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I'm lvl 50 and valor 59 and don't see the point anymore...


Torothin

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I enjoyed the leveling, probably screwed myself by rushing it to find out whats next. I'm only 53 valor and over two weeks of not getting anything in the champ bags has taken its toll(I even tried opening them in WZ's lol)

Ilum is horrid. They should atleast let us put fig newton stickers on our speeders if we are going to drive in circles.

 

I don't want to win trade, but ended up doing it the other day out of fear of getting left so far behind that WZ's will be more of a BM roll fest.(actually qued into a huttball, where the score was 5-0 and the other team was waiting in our graveyard to harvest us lol, throw the ball, kill the carrier, get defender points, rinse repeat. I loaded in and by the time I was in the wz, my chat was showing 4 people have left the ops group, not a great sign lol.

Outlaws den was really fun, but I haven't seen anyone else in it for weeks. Wierd cause the only time I saw people in there was when they took the comms chest out lol? They put a reward back in and now no ones ever there?

Ilum's the size of disney land, but they put the attractions of a small town agriculture fair in that space.(can only look at the worlds largest pumpkin for so long, before I don't give a crap about it)

 

I'm not dogging the whole game, It was really fun(pve side for me), but I stick around for pvp(I know, we are a minority)

I'm not switching to any other mmo, just taking a couple months off and will be checking the site for updates. I've got the feeling that bioware will fix up Ilum and add some incentives for warzones(let me sell centurions for champ comms!!!!, even if its 50 for 10, just so I can plan on achieving my goals, should my 1/10 proc rate end up being 0/37)

Bioware will get it right or make improvements in time, and I will definitely be back for them, cause I love their games.

Edited by williambr
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I appreciate your respect for my opinions as well but please to allow us get a better understanding of what you mean or are talking about you have to explain your opinions don't just give them or things like these other guys said will be said.

 

I've done exactly that since beta. I've gotten it down to the list that I posted.

 

Due to the hostility on the forums against anyone that doesn't wear the "special" glasses, I've not been as descriptive as I've been in the past.

 

If you look at this list, it really doesn't need too much more explanation. To someone that designs a game or someone that longs for those same elements, they should be able to look at this and get a fair to clear understanding of what I'd love to see. It's really not that cryptic.

 

Also just to briefly address something someone else said in this thread; these are not demands and I am not looking for ALL of these items to be added. I'm looking for some or all.

 

And again this is where I go back to bad game design or game design to make money at the cost of quality game-play.

 

If developers added more social and non-combat sandbox elements into the game, there would be so much more available to do that you wouldn't have the nothing to do problem at end-game. Picture everything SWG had that you loved and add it. Then slow the leveling curve down.

 

I recently played a game that was pretty ground breaking as far as dynamic environmental content. I loved the game though I thought the worlds were too small and it also lacked player housing and the like. But I found a niche, harvesting. So I was in no rush to 50. Then one day, they patched it to almost insta-spawn for what was formerly a rare item. Why did they do this? Because it was preventing people from getting to end-game FAST enough.

 

Well people got to end-game and guess what? They quit.

 

The point of this story is that I believe that end game is a goal, but it should be a goal in the distant future like older mmo's.

When development teams along with their sponsors get this and do it right, you'll see a great game.

There should be a true mid game so there is no rushing to 50. And that could be harvesting, crafting, exploring, etc.

 

The problem is games aren't designed this way anymore. It's like someone took a standard mmo from 10 years ago and put it on speed 78 or for those that have never used a turn-table, it would be like putting the game on permanent fast forward so it sounds like Alvin and the Chipmunks.

 

I'm really getting to the point where I want to write a game and be done with it. If i got 1000 people that would be good enough. lol

 

Here is a post from someone that articulated the feeling a lot better:

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=253172

Edited by Waypoc
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This has been my biggest gripe since day one.

 

This game has no point, no challenge. I've already canceled and have filled out 2 surveys that were emailed to me asking how I feel about the game and why I left.

 

Here is what I wrote:

 

If some or all of the following were done, I would seriously consider coming back:

  • Add Planets with no specific level range. Just a very mysterious Star Wars planet where you can run into mobs that are level 1 or level 50. All levels are there, low and high. Be Careful
  • No yellow brick road quests where you literally follow a road and questline like a robot to the next quest line or area. It works in other games because they are much more open
  • When you open a map, have it be the entire world, not just some tiny segment. I know you can click the whole world map and see the whole world but it still seems so small and segmented like I'm running from one ride or warehouse to another
  • No walls
  • No exhaustion from running into the desert
  • More mystery. More mystical mysterious Gameplay. You know, like Star Wars
  • More immersion
  • More in-depth crafting - Crafting that YOU as the player actually have to do and not only your Companion
  • Player Housing on a planet that's non-instanced. No there would not be a blight if they just added rent with limits on how much you could pre-pay
  • Chat Bubbles
  • Scalable UI
  • Movable UI
  • Pet Mounts
  • Vehicle Mounts that actually work and feel right. In TOR they just don't feel right. The vehicles in TOR feel and drive like a hula skirt that you're wearing. It feels very fake
  • Community
  • More People - Stop the Sharding/Instancing
  • Pets that are not Companions
  • Less Gated Gameplay
  • True Open Worlds
  • More in-depth Meaningful Harvesting
  • Remove the mountain Walls, regular walls. Stop making me run 5 miles in one direction to get to an objective that is just on the other side of another wall
  • Broker that works
  • Guild Halls - Non-Instanced
  • No Mobs on every single node and every single path. It's ridiculous
  • No Combat Delay
  • Better Textures
  • Food with Stats crafted by Players
  • Moddable Orange Armor that has a base stat so that it is actually worth something more than appearance
  • Open World PvP with actual rewards so that everyone isn't always in WZ's on PvP Servers. And NO NOT JUST ILUM
  • Slow level progression down with sandbox elements that would make people slow down because they desire to

 

Also, it just seems that nothing you do in the SWTOR world really matters.

BW's almost doctrinal stance on the solo story design is a mistake. Their stance on solo gameplay as a whole, in an MMO, is a mistake.

 

SWTOR's group content is INCONSEQUENTIAL. If I did 5 fp's total, that would be a lot. There is no need to do them. You do not need to do them to advance in any way. I made it to 50 on one toon and 20 on another in 30 days without them. You say I missed out on great gear??? Really and with what consequence? NONE! And I was constantly ahead of the leveling curve right up to Corellia which is 47-49.

 

The group content is fun that being FP's and Op's but it's old and tired and in the end doesn't matter as everyone will get good enough gear or better gear without trying so there is no point to it.

 

People on the forums tell you do the FP's, OP's, crafting and such but none of it really matters in the end. Crafting : you will loot better gear while PvPing or running regular quests , fps or ops, so no point. Gear is easy to get so everyone will have it so again no point to ops or fp.

At end game the game really becomes pointless especially on Ilum as Republic.

 

That's one of the biggest things I come away with is that the game is too easy, too much good gear drops for nothing, no one needs you and you need no one. No middle game content that would make someone slow down. No real Epic questing going on. It's just more like doing assignments. You will get everything you want guaranteed. No risk whatsoever. It's epicly boring.

 

It's the state of MMO's today I guess. Kind of sad actually.

 

 

SWG is gone bro. We miss it, but you have to get over it.

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SWG is gone bro. We miss it, but you have to get over it.

 

Yeah I got the memo.

 

So are you saying that we should just forget a game that had some awesome sandbox elements for the fast paced get it now crap that we have today?

 

Why not learn from SWG, the good parts, and implement them?

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I told myself I would give this game 6 months to set itself straight. I don't know if that's going to happen. Something about Eve-Onlines player influenced economy, Universe, how the PvP is, and how it encourages co-operation(on multiple levels). Well I miss that. This game is lacking something and it is just a grind for gear(so exciting).

 

I'm valor 59 and have my champ gear and really don't know if I want to even start going for my BM. I want to give this game the benefit of the doubt and give it the 6 months like I initially planned but I just don't know.

 

I would have more fun running fleets in faction warfare(eve-online) then I would playing hutt ball 90% of the time just to get a bag. BW said this game cares about PvP but so far the overall mechanics tell me otherwise. I just don't know guys. I'm losing faith and interest fast.

 

Every day I play less and less. Some of you may think this is the greatest game ever. But I will disagree. If only world PvP meant something and we were fighting for something then it would be great. A ranking system where PvP stats can be seen and rewards given then I might stick around. But so far, 6 months is a lot to ask. last night was the first time I spent the night reading a book as opposed to playing this game. That's not a good sign...

 

*Sigh*

 

I completely agree with you my friend... I have been playing since closed beta, and I promised myself to give SWTOR at least six months like I did for Rift.

 

Lord knows I am a patient and tolerant human being, but as the days go by, I simply just can't bother to log on anymore. I am a lvl 50 fully champ/BM geared Sith juggernaut, 62 valor, and I don't do PvE.

 

A game session of mine consists of :

-Weekly PvP quests

-Daily PvP quests

-erm... help guidmates with their quests !

 

Since I believe in Bioware and Mythic, I will give you some time to convince us... But since the latest patch, I can't even validate my Illum quests for god's sake !

 

Do something, because the Star Wars licence won't save a badly programmed game !

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Explain to me that earning gear is my end game. Once I complete my daily's and weekly's I have no point in playing once I hit BM. Tell me what's the fun in that?

 

So explain this to me... you hit lvl cap, get the geared out and then get mad that there is nothing else to do? I'm sorry, but how is this different from any other MMO? There is ALWAYS going to be some sort of "end" until the next batch of content. What game were you playing that there are endless tiers of gear to work towards? Espcially with a 1.5 month old game.

 

There is a lot to do. You can pvp, since apparently you are a pvper, but I guess you only pvp for the gear (sigh). You could run flashpoints and ops... yeah maybe you don't need anything from there... but you can still play the game for, I don't know... fun.

 

Have fun game hopping to the next game where you reach max lvl, gear out, complain and then rinse repeat.

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I told myself I would give this game 6 months to set itself straight. I don't know if that's going to happen. Something about Eve-Onlines player influenced economy, Universe, how the PvP is, and how it encourages co-operation(on multiple levels). Well I miss that. This game is lacking something and it is just a grind for gear(so exciting).

 

 

You'll never find anything as immersive as EVE as all the other MMOs aren't based on PLAYER-RUN production/politics/warfare/etc.

 

I'm in the same boat as you when it comes to PVP given that I'm a 7yr EVE veteran...EVE is hands down the best PVP MMO. Having said that, I really enjoy SWTOR for "PVP light" and a short-term distraction during times where I simply don't have the time to play EVE (takes more time committment, I think we can both agree on that).

 

Other MMOs could learn a TON from EVE. There's not a lot of MMOs with such a loyal player base.

 

PS: Which corp are you part of in EVE? I'm former Outbreak, but sadly don't have the time to be very involved in corps like that due to my RL job :(

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Still a gear grind, just different... Everybody starts with T1 garbage.. time, skills, ??? later you gots T2.. more time skills ??? later T3.

 

Don't fool yourself into thinking EVE is something it isn't.. or worse yet, that it isn't something it is.

 

I can still take down a 100m ISK battleship in a 35m cruiser with the right tactics though...whereas in in SWTOR the impact of tactics is greatly diminished by gear.

 

I can also engage 5-10 people in more expensive ships by using the right tactics.

 

In short, skill > gear in EVE. Not saying EVE is perfect, but when it comes to PVP, it hands down is.

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Explain to me that earning gear is my end game. Once I complete my daily's and weekly's I have no point in playing once I hit BM. Tell me what's the fun in that?

 

PvP for fun because you like it and it's enjoyable. If PvP isn't fun, then you shouldn't be PvPing in the first place.

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Ok so if it had content can you or anyone remember what you did with out reciting what you did in PVP because again that is not content, content is single player mostly but group content against environment not players. I played sandbox games that had no hand holding and had far less content than SWTOR. When I played EVE for the few months that I did I found a small amount of content but not enough to keep me interested out side of the PVP. Every MMO is a gear grind sorry that is just the nature of the beast you do everything to get levels and gear sorry.

 

EVE's content is player driven mostly, even the PVE aspect often requires you to be part of a well organized corporation.

 

To give you an example: They introduced wormholes where people can set up player owned structures, fuel them, "farm" complexes, gather resources on planets, and then produce 95% of the mods and ships in game right there to sell on the player market. However, without a good corporation you don't stand a chance at doing all that (unless you have an army of alts...which still won't allow you to defend that wormhole against pirate players like myself)...because it's not SOLO content. If you wanna play on your own, EVE isn't for you.

 

WoW and SWTOR feels like a GAME...whereas EVE feels like a second life if you're part of a good corporation/alliance. It makes a massive difference whether or not you find a good corp, which is why a lot of people don't like EVE...they never found a good corporation. And Eve doesn't exactly make it easy to find a good corporation because of ingame politics and spy games. There's a lot of mistrust until people get to know you. Hell, the largest heist in a game (netting several $10k for the thief) was done in EVE through spy games and infiltration. How many games do you know where through social engineering you can make $50k+ in real life money?

 

However, it's exactly those politics and spy games that drive the community and keep the game going. In the long term, that's great for the devs because once players are over the initial harsh learning curve (that weeds out most of the WoW kiddies), players tend to stick around. I can't count the number of times mates in EVE said "goodbye, I'm going to play WoW/WH/SWG/etc from now on", just to see them back in EVE a few weeks/months later. That includes me by the way ;)

 

As for grinding in EVE, you only have to do that if you're not clever enough to make money in game otherwise. I spent 99.9% of my time PVP'ing, and made billions through playing the market a bit like a real life market. Buy cheap, sell for more. For example, if I found out that one particular mod was very popular at some station, I used to buy every single one...just to put it back onto the market at a 10-50% markup. Takes like 2min, nets you millions/billions. Or you find that one region doesn't have a particular mod for sale...so you fly to the main market hub (Jita), pick it up for cheap, and sometimes you could sell it for twice the amount you paid for (or more).

 

I also used to run space stations (POS) and produced different materials. Your station produces stuff while you're logged off, and work consists of shipping fuel there once a week, and dumping your products onto the market. That's like an hour of work per week if you set it up correctly. Also nets millions/billions.

 

In short, if you have the brains there is almost no grind in EVE. Of course it takes time to learn all that, and the learning curve is super harsh in EVE...especially if you can't find a good corp. So some unlucky players who try the game never get a chance at experiencing how awesome EVE really is.

Edited by RadehX
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I can still take down a 100m ISK battleship in a 35m cruiser with the right tactics though...whereas in in SWTOR the impact of tactics is greatly diminished by gear.

 

I can also engage 5-10 people in more expensive ships by using the right tactics.

 

In short, skill > gear in EVE. Not saying EVE is perfect, but when it comes to PVP, it hands down is.

 

Then go play EVE?

 

I dont understand why people complain and say game "X" or game "Y" is better. IF its better why did you stop playing it? doenst make much sense really. And if you stopped and didnt like the new thing you tried why not go back?

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EVE has no skill involved. It's "My setup hard-counters yours therefore I win."

 

You're comically wrong :p

 

Why? Because there's ALWAYS a counter setup to any setup. If you get outplayed because someone else prepared better it's your fault. If you fly a large battleship with large drones and then lose to a small pirate frigate or bomber because you can't hit him, that's not the games fault. It's YOUR fault for being a moron and not thinking ahead (aka not packing some light drones that CAN hit those setups that counter yours).

 

You clearly have no clue about tactics.

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Then go play EVE?

 

I dont understand why people complain and say game "X" or game "Y" is better. IF its better why did you stop playing it? doenst make much sense really. And if you stopped and didnt like the new thing you tried why not go back?

 

I still do ;)

 

It's just that my RL job won't allow me to play as much anymore...and EVE just takes more time to enjoy than SWTOR. I never said I don't like SWTOR, I'm actually having fun. They're entirely different games you can't really compare. However, SWTOR could add some of the good aspects of EVE to make the game better.

 

Nothing's stopping me from enjoying both, no? ;)

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The fact of the matter is SWTOR (cut scenes and voice acting aside) is really no different than WoW, Rift or many other theme park mmos. After you've played a few, they all begin to feel the same in short time. SWTOR is nothing special, you shouldnt be surprised about how you're feeling. I have a week left on my sub and I"m not renewing..
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The fact of the matter is SWTOR (cut scenes and voice acting aside) is really no different than WoW, Rift or many other theme park mmos. After you've played a few, they all begin to feel the same in short time. SWTOR is nothing special, you shouldnt be surprised about how you're feeling. I have a week left on my sub and I"m not renewing..
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The fact of the matter is SWTOR (cut scenes and voice acting aside) is really no different than WoW, Rift or many other theme park mmos. After you've played a few, they all begin to feel the same in short time. SWTOR is nothing special, you shouldnt be surprised about how you're feeling. I have a week left on my sub and I"m not renewing..

 

They feel the same because of the two ton heavy thing that ruined it all. Prior to said thing MMO's didn't have as big of a following and almost considered a niche market.

 

There doesn't have to be a grind nor does the progression have to have a reward. You could separate the two forms of content (pve / pvp) and work it so rewards don't impact one another. Let the player base decide on how they want to play and develop content for both at a equal place.

 

You don't have to tie players to a small warzone type map. You could let the world and server rule set dictate what happens where. You could provide weekly and monthly statistics based on guilds, class, and overall numbers.

 

You could create the feel of eve to some degree by expanding guilds by using alliances. This way you can be in a large or small guild yet be part of a bigger overall orginization for raiding or pvp, et all.

 

I mean lets face it none of us really know what Bioware has in store for us. They are talking about a guild summit and other things but I'm sure we all agree there is potential. We just don't know what and many times the unknown is what drives us away in the end. I lean towards the PvP aspect of the game and that is what is driving me away at the core.

 

Ilum is nice, but it is broke. Win or kill trading isn't fun and it is making stuff easier to obtain than it sould. Factor in population, or lack thereof, for republic side subscribers and it starts to wear you down. Trading isn't helping in the long run because while you do complete your daily and weekly you are allowing the same to happen to the imperial side of the house. Now not only are you out numbered you are now also out geared when you should be preventing them from completing theres so only YOU have the upper hand.

 

Then add in the fact that there isn't any "real" incentive for world pvp out side the short thrill kill for a few seconds why play? I mean warzones are ok but the don't change and confine you to a space / map only so big.

Edited by Incendergel
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Only reason why im quitting as a PvPer? The fact that if I wanted to sit down and have an 8 hour gaming session, I'd be stuck playing huttball the entire time. Ridiculous. I shouldn't be paying to play 1 out of the 3 Warzones all day.
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