Schwarzwald Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 The title says it all. Voidstar is horrible and my least favorite map in the current pool (and it should be yours as well). While the idea of voidstar is alright, the execution is downright terrible with some major game breaking flaws. 1. The respawn door timers. The amount of time you stay out on the field is completely random based on when you die. For instance, last night I was in a Voidstar in which I died 4 times while on defense, every time I died the door was a moment from opening and I simply just ran out and rejoined the battle. There was zero downtime and my death wasn't punished at all. I was actually rewarded with full health and the ability to re-enter combat. This is just game breaking and absurd. The reverse is also true though, in that some players will spawn in just as the door is closing and then they will be locked out of the fight for what seems to be 25+ seconds. There is another, bigger issues to these door mechanics. In organized ranked warzones, lets say that someone on your team is dead in the grave yard and some guys on your team are low on health while defending. The guy in the graveyard can all out over vent, hey guys, the door is about to open. Everyone with low health can then /stuck, die, respawn and come back into the fight at full health. This ties into my next point. 2. The transition between areas is terrible. Here is the situation that happens. The first door explodes, and then there is nearly a 20 second window before the defending respawn location switches. During this time, if you die, you are sent back to the first defending area respawn. This is TERRIBLE design because it automatically puts the defending team at a disadvantage by allowing the offensive team to pretty much landslide across the entire map uncontested. The moment the doors go down, the defending respawn point needs to change instantly. Some may say that 'oh its good teamwork if some people on a team can slow down a defending team in the 1st room while others push ahead and cap undefended doors, thats good teamwork.' NO. It is not a result of good teamwork, it is a result of poor map design. Do you know what this promotes? This promotes suicide via /stuck. In a situation like this, it is more beneficial for a defending member to /stuck to die and respawn then it is to stay live. These bad door mechanics set up situations in which it detrimental to your team the longer you stay alive in that area. I really don't have a problem with the 2nd half of the map. Crossing the bridges to get to the 2nd door works MUCH better then the first room and the corridors afterward bottleneck which gives more chances for defending teamwork. The problem with the first door is that there is no bottleneck. And while I understand that there should be a gradient difficulty on how hard it is for the offensive team to make progress, it isn't executed properly. tl;dr. Not only does the map in general promote stale and boring gameplay, the mechanics of the doors in the first room and respawn timers in general make the game broken and more reliant on how skillfully you can time your death, as opposed to staying alive as long as you can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerro Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 Two organized teams in Voidstar, noone die, no team plant a bomb, its a tie! Winner is decided by rng! Sounds like fun but yea i agree with you there are a lot of work that have to be done in Voidstar, Huttball to for that matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schwarzwald Posted February 27, 2012 Author Share Posted February 27, 2012 Two organized teams in Voidstar, noone die, no team plant a bomb, its a tie! Winner is decided by rng! Sounds like fun but yea i agree with you there are a lot of work that have to be done in Voidstar, Huttball to for that matter. The only thing in my opinion that needs to be addressed in huttball is that team comps can easily be stacked to the point where the game is herp-derp and that Agents/Smugglers have zero mobility options on that map to the point where they are hurting their team if they are holding the ball for more then 5 seconds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crujido Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 I disagree. You get lucky to avoid the door. The only issue that needs to be fixed is dots interupting caps. One sage can effectivley hold off a team by spamming weaken mind/crush. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ComeAndSee Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 Voidstar is the only map right now where two good teams can completely prevent the other from getting through. It's very easy for me to sit in the middle between both points and cherry pick when one side collapses and keep them from capping. // 1. Respawn time isn't long enough for defenders. Too many times where you get in a position to cap and the door opens. 2. Door cap time needs to be shortened. 8s is too long, it should be 5s. 3. Defender respawn gate needs to open immediately once a door is destroyed. 4. Defenders spawn needs to be pushed up immediately after the door is breached. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tharax Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 I'd like to throw my support behind the idea of a redesign as well. Currently, I think the difficulty for offense is inverted. The closer the doors are to each other, the easier it is for the defending team to move between them. It follows, therefore, that if the defense is able to get to the other door more quickly, it is harder for the offense to cap the doors. Currently, the doors get farther from each other as you progress: the first doors are the closest together, the third doors are farthest apart. So it gets easier to cap doors the more you progress. I think it would be more effective to have the first doors be farthest apart and the third doors be closest together. This eliminates a large portion of the frustration factor that always comes into play when your team has trouble on the first set. It also fosters a more "epic" style of gameplay, as the real challenge lies in protecting the final doors - the defense can rally in a last stand, while the offense is spurred on by the momentum of their increasingly hard accomplishments. Simply put, I just think it would be cooler for the difficulty in capping to increase - not decrease - over the course of the map. I would also like to see some extra delineation in the point distribution on void star. Capping the bridges and the forcefields are difficult to do - they should be worth a point each (meaning you get a point if you extend either bridge or disable any forcefield, not one point for each bridge you extend, etc). This could solve some issues with the tiebreaking system and encourage teams to recognize the importance of each of these objectives (if they do not already). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ComeAndSee Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 I mean, I'll openly admit I use /stuck to kill myself just to get across the gate in order to prevent a bum-rush on one of the side doors after the 1st door is breached. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GregoriusMaximus Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 I totally agree. I hate voidstar with a passion, such a skill-less lame WZ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GregoriusMaximus Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 My only problem is with your point 2. If you're the defender at the first door, you -want- to respawn at the original defender point, otherwise you can't stop them getting the bridges down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GregoriusMaximus Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 The only thing in my opinion that needs to be addressed in huttball is that team comps can easily be stacked to the point where the game is herp-derp and that Agents/Smugglers have zero mobility options on that map to the point where they are hurting their team if they are holding the ball for more then 5 seconds. Agents/Smugglers can stealth past the fire/to the enemy ball line and pick up the pass. They have good aoe stuns too to make the final run. Not so bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ComeAndSee Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 I totally agree. I hate voidstar with a passion, such a skill-less lame WZ. Civil War is up on my hate list too because of the side-speeders. It makes any sort of non-team zerg attack useless unless you manage to ninja the cap. Huttball is my favorite (despite the knockback abuse) because it allows 2-3 skilled people to carry the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elyree Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 Voidstar will be a terrible ranked map no matter what you do to it. It will be a constant stalemate with neither team ever breaking through the first door because it's just too easy to interrupt bomb planting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GregoriusMaximus Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 Civil War is up on my hate list too because of the side-speeders. It makes any sort of non-team zerg attack useless unless you manage to ninja the cap. Huttball is my favorite (despite the knockback abuse) because it allows 2-3 skilled people to carry the team. Yeah, I totally agree. Just a second or two more on the side speeders and it'd be a-ok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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