Marauders? What about Pyrotechs? (honest question regarding damage numbers)

[Bastus]

All I know is, on my Marauder, Pyrotechs are super annoying, especially during that new Warzone. But then again almost any ranged class is annoying, it's just that PT's are harder to kill. They do however do very significant damage, and the advantage of being long range, and having heavy armor seems a little unbalanced to me. I also have a 50 BH, so I know how easy killing is with this class.

[Varicite]

I must be doing it wrong, i have never broke 600k damage, but i play on shadowtown and near 80% of the time i do top damage with the most killing blows and what not. i do some AoE damage so the numbers might be a little padded but the bulk of my damage is single target and I DO chase healers around(again padded numbers). also dont fear any class 1 v1, if they get the jump or not. PT burst is retardedly good however as far as PT vs Mara i think Mara get way too many def CDs it is freakin redic and the fact that every class in the game gets nerfed but mara's get buffed tells me bioware is sucking mara and sent **** all day long. so a good Mara can out DPS me 1 v1 so fast it isnt funny, and if i have a full bar of heat to burn up and none of my attacks are on CD i can burst a mara down so fast it isnt funny difference is mara can stop my dps at anytime, and just leave the fight whenever. can someone direct me to where i QQ and cry nerf for mara/sent

 

oh and somewhere else i saw some justification that mara are frontline fighters and need the def CDs 10m is very close, it is front line, yea i can set up a combo from 30m but if i want to kill someone those 30m are getting eaten up very quick, so PT are FRONTLINE, they are very squishy, heavy armor is a *********** joke QQQQQQQQQ *uck marauders, i would be pew pewing but my server seems empty right now, if they dont release rated soon everyone will be gone fishing by the time they make this game fun

 

You can't break 600k damage unless the enemy team is HEALING all of the damage you're dishing out. If you kill someone, you can't keep damaging them.

 

The games where people are getting those numbers are healfests, and not really an indicator of anything.

 

I remember the first time I broke 500k on my PT. I spent the ENTIRE first round of Voidstar fighting a Commando healer 1v1 (pre-1.2, when this was just dumb). I never killed him, and he didn't kill me, and when we decided to stop fighting eachother his team got to the datacore. We had fought for almost 7 minutes straight.

 

500k+, and the vast majority of it was done against ONE target whom I did not kill.

Edited April 19, 2012 by Varicite

[roggles]

incorrect

 

flame burst = single target

rocket punch = single target

thermal det = single target

rail shot = single target

unload = single target

rapid shots = single target

death from above = AOE

flamethrower = AOE

explosive dart =AOE

 

the majority of pyrotech damage comes from thermal det, rail shot, and the abilities that proc PPA. all of which are single target damage.

 

This a hundred times, and i dont use flamethrower ever!

[cashogy]

This a hundred times, and i dont use flamethrower ever!

 

the only time i will use flamethrower is in conjunction with electro dart on a low health opponent. it adds style points imo

[Cryowolf]

Once in the melee range the Pyro has no mechanic to exit. There is no stealth out button, there is no 99% damage reduction, there is no AE mez.

 

Bam! Nailed that one on the head.

[cashogy]

You can't break 600k damage unless the enemy team is HEALING all of the damage you're dishing out. If you kill someone, you can't keep damaging them.

 

The games where people are getting those numbers are healfests, and not really an indicator of anything.

 

I remember the first time I broke 500k on my PT. I spent the ENTIRE first round of Voidstar fighting a Commando healer 1v1 (pre-1.2, when this was just dumb). I never killed him, and he didn't kill me, and when we decided to stop fighting eachother his team got to the datacore. We had fought for almost 7 minutes straight.

 

500k+, and the vast majority of it was done against ONE target whom I did not kill.

 

this

 

this is why 600k+ damage numbers arent that impressive; theyre more dependent on the other teams class make up than a players ability.

 

the most damage ive had in a warzone where the opposing team had no healers was ~450k and 80 something kills. it was fun

[Varicite]

this

 

this is why 600k+ damage numbers arent that impressive; theyre more dependent on the other teams class make up than a players ability.

 

the most damage ive had in a warzone where the opposing team had no healers was ~450k and 80 something kills. it was fun

 

I'm pretty sure I got MVP for that match, as I remember commenting how stupid it was to vote me MVP for not doing anything but dueling 1 healer the whole match.

 

But some people just love those damage scores.

[anwg]

Because pyrotechs are squishy as **** (the reason marauders are seen as OP is they combine great offense with probably the best defense)

[anticept]

All I know is, on my Marauder, Pyrotechs are super annoying, especially during that new Warzone. But then again almost any ranged class is annoying, it's just that PT's are harder to kill. They do however do very significant damage, and the advantage of being long range, and having heavy armor seems a little unbalanced to me. I also have a 50 BH, so I know how easy killing is with this class.

 

Oh Shoot!! My marauder loses to some class (or players ?) they must be OP... In novare ?? it´s like VS/CW combined with little elevation and cramped objective areas how can that be more difficult than VS shooting range or CW with limited "cover". Maybe you should stick to the BH if it´s so easy oh wait then marauders would kill you. Come on now every class has weaknesses most cases it´s the person controlling it tough it up you got the Fotm OP class enjoy while it lasts.

[Scoobings]

Oh Shoot!! My marauder loses to some class (or players ?) they must be OP... In novare ?? it´s like VS/CW combined with little elevation and cramped objective areas how can that be more difficult than VS shooting range or CW with limited "cover". Maybe you should stick to the BH if it´s so easy oh wait then marauders would kill you. Come on now every class has weaknesses most cases it´s the person controlling it tough it up you got the Fotm OP class enjoy while it lasts.

 

I'm legitimately curious, what class is the rock to marauder scissors? Given equal CDs, gear, and skill I can't think of a class that marauder loses to.

 

I'm not trying to make a point, because pvp isn't balanced around 1v1, I'm just trying to understand what class you might be referring to.

[Varicite]

I'm legitimately curious, what class is the rock to marauder scissors? Given equal CDs, gear, and skill I can't think of a class that marauder loses to.

 

I'm not trying to make a point, because pvp isn't balanced around 1v1, I'm just trying to understand what class you might be referring to.

 

Tankasin, if they have any clue. : )

 

It can be a hard fight though, but I'd give the edge to the Tankasin if skill / gear are equal.

Edited April 19, 2012 by Varicite

[Xinika]

 

Actually, let's just take out every class in this game that doesn't use a lightsaber.

 

I would be fine with this to be honest.

[Scoobings]

Tankasin, if they have any clue. : )

 

It can be a hard fight though, but I'd give the edge to the Tankasin if skill / gear are equal.

 

Ahh, yeah I could see that.

[Easpeak]

It's just that pyros are really easy to play to be effective.

[TheNegotiator]

Just like how you could have thought before you made a post filled to the brim with misinformation.

A heavy hand normally leaves a bigger mark than a gentle tug.

 

You couldn't be more wrong. I said a Vanguard has no chance against a well-geared PT. This is true, my tactics spec'd Vanguard (who is valor 66) will never win a 1 vs 1 against a PT. Entirely valid statement (last time I checked a do play a Vanguard). The fact that an assault spec'd Vanguard "might" be able to 1 vs 1 a PT does not make my statement invalid. On top of this, I have "never" seen any vanguard top 300k damage.

 

Using assumption can be interpreted as "stupidity". The jerk I was referring to assumes I should have already known that I have a tree available which mirrors the PT fire-damage tree. How am I supposed to know? I never played the spec nor do I play a bounty hunter. If the person really "was" as smart as he thinks, he might of thought about this before he started his tirade. Now who is the stupid one exactly?

[yukirshiro]

It's just that pyros are really easy to play to be effective.

 

This is somewhat true.

 

Being effective on a marauder or tankasssins requires you to be able to use cooldowns intelligently. None of the pyro cooldowns are essential to the spec in the same way.

[Serrowherrow]

You couldn't be more wrong. I said a Vanguard has no chance against a well-geared PT. This is true, my tactics spec'd Vanguard (who is valor 66) will never win a 1 vs 1 against a PT. Entirely valid statement (last time I checked a do play a Vanguard). The fact that an assault spec'd Vanguard "might" be able to 1 vs 1 a PT does not make my statement invalid. On top of this, I have "never" seen any vanguard top 300k damage.

 

Using assumption can be interpreted as "stupidity". The jerk I was referring to assumes I should have already known that I have a tree available which mirrors the PT fire-damage tree. How am I supposed to know? I never played the spec nor do I play a bounty hunter. If the person really "was" as smart as he thinks, he might of thought about this before he started his tirade. Now who is the stupid one exactly?

 

In case you aren't aware, bounty hunters and troopers are mirror classes. They have mirrored talents, mirrored abilities, mirrored armor stats. The only difference lies in animation and appearance, therefore, the assertion that vanguards are inferior to powertechs is based on perspective alone and no actual evidence.

[exphryl]

It's just that pyros are really easy to play to be effective.

 

Yet the difference between a person who knows the class fully and who doesn't is 100% difference. It's easy to play, it is not easy to play effectively....

Edited April 20, 2012 by exphryl

[Jetflair]

1. On my Scoundrel healer, the only class that I find dangerous on a short 1v1 fight are Powertechs. It's not unusual for the fight with them to go something like this: 4.5k rail shot, 2k flame burst + 700 dot which starts rolling, followed by 4.5k grenade + 700 dot +5k railshot simultaneously - 17k damage on the course of 4.5seconds. When that happens (which is often) I will go down shortly if i haven't already (as i do have some hots rolling). No other damage dealer can come close to doing so much damage to me in such a short time. The only ones that can come close are Concealment Operatives and that's only if they open on me from stealth (which is still less bursty than powertechs) - PTs can do this rotation every 15 seconds... Which brings me to my 2nd point.

 

2. On PVP - Powertechs\Vanguards are the highest single target damage AC in the game in PVP - at any time we have a bunch of BM\WH geared DPS guys, if there's a powertech among them, almost always he will have the highest damage at the end of the match - an annihiliation marauder (which takes time to build up damage on a target and is, in my opinion, a much less dangerous damage dealer) will have around 300k while a PT will have 450-500k.

 

I am pretty sure, even though it's still quite a new subject, that PTs are next up on the nerf list (it's funny to think they felt their last nerf was unjustified).

 

And by the way, they are definitely not as squishy as they try to make themselves out to be. It's true that they have one good defensive CD, but with the talent to reduce the cooldown it's usually around a 1min CD - and in general, from the other side of things, they are very easy to keep alive as a healer (maybe it has to do with the fact that whomever they are fighting goes down pretty fast).

 

Assault has very good dots that cause most of the damage. Fast kills actually lessen the damage done.

 

Just run around with Assault vanguard and throw Incidenary round to everyone you meet and shoot everything with plasma cell and overall damage will go up. You may not kill anyone bit damage done goes up as you can spam both from range.

 

Same effect you can get by rolling tank spec and spamming Ion Cell while people try to kill you. That way you get near 300 k if other side has healing since burst wont drop most of time anyone fast and you will spam it ages so damage will pile up. If you can't kill opponents and they can't kill you the overall damage will go up on both sides like somebody else points out in this thread with 600 k damage example.

 

Damage done and fast kills are two different statistics. Burst is the thing that one should look for not total damage done. Burst decides how effective the dps because it more correlates with killing opponents.

[Varicite]

In case you aren't aware, bounty hunters and troopers are mirror classes. They have mirrored talents, mirrored abilities, mirrored armor stats. The only difference lies in animation and appearance, therefore, the assertion that vanguards are inferior to powertechs is based on perspective alone and no actual evidence.

 

Well, if we wanna get technical, there are a few bugs w/ the Trooper class that do cause it to be very slightly inferior to its mirror in PvP capability.

 

I believe the Trooper equivalent of CGC dot is missing 1 tick of damage, as well as the wind-up on their version of DFA being a bit slower (though this may have been addressed in 1.2). Pretty sure the difference between Unload and Full-Auto was fixed in 1.2.

 

Somehow, I highly doubt that's what he was referring to, though. : P

[Baarabas]

You guys sure you aren't getting hit by a pyrotech mercenary?

 

Ha...ya this!

 

To be a shared tree, Pyro Merc is way inferior.

[cashogy]

Ha...ya this!

 

To be a shared tree, Pyro Merc is way inferior.

 

depends on the pyro merc. 30m range on all attacks is quite nice

[pwnshoppe]

Assault has very good dots that cause most of the damage. Fast kills actually lessen the damage done.

 

Just run around with Assault vanguard and throw Incidenary round to everyone you meet and shoot everything with plasma cell and overall damage will go up. You may not kill anyone bit damage done goes up as you can spam both from range.

 

Same effect you can get by rolling tank spec and spamming Ion Cell while people try to kill you. That way you get near 300 k if other side has healing since burst wont drop most of time anyone fast and you will spam it ages so damage will pile up. If you can't kill opponents and they can't kill you the overall damage will go up on both sides like somebody else points out in this thread with 600 k damage example.

 

Damage done and fast kills are two different statistics. Burst is the thing that one should look for not total damage done. Burst decides how effective the dps because it more correlates with killing opponents.

 

If you are using Incendiary, you need to use some strategy. IR costs 3 ammo with is 1/4th of our total resources. It is much better to do ion pulse -> railshot -> stockstrike -> railshot if you can safely be in range. IR is only good if you have to close distance and have some time to regen ammo before you get in close for ionpulse/stockstrike

[Baarabas]

Thank you, we have one def CD and it is next to nothing compared to any tank class. Marauders are not tanks at all and can out survive us far greater. The most damage I have ever done is 500k+, I am a single target spec. People just whine about being killed to much. No class should be aplha, pyrotech is not alpha by a long shot.

 

/This!

[me_unknown]

I'm legitimately curious, what class is the rock to marauder scissors? Given equal CDs, gear, and skill I can't think of a class that marauder loses to..

 

snipers/gunslinger

 

and...... vanguard/powertech BUT not as pyrotech/assault specc! (don't ask me which specc, i won't tell you that )

 

.... and there is at least another class capable of defeating marauders sentinels. of course given both are at least full bm or very close too.