Duffer Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 (edited) I'm at 3 bm tokens out of 36 BM boxes. That's 1 token per week. It takes 20 tokens to get a full set of BM. The drop rate is supposed to be 25%, but for me and a lot of others (who have made dozens of similar threads) I'm around 9%. If the trend stays current then it will take me 5 months straight of daily/weekly pvp quests. Over on the Customer Service forums there was an official response to this concern: Greetings All, We apologize for this issue, it is a known one and it is due to be resolved in a future patch at some point after 1.1.3 Unfortunately there was a followup response later in the same thread: Apologies about this, but our CSR made an error in his earlier statement. We have tested the Battlemaster Commendations and they are working as intended, per Gabe's previous post. The chance for a Battlemaster Commendation to be in a Battlemaster Bag is still 25%. Again, apologies for the confusion. To recap: 5 months to get full Battlemaster is working as intended. Do not reply to this post with a statistics lecture. Nobody wants to hear it. The point of this thread is to draw attention to how absurd this system is. It needs to change. **EDIT** I'm now at 7 tokens out of 52 bags (13.5% drop rate). That's RNG for you. If you rely on 'randomness' to distribute loot then there will always be people like me at the bottom of the curve getting royally screwed over. Gabe has posted that Bioware intends to address this issue in a "future" patch (he does not specify 1.2 as some in this thread have claimed). Why wasn't it changed over when they did the Centurion and Champion system? They know the system is junk; that's why they changed Cent and Champ, but Battlemasters were left out in the cold apparently because Bioware mistakenly believes that people will stay subscribed longer in order to get a full set. Edited February 23, 2012 by Duffer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ortof Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 (edited) I thought they were RNG. With that said, you can't "expect" anything. You could have full BM by the end of next weeks weeklies. You never know. EDIT: Perhaps you need to learn what the laws of percentage really are. It isn't I have a 1 in 4 chance of winning therefor 1 in 4 bags WILL give me a token. Hell, you could get 1,000 bags and even at 50% have all 1,000 give you nothing. Edited February 16, 2012 by Ortof Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nocorras Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 Only took me 3-4 weeks to get full bm. RNG is RNG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noctournys Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 This might matter if Battlemaster meant anything. Since it is about a 2% upgrade... who cares Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atreyuz Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 RNG is RNG This :/. 6 BM bags opened since Im 60 (61 currently). 4 BM commendations. I know, Im a lucky bastard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nocorras Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 This might matter if Battlemaster meant anything. Since it is about a 2% upgrade... who cares I agree to a point, but the draw of MMOs now is gear/character progression (at a reasonable rate). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ortof Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 This :/. 6 BM bags opened since Im 60 (61 currently). 4 BM commendations. I know, Im a lucky bastard. Someone somewhere who has opened 2 bajillion bags in the last 4 months of playing (see what I did there) is nerd raging at your post. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarvus Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 I just hit 60 valor about 3 days ago. I popped the one BM bag I've had in my cargo hold since the mid 30s, and probably popped about 4 or 5 additional bags, can't recall exactly. But it's only been a few days. I got 4 BM tokens and picked up two pieces of armor. I'm not saying this to rub it in, or to make you feel bad or to brag about dumb luck on my part, just as a counterpoint to let you know that it doesn't always go the way you describe and that random can feel pretty unrandom at times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duffer Posted February 16, 2012 Author Share Posted February 16, 2012 (edited) EDIT: Perhaps you need to learn what the laws of percentage really are. It isn't I have a 1 in 4 chance of winning therefor 1 in 4 bags WILL give me a token. Hell, you could get 1,000 bags and even at 50% have all 1,000 give you nothing. I hate you so much. To recap: 5 months to get full Battlemaster is working as intended. Do not reply to this post with a statistics lecture. Nobody wants to hear it. The point of this thread is to draw attention to how absurd this system is. It needs to change. Edited February 16, 2012 by Duffer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lupious Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 I'm at 9% as well....2 out 22. Weird coincidence eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duffer Posted February 16, 2012 Author Share Posted February 16, 2012 There are a myriad of other threads started by people in my situation. I am not optimistic the trend for my BM tokens will change. I'm glad to hear some of you are actually skilled at RNG, and have your gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kricys Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 Full bm for a while and I've gotten 5 coms in last 3 days. SUp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quantum Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 (edited) I'm at 3 bm tokens out of 36 BM boxes. That's 1 token per week. It takes 20 tokens to get a full set of BM. The drop rate is supposed to be 25%, but for me and a lot of others (who have made dozens of similar threads) I'm around 9%. If the trend stays current then it will take me 5 months straight of daily/weekly pvp quests. Over on the Customer Service forums there was an official response to this concern: Unfortunately there was a followup response later in the same thread: To recap: 5 months to get full Battlemaster is working as intended. Do not reply to this post with a statistics lecture. Nobody wants to hear it. The point of this thread is to draw attention to how absurd this system is. It needs to change. I tried explaining this in another thread... 25% chance does not mean you should get 1/4 or 25/100 or anything else. Since there is an infinite number of possible bags in the game you cannot pull a sample size to use as a basis for determining a percentage, since 1/4 = 250,000,000/1,000,000,000 = 5,000,000,000,000/20,000,000,000,000 , you simply can not determine what an accurate sample size would be out of infinity. What that 25% chance really means is you have a 75% chance of failure. The odds are greatly stacked against you getting a token, if you are getting 7 our of 10 bags you beat the odds, and passed the RNG check those 7 times, but you only had a 25% chance on each individual bag. If you don't get one after opening 200 bags you still had a 25% chance of success, but still failed due to the 75% chance of not getting a token. Edited February 16, 2012 by Quantum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ortof Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 I hate you so much. You can hate me all you want. But it's a fact. So are you going to do what my 4 year old does and cover her ears, screaming la, la la la, la la la la, I can't hear you while the fact of the matter is, you have sh*tty luck? Come on man.... What's next? Why not write your state government on why you haven't won the state lottery or Powerball yet? I mean, the odds of winning are roughly 1:3.4... Much better odds than getting gear.. Again, you can complain all you want, but to say "I don't want to hear facts" is a bit childish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ortof Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 I tried explaining this in another thread... 25% chance does not mean you should get 1/4 or 25/100 or anything else. Since there is an infinite number of possible bags in the game you cannot pull a sample size to use as a basis for determining a percentage, since 1/4 = 250,000,000/1,000,000,000 = 5,000,000,000,000/20,000,000,000,000 , you simply can not determine what an accurate sample size would be out of infinity. What that 25% chance really means is you have a 75% chance of failure. The odds are greatly stacked against you getting a token, if you are getting 7 our of 10 bags you beat the odds, and passed the RNG check those 7 times, but you only had a 25% chance on each individual bag. If you don't get one after opening 200 bags you still had a 25% chance of success, but still failed due to the 75% chance of not getting a token. He didn't want to hear it from me either and in fact hates me. I guess he just wants BW to ship him and everyone above valor level X all the gear they "deserve"at that point. I mean clearly he doesn't want to hear why the odds work the way they do, he just wants them to work for him and NAO! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quantum Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 (edited) He didn't want to hear it from me either and in fact hates me. I guess he just wants BW to ship him and everyone above valor level X all the gear they "deserve"at that point. I mean clearly he doesn't want to hear why the odds work the way they do, he just wants them to work for him and NAO! I don't like the current system myself either and I'm dreading when I hit Valor 60 at going through the BS to get a BM set. But I won't go around saying that the system is "broken" when it's not. I'd rather say the system could be improved. Personally I'd like to see that 25% chance of a token increase by a % for each bag that you get nothing. For example.... Bag 1. 25% Bag 2. 30% Bag 3. 35% Bag 4. 40% Bag 5. 45% Bag 6. 50% Bag 7. 55% Bag 8. 60% Bag 9. 65% Bag 10. 70% Bag 11. 75% Bag 12. 80% Bag 13. 82% Bag 14. 85% Bag 15. 87% Bag 16. 90% Bag 17. 92% Bag 18. 95% Bag 19. 97% Bag 20. 100% This way you'd never go over 20 bags without a token, and you'd have a better than even chance on your 7th bag. This would put the odds in your favor of getting at least 2-3 tokens a week. Edited February 16, 2012 by Quantum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ortof Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 I don't like the current system myself either and I'm dreading when I hit Valor 60 at going through the BS to get a BM set. But I won't go around saying that the system is "broken" when it's not. I'd rather say the system could be improved. Personally I'd like to see that 25% chance of a token increase by a % for each bag that you get nothing. For example.... Bag 1. 25% Bag 2. 30% Bag 3. 35% Bag 4. 40% Bag 5. 45% Bag 6. 50% Bag 7. 55% Bag 8. 60% Bag 9. 65% Bag 10. 70% Bag 11. 75% Bag 12. 80% Bag 13. 82% Bag 14. 85% Bag 15. 87% Bag 16. 90% Bag 17. 92% Bag 18. 95% Bag 19. 97% Bag 20. 100% This way you'd never go over 20 bags without a token, and you'd have a better than even chance on your 7th bag. This would put the odds in your favor of getting at least 2-3 tokens a week. Seems like a pretty reasonable fix to me. Well, not fix, but improvement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duffer Posted February 16, 2012 Author Share Posted February 16, 2012 (edited) It is not about statistics. It is about how absurd the system is. Like I said in the original post. Edited February 16, 2012 by Duffer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ortof Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 It is not about statistics. It is about how absurd the system is. Like I said in the original post. You've done nothing but shown your disdain for the PVP reward system. What would "you" do to improve it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duffer Posted February 16, 2012 Author Share Posted February 16, 2012 (edited) You've done nothing but shown your disdain for the PVP reward system. What would "you" do to improve it? You've done nothing but put words in my mouth and offer irrelevant and unwanted commentary. Bioware's current system deserves the full amount of disdain that any rational person can muster. I would improve it by making it the exact same as the Cent and Champ system. Why did they not do it for BM also when they made those changes? Edited February 16, 2012 by Duffer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ortof Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 It deserves the full amount of disdain that any rational person can muster. I would improve it by making it the exact same as the Cent and Champ change. Why did they not do it for BM? Because BM only takes 3 tokens for some. You mean to tell me that you would rather them give you 7 BM tokens and 15 Champ tokens per bag? I honestly hope you mean to rework the entire system so a BM takes over 70 (seeing as tier one took so little, then Champ took 67 at most would make sense to have BM bumped up a bit from that). That I could see as an improvement as well. Either way though the current system isn't broken man. Could it be better? Ya, but it's not flawed or broken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lealz Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 It deserves the full amount of disdain that any rational person can muster. I would improve it by making it the exact same as the Cent and Champ change. Why did they not do it for BM? This. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carbonated Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 we need more blogs on how many people have opened imho. btw im valor 47 and use 2 pieces of pvp gear, got a total of 5 pieces. And I couldnt care less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xNear Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 You've done nothing but shown your disdain for the PVP reward system. What would "you" do to improve it? I'm not the OP but obviously he would give everyone a full BM set with 1st month sub. Yeah, RNG sucks, but honestly (for the empire pvp players anyway since thats all I can speak for) the game would just end if you managed to get full BM in a month or so - and some people do. Honestly with the way they "fixed" the comms situation you're at least rolling in full Champion gear. It has gotten so easy to get to Champion that the only thing from keeping me from rerolling republic (the time invested in my main) that after banging out the daillies on my BM I derp around on an alt. The pvp is enjoyable at every level of the game IF you know how to play the games correctly. What it boils down to is the RNG grind gives you some meager carrot on a stick so you keep chuggin along. The stats between Champ and BM are marginal at best so enjoy the game for what it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duffer Posted February 16, 2012 Author Share Posted February 16, 2012 Either way though the current system isn't broken man. Could it be better? Ya, but it's not flawed or broken. It is flawed and it is broken when it can take one person 2 weeks to fully gear up and someone else 5 months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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