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Powertechs aren't OP


Saerith

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yes they do lol

 

the hybrid versions of these are even worse

 

The hyrbrids do crap for damage, so yes, it is somewhat balanced. Pyro's are still closer to the top of the food chain than most other classes, but far behind marauders and assassins.

 

Damage across the board is too high (I believe for every class) and that is because of expertise. Tone down expertise and many of the issues you face with pyro's will be resolved. They can still have even more of a nerf to damage, but need some defensive cd's or more utility to supplement this.

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+ 30m 4 sec stun

+ aoe 2.5 sec stun (45s cd)

+ guard as well

 

I'd say they have decent utility. Don't pretend that they don't.

 

compared to other tank ac's our cooldowns are considerably weaker also you can't use guard and do that damage as they require you be in 2 seperate cylinders. cylinders that have cast times that can be interrupted and require you to stand still and do nothing so it's not like you can swap easily or repeatedly.

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Where did I state that PT has "OP defensive cds"? Don't try to twist my words only because you are scared of your class getting nerfed.

 

You said it was easier to kill a sniper than a PT ? (or very close)

 

it is not even close.... I dont care about a possible nerf if BW nerf us like they did for the 1.2.

 

I am just sick of bad people qqing because there are some PTs using adrenal/relic with red buff (=>1350 power).

 

I dont say game is perfectly balanced but when I read PT isn't squishy....

 

My RS : 1850 dmg

TD: 2250 dmg

 

And i have 1200 expertise and 5 WH items, yeah my two stronger spells are op....

 

WHich AC are you playing ?

Edited by SaulSerpine
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That's why the pvp in this game isn't about duels. This is why we have crowd control, heals and guard to stop DPS monsters (powertechs, marauders, snipers, juggs etc) some DPS are just going to eat your AC alive.

 

I've personally never had a powertech do that much damage to me, but you probably came across a very good one in which you're not a very good sage/sorcerer. It happens, people have a tendency in pvp to think they're better than they are and cry for nerfs when they die to something.

 

 

 

Any class can easily get 200k damage in battlemaster gear lol? I play a Vengeance Jugg and I get over 200k while defending a node in alderraan..

This and you would only get 200k if the nodes being attacked constantly.

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While that might be true apparently someone forgot to tell this guy that he cant DPS and guard in the same WZ.

 

http://i.imgur.com/7xAQm.jpg

 

PS i have to be nice to you...the SWTOR moderators told me too :(

 

 

full length voidstar game those numbers of protection are easily reachable by just using taunts effectively.

 

our burst potential is superb but our defense and control abilities are laughable compared to any other AC, a damage outpurt nerf without buffing our utility would kill in us in raids and pvp, also a lot of 'burst' damage as pyro is kinetic and ranged meaning that while a squishy healer migt get nuked the other glowstick classes aren't anyway near as comparable, it's frustrating to see your ppa proc get deflected by the marauder or sin even though you have 100% accuracy.

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You misunderstand - im not saying they should remove the cd on dispel, I'm saying its a ******** 'counter' to pyros - its a minor annoyance, not a counter.

 

and you're missing the point about the point made by you. You acted like they can constantly re apply the DoT, like they have infinite resources. So in fact dispell IS A COUNTER!!! Pyro is the MOST resource (heat/ammo) starved spec IN THE GAME, therefore dispell is an even bigger COUNTER to pyro then ANY other spec in game. Period.

 

 

Another reason why you won't see Pyro nerfed is because, ask anyone that does the real end game PVE, ALL specs of Powertech and Vanguard are at the bottom of the barrel in ALL categories

Edited by Balor
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People keep saying that pyro PTs have horrible utility and horrible defense. You do not. You have horrible mobility. You have meh defense with heavy armor (yes it matters) and the 25% shield on a short cd. The ability to survive assist trains matters in organized matches and you can live longer than some other classes. So what you won't get away from a melee train, neither will any other class against a decent team. Sure, you don't have the defensive CDs of marauders or tankassins but everyone knows they're ridiculous.

 

You have good utility with aoe and single taunts (great), aoe stun (ok), ranged stun (great), ranged slow (good), short interrupt (good), guard in emergencies (good) and pull (amazing). If you don't know how to properly leverage your utility within a team, the problem is on your end.

 

PTs keep justifying your ridiculous burst by comparing your relative (your utility is actually good) weaknesses to 2 other OP classes. It was OP before 1.2 and with healing screwed over and TTK down it's even worse after. Your dps needs to be toned down and you need a small mobility buff.

Edited by durvas
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PTs keep justifying your ridiculous burst by comparing your relative (your utility is actually good) weaknesses to 2 other OP classes. It was OP before 1.2 and with healing screwed over and TTK down it's even worse after. Your dps needs to be toned down and you need a small mobility buff.

 

How much ? like 75 % dmg reduction ? let s say 90% ok !

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People keep saying that pyro PTs have horrible utility and horrible defense. You do not. You have horrible mobility. You have meh defense with heavy armor (yes it matters) and the 25% shield on a short cd. The ability to survive assist trains matters in organized matches and you can live longer than some other classes. So what you won't get away from a melee train, neither will any other class against a decent team. Sure, you don't have the defensive CDs of marauders or tankassins but everyone knows they're ridiculous.

 

You have good utility with aoe and single taunts (great), aoe stun (ok), ranged stun (great), ranged slow (good), short interrupt (good), guard in emergencies (good) and pull (amazing). If you don't know how to properly leverage your utility within a team, the problem is on your end.

 

PTs keep justifying your ridiculous burst by comparing your relative (your utility is actually good) weaknesses to 2 other OP classes. It was OP before 1.2 and with healing screwed over and TTK down it's even worse after. Your dps needs to be toned down and you need a small mobility buff.

 

You already made yourself look stupid and your argument moot when you said our mobility is low. We have the highest mobility out of ANY ranged class. lol....

 

Also the shield is not on short CD and 25% for the little duration is not much. Heavy armor gives like a COUPLE % diff in PVP compared to medium... you fail again......Again you say the burst is insane, but in the end are just repeating what other QQers have said in this thread which have already been PROVEN wrong.

 

You made a long post but in reality is just says "I need to L2P"

Edited by Balor
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You already made yourself look stupid and your argument moot when you said our mobility is low. We have the highest mobility out of ANY ranged class. lol....

 

Also the shield is not on short CD and 25% for the little duration is not much. Heavy armor gives like a COUPLE % diff in PVP compared to medium... you fail again......Again you say the burst is insane, but in the end are just repeating what other QQers have said in this thread which have already been PROVEN wrong.

 

You made a long post but in reality is just says "I need to L2P"

 

PROVEN wrong?

what has been PROVEN wrong that he said? And what was the proof?

 

Edit: I want to clarify something. I don't think PT need a nerf. I think balance is actually really good right now. I think its Ridiculous that PTs cry about other classes being OPed though.

Edited by LiveandDieinLA
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PROVEN wrong?

what has been PROVEN wrong that he said? And what was the proof?

 

Edit: I want to clarify something. I don't think PT need a nerf. I think balance is actually really good right now. I think its Ridiculous that PTs cry about other classes being OPed though.

 

L2Read.

 

EX: Dispell

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L2Read.

 

EX: Dispell

 

"Again you say the burst is insane, but in the end are just repeating what other QQers have said in this thread which have already been PROVEN wrong."

That's what you said, implying that PT doing insane burst has been PROVEN wrong, which is possibly the dumbest thing I've seen on this forum.

 

Of course, that may not be what you were attempting to say, in which case, learn to write.

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"Again you say the burst is insane, but in the end are just repeating what other QQers have said in this thread which have already been PROVEN wrong."

That's what you said, implying that PT doing insane burst has been PROVEN wrong, which is possibly the dumbest thing I've seen on this forum.

 

Of course, that may not be what you were attempting to say, in which case, learn to write.

 

It is what I said, no attempt required.

 

If you let any class, any AC, in dps spec sit there and do their rotation they are going to melt and burst you down just as fast (newsflash, pyro isnt the fastest). Therefore, if all DPS classes are doing "Insane" damage, it no longer then can be labeled as "insane", and when asking for nerfs needed "all dps specs in game" would have to in place of just "pyro". When said justification and explanation for said nerfs were shot down by the very simple counters as evidence, that can also be stated said QQers were in fact "proven wrong"

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It is what I said, no attempt required.

 

If you let any class, any AC, in dps spec sit there and do their rotation they are going to melt and burst you down just as fast (newsflash, pyro isnt the fastest). Therefore, if all DPS classes are doing "Insane" damage, it no longer then can be labeled as "insane", and when asking for nerfs needed "all dps specs in game" would have to in place of just "pyro". When said justification and explanation for said nerfs were shot down by the very simple counters as evidence, that can also be stated said QQers were in fact "proven wrong"

 

Actually yes, the pyro does put out more damage than any other AC. There has been no evidence provided to counter this assertion, just the opinions of the feeble minded. Nothing has been proven, on either side of the argument.

 

I know education is this country (I am assuming you are American) is terrible, but your syntax is awful. Half of what you wrote doesn't even make sense grammatically. Usually I don't get on people for their poor writing, but when they make ******* comments like L2Read I make an exception.

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Actually yes, the pyro does put out more damage than any other AC. There has been no evidence provided to counter this assertion, just the opinions of the feeble minded. Nothing has been proven, on either side of the argument.

 

I know education is this country (I am assuming you are American) is terrible, but your syntax is awful. Half of what you wrote doesn't even make sense grammatically. Usually I don't get on people for their poor writing, but when they make ******* comments like L2Read I make an exception.

 

Learn to read, play, and all the above.

Edited by Balor
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People keep saying that pyro PTs have horrible utility and horrible defense. You do not. You have horrible mobility. You have meh defense31%+5% with heavy armor (yes it matters) and the 25% shield on a short cd2 minutes, worst dcd out of all "tank classes". The ability to survive assist trains matters in organized matches and you can live longer than some other classes. So what you won't get away from a melee train, neither will any other class against a decent team. Sure, you don't have the defensive CDs of marauders or tankassins but everyone knows they're ridiculous.

 

You have good utility with aoe and single taunts (great), aoe stun (ok), ranged stun (great), ranged slow (good)10m ranged slow, short interrupt (good)8 second interupt, guard in emergencies (good)1.5 seconds to activate cell, then how ever much time to put people in guard, btw dps is cut down by 40%, I actually get about as much damage from my cylinder than I do with hib/rail and pull (amazing)only amazing if you spec into it, which you can't as a pyro. If you don't know how to properly leverage your utility within a team, the problem is on your end.

 

PTs keep justifying your ridiculous burst by comparing your relative (your utility is actually good) weaknesses to 2 other OP classes. It was OP before 1.2 and with healing screwed over and TTK down it's even worse after. Your dps needs to be toned down and you need a small mobility buff.

 

I didn't find many accurate statement, mainly due to you not knowing the class very well.

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Actually yes, the pyro does put out more damage than any other AC. There has been no evidence provided to counter this assertion, just the opinions of the feeble minded. Nothing has been proven, on either side of the argument.

 

I know education is this country (I am assuming you are American) is terrible, but your syntax is awful. Half of what you wrote doesn't even make sense grammatically. Usually I don't get on people for their poor writing, but when they make ******* comments like L2Read I make an exception.

 

What class are you playing ?

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That really sums up the issue very well.

"The best defense is a good offense". Because PTs have the best offense in this game by definition they also have a very good defense.

 

By the way: anyone who calls PTs "glass cannons" really does not know this game very well. Sniper, Operative, Commando all go down much quicker while doing less burst damage (only Sniper comes close).

 

Having the most damage doesn't mean you have the best offense. Having the most kills does. There is put me under dps, then there is tinker dps. PT is tinker dps outside of an average of 15 seconds per 2 minutes where they have put you under dps.

 

You can't get damage numbers if all your opponents are dead. You can get 40k damage going after a healer after 20 seconds, or you can get 18k damage on that healer and putting him down in 4 seconds. There are other classes that put them down in 4 seconds.

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Having the most damage doesn't mean you have the best offense. Having the most kills does. There is put me under dps, then there is tinker dps. PT is tinker dps outside of an average of 15 seconds per 2 minutes where they have put you under dps.

 

You can't get damage numbers if all your opponents are dead. You can get 40k damage going after a healer after 20 seconds, or you can get 18k damage on that healer and putting him down in 4 seconds. There are other classes that put them down in 4 seconds.

 

Exactly. I can tap dot on my sage all day long and put out impressive daamage numbers. Noone says that sage/sorc requires a nerf though. The stats at the end of the warzone do not differ between AoE damage, dots and single target damage for example. PTs have, like you said high spikes, followed by average damageoutput.

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You already made yourself look stupid and your argument moot when you said our mobility is low. We have the highest mobility out of ANY ranged class. lol....

 

Also the shield is not on short CD and 25% for the little duration is not much. Heavy armor gives like a COUPLE % diff in PVP compared to medium... you fail again......Again you say the burst is insane, but in the end are just repeating what other QQers have said in this thread which have already been PROVEN wrong.

 

You made a long post but in reality is just says "I need to L2P"

 

When I talk about a Pyro PT's mobility, I'm talking about being able to move. Like moving from place to place, being able to LOS, anti-kiting, positioning, the mobility that melee always talks about. Did Pyro PTs somehow become considered ranged classes in the past 5 min and the meaning changed to being able to cast on the move? You took something completely the wrong way and used it to ignore the post. The only thing you even countered with still doesn't change that heavy armor and a 25% reduction is as much as other classes get for defense during assist trains, you're not frail flowers out there. Just because marauders and tankassins are ridiculous doesn't make yours bad compared to the rest of us.

Edited by durvas
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You already made yourself look stupid and your argument moot when you said our mobility is low. We have the highest mobility out of ANY ranged class. lol....

 

Also the shield is not on short CD and 25% for the little duration is not much. Heavy armor gives like a COUPLE % diff in PVP compared to medium... you fail again......Again you say the burst is insane, but in the end are just repeating what other QQers have said in this thread which have already been PROVEN wrong.

 

You made a long post but in reality is just says "I need to L2P"

 

Pyro's do have horrible mobility. No speed buff, and a craptacular "remove movement impairing affects" ability that you must spec into for a long cool down. Don't know how you think pyro (or even APT) has the best range mobility of any class, especially since it is a melee class primarily.

 

The shield itself isn't on a short cool down, but specing into the proper talents can make it semi-short (about 1:15 I believe in ideal situations).

 

Heavy armor isn't THAT much of a difference maker. As you stated, heavy armor negates a couple % more than medium; its nice but not game changing as Marauder/Assassin cool downs.

 

Burst is high, but Pyro's don't have much else. Sub burst with more utility, defense, and I think a burst damage nerf (keep sustained damage the same btw) could be ok.

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PT's have great mobility. I don't mean they can hop around the map. I mean they have the option of running and gunning.

 

I don't call them a melee class. They can't win melee fights. They are melee vs ranged and ranged vs melee. The snare on our attacks is insane. You can literally run circles around melee. The rotation is very easy and the burst is one of the highest in the game. The difficulty is being in the right spots to keep your damage high.

 

You can peel and kill! Very fun class! Really doesn't need a nerf.

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When I talk about a Pyro PT's mobility, I'm talking about being able to move. Like moving from place to place, being able to LOS, anti-kiting, positioning, the mobility that melee always talks about. Did Pyro PTs somehow become considered ranged classes in the past 5 min and the meaning changed to being able to cast on the move? You took something completely the wrong way and used it to ignore the post. The only thing you even countered with still doesn't change that heavy armor and a 25% reduction is as much as other classes get for defense during assist trains, you're not frail flowers out there. Just because marauders and tankassins are ridiculous doesn't make yours bad compared to the rest of us.

 

You don't think they are ranged? = LOL #1

You don't think they are mobile? = LOL #2

You think heavy armor adds a lot = LOL #3

You think PT/VGs have abilities in their rotation that requires still casting = LOL #4

 

 

I could go on and on, but really you need to take a step back from the forums, maybe learn what class you are talking about ffs..... this is just pitiful. Since you OBVIOUSLY do not play the class, either roll one, or at least jump on http://www.torhead.com and do some research before jumping into a thread about a class you know NOTHING about and acting like you have some doctorate on the subject

 

 

You can keep coming in here claiming that you are okay with some nerf to this but keep everything else the same or add a little more survivability but nerf burst, but don't play the class and don't know how that would break the spec. Besides, it isn't going to get nerfed, hate to burst the bubble here yet again, it really isn't. Because, now here is the kicker, it isn't (key work isn't) overpowered. If that can be proven in something like a thread, obviously there isn't even a need for BW to look at metrics

Edited by Balor
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