Nocturnalis Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 the problem is. the adjustments it needs vs the adjustments the qqers on the forum call for are very different things. So are you saying the OP's argument isn't valid? I mean it's spelled out right in this very thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaidarlol Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 So are you saying the OP's argument isn't valid? I mean it's spelled out right in this very thread. i believe the OP's argument is invalid because he personally doesn't have issues with what he claims to be overpowered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScipioAemilianus Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 I just think that there aren't enough good players yet to test any real data against. there are alot of bad players still grasping thier class. some are faster learners. I think time is what we need before busting out the nerf bat. I can't imagine BW releasing a game that took 5 years to put to gether and having an op class. I just don't want ot see what happened in wow where we had FLOTM classes or one the company has a hard on for a class like Blizz did with rogues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaidarlol Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 I just think that there aren't enough good players yet to test any real data against. there are alot of bad players still grasping thier class. some are faster learners. I think time is what we need before busting out the nerf bat. I can't imagine BW releasing a game that took 5 years to put to gether and having an op class. I just don't want ot see what happened in wow where we had FLOTM classes or one the company has a hard on for a class like Blizz did with rogues. i agree with you completely, this game is not even 2 months old and everyone is already crying for nerfs. it is absolutely ludicrous. and yes speaking as a sorcerer, i believe the operative nerf was unjust and shouldn't have been made. even if GOOD operatives considered this to be a buff (lol?). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dcgregorya Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 i agree with you completely, this game is not even 2 months old and everyone is already crying for nerfs. Roughly translated, "Please let me have more time to exploit this." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaidarlol Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 Roughly translated, "Please let me have more time to exploit this." roughly translated, "i'm bad at this game, and i refuse to learn how to counter these abilities, i prefer someone just make it easier for me" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrbiggggy Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 i think they should consider buffing everyone else's cc yeah yeah theres already too much cc in this game but i dunno:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tumri Posted February 15, 2012 Author Share Posted February 15, 2012 (edited) If they buffed everyone else's CC they might as well just have every warzone have a mechanic that stuns random people around the map every few seconds. There's far too much CC already. Edited February 15, 2012 by Tumri Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tumri Posted February 15, 2012 Author Share Posted February 15, 2012 (edited) i believe the OP's argument is invalid because he personally doesn't have issues with what he claims to be overpowered. If I have issues with the class I need to L2P and I suck. If I don't have issues with the class but make a thread about an imbalance then my argument is invalid. --- These are the two points repeated over and over about my own personal skill so far. It's Lose-Lose with this sort of logic. Edited February 15, 2012 by Tumri Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaidarlol Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 (edited) If I have issues with the class I need to L2P and I suck. If I don't have issues with the class but make a thread about an imbalance then my argument is invalid. --- These are the two points repeated over and over about my own personal skill so far. It's Lose-Lose with this sort of logic. it isn't about your own personal skill. if you propose a point which is sorcerers' ccs are over powered, and yet you can do better than them in pvp. there are only 2 possibilities. a) you are an absolute master at your class either due to your own natural talents or intelligence or what have you. b) the cc's are actually not overpowered as you have learned how to beat them is that a wrong assumption? Edited February 15, 2012 by shaidarlol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Celebrus Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 (edited) roughly translated, "i'm bad at this game, and i refuse to learn how to counter these abilities, i prefer someone just make it easier for me" Roughly translated: I enjoy having an advantage over other players, then rubbing that blatant advantage in their face, then I enjoy calling them ridiculous when they ask for my advatange to be taken away because I couldn't function without it but rather than admitting that I will call them "bads" because my vocabulary is limited. Sorcs/sages will get tuned, just like ops did, and yes, the op "nerf" if you can even call it that, was needed. Edited February 15, 2012 by Celebrus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
savionen Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 (edited) it isn't about your own personal skill. if you propose a point which is sorcerers' ccs are over powered, and yet you can do better than them in pvp. there are only 2 possibilities. a) you are an absolute master at your class either due to your own natural talents or intelligence or what have you. b) the cc's are actually not overpowered as you have learned how to beat them is that a wrong assumption? If everyone but Sorcerers think they need to be nerfed, does everyone but Sorcerers need to learn to play? Seems like the exact same thing as before Operatives got nerfed. Operative before they got nerfed: Operatives shouldn't be nerfed, it's fine that I 3-shot everyone. They just need to l2p. This is the only class I play. Edited February 15, 2012 by savionen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnSixteen Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 i am sorry, your reason of rolling a sorcerer is completely invalid because of the "fact" that they are op, because it is the only reason to roll a sorcerer. Well I'm not sure how my own personal reason for rolling a class could be invalid, but hey I'll go with that. Did you eat a pop tart this morning? If so, your reply is invalid due to the fact that pop tarts are op, which is the only reason to eat one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaidarlol Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 Roughly translated: I enjoy having an advantage over other players, then rubbing that blatant advantage in their face, then I enjoy calling them ridiculous when they ask for my advatange to be taken away because I couldn't function without it but rather than admitting that I will call them "bads" because my vocabulary is limited. Sorcs/sages will get tuned, just like ops did, and yes, the op "nerf" if you can even call it that, was needed. if the nerfs come, so be it, i will just have to work harder to achieve what i can do now. and i assure you i will. but you will never see me on the pvp forums whining about how overpowered another class is/are/will be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaidarlol Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 Well I'm not sure how my own personal reason for rolling a class could be invalid, but hey I'll go with that. Did you eat a pop tart this morning? If so, your reply is invalid due to the fact that pop tarts are op, which is the only reason to eat one. ugh, my post to yours was completely showing the absurdity of some of the claims ppl make. as in i'm being sarcastic and nothing more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jabtiz Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 Well I'm not sure how my own personal reason for rolling a class could be invalid, but hey I'll go with that. Did you eat a pop tart this morning? If so, your reply is invalid due to the fact that pop tarts are op, which is the only reason to eat one. Pop tarts are weak. They got nerfed along time ago. Toaster Strudel is OP and in need of a nerf though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MMOgamer Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 good post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScipioAemilianus Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 Roughly translated: I enjoy having an advantage over other players, then rubbing that blatant advantage in their face, then I enjoy calling them ridiculous when they ask for my advatange to be taken away because I couldn't function without it but rather than admitting that I will call them "bads" because my vocabulary is limited. Sorcs/sages will get tuned, just like ops did, and yes, the op "nerf" if you can even call it that, was needed. you aremissing the point.. From what I see they don't need anythign quit yet,. as is most players are still feeling thier way around the class. let them get in thier skins before random nerfs begin. I am already seeing an increase in players abilities from the start. Of course all classes need nerfed. no one is as good as I am therefore it must be an op class. C'mon lean adapt and overcome or go back to wow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaidarlol Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 If everyone but Sorcerers think they need to be nerfed, does everyone but Sorcerers need to learn to play? Seems like the exact same thing as before Operatives got nerfed. Operative before they got nerfed: Operatives shouldn't be nerfed, it's fine that I 3-shot everyone. They just need to l2p. This is the only class I play. do you think that the ppl who does not think sorcs are imbalanced actually posts? how many ppl who actually believe things are balanced make posts about how balanced this game is? let's just say sorcerers got nerfed to the ground, do think there will be posts about how balanced the game is? i guarantee you no one will say anything. again, speaking as a sorcerer, i believe the operative nerf wasn't necessary, but i guess my voice is irelevant.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renlotho Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 actually the OP is completely implying that a the difference between a good and a bad sorc/sage is really small, as where the difference between a good and a bad say marauder for example is huge. Funny I didn't get that at all, his posts imply the opposite that most are baddies, but even playing badly they are powerful due to the wide assortment of skills. Furthermore, a well played hybrid sorc is straight up OP. His original post was actually an assessment of abilities not an implication of the skill or lack thereof of players... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScipioAemilianus Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 you aremissing the point.. From what I see they don't need anythign quit yet,. as is most players are still feeling thier way around the class. let them get in thier skins before random nerfs begin. I am already seeing an increase in players abilities from the start. Of course all classes need nerfed. no one is as good as I am therefore it must be an op class. C'mon lean adapt and overcome or go back to wow. FYI I'm not even a sith sorc and I think its fine. I just cruised the different threads and all I'm seeing is every single class having people cry about how OP the others ar and how they want outragous increases of 20-30% to abilities. I hope BW lets the cement dry before nerfing or tweeking. otherwise its wow all over again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaidarlol Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 (edited) Funny I didn't get that at all, his posts imply the opposite that most are baddies, but even playing badly they are powerful due to the wide assortment of skills. Furthermore, a well played hybrid sorc is straight up OP. His original post was actually an assessment of abilities not an implication of the skill or lack thereof of players... here is the post My server is already at least 40%+ Sorcerers and about 25% Mercenaries right now lol. With that said I'm leveling one up right now. I've actually been having some really good low level WZs with my Sorc and before I played one I never knew they had so many tricks. The average Sorcerer doesn't even use half the tools available to him and still does okay. When I was on my Marauder I didn't even know Force Slow was baseline! I always assumed it was a talent or something because I barely had it used against me. Even without Backlash and Electric bindings I'm finding myself kiting most level 40-49 players with ease. It's unbelievable but I didn't know that the delay from the knockback didn't root you in place. I had always thought that once you cast Overload you had to stand still but I was amazed when I found this to not be the case. I've been averaging about 250-300k damage in the basic greens/and odd blues from quests and drops around my level and my Sorcerer isn't even high enough level for Force Storm so it's almost all single target. With the baseline CC I find that it's simple enough to juke people into places where they'll get knocked back into a fire or down a ramp or the balcony in Alderaan WZ. I feel like I'll be untouchable once I get all my talents on this character. when a "baddie" can do ok that to me at least implies that the difference between a good sorc and a bad one is small as compared to other classes Edited February 15, 2012 by shaidarlol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vales Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 (edited) Dude you're dumb. I can't wait till you play vs an all sage or all sorc team in huttball. You're going to get roflstomped before you can even react. Actually more like Resolve bar being up 90% of the time. here is the post when a "baddie" can do ok that to me at least implies that the difference between a good sorc and a bad one is small as compared to other classes And where is the evidence for that claim? Because anecdotal evidence is worthless at best just like the anecdotal evidence of the OP. There is absolutely zero empirical data on any of the claims. It is all subjective opinions nothing more. And in terms of skill cap Sorc/Sage have the highest simply due the amounts of options available for most situations. Edited February 15, 2012 by Vales Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthiel Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 making wrath only proc crushing darkness is *********** stupid what am i supposed to use my wrath procs for the 15 sec the spell is on cd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaidarlol Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 Actually more like Resolve bar being up 90% of the time. And where is the evidence for that claim? Because anecdotal evidence is worthless at best just like the anecdotal evidence of the OP. There is absolutely zero empirical data on any of the claims. It is all subjective opinions nothing more. And in terms of skill cap Sorc/Sage have the highest simply due the amounts of options available for most situations. yes vales, i agree with you, which is why i only said he implies this, it doesn't mean it's true. my only issue with the OP isn't with his argument's presentation or saying that he's showing false information. i simply disagree because he personally has either overcame the apparently overpowered abilities of a sorcerer, or he never had an issue to begin with as he does better than sorcerers in pvp or maybe marauders are overpowered when fighting sorcerers. although i personally will never believe that in the current game state. so my reaction is, if the OP can do it why can't others? why is it always the classes' fault? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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