BOP Synthweaved Rakata gear

[WickedPrince]

I realize this isn't such a new topic but I wanted to make it easier for my guildies to chime in.

 

I have an Character (Jedi Consular/Sage) who does Synthweaving (400 level) and when I had the credits for the Rakata gear schematics I grabbed them all thinking I'd be able to craft stuff for my alts and my guildies, and maybe even sell a few on the GTN. Then the other day somebody pointed out that these are all Binds On Pickup, which means as soon as my crafter finish's crafting it, they are HERS - PERIOD.

 

If these were Elite PVE gear maybe I could see a point to it, but Rakata gear is starting PVE gear only, so she'll use the one and only piece she will ever craft only until she can get the next grade up. 8k credits for a schematic that gets used once is worthless, and that's not counting the almost twenty other schematics I purchased that I won't ever use because the gear is heavier armor than she can wear - or for the wrong advanced class.

 

The rarest component on these is the Biometric Crystal Alloy (BCA) - which of course is a Final Boss drop on some Hard Mode missions. I have to slog through an HM to fight my companions for a chance at ONE BCA so I can craft one Rakata piece - that the only thing I can do with is sell to an NPC vendor for less than the other mats cost me. Now I understand that the BCA is no longer BOP so I can even buy it on the GTN at outrageous prices, so that removes the only other real reason why these should be BOP - that the special material is BOP - which it isn't anymore.

 

To reiterate, The Synthweaved Rakata gear shouldn't be BOP because it's not the best PVE gear available, and now none of the components are BOP either.

 

I am sure that Synthweaving isn't the only case with this, it's just the one nearest to my heart right now. One suggestion I saw was an idea adopted by another well-known MMO I won't mention - that BOP items be allowed to be traded for up to 2 hours after being acquired. Assuming I could then trade, mail, or put it on the GTN within 2 hours of crafting that would work fine.

[DansbyRotten]

I think the argument made here is well stated.

 

My main is also a 400 synthweaver, and it is frustrating that the top end gear I can craft is not usable by other players.

 

I hope the developers considering changing this, especially if they want crafting to be somewhat relevant in end game.

 

I know that is a big if...

[Lithium-]

What are you talking about? Rakata gear was the best available PvE gear until 1.2 brought in black hole and campaign gear.

 

It makes sense that you can only create for yourself so you have a reward for reaching 400 synth and it doesn't screw up the economy. Tionese is the starting level gear, followed by columni.

[WickedPrince]

Lithium, the key phrase in your own argument is "WAS the best" It isn't anymore by far. I did not say the Rakata wasn't good, but it's not the best there is. And as is, the reward for my hard work of pushing my Synthweaving to 400 is a huge amount of credits spent on gathering missions and companion gifts so I can make a few pieces of gear only I can use, and isn't the epitome of PVE gear. I didn't even mention that most of it's as ugly as nearly all the Consular gear is. There are very good reasons why a large portion of Consulars are wearing Nar Shada Slave Girl Outfits - and a lot of them have to do with the fact that so many of us find the regular consular gear ugly. It isn't even gear ONLY a Synthweaver can acquire, anyone can with a lot less effort. Edited May 10, 2012 by WickedPrince
Correction

[Sambril]

What are you talking about? Rakata gear was the best available PvE gear until 1.2 brought in black hole and campaign gear.

 

It makes sense that you can only create for yourself so you have a reward for reaching 400 synth and it doesn't screw up the economy. Tionese is the starting level gear, followed by columni.

 

I'm sorry but that line of reasoning never made sense to me. The one item that you could craft that might have been attractive to endgame players and you were not allowed to sell it. It was a real kick-to-the-crotch for crafters. The reward for reaching 400 in a skill should be the ability to craft good items for others. The economy doesn't work unless you can produce items that people want. And that includes endgame as well as the leveling game.

 

All it did was encourage grinding the crew skill that had a Rakata item useful to you, make the items you need, then drop the skill and move to the next one. And of course you would save Biochem until last because that one requires you to have the skill to use the item. Crew skills were used as a means to an end, whereas a lot of players want to use crafting as a main part of their gameplay.

 

Now that Rakata is no longer top-dog this is changing as the top end players move on to the Campaign gear. Crafters can now make orange gear with augment slots, and the augments to go in them so they now have something that endgame players need, though because older set bonuses can't be transfered it is of most benefit to the players who are working on their Campaign set. Players still on lower tiered gear don't use augments.

[Screaming_Ziva]

Lithium, the key phrase in your own argument is "WAS the best" It isn't anymore by far. I did not say the Rakata wasn't good, but it's not the best there is.

No, you didn't say it's not the best there is. You said it is the worst (ie starting PvE gear) which is far from correct.

 

I'm kinda on the fence with this. On one hand, I'd like to be able to craft and sell some of these. On the other hand, I kinda like that it's a reward I have received for being 400 Synthweaving. You can actually get Synthweaving to 400 in under a day if you have 5 companions so it's really not even all that special. It's not like biochem where we have to keep Synthweaving to equip it either. A while ago I suggested these should be changed to bind to legacy instead of BOP and I think that would be a pretty decent compromise.

[JeyKama]

Eh, the BoP Rakata pieces are meant to be a profession perk, not a trade item. All other Columi+ level schematics are raid drops, but the Rakata belt/bracers that synthweaving/armormech get are simply learned from trainer, and use non-raid materials.

 

Look at it this way, at least you can still crit your Rakata pieces, unlike Artifice.

[djcreature]

I would rather have crew skill specific buffs for reaching 400 than making crafted gear boe. The people that argue for the boe side are only worried about filling their pockets with credits, true there will be a small portion that want it to help guildmates, but that is only good a few times as well and then useless again. Endgame raiders would rather have the buffs to help give them that little bit of an edge.

[wainot-keel]

Look at it this way, at least you can still crit your Rakata pieces, unlike Artifice.

Unless they screwed up something in the latest patch and it's not working anymore,

that's not true

[ScarletBlaze]

It really doesn't make sense anymore to have this BOP since the rare Cyrstal you need is now BOE so it really should have been changed to BOE when that happened.

 

And the arguments that it would hurt the market I seriously doubt it since the crystal is a rare drop and if someone wants to make it for their guild members that should be an option. That is what a guild is for is to help one another.

[JeyKama]

Unless they screwed up something in the latest patch and it's not working anymore,

that's not true

 

I can post a screenshot of my pre-1.2 augmented relic too~

 

There's been several threads of people trying to crit relics since then with no success, both rakata and campaign, while people have still been successfully critting the armor. So either the entire set of people trying to crit relics have been astronomically unlucky, or no one has bothered to chirp in those threads that they had crit a relic since 1.2, which is possible too.

 

Either way, artifice relics are bop too, as are cybertech grenades and rakata meds (though those aren't quite the same since they require the profession to use). Augmented Rakata belts/bracers are still slightly better or equivalent to their Black Hole flavors for the most part.

Edited May 10, 2012 by JeyKama

[GnatB]

Eh, the BoP Rakata pieces are meant to be a profession perk, not a trade item.

 

And crafting perks are a horrible horrible idea (unless they only benefit in the actual act of crafting) Which is why reuseables are being phased out, (and should simply be removed) and why BoP crafted stuff is being phased out (and should simply be removed)

[WickedPrince]

Screaming_Ziva, you are correct, I had to do a bit more research since I own exactly one piece of real PVE equipment - the Rakata bracers that really were only very slightly better than the Critical Arch Savant Bracers I gave to Nadia afterwards. Rakata isn't the worst PVE but it's still not the best, which means it's not worth keeping past when I can get better. Definitely not worth all the time and effort I put into Synthweaving. The Rakata bracers haven't really done very much to improve my survival in HMs, nor really will the rest of the Rakata gear.. Especially considering that by the time I get all the BCAs I would need to produce a full set I could probably have purchased most of a set with comms. And lets completely ignore burning through multiple attempts to get a critical and get the augment slot that supposedly I can get anyways for far less effort when 1.3 comes out.

 

The core of my argument still holds, there is no good reason for any crafted items to be BOP when there are better items in the game already.

 

I am going to also note for the trolls that I keep saying "I" and "My" because I can only speak from my own experience in this. But if I find it frustrating I'm betting that other synthweavers are also having the same experience. Fact is, I talked with several members of my guild who are also synthweavers and they agree that this is problematic. My guild includes 137 characters - though I couldn't say how many actual players that is, but about half are Jedi of one stripe or another - and if you do the numbers we've got many Synthweavers and many people who could benefit from out being able to share our craft.

 

As others have mentioned there is already a growing trend for people to peak out a craft so they can get the best gear they can that way, then switching to the next craft for the next item. So what real purpose is served with this?

[DeyoZero]

all i hear is QQ QQ

 

All I hear from you is "I don't know what this argument is about, so I'll troll."

 

Crafters make two things that are relevant to the endgame: Rakata gear and augmented items. We can only provide one of those to other players.

 

Rakata gear is not final gear, but augmented items are. So why is it that we're allowed to sell augmented items, but not Rakata gear?

 

-c.

[wainot-keel]

I can post a screenshot of my pre-1.2 augmented relic too~

 

There's been several threads of people trying to crit relics since then with no success, both rakata and campaign, while people have still been successfully critting the armor. So either the entire set of people trying to crit relics have been astronomically unlucky, or no one has bothered to chirp in those threads that they had crit a relic since 1.2, which is possible too.

.

 

uffff... I wasn't aware of such problem. I burnt like 12 alloys for an augmented relic until I stopped trying, but I thought it was just bad luck, but if it's true that some people have wasted like 70 of them, sheesh... something's broken...

[WickedPrince]

Ok here's another argument for removing the BOP from the crafted gear.

 

Once you have reached level 50 with a character you have three options.

1. Retire the character and never play it again unless you want to craft stuff for new characters.

 

2. Play PvP - which I have no real interest in and since Synthweavers can't craft anything really useful for PvP anyways the choice is immaterial to my argument. I know I am not alone in not having any interest in PvP, I have too many bad experiences with PvP in other games, and from what I hear from my guildies who DO PvP it's very one-sided because the Republic side doesn't have the coordination that the Imperials have. But again, pretty immaterial to my argument.

 

3. Run Hard Modes. IF us Synthweavers could craft gear for our friends we run these with it would motivate all of us to run them even more since we'd be able to get a real reward out of it fairly quickly. I've run about a dozen HMs so far and only been able to finish about two because me and most of my guildies just don't have the gear needed. And of course you can't GET the gear until you finish multiple HMs. Being able to help our guildies and friends with a few pieces of gear at least would help us all out. Even a slight improvement in our survival increases our interest in running them.

[Darth-_-]

All I hear from you is "I don't know what this argument is about, so I'll troll."

 

Crafters make two things that are relevant to the endgame: Rakata gear and augmented items. We can only provide one of those to other players.

 

Rakata gear is not final gear, but augmented items are. So why is it that we're allowed to sell augmented items, but not Rakata gear?

 

-c.

 

actually i do know what this post is about, more PvEers crying because the items they can craft at 400 are BoP, so they cant sell them on the GTN for credits instead they have to go do Dailies (ilum / belsavis / black hole) instead. you farm them and sell the items on the GTN for crazy amounts of credits to try and get rich.

 

no one cares, craft your rakata item then move on. dont worry you will be able to farm in the HM's and OPs to get better gear

 

you screwed up our PvP gear with threads like this please STOP

[Darth-_-]

and btw if you want the gear level the crafting, if your guild needs the items share mats and level up to 400 in a couple of hours it isnt that hard

[DeyoZero]

actually i do know what this post is about, more PvEers crying because the items they can craft at 400 are BoP, so they cant sell them on the GTN for credits instead they have to go do Dailies (ilum / belsavis / black hole) instead. you farm them and sell the items on the GTN for crazy amounts of credits to try and get rich.

 

no one cares, craft your rakata item then move on. dont worry you will be able to farm in the HM's and OPs to get better gear

 

you screwed up our PvP gear with threads like this please STOP

 

How is PvP, or the gear therefrom, relevant to this discussion or any part of the game or anything in the universe anywhere ever?

 

-c.

[Darth-_-]

How is PvP, or the gear therefrom, relevant to this discussion or any part of the game or anything in the universe anywhere ever?

 

-c.

 

How is Better RAIDing gear relevant to anything anywhere? if you can already do OPs in your current gear then why get new?, and if it only takes a couple of hours to level to 400 Armor / Biochem / Synthweaving if you share mats then why is this thread even relevant?

 

ppl just want stuff handed to them and or i.e want to make credits in-game

[DeyoZero]

How is Better RAIDing gear relevant to anything anywhere? if you can already do OPs in your current gear then why get new?, and if it only takes a couple of hours to level to 400 Armor / Biochem / Synthweaving if you share mats then why is this thread even relevant?

 

ppl just want stuff handed to them and or i.e want to make credits in-game

 

I would also like to spend credits to buy the gear from other crafters, rather than repeatedly grinding one skill after another to 400.

 

You specifically make the point that any player willing to spend a couple of hours to level the skill can get all the gear. You seem to take exception to the possibility that those players would instead spend a couple of hours playing other parts of the game to get the credits to get all the gear. Why is that?

 

-c.

[WickedPrince]

Darth-_- how in the world does this thread affect PvP? That is other than dilute the endless whining of people who only do PvP from being the only thing on the forums?

 

If you actually read what I said, I've STARTED many HMs and only finished a couple - because the gear of my whole guild is insufficient to the task. IF we could share the special items that each crafter can make instead of wasting time rebuilding each craft from scratch for it - it would help us to be able to complete them. The game is not served with the current player theorem of every single character maxing out every single craft to make themselves the best PVE gear that can be made. Fact is that the current system of the crafts just serves to convince me that my characters from now on won't craft anything, they'll just take gather skills so I can rob my environment of matts to sell on the gtn for the fools who don't realize the pointlessness of the current crafting system.

 

When I started the thread honestly I had NO PVE gear and hadn't even figured out how to purchase it. I couldn't get through ANY HMs to get the comms to do so - instead I have a near endless supply of Tio Crystals that are worthless by themselves. Most of my level 50 Guildies are in the same boat. You can't finish an HM or Ops without good PVE gear, which you can't get unless you can finish an HM or an Ops. Since then the one guildie who actually manipulated me into trying HMs quit the guild because nobody else has good enough gear for us to finish any HMs with him.

 

I don't care about the credits I'd theoretically be able to make by selling the Rakata stuff, I can make 100k in about an hour in the Black Hole and already have purchased everything I really care to that can be purchased with credits that way.

 

What I really wanted by posting this thread was what I thought I was getting when I bought all the Rakata Synthweaving Schems - the ability to craft USEFUL stuff for alts and guildies who could use them. Instead what I have is the ability to craft Rakata belts and bracers for my synthweaver's companions - most of whom I never use.

 

What the current crafting system along with the current PVE gear purchasing system encourage is people to quit the game after reaching level 50. I am certain that if SWTOR did a thorough check of their player numbers they'd see that themselves. The current system only encourages bull-headed players to stay on - both by having us waste time rebuilding entire crafts with each and every character to get the special gear-bits that only somebody who has that craft can make for themselves, and with the "Need to finish an HM to get gear so you can finish an HM" system. I don't want to see that. I want to see the people who join my guild keep playing. Being able to help prep them to go on Ops and HMs and stuff would help keep them around.

[AshlaBoga]

Darth-_- how in the world does this thread affect PvP? That is other than dilute the endless whining of people who only do PvP from being the only thing on the forums?

 

If you actually read what I said, I've STARTED many HMs and only finished a couple - because the gear of my whole guild is insufficient to the task. IF we could share the special items that each crafter can make instead of wasting time rebuilding each craft from scratch for it - it would help us to be able to complete them. The game is not served with the current player theorem of every single character maxing out every single craft to make themselves the best PVE gear that can be made. Fact is that the current system of the crafts just serves to convince me that my characters from now on won't craft anything, they'll just take gather skills so I can rob my environment of matts to sell on the gtn for the fools who don't realize the pointlessness of the current crafting system.

 

When I started the thread honestly I had NO PVE gear and hadn't even figured out how to purchase it. I couldn't get through ANY HMs to get the comms to do so - instead I have a near endless supply of Tio Crystals that are worthless by themselves. Most of my level 50 Guildies are in the same boat. You can't finish an HM or Ops without good PVE gear, which you can't get unless you can finish an HM or an Ops. Since then the one guildie who actually manipulated me into trying HMs quit the guild because nobody else has good enough gear for us to finish any HMs with him.

 

I don't care about the credits I'd theoretically be able to make by selling the Rakata stuff, I can make 100k in about an hour in the Black Hole and already have purchased everything I really care to that can be purchased with credits that way.

 

What I really wanted by posting this thread was what I thought I was getting when I bought all the Rakata Synthweaving Schems - the ability to craft USEFUL stuff for alts and guildies who could use them. Instead what I have is the ability to craft Rakata belts and bracers for my synthweaver's companions - most of whom I never use.

 

What the current crafting system along with the current PVE gear purchasing system encourage is people to quit the game after reaching level 50. I am certain that if SWTOR did a thorough check of their player numbers they'd see that themselves. The current system only encourages bull-headed players to stay on - both by having us waste time rebuilding entire crafts with each and every character to get the special gear-bits that only somebody who has that craft can make for themselves, and with the "Need to finish an HM to get gear so you can finish an HM" system. I don't want to see that. I want to see the people who join my guild keep playing. Being able to help prep them to go on Ops and HMs and stuff would help keep them around.

 

 

Actually all you need for the HM Flashpoints are the hilts/barrels and mods from the Daily Comm vendors. Each costs 8 daily comms and so 40 daily comms is enough to beat a HM. That you were unable to beat any of the HM FPs suggests that the problem is your guild refuses to do daily commendation missions (Belsavis, Illum, Black Hole District).

 

However, if you really don't want to gear up via solo PvE content (the dailies are mostly solo missions that reset at 5 AM Pacific Time) then you can PvP grind for full BattleMaster. Trust me, 5/5 Battlemaster Gear makes HM BT and Foundry easy.

 

If your group has either full BM or the 5-7 daily comm mods and still can't beat HM BT then the problem is PEBKAC.

 

Grinding HM BT may be boring, but any competent player can do it, and after you've got 2/5 Columi and 3/5 BM you should be able to blast through any HM other than Kaon Under Siege and Lost Island.

[DeyoZero]

Grinding HM BT may be boring, but any competent player can do it, and after you've got 2/5 Columi and 3/5 BM you should be able to blast through any HM other than Kaon Under Siege and Lost Island.

 

HM BT is simple.

 

MH Esseles is considered one of, if not the hardest on the republic side.

 

No, I don't know why they decided to make Ironfist a TPW factory, but there you have it.

 

-c.

[WickedPrince]

AshlaBoga, you are still missing the point. By making the best pieces you can make with each craft BOP they are encouraging the hardcore players to rotate through and max each and every craft that might be useful to them in turn and ending with Biomedics so they can get and use the various medpacks and stims that are BOP. And additionally encouraging the rest of us to skip crafting at all since it's pretty much a waste of time to only do one craft and a huge pain in the butt to retool through four or five crafts with each and every character. They should be encouraging us to share our crafting with each other instead. I LOVE the crafting system, except for this one thing that completely sucks.