Feels like a single player RP

[Touchbass]

Its not only the grouping up or raiding that makes this game feel like a single player its that you do not see anyone around for a long time. I am on Hidden Beks EU one of the higher populated server and some places its fairly bad.

 

As you say WOW does blow this away as an MMO problem is as a single player this would have been a very good game but there is no real social interaction within the game which is real sad. Its time for server merges if they do not keep the subscribers they have now happy will cost them i the end.

 

This is a very simple problem to sort out merge servers up until they are on high and close servers down until they are actually needed if subs increase etc.

 

WoW feels a bit old, especially if you play both games at the same time. However, being able to group much easier and having more rewarding content to work towards really makes WoW more sustainable, plus it feels more alive. SWTOR has potential, but we'll see how well it takes off. The arrogance of the developers to ignore what there playerbase wants is a warning sign though ...

[RabidPopcorn]

WoW can learn from SWTOR; SWTOR can learn from WoW. Sadly though, the typical response is "I don't wanna play a wow clone".

[thegimble]

WoW feels a bit old, especially if you play both games at the same time. However, being able to group much easier and having more rewarding content to work towards really makes WoW more sustainable, plus it feels more alive. SWTOR has potential, but we'll see how well it takes off. The arrogance of the developers to ignore what there playerbase wants is a warning sign though ...

 

I agree with your point re wow feels a bit old. Pandarian is a bit of a boost especially the detail on the panda monk but its no major upgrade graphically but its better. SWTOR has the potential to be a great MMO and 1 of the easiest fix is server merges asap.

 

But for some reason Bioware seems to behave with a god type temperament and they are right and everyone else is wrong. Seems a common issue since the first 2 weeks we need server merges but nothing seems to be happening.

[Darth_Moonshadow]

WoW can learn from SWTOR; SWTOR can learn from WoW. Sadly though, the typical response is "I don't wanna play a wow clone".

 

The irony is that they keep asking for Warcraft stuff right after they say that.

[DieAlteHexe]

Can I ask all the "defenders" a stupid question? If it's okay to feel like you're playing a single-player game, why are we paying an MMO subscription?

 

I certainly don't feel like I'm playing a single-player game. At the very least there is no "save". Sorry, sorry.

 

As for paying for an MMO sub? I pay for one reason and one reason only...because I enjoy the game.

[thegimble]

WoW can learn from SWTOR; SWTOR can learn from WoW. Sadly though, the typical response is "I don't wanna play a wow clone".

 

Its not about playing a wow clone thats the issue many seem to be missing. Its about playing an MMO and the clues is in the title.

 

Massively Multiplayer Online. Problem is for many people not all it does not feel like an MMO. WOW clone responses proves many do not understand some issues in the game as it does not affect them.

[Optrex]

Here's some of the elements of the game that I think contribute to the single player feel of the game apart from or contributing to the lack of players on planets.

 

 

PLANET SIZE

 

Apart from your cradle starting planet the other worlds are too vast for the amount of content they hold. At a guess i would say theres around 1hr of story telling, 2hrs of traveling and 3 hrs of action. So thats around 6hrs of gaming per planet. This can be increased by another hour or 2 while LFG.

The planets also have too many instanced and segregated parts making it feel less of an open world.

 

Alot of people on the second time around spam spacebar on story telling dont bother wasting their time LFG and they are pretty much done with the planet in 4-5hrs.

 

MISSIONS

 

Missions are too much on rails. You go to a planet, board your rail cart and off you go. Exploration is pointless because everything you need is laid on your path. Class missions are too divided sending people off in different directions.

 

STORY TELLING

 

BW did a great job with the cutscenes and storytelling, there are just too many for a MMO. They are great the first time around but make it seem like a normal single player game.

A lot of people lack patience, although not a fault of BW, the way the missions are given through the story is. People the second/third/fourth time around tend to spam spacebar the story and are not willing to wait 10mins for some new person everytime he/she gets or hands in mission.

 

LEVELING

 

You level too quickly and this is not down to people rushing the content and im not saying they should add a grind. Even with the average amount of content on each planet you can still over level for the next planet. If it wasn't for the class missions you could skip 1-2 planets.

 

CRAFTING

 

IMO, crafting should be a big part of any MMO as it creates interaction with others. Due to the speed at which you level and the hand outs for everything you need, crafting becomes pretty useless. The timed builds also reduce this interaction with people outside your friends list or guild.

 

PVP & WAR ZONES

 

Ive added this for the reason of exp gain for WZ's and the aweful world PvP. Although WZ's bring people together, the Exp gain from WZ's reduces the time people will spend on planets. For those on PvP servers, im not sure if your experience was the same as mine, but I never hardly saw any enemy to PvP with. On the contested territories it seemed like we were still segregated to different parts of the map.

 

COMPANIONS

 

Isn't the idea of an MMO to make companions with RL people? OK, so companions are alright for your ship, that you can interact with and to run a few errands. With some classes you can solo run +2-4heroics with them and with their gathering/crafting skills you never have to visit another planet again. Full battle companions is a bad thing to have in a MMO, IMO, and BW took it to an even more aweful level.

 

After you have gained 1-2 companions, along with the WZ Exp and drop ships for flashpoints, you never have to leave the fleet again and still level all your crafting/gathering levels and your char.

 

SPACE

 

No one can contest that this is the biggest single player aspect of the game. Completely cut off from anything in the game, even chat. They could have at least added a few class missions to it to make it feel a valid part of the game.

Edited April 4, 2012 by Optrex

[Dayln]

I like some of the terms being flung at people here

 

Defenders?

 

I’m not defending anyone, I am only saying that I group, a lot, I have characters that have never done any quest solo... ever.

 

I’m not defending anyone or anything.

 

You feel how you feel, but you cannot say that this game is not an MMO, yes it is, you may choose not to play it as one, but that is your choice.

 

You may feel like it is a single player game... that is fine, you feel how you feel.

 

The only objection I have is when people make blanket statements about how this is not a ,massively multiplayer game, well of course it is, there are literally many hundreds of thousands of us that play it as one.

 

We group, we group a lot, in guilds, in pugs, with friends and family, we group all the time.

 

If you don’t, that is a choice you make.

[ferroz]

Indeed. But then it's not "one world" and therefore doesn't count.

No, it's one world per ruleset so that's pretty clearly in line with what he's asking for.

 

You are right, my response was inappropriate. I acknowledge my error and apologize. I let my frustration at my experience of other posts through the months get to me. The posts I was referring to were better written than my responses and my response was inappropriate in relation to the posts I was referencing.

Yeah, it's pretty easy to get caught up when you read a bunch of unreasonable posts all at once.

 

 

 

Missions are too much on rails. You go to a planet, board your rail cart and off you go. Exploration is pointless because everything you need is laid on your path. Class missions are too divided sending people off in different directions.

I think this is the biggest problem: the planet missions are far too linear, and it's really inconvenient to get people synced up so that they can all be working on the same quests, so they often won't bother.

 

wow has the same problem with Cata... it's just downright frustrating to try and keep synced up with a group of friends so that you can level together.

Edited April 4, 2012 by ferroz

[Dayln]

All current ( non sandbox ) MMO quests are linear

 

Sandbox games such as UO ( is that still around?) , and SWG ( now dead ), and EVE and a few others are not in any kind of competition for players from the majority of MMO’s out there.

 

Now if you are saying it is time for someone to think outside the current MMO formula box…. I agree.

[nartiuslightlord]

Feels good to me. really those of us here before release knew the game would have the options of solo play or grouping. it sounds like a low pop server problem and from what I have read since being back transfers are coming.

 

I was seeing many people on my server. even more then pre-release before i left. so far so good. I just want more solo options like more then one companion out for solo flashpoints if i fail to get a group at certain server times I play.

[ferroz]

All current ( non sandbox ) MMO quests are linear

No, wow is still fairly non-linear other than the actual cata zones (thr 81+ zones and the new starting zones). If you have someone within level range to group with you, you can go over to their area and pick up most of the quests.

 

that's not the case in swtor... far more of the quets only become available as you work through the quest chain.

[sjmc]

No, wow is still fairly non-linear other than the actual cata zones (thr 81+ zones and the new starting zones). If you have someone within level range to group with you, you can go over to their area and pick up most of the quests. that's not the case in swtor... far more of the quets only become available as you work through the quest chain.

This is primarily an issue for the "planet quest" chain (and of course the individual class quests) that starts at the spaceport/orbital station on each planet. You can usually share the other quests in the area. There are also heroic quests that you can do (since you have a group).

 

Do you need to have the quest to enter the quest instance of someone else in your group?

Edited April 4, 2012 by sjmc

[Omaddon]

I do not mind the game to be somewhat RP oriented because it is the follow up of the KoTOR series and I loved those games.

 

I play once maybe twice a week with a few friends, we made a guild. We are 4 in it. Will we be more? I do not think so. We play this very casually and I, for one, quest on many alts for the story. My highest ones do not go beyond level 30 and that is fine, they will get to level 50 eventually, I have time.

 

End game matters very little to me. I understand why it is there, but I do not participate in it because it is, for me, a waste of time. Whatever gear you get will be rendered useless when the next major content patch comes out.

 

I have done some end game in WoW, but only in guild groups and only a few time a week. If I get better gear, fine. But I want to have fun with friends and , if alone, I want a good story and that is why I play WoW and SWToR.

 

When MoP comes out, all the gear that was found/made/looted will be obsolete in 7 to 10 quests, starting the process over again.

[Lostkoss]

I am an upset consumer and veteran avid gamer. Extremely disappointed.

 

I was sold A full feature "themepark" MMO , what I got was just one lousy rollercoaster on tight rails that gets boring very quickly.

[cbowsin]

Feels like a mmorpg to me, but that is probably because I actually understand what that means. Hint: has nothing to do with grouping.

[DieAlteHexe]

Feels like a mmorpg to me, but that is probably because I actually understand what that means. Hint: has nothing to do with grouping.

 

^ That.

[Chewpaco]

Feels like a mmorpg to me, but that is probably because I actually understand what that means. Hint: has nothing to do with grouping.

 

Couldn't be further from the truth.

 

MMORPGS has everything to do with reliance on others for progression.

 

For new gamers - (Post WoW) Massive Multiplayer Online Roleplaying Game, simply means playing a game on a server that has chat options, and optional cooperative options.

 

Role Playing used to mean a heck of a lot more, than the "weirdos" that want to stand around in the forest and put on a fantasy online wedding.

 

You played your role throughout the community in combat to level - at every turn.

 

If you were a healer, you healed. Your ability to DPS and solo stuff was very limited, and a slow grind - almost a waste of time.

 

Your ROLE - was ever present, at every turn. It defined you. Everything you did, revolved around YOUR ROLE within a cooperative combat gaming community. PvP or PvE did not matter. It was your ROLE.

 

That feeling and definition of who you are, defined by class choice - is absent from MMORPG's today.

[sjmc]

MMORPGS has everything to do with reliance on others for progression.

I don't think that is completely true. They *may* require reliance on others for progression, or thay may simply allow for it as one option among several.

 

MMORPGs are simply games where many people play at once in the same persistent world. Each player will generally have his own objectives that might line up with other people's objectives or they might not.

 

It should provide tools to allow people to work together to achieve common objectives, if they should want to. These objectives might be combat-based (grouping to kill mobs or complete quests or even PVP) or they might be more social (guilds, marketplaces, gathering places, etc.).

 

How much you are required to participate in community activities varies from game to game. If you allow people to do things on their own, many people will do that, leaving a smaller pool of potential group-mates for group activities, making it hard for people that want to group to find those groups.

 

However, if you force grouping to progress, making the "groupers" happy, you are reducing the happiness of anyone that would have prefered to do it by himself.

 

It is a dilemma that each game developer faces.

[sithlordcip]

SWTOR - best Star Wars CO -OP RPG with an awesome story

 

but MMO lacking ( not because it doesnt have cross server LFD )

[terminova]

No, wow is still fairly non-linear other than the actual cata zones (thr 81+ zones and the new starting zones). If you have someone within level range to group with you, you can go over to their area and pick up most of the quests.

 

that's not the case in swtor... far more of the quets only become available as you work through the quest chain.

 

When I played the revamped zones after Cataclysm...everything in Azeroth was very linear in each zone meaning there was nothing non-linear about them, and many of the quests were zone wide quest chains in which you had to complete the previous set of quests before the next set became available. The linearity broke down in Outland as the Burning Crusade content hadn't been revamped as the Azeroth content had been. Case in point, you couldn't just walk into the middle of the zone and pick up quests your level, you had to get the quests below your level and do them before getting the later quests for your level.

 

The non-linearity is tied to not having to do specific zones in order to progress in level, but that's where the non-linearity disappeared as the rest of the content was very linear.

 

SWTOR - best Star Wars CO -OP RPG with an awesome story

 

but MMO lacking

 

That's a contradictory statement.

Edited April 4, 2012 by terminova

[zwhimsicalz]

It definitely feels like a single player experience with so many servers completely DEAD.....

[GnatB]

Yes, it feels a lot like a single plaeyr RP.

 

Which is pretty much the only reason I'm playing it. I don't particularly LIKE MMORPG's. This game, however, is fun.

[Shingara]

Couldn't be further from the truth.

 

MMORPGS has everything to do with reliance on others for progression.

 

For new gamers - (Post WoW) Massive Multiplayer Online Roleplaying Game, simply means playing a game on a server that has chat options, and optional cooperative options.

 

Role Playing used to mean a heck of a lot more, than the "weirdos" that want to stand around in the forest and put on a fantasy online wedding.

 

You played your role throughout the community in combat to level - at every turn.

 

If you were a healer, you healed. Your ability to DPS and solo stuff was very limited, and a slow grind - almost a waste of time.

 

Your ROLE - was ever present, at every turn. It defined you. Everything you did, revolved around YOUR ROLE within a cooperative combat gaming community. PvP or PvE did not matter. It was your ROLE.

 

That feeling and definition of who you are, defined by class choice - is absent from MMORPG's today.

 

MMO has nothing todo with reliance on others at all, this game has much reliance on others as any other mmo out there, I can lvl from 1-85 in wow without being given a free 80 solo, i can lvl solo in rift, aion, warhammer, sto etc etc etc. Only difference in wow is that its a much better and story driven game which makes it more fun then a grind.

 

of course if you can finish a flashpoint solo or an operation solo please upload a video to youtube of you doing that against mobs your lvl.

 

And your role in swtor is just as important the only difference is that your advanced tree of which we have 2 with 3 trees in each means you arnt pinned down to just a healer a tank or a dps.

Edited April 5, 2012 by Shingara

[Zekim]

Loving ALL the feedback on this! Thank to everyone for their insight, personal experience, and for really not flaming me for my new player opinion. Look, I'm still loving the game so far. Sitting at lvl 36 with my BH. I'd like to see a bit more community/socially driven things but there's a fine balance to doing that and it could ruin the game for many people. I'm a day player which I knew would hurt my chances at seeing many folks on when I am. I'm going through the required story line questing which really needs no grouping, and to be honest, I don't mind soloing a game. That said, if a reason to socialize were to come to fruition, I'd be all over it as a much needed break from the leveling.