea if BW at this point - given that there does seem to be an awful lot of disappointed people here - really open up and tell us all their roadmap and vision for the game:

 

- What game systems are they exploring?

- What content patches are they looking to do?

- Above all, after 6 months or so, what is their vision for the game? Has it changed since launch? What do they want the game to be? Where are they going with it?

 

[Andryah]

As the OP states, it would be a great idea if BW at this point - given that there does seem to be an awful lot of disappointed people here - really open up and tell us all their roadmap and vision for the game:

 

- What game systems are they exploring?

- What content patches are they looking to do?

- Above all, after 6 months or so, what is their vision for the game? Has it changed since launch? What do they want the game to be? Where are they going with it?

 

 

Quite a bit of this was shared at the guild summit.

 

People has such short memories it seems.

 

But it is moot anyway. NO amount of communications by Bioware will please the displeased. Being vocally displeased about the game in the forums here is a meta-game for some. Not unique to this game by any means, the same silliness is going on over in the Tera forums right now, and the long running WoW forums are famous for it.

[SliggXx]

Agreed. I've seen enough of the posts on here to realize that nothing the developers do will ever make many of these people happy. If they were specific about release dates and if (for any reason) they had to delay that date, the forums would be lit up with complaints of being lied to, the devs don't care, etc.

 

 

I know right? It is crazy that people should expect a well-run company to set deadlines and actually live up to them. WEIRD, I know. I mean it isn't like every other business in the world does that...

[SliggXx]

Quite a bit of this was shared at the guild summit.

 

People has such short memories it seems.

 

But it is moot anyway. NO amount of communications by Bioware will please the displeased. Being vocally displeased about the game in the forums here is a meta-game for some. Not unique to this game by any means, the same silliness is going on over in the Tera forums right now, and the long running WoW forums are famous for it.

 

You mean holding to account people they are paying to deliver on promises they have made? What a concept! Your fanboism is mindboggling considering half the servers in this game are virtually empty.

[Andryah]

You mean holding to account people they are paying to deliver on promises they have made? What a concept! Your fanboism is mindboggling considering half the servers in this game are virtually empty.

 

Thanks for sharing. You have definitely moved the discussion forward by attacking me.

[kottonmouth]

Dang, well written... A large part of my pre-order was too get all the names/legacy name I wanted. My server is totally dead, I'm assuming when transfers or merges happen I'll have to rename everything I own. Communication is key like the OP is saying; but quite honestly I'm not sure If I will be staying to use my free month. Too make this game ideal for myself and many others it would require major re hauls of pretty much every major system. Some items on my disappointment list are 0 world pvp, character animations/abilities are based on faction not force alignment, unimpressive character creation, extremely instanced world...literally the whole game is a series of load screens, no adventure, story is very linear, 4 wzs dont cut it for me, extremely pg-13 atmosphere, space combat...why is it here?, Legacy is a myriad of uninteresting fluff, item acquisition is just a series of grinds, half a year in this title is missing an atrocious amount of standard features pretty much every other competitor offers, the list goes on. I just don't have faith in Bioware anymore.

[Elror]

Food for thought from another gaming board.

 

Remember Dallas Dickinson? In 2005, he was Senior Producer for SWG at SOE.

 

He pushed through the disastrous NGE and was eventually canned for its catastrophic failure and had to leave SOE. Two weeks after the launch he was giving interviews like this on Stratics.com ( http://swg.stratics.com/content/?Cat=264&uid=633 ). His forum name is 'Slothrop'.

 

Brekkee - *Zeto-Starsider* Why continue with the NGE even though the overwhelmingly negative response? I personally know of ALOT of people quitting over this.

SWG-TSlothrop - Actually, we have had a pretty positive response to the enhancements.

SWG-TSlothrop - Certainly, many veteran players have had issues with it, but this is really just the nature of change.

SWG-TSlothrop - Most everyone else sees that we are finally delivering on the fantasy of Star Wars

 

I certainly hope a dishonest, arrogant man like this never has anything to do with a Star Wars game again...

 

 

 

Oh wait...

 

Fast forward four years to June 2009:

 

http://www.videogamesblogger.com/2009/06/09/star-wars-the-old-republic-will-be-the-first-fully-voiced-mmo.htm

 

"Running on live servers back in Austin, The Old Republic already seems like a realized world. In the first segment, BioWare producer Dallas Dickinson ran us through the world of Hutta..."

 

Oh dear.

 

 

 

yeah not touching that game with a ten foot pole. on the upside i cant wait to see the fanbots break down on the forums when the

 

"working as intended" crap starts flying. you have the same incompetent people working on this game as the last plus:

 

1.bioware a company that has never ran a mmo before...and more importantly never dealt with a playerbase before.

 

2.EA...the borg of gaming. your money WILL be assimilated.

 

3. lucas arts: the minds of birds trapped in the bodies of developers.

 

I have no choice but to agree to that... SO as a gamer what game would you advise to me ?

[GreatGarth]

Good job OP.

Sorry Bioware, I unsubed due to your lack of communication and the ghost town that is my sever (The Crucible Pits).

[psi_overtake]

*A ton of good points*

 

When most of my guild isn't doing an op because they're either offline or too demoralized about the state of the game, more info from the developers would help so incredibly much. Most people who have subs have a perception of the game - What am I going to do when I log in? Who's going to be on? Is it even worth logging in? - and generally, devs keeping quiet gives us nothing to look forward to.

 

When I asked one guildie why we're not running EC, he said "why would we? The gear isn't going to help us overcome any other challenge out there. You can't use it for PvP." I think we're all just tired of the same old "soon" promises and content. The guild has nothing to look forward to. The silence is pushing them into doing other activities.

[Andryah]

Good job OP.

Sorry Bioware, I unsubed due to your lack of communication and the ghost town that is my sever (The Crucible Pits).

 

Be honest. If your server was flush with players and you were able to play what you want to play, you could care less what (if anything) they communicate.

Edited May 11, 2012 by Andryah

[Elror]

Good job OP.

Sorry Bioware, I unsubed due to your lack of communication and the ghost town that is my sever (The Crucible Pits).

 

Same, + performance issue pissing me off

[TheOnlyKyrenS]

I'm Commander Shepard and this is my favorite wall of text on the Citadel.

[johnduane]

1.bioware a company that has never ran a mmo before...and more importantly never dealt with a playerbase before.

 

2.EA...the borg of gaming. your money WILL be assimilated.

 

3. lucas arts: the minds of birds trapped in the bodies of developers.

I have no choice but to agree to that... SO as a gamer what game would you advise to me ?

 

__________________

 

I wish I could answer that.

 

I will say that LA brought over people from the failed SWG because they knew them. The NGE basically took a sandbox game and abominated it into templated characters. Throw in some Mythic devs that were also responsible for the word fail and you get a mess. I think it's a valid point that Bioware has only created console games before this venture. You release it, you move on. The persistency of players is clearly new to them.

 

Further, who knows how the Borg (EA) run this studio they own? Maybe they can't project specifics because it is tied to funding (dog on a leash). Who knows?

 

The games currently on the market aren't ones I could recommend. God love it, WoW was fun for a long time, but it's old and stale now.

 

Rift didn't work for a ton of players. The F2P arena isn't good (LOTRO, DDO, STO). Guild Wars 2 does not look like a savior, Diablo 3 isn't an MMO (though likely will have a better community than this game). I also doubt Bethesda can pull anything off with Elder Scrolls since they chose the same lousy engine Bioware did.

 

In the end, it may be Titan, but I just can't honestly recommend something to play in the current market that isn't fraught with dismay, boredom, hatred, or is just plain awful.

 

[SlimsPicken]

I thank you sincerely for the 30 days free and I'll be completely honest here, there's probably no risk of my sub going anywhere for at least the next few months. There are many, however, that are viewing this 30 days as a watermark for Bioware. The silence, to me at least, is extremely disconcerting.

 

We need some information about the direction of our beloved game. We need it now. I plead with you to communicate the future plans (not a year from now but days/weeks from now) to your players. I ask this of you not while wielding the threat of my subscription over my head like an axe but while holding it in my palms like a beggar.

 

It's time to open those lines of communication. The silence is becoming deafening.

 

It's time.

 

The above quoted piece is exactly how I feel as well. I support things I believe in, but its getting harder and harder to continue believing blindly.

 

Please aware us of your intentions, make promises, and keep them.

[GreatGarth]

Be honest. If your server was flush with players and you were able to play what you want to play, you could care less what (if anything) they communicate.

 

Lol, thats true

[psi_overtake]

... i say again....reroll...if you don't want to reroll go away until mergers. ...

 

Do you realize how completely asinine that is? "We know you paid us $X over the course of # months. You made friends, created a guild structure, got to know your PvP allies and enemies, and thoroughly enjoyed yourselves. Now pretend like that never happened, and pay us more money to do it all over again on another server so that you can keep enjoying the game." That's a HORRIBLE business model.

 

People want to play a game and feel like what they do matters, even if all they have to show for it is their gear, or legacy level, or codex entries, or whatever. Killing that tiny bit of persistence is NOT a good solution.