Marauders do not need buff

[Twar]

Ok I am going to first say this, I come from the guild Thirsty which is currently world 7th in all content clear. I have played this game since day one and have seen everything. I play a Rank 65 BH mercenary with 4/5 BM gear, MH and OH BM. Still need gloves/bracers/belt.

 

Whenever I roll with a marauder whom actually knows how to play this game, he beats pretty much every DPS class, including myself, EVERY time in the damage meters, and I am an extremely competent pvp player. In raids, marauders are our number 1 priority for battle resurrection for dps classes as they do the most damage in our raids.

 

Now, there is the problem with their abilities to survive which further enhances their complete over powered playstyle. Their first shield does 50% damage reduction for 12 seconds. 12 seconds is way more than enough time for a marauder to kill TWO people and still live. Well if that shield does not help them out to survive, they have a 90% damage reduction cheat death that lasts for 5 second but with a 90 second cool down.

 

Well if all else fails, they can just pop their vanish ability with has a 45 second cool down. On top of this ability to survive they can also charge and interrupt with a EIGHT second cool down! When I watch marauders they pretty much wipe out the whole enemy team and only have about 2-3 (most of the time 0 with a healers) deaths throughout a whole match.

 

So why do they deserve this buff? The simple answer is that Bioware is listening to the masses, and it is safe to say the masses do not have the highest intellect level when playing this game. Making masses happy= money.

 

There is no counter to what I have said... I see what I see and I hear what I hear from these marauder players and even THEY themselves think this buff is a joke.

 

There is no need to buff a buffed class. Stop listening to the masses whom are not entirely all the good at playing this game!

[EasymodeX]

even THEY themselves think this buff is a joke.

 

Except there's a 50% chance that the actual result is a nerf.

[Kricys]

Except there's a 50% chance that the actual result is a nerf.

 

I think theres a 60% chance that you're 100% right.

[Hoseman]

. In raids, marauders are our number 1 priority for battle resurrection for dps classes as they do the most damage in our raids.

 

 

 

You know this.... because you have dps meters right? you have parses? wanna post them? Id love to see actual evidence then someone who has "level 26 marauder" on his sig.

[Karniel]

I think people have the knee jerk reaction when playing marauder, Omg Im not seeing upser big numbers and people dying right off the bat. You actually have to do something other than face roll..

[Sayc]

I think theres a 60% chance that you're 100% right.

 

There is a 23.4% chance you miscalculated.

 

I think people have the knee jerk reaction

 

I think people have a knee jerk reaction to be stupid when playing marauder.

Edited February 3, 2012 by Sayc

[OniGanon]

Did I miss something? What buff?

 

The Bleedout fix and Hemorrhage change? Is that what you mean?

 

I'm no maths whiz, but +15% bleed damage +30% bleed crit damage doesn't sound like a mind-blowing boost over +36% bleed damage. Sounds like it'd be less, actually, unless your crit rate is like 70% or something ridiculous.

Edited February 3, 2012 by OniGanon

[Aztian]

says a Level 26 Sith Warrior Marauder

[AcaciaDragon]

Did I miss something? What buff?

 

The Bleedout fix and Hemorrhage change? Is that what you mean?

 

I'm no maths whiz, but +15% bleed damage +30% bleed crit damage doesn't sound like a mind-blowing boost over +36% bleed damage. Sounds like it'd be less, actually, unless your crit rate is like 70% or something ridiculous.

 

I think he was referring to a general buff, one that is not yet clear as what it will be that so many people claim we need. As noted by the title of the thread which was aimed at Marauders in general, not annihilation spec, which those changes apply to.

[Munx]

If marauders are so awesome in raids, how come your 16 man Nightmare screenshot only seems to have one?

 

 

 

http://www.thirstytor.com/wp-content/uploads/Screenshot_2012-01-23_20_51_30_626660.jpg

 

Oh and 2 for your karagga NM

 

http://www.thirstytor.com/wp-content/uploads/Screenshot_2012-01-23_20_51_30_626660.jpg

 

 

I would think that if the marauders were as SUPREME as you seem to claim, you would bring more then 1-2 of them in a 16man raid.

 

1: you failed to mention Undying rage takes 50% of our hp, and its a 99% dmg red fyi.

 

2: Saber ward is a 3min cool down, not exactly something you'll use at all times, oh and you forgot the part about it being only 25% to tech and force

 

And 12 seconds is not enough times to kill 2 people who use theyr cooldowns also.

 

Even less so if they are somewhat equally geared.

 

3: I play a Sentinel and a Marauder, both 50, both raiding. You have a 26 marauder, stay under your bridge.

 

4: you forgot to mention that force camo only lasts for 5 seconds, you try very hard to make it sound like the same thing as stealth.

 

 

 

PS: I don't care if you are the self proclaimed 7th guild in progression.. Newsflash: Swtor raiding is simple.

 

As for 16 man, the only thing impressive about it is beating the trash, since the bosses are actually easier then 8man -_-

 

And people don't bother suffer trough the lag just to get the same or less loot.

Edited February 3, 2012 by Munx

[Tumri]

Stuff

 

Sounds like you're butthurt that your guild values your Marauder more than you. Just FYI if you're not doing better in Warzones than your Marauder friend you're not as good as him. BH have way more utility in PvP and if for some reason you're still failing to do well it's because you suck at your class.

Edited February 3, 2012 by Tumri

[HBninjaX]

you have to be trolling brotha

[keltonz]

12 seconds is way more than enough time for a marauder to kill TWO people and still live.

 

If two enemies had 15k health each (low), that would require 3750 damage per GCD. I'm sure its possible... with adrenals, relics, crits, no defensive cooldowns, and immobile opponents. In other words, I don't think you know what you're talking about.

[Sayc]

If two enemies had 15k health each (low), that would require 3750 damage per GCD. I'm sure its possible... with adrenals, relics, crits, no defensive cooldowns, and immobile opponents. In other words, I don't think you know what you're talking about.

 

Shii cho, pop zerk, pop all your buffs, and hope you crit on everything

[Munx]

Thats not including theyr armor damage reduction which will be anywhere from 25-40%

 

Not to mention theyr own defensive cooldowns, or kiteing, stunning, knockback etcetc.

 

Unless you are fighting clickers or worthless players its simply not gonna happen.

 

And lets not even bring up well specced hybird mercs/commandos, they can heal trough anything a marauder can dish out single handedly, even when debuffed

Edited February 3, 2012 by Munx

[Ashnazg]

When I watch marauders they pretty much wipe out the whole enemy team

 

You could've made your troll a little less obvious. Marauder's burst is only a little bit better than that of a assassin tank.

[Sithlordjoe]

I play a 50 Marauder. PvP is not some 1v1 marathon its a all out brawl and if we don't have a healer and if our enemies do we are screwed Marauders can't punch out enough damage to out kill a person being healed or a healer solo half the time. Now I'm speaking from a perspective that pugs..I pvp alone majority of the time and let me tell you Marauders unaided blow we have no utility, our survive ability only matters if we are facing a solo target because every other class can pound us if we aren't focused on them. The fact that we have to waste our limited close encounter time putting up bleeds and not dealing any damage to anyone who is geared with expertise is a joke. You cant compare pve and pvp damage because they are different specs. People that do not play Marauders shouldn't comment on our abilities since they can't seem to get any of the facts right.

 

Force Camo: 4 second cloak, if we have no hp and there is not a rock to hide behind anyone with a brain can find us and finish the job..they know it only lasts 4 seconds.

 

Undying Rage: kills us by 50% giving us a 99% damage reduction for 5 seconds..omg..we can suck for 5 more seconds but cant finish the job because our burst sucks so bad.

 

force choke: .....is a joke..3 seconds channeled...why the hell is it channeled...bounty hunters get electric dart or something..4 seconds that's not channeled which means they can pound while doing it.

 

Marauders need some utility and we need some burst damage instead of bleeds.

[Selixx]

Now, there is the problem with their abilities to survive which further enhances their complete over powered playstyle. Their first shield does 50% damage reduction for 12 seconds. 12 seconds is way more than enough time for a marauder to kill TWO people and still live. Well if that shield does not help them out to survive, they have a 90% damage reduction cheat death that lasts for 5 second but with a 90 second cool down.

 

I agree a lot with what you say, but for a couple things. First, the 50% mitigation is not actually 50% mitigation. It is +50% defense rating; which means against people with high accuracy, it is not 50% mitigation; also, because of the nature of the skill, it could actually be 0% mitigation. If you actually dont parry anything (bad RNG), the skill coul be completely worthless. It is by no means 50% mitigation, and against the majority of attacks in the game Force/Tech/Etc it is only 25% mitigation. That said, ward is a powerful cooldown, but it is certainly not foolproof.

 

Undying rage is indeed also a very powerful cooldown; but any reasonable, intelligent player will bypass undying rage altogether. How? Easy, immobilizing effects, stuns, vanishes, or putting a dot effect down and running away. Again, it's still powerful, but any reasonably intelligent player can bypass the effect completely.

 

I have to say, of all our defensive CD's, cloak is the best. It's a flat 20% mitigation rate, against all damage types, on a 1min cd, and reflects a minimal amount of damage back. That said, the defensive cd also has its weakness, in that it needs to be refreshed every 6 seconds by an attack. I personally like to save my vanish for this cooldown, which most people seem to pop in conjunction with ward. You pop both of those, I vanish, let cloak wear off, pop my own cloak.

 

All that said, I agree, Marauder is a very, very powerful class for pvp. I just wish we had the ability to select a healing or tanking tree as well, so we could bring a little something else to raids. I think huttball is a bad representation of our class, with all the range happy mechanics at play, we suffer a huge disadvantage. I think our class shines on Voidstar and Civil War.

 

A lot of people also say the class is complex, and tough to play, but I disagree. I came from Aion, and played a cleric, and a sorc in Aion. Both classes have far more skills, and keybinds in this one. Anyway, I agree, we dont need a buff, but that's ok. The buff is actually a nerf, so no big deal.

 

P.S. - My merc buddy beats me every time in huttball for dmg, I just cant seem to close the gap on that map xD

[NekoWAR]

I think huttball is a bad representation of our class, with all the range happy mechanics at play, we suffer a huge disadvantage. I think our class shines on Voidstar and Civil War.

 

 

P.S. - My merc buddy beats me every time in huttball for dmg, I just cant seem to close the gap on that map xD

 

How can the best huttball carrier class be in disadvantage in huttball? You know, this warzone is not about dealing more damage than *insert any class*.

[Dranzen]

 

Whenever I roll with a marauder whom actually knows how to play this game, he beats pretty much every DPS class, including myself, EVERY time in the damage meters, and I am an extremely competent pvp player. In raids, marauders are our number 1 priority for battle resurrection for dps classes as they do the most damage in our raids.

 

 

So do you guys have access to combat logs? I mean, does your guild have combat logs and no one else does?

 

So what are you using to determine your damage parses?

[sprasz]

Ok I am going to first say this, I come from the guild Thirsty which is currently world 7th in all content clear. I have played this game since day one and have seen everything. I play a Rank 65 BH mercenary with 4/5 BM gear, MH and OH BM. Still need gloves/bracers/belt.

 

Whenever I roll with a marauder whom actually knows how to play this game, he beats pretty much every DPS class, including myself, EVERY time in the damage meters, and I am an extremely competent pvp player. In raids, marauders are our number 1 priority for battle resurrection for dps classes as they do the most damage in our raids.

 

Now, there is the problem with their abilities to survive which further enhances their complete over powered playstyle. Their first shield does 50% damage reduction for 12 seconds. 12 seconds is way more than enough time for a marauder to kill TWO people and still live. Well if that shield does not help them out to survive, they have a 90% damage reduction cheat death that lasts for 5 second but with a 90 second cool down.

 

Well if all else fails, they can just pop their vanish ability with has a 45 second cool down. On top of this ability to survive they can also charge and interrupt with a EIGHT second cool down! When I watch marauders they pretty much wipe out the whole enemy team and only have about 2-3 (most of the time 0 with a healers) deaths throughout a whole match.

 

So why do they deserve this buff? The simple answer is that Bioware is listening to the masses, and it is safe to say the masses do not have the highest intellect level when playing this game. Making masses happy= money.

 

There is no counter to what I have said... I see what I see and I hear what I hear from these marauder players and even THEY themselves think this buff is a joke.

 

There is no need to buff a buffed class. Stop listening to the masses whom are not entirely all the good at playing this game!

 

 

you do realize that an mmo game is for the masses, and not the "few" as you put it your self "extremely competent pvp player". Just saying you cant balance the game around the few, you need to do it around the as you put it "the masses do not have the highest intellect level when playing this game"

 

So if the players of a game lack all what you clame then the makers of the game need to help out thats the nature of games.

[sprasz]

If marauders are so awesome in raids, how come your 16 man Nightmare screenshot only seems to have one?

 

 

 

http://www.thirstytor.com/wp-content/uploads/Screenshot_2012-01-23_20_51_30_626660.jpg

 

Oh and 2 for your karagga NM

 

http://www.thirstytor.com/wp-content/uploads/Screenshot_2012-01-23_20_51_30_626660.jpg

 

 

I would think that if the marauders were as SUPREME as you seem to claim, you would bring more then 1-2 of them in a 16man raid.

 

1: you failed to mention Undying rage takes 50% of our hp, and its a 99% dmg red fyi.

 

2: Saber ward is a 3min cool down, not exactly something you'll use at all times, oh and you forgot the part about it being only 25% to tech and force

 

And 12 seconds is not enough times to kill 2 people who use theyr cooldowns also.

 

Even less so if they are somewhat equally geared.

 

3: I play a Sentinel and a Marauder, both 50, both raiding. You have a 26 marauder, stay under your bridge.

 

4: you forgot to mention that force camo only lasts for 5 seconds, you try very hard to make it sound like the same thing as stealth.

 

 

 

PS: I don't care if you are the self proclaimed 7th guild in progression.. Newsflash: Swtor raiding is simple.

 

As for 16 man, the only thing impressive about it is beating the trash, since the bosses are actually easier then 8man -_-

 

And people don't bother suffer trough the lag just to get the same or less loot.

 

 

Great reply post

[Kodokai]

Ok I am going to first say this, I come from the guild Thirsty which is currently world 7th in all content clear.

 

Is this ment to be an achievement? o.0

[darthmorbous]

i wouldnt buff marauder or sentinel, i think they r pretty good balanced; difficulty to play balances the ammount of good marauders; thing is, i with my mara and my sentinel , annihilation and watchman speced have 33 keybinds. wich is FUN , but for most is ****, so Bioware listened to whiners that do not know how to play..fact is , they´ll suck anyway.

Its about how you play, yesterday i killed a lvl 47 mara ganker with my 33 sentinel 1v1!!!

He sucked and i was good, and i didnt need a buff to do it.

I think, CARNAGE marauder need a slight buff in ataru proc chance, not in damage.

Combat sentinel that is.

And btw i laugh at ranged classes with heal+bubble+shield+aoe damage+ CC whining about marauder. If your friend is toping the charts , you have a really good mara friend that learned to play mara wisely, but ffs, if you were as good as he is with your class you wouldnt be whining here.

Second; marauders at endgame had to really learn how to play right, mara cannot make ONE mistake, not ONE.

Leave Mara/Sent as it is, but ffs stop with the whining.

[darthmorbous]

Great reply post

 

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^THIS^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

 

mara/sent is in no way OP, is just a very good class for people that dont have problems with keybinds and movement.

 

i have 33 keybinds, you guys?