fjbd Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 Just lost my 10th (or maybe 15th) consecutive wz to a sith sorc premade. And they weren't even close. This suggests a couple of issues: + it ruins the game to make pugs queue vs premades. sure, it's fun for the premade but it ruins the game for everyone else. this is a case where the good of the many should outweigh the good of the few. if you want to keep your subscribers, you should implement separate wz queues asap. if the premades have to queue for an hour to get a wz pop then oh well - evidently no one wants to play against them. + it ruins the pvp metagame to allow a single toon to self heal, shield, CC, escape and do massive DPS. in all other serious PVP games I've played there is a tradeoff between healing and DPS. the fact that there is no such tradeoff in this game is the reason why all-sorc premades can be successful. and it's boring and annoying to play wz after wz against a single toon type. you ought to restructure the abilities to require a diverse group to be successful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidopro Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 they are trolling you and its working. I bet they see this forum post and their epeens grow an inch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thundartwothree Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 they are trolling you and its working. I bet they see this forum post and their epeens grow an inch They need that inch, they all play Sorcs:rak_tongue: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waagabond Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 they are trolling you and its working. I bet they see this forum post and their epeens grow an inch Exactly how are they trolling? I see this myself. The last week im facing every day full sorc premades, and often they get a merc or two with them, and frankly. there is absolutely nothing you can do. Sorcs are overpowered and thats it, mix them with a face rolling 1 button class like mercs or gunnery commandos and its just a winning concept. Im not one to complain, but the class balance and class mechanics in this game was definately NOT thought through. The sad part is that they nerfed the only class that was really good in handling sorcs and sages: Operaives and scoundrels. Had they been restored the warzones would look different. But who got that nerf through? A full community of sorcs and sages that could not stand not able to face roll every single class in this game. Im glad we have the option to leave warzones, and I have not done this in more then 10 years of PVP MMOs as I just dislike it. But there is just no point facing a sage, sorc premade...sorc premade mainly cause there is 3 sorcs for every sage. Republic players have a tendancy to roll the class they like to play. Imperial players, not all mind you, but the trend among people on imperial is they are choosing the class that they can have the easiest and become most powerful with. I dont blame them actually, but its just so blatantly crystal clear that its sad Bioware are not acknowledging this fact and hit that class with a bat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AntoniusDelitan Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 (edited) Just lost my 10th (or maybe 15th) consecutive wz to a sith sorc premade. And they weren't even close. This suggests a couple of issues: + it ruins the game to make pugs queue vs premades. sure, it's fun for the premade but it ruins the game for everyone else. this is a case where the good of the many should outweigh the good of the few. if you want to keep your subscribers, you should implement separate wz queues asap. if the premades have to queue for an hour to get a wz pop then oh well - evidently no one wants to play against them. So I get penalized with 1-hour queues because I want to play a Massively Multiplayer game with my friends? Nuh-uh... I give the matchmaking 2 minutes to queue me up against a premade... then I want a warzone regardless of premade or pug. + it ruins the pvp metagame to allow a single toon to self heal, shield, CC, escape and do massive DPS. in all other serious PVP games I've played there is a tradeoff between healing and DPS. the fact that there is no such tradeoff in this game is the reason why all-sorc premades can be successful. and it's boring and annoying to play wz after wz against a single toon type. you ought to restructure the abilities to require a diverse group to be successful. Oh, one of those 31/31/31 spec sorcerors again! Did you know the only respectable healing in the hybrid sorc spec is from putting a 2.8k shield up on cooldown? They have HORRIBLE heals... find your interrupt. Edited February 16, 2012 by AntoniusDelitan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bejita Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 (edited) its true, they are playing the game the way its meant to be played, stacking sorcs and takingg 1 jugg for guard is the sure fire way to win in competetive and casual pvp thats why sith sorcs need a big stinking smelly doo doo of a nerf patch to fly all over them and bring them in line with everyone else Edited February 16, 2012 by Bejita Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallorik Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 They need that inch, they all play Sorcs:rak_tongue: Hah! Yeah sorcs are a little op, they can do just about anything better than any other class. But the sorc and sage screams will be loud when they get around to nerfing them, or buffing the less fortunate like commando/merc healers. One of the biggest problems i see with these classes are the innate abilites they get from their ac, They need to move alot of those abilites into talent trees the same goes for tank ac's, things like heals and taunts should be tank/healer only not just generic ac abilities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raansu Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 I've been seeing this a lot on my server as well. It's either a full team of inquisitors or a mix of inquisitors and bounty hunters. Inquisitors are just the jack of all trades because of their hybrid spec. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSteebin Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 I'm a sage. Actually I would rather fight a sorc premade than a BH premade anyday. Their damage is easier to heal through when I'm healing, and when I'm dpsing they are easier to kill than bounty hunters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thundartwothree Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 In all honesty the Sorc/Sage ACs were most likey made with the begginer gamer in mind, its pretty typical in most MMOs to have that one class with an answer to most situations. But with other MMOs that class doesnt really excell at any one thing, in this game they do. So coupled with the ease of use, strength of the AC and "coolness" factor (Friggen Lightening!) people naturally flock to it, after all people are most likely to take the path of least resistance. It'll last awhile then BW will either up the skill curve of the AC or just outright nerf them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistols Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 The sad part is that they nerfed the only class that was really good in handling sorcs and sages: Operaives and scoundrels. I handle Sorcs just fine on my Vanguard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orangerascal Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 ill take sorcs over maruaders/assassins and ops any day of the week Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mandrillagon Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 Sorc/sage are being campaigned by the community for a nerf even harder than scoundrels were and we know the outcome. Sorc/sage are going to be nerfed and until they are we just have to deal with this nonsense in warzones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spymaster Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 (edited) So I get penalized with 1-hour queues because I want to play a Massively Multiplayer game with my friends? Nuh-uh.... Lol.... it's always this same excuse. Massively Multiplayer game doesn't = You and a small group of friends get preference over everyone else just because you have a premade group. If you really want to follow that logic you shouldn't get to form a premade at all because you're just playing with the same small group of friends every match instead of everyone on your server. What's massive about that? Now don't get me wrong, I'm not saying you shouldn't be able to play with your friends... but I'm sick of seeing this flawed point brought up so often... "It's an MMO so I get {insert preferential treatment here}"...... sorry man, but calling MMO is not a good reason for you and your pals to get an easy win button. Edited February 17, 2012 by Spymaster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
denpic Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 You sure they are premades or just the popular choice Most wz I'm in are all sorcs and bh"s Seeing a sith warrior is pretty rare same with the sniper When rateds come hopefully their will be a way for the player base to gauge Class numbers better But I think it would be safe to say sorcs Are most Played class Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talizzar Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 pugs are going to lose against premades and I don't care what they are playing. They have comms and you don't they all know what is going to happen next and you don't. You believe all the forums posts. Sorcs die and die fast when you know what you are doing especially when their stuns are on cool down. A hybrid sorc can't heal burst damage and their big heal takes nearly 3 seconds to cast if not interrupted and heals for crap. We get in with premades and we leave or laugh with them and try to pick off what we can. Only 4 of them are premade. If they get lucky enough to get in with 4 other buds you are toast. When 4 people are working together and your 8 are all over the place do you really expect to compete? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holskabard Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 (edited) Oh, one of those 31/31/31 spec sorcerors again! Did you know the only respectable healing in the hybrid sorc spec is from putting a 2.8k shield up on cooldown? They have HORRIBLE heals... find your interrupt. This, if spec'd for decent dps and prioritizing crit/surge over alacrity then a sage/sorcerer has a 2-3k'ish heal with 2.7'ish s. activivation time. Sure if spec'd healing or hybrid with enough points in healing they still have awesome cc but the dps is almost laughable, they're tickling you to death. Edited February 17, 2012 by Holskabard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AntoniusDelitan Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 (edited) Lol.... it's always this same excuse. Massively Multiplayer game doesn't = You and a small group of friends get preference over everyone else just because you have a premade group. If you really want to follow that logic you shouldn't get to form a premade at all because you're just playing with the same small group of friends every match instead of everyone on your server. What's massive about that? Now don't get me wrong, I'm not saying you shouldn't be able to play with your friends... but I'm sick of seeing this flawed point brought up so often... "It's an MMO so I get {insert preferential treatment here}"...... sorry man, but calling MMO is not a good reason for you and your pals to get an easy win button.Your strawman arguement is massively flawed. Edited February 17, 2012 by AntoniusDelitan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gryphandor Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 I handle Sorcs just fine on my Vanguard. 1 vs 1 I will squash a Sorc on my Shadow. Now in a 2 vs 2 they always come out ahead. CC one and burn the other. It just scales the more Sorc there are in a group. I mean 3 Sorc vs 5 of almost any other combo lacking a healer will fall to the 3 Sorc group. I honestly think you should take reduced damage the more people that hit you and even more reduced damage of the same type. It would encourage more 1 vs 1 if people knew they would suffer a DPS loss zerging people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orangerascal Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 Sorc/sage are being campaigned by the community for a nerf even harder than scoundrels were and we know the outcome. Sorc/sage are going to be nerfed and until they are we just have to deal with this nonsense in warzones. good luck with that especially since the developers said they like the sage/sorc where are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrDeas Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 they are trolling you and its working. I bet they see this forum post and their epeens grow an inch If this is on a RP server I'd doubt that it's them troll rolling. Lots of guilds on RP servers do have restrictions on class so it's not beyond possibility that it's a coincidence that they all went for PvP together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spymaster Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 (edited) Your strawman arguement is the massively flawed arguement. That doesn't even make sense. What I posted was not a strawman in any way. You plainly stated that your reasoning for wanting to keep your premade vs pug status was "this is an MMO"... that's the argument I addressed. How is that a strawman? It's not. (Lol at the wikiepedia quote... spare me your Condescension) Nice little pun there, but it doesn't hide you from the facts. Just saying "this is an MMO... so I get to.... yadda yadda" is a horrible point and shouldn't be made on the forums. Edited February 17, 2012 by Spymaster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AntoniusDelitan Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 (edited) That doesn't even make sense. What I posted was not a strawman in any way. You plainly stated that your reasoning for wanting to keep your premade vs pug status was "this is an MMO"... that's the argument I addressed. How is that a strawman? It's not. Nice little pun there, but it doesn't hide you from the facts. Just saying "this is an MMO... so I get to.... yadda yadda" is a horrible point and shouldn't be made on the forums. If you really want to follow that logic you shouldn't get to form a premade at all because you're just playing with the same small group of friends every match instead of everyone on your server. What's massive about that? ^^ Classic strawman arguement introduction. "If you really want to follow that logic" I said nothing more than premade groups shouldn't suffer any longer queues then getting the next 4 open spots that come along if another premade group is not available withing, say, 2 minutes. Edited February 17, 2012 by AntoniusDelitan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrDeas Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 ^^ Classic strawman arguement introduction. If you really want to follow that logic I said nothing more than premade groups shouldn't suffer any longer queues then getting the next 4 open spots that come along if another premade group is not available withing, say, 2 minutes. How is it a straw man argument? A straw man argument relies on a fallacy or misconception. So tell me where the misconception was in his argument? That an MMO includes more than just your friends? That there are others playing the game that have requirements besides you and your friends? I really fail to see your logic here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spymaster Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 (edited) ^^ Strawman arguement. I said nothing more than premade groups shouldn't suffer any longer queues then getting the next 4 open spots that come along if another premade group is not available withing, say, 2 minutes. But you did say more that..... You said the reason you and your friends shouldn't have to wait is "because it's an MMO"... which is the flawed part of your post, which is what I pointed out. So, yeah... it's not a strawman. Maybe check your own link?? If you want to wait less for a WZ you should join the que that pops faster because more people are in it. If you HAVE to que "with friends because this is an MMO".... you should face the consequences of that choice. If premade ques pop less often, what does that tell you about the number of MMO players who play the way you do? Edited February 17, 2012 by Spymaster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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